New Carnival Ships

[Lady_K]

I know that the Liberty will be a Conquest-class, but what are Carnival's plans for ships after this?

 

It seems that the Spirit-class ships are by far the most liked by passengers, and a lot of people seem to dislike the size of the Conquest-class (though I didn't mind it). Do they take passenger comments into consideration when deciding what new ships to build? I'm sure the designing-building process takes years.

 

Just curious.

 

 

Carnival Glory - 5/15/04

Imagination - 4/00

[SunFunCruiser]

It would be a wonderful thing if they added activities onto these new mega ships instead of just extra cabins. They need movie theatres, better kid's clubs, golf, ect...

[BigDoug]

Here are some links as to what ships Carnival has on order:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=83510&highlight=ship+order

http://www.cruisenewsdaily.com/newships.html

Right now Carnival only has a Conquest class ship ordered but is working on the design of a new class of ship possibly larger than the new RCI Liberty OTS (aka Ultra-Voyager). Carnival also has on order some ships for the other lines it owns.

[BigDoug]

I posted the name of the new RCI ship incorrectly.:eek: It is to be called Freedom OTS. There was some speculation on the boards that the 2nd ship would be named Liberty OTS. Sorry about that.

[kkorman]

The money is made by having more people on board, that is why they are more likely to build these Conquest-class sardine cans. Why build a $400 mill dollar ship for 2000 when you can build a $400 mill dollar ship for 3500. Simply math tells you why.

[robsvacation]

Well, mums the word right now.

 

I doubt we'll any more Spirit Class ships. A couple of shipyards have concept plans that would squeeze a 100,000 ton ship into panamax dimentions (mostly through making the ship "stubby" with more cabins forward over the bow)

 

The big talk is of the pinnicle project, a ship platform who's design was begun by Princess prior to the Carnival takeover with a size of over 180,000 tons. I doubt they will announce this until Ultra Voyager is finalized, Kinda like RCCL did when they announced ultra voyager just before the Queen Mary 2 took to the seas. Trouble is rumor has it RCCL has a 200,000+ ton design in the wings

 

:rolleyes:

 

Just buy an island and put 1,000,000 outboards on one side and call it a day.

[kkorman]

Well, mums the word right now.

 

I doubt we'll any more Spirit Class ships. A couple of shipyards have concept plans that would squeeze a 100,000 ton ship into panamax dimentions (mostly through making the ship "stubby" with more cabins forward over the bow)

 

The big talk is of the pinnicle project, a ship platform who's design was begun by Princess prior to the Carnival takeover with a size of over 180,000 tons. I doubt they will announce this until Ultra Voyager is finalized, Kinda like RCCL did when they announced ultra voyager just before the Queen Mary 2 took to the seas. Trouble is rumor has it RCCL has a 200,000+ ton design in the wings

 

:rolleyes:

 

Just buy an island and put 1,000,000 outboards on one side and call it a day.

 

 

A Acrnival ship at 180,000 tons.. they would pack on 10,000 people and not have enough public space to support them No thank you. I am not too eager to jump on the ultra-voyager myself. I 'll stick to smaller ships (aside from my planned trip on the Grand Princess and the QM2 next summer.)

[glrounds]

I'm sorry, Carnival, but I will have to agree with the previous poster.

Some are too small (Fantasy-class), and some are too big (Conquest-class), but the SPIRIT-CLASS ships are JUST RIGHT ! ! :)

 

Although a beautiful ship, The GLORY (currently the largest Carnival has) was laid out badly, I thought. Crowds were everywhere and traffic around photographers, etc. on the main promenade were ridiculous. The aft Lido deck was enclosed on all sides. Love to be open to the sea. :(

[Cruising89143]

I also am one that dislikes the Conquest class of ships. They have replaced the Fantasy class ships as the new cash cow of the fleet.

 

If Carnival does indeed build the new Pinnacle class ships reported to be somewhere between 180 and 200,000 tons you can expect at least upwards to 4500-5000 passengers on this ship plus crew. Too many people IMHO. My other concern on this, what happens with a major disaster at sea? I cannot imagine trying to get that many people off of a ship at one time. Also, I would think that embarkation and debarkation would be a nightmare.

 

The cruise lines can continue to build bigger if they want but I for one have no desire to be on something that large. Carnival has a major winner with the Spirit class but they do not seem to be interested in building anymore of them.

[mnsawyer]

Can someone please clarify ship categories for me - I assume the Victory & Triumph are conquest class and the Valor (new), Miracle, Glory, etc. are spirit class? Are they all pretty much the same size and layout???

[GoinCruisin]

Okay, hopefully I get these right :D

 

Holiday Class includes the Holiday, Jubilee, and Celebration

Spirit Class includes the Spirit, Pride, Legend and Miracle

Fantasy Class includes the Fantasy, Sensation, Paradise and Ecstasy

Destiny Class includes the Destiny, Triumph, and Victory

Conquest Class includes the Conquest, Glory and Valor

 

I'm sure I'm missing a few....

 

And no, they are not all the same in layout and size... you can look on Carnival's website and see the deckplans and layouts of each.

[mnsawyer]

Thanks for the info. Have sailed on the Triumph and just trying to get a sense of what the difference will be on the Valor??? I haven't read good things about the spirit class either.

[basketsiam]

We've sailed on both the Triumph and the Glory. Both are layed out identically, except the Conquest class ships (including the Valor) are 50 feet longer. You might opt for a midship cabin to save yourself some steps!!! There tend to be long lines at times, but both are beautiful ships. As for the Spirit class ships, they are substantially smaller than both the Destiny and Conquest class, and a favorite of many Carnival Cruisers. I'm certainly looking forward to trying the Miracle in March. :D :D

[momofmeg]

Well we have booked the Mariner of the Seas for next year so I will see what all the hype about voyager class ships is and se whether I really care for it or not. I do know I hate the dinky cabins and no self laundry on RCCL-I guess it depends on how often I do the putt-putt or go to the iceskating show-as I have no desire to rock climb or inline skate. I did think Carnival Miracle was a beautiful ship but have read so many negative things about the conquest class ships here on these boards I have no desire to book one of them.

 

As far as the post saying it is 400 million to build a spirt class ship which I think was around 98000 tons and 400 million to buld a conquest class ship which is another 20000 tons I find that hard to believe it cost the same price for a conquest class when it is that much bigger then the spirit class ship.

 

We loved the Disney Wonder. Her cabins and balconies were super. Although size wise she was between the fanasty class and spirit class-she seemed like a smaller ship. I would like to see myself- more smaller ships built with balconies-just not sure I will care for the mega-ships. Heck I felt Miracle and the fanasty class ships were a little bigger then I wanted. But since most feel "bigger is better" I guess I am in the minority. Heck I would be willing to pay MORE for a nice small ship with balconies. But ofcourse I by myself would not be enough to induce these cruiselines to build nice small ships I guess.

[basketsiam]

The Spirit class ships are about 88,000 tons, the Destiny class ships are 100,000 tons, and the Conquest class ships are about 110,000 tons. With that, it is far easier to fit more passengers on the Conquest class ships. They really are quite awesome to see. Just be prepared to deal with more people......Oh, well. Any day at sea is better than a day on land!!!!

[Cruising89143]

I will be on the Navigator three weeks from today. My first on a Voyager class ship. The cabins on the newer RCI ships are about the same size as Carnival. I booked a category JS on the Navigator and looking at the many photos, it is size wise between a category eleven and twelve on Carnival but I paid less than what I have paid on Carnival for a cat. eleven. Should be a great cruise plus I read over on the RCI board that the Navigator is getting the new menus starting with todays cruise. It is a test.

[kkorman]

 

As far as the post saying it is 400 million to build a spirt class ship which I think was around 98000 tons and 400 million to buld a conquest class ship which is another 20000 tons I find that hard to believe it cost the same price for a conquest class when it is that much bigger then the spirit class ship.

 

There is not a big difference in price in building these ships (at least within the cruise lines... I know the QM2 was 800 mill). Bottom line and the point I was making was that if you have an average of 1500 more people on board each week, as you do on a Conquest class(3700 to 2200), there is a whole lot more potential to make money on that ship. So in this case, bigger is better.

 

I just did a check on a website of ships released and the Miracle (Spirit class) was $375 mill and the Liberty (Conquest) is $400 mill.

[jnnifer01]

I don't mind the larger ships, I just wish they (Carnival) would add more onboard activities (like putt putt, a movie theater, rock climbing, etc.). It would be nice to have the option of doing something different every day at sea. DH and I love to cruise, but on the longer cruises, we find ourselves just walking around and eating all day for lack of activities (which beats being at work, but I feel I'd have more fun doing the above activities I listed).

What would be even better is if they made a larger ship with larger cabins (as opposed to more of the same sized cabins- but I guess that would make less $$$).

I'd go for that! :)

Oh well. I'll take what I can get ;)

[seaventurer]

I can't believe what I am reading. I remember in the '60's sailing on the Rotterdam (v) which was considered BIG way back then, at 38,000 tons - this was my first cruise. As a cruise buff and passionate ship and sea lover ...you would never have been able to imagine how this business would evolve - and has. Carnival's 1st (second hand) ship, the Mardi Gras was a mere 27,000 or so tons and actually grounded off the coast of Miami on her innaugural cruise - with the media and travel trade on board...who would know?

 

I've sailed on many Carnival ships including the Holiday, Imagination, Triumph, Facination and my all time favorite - the Spirit...

 

Hearing posters call the Spirit a "small" ship is awkward...cruising today is not what a cruise ever was...I will not support a 180,000 ton ship and will stick to the Triumph if I want big. The Spirit is perfect and seemingly will be considered yacht-size in a few years.

 

For the first-timer crowd, these Giga-ships may be great if you like traveling with 5,000 other people. Take a number - I like the Carnival product - overal, but this is beginning to get entirely out of hand. How many billions of dollars does Carnival need to earn before they learn that value too can bring foward profits and rewards...so here we go...the Walmart of crusing...

[glrounds]

I can't believe what I am reading. I remember in the '60's sailing on the Rotterdam (v) which was considered BIG way back then, at 38,000 tons - this was my first cruise. As a cruise buff and passionate ship and sea lover ...you would never have been able to imagine how this business would evolve - and has. Carnival's 1st (second hand) ship, the Mardi Gras was a mere 27,000 or so tons and actually grounded off the coast of Miami on her innaugural cruise - with the media and travel trade on board...who would know?

 

I've sailed on many Carnival ships including the Holiday, Imagination, Triumph, Facination and my all time favorite - the Spirit...

 

Hearing posters call the Spirit a "small" ship is awkward...cruising today is not what a cruise ever was...I will not support a 180,000 ton ship and will stick to the Triumph if I want big. The Spirit is perfect and seemingly will be considered yacht-size in a few years.

 

For the first-timer crowd, these Giga-ships may be great if you like traveling with 5,000 other people. Take a number - I like the Carnival product - overal, but this is beginning to get entirely out of hand. How many billions of dollars does Carnival need to earn before they learn that value too can bring foward profits and rewards...so here we go...the Walmart of crusing...

(my emphasis)

 

Excellent post, seaventurer. I quite agree with you also. My first cruise was also on a tiny (by today's standards), French POS ship of the Pacquet Line, probably 30,000 tons.

 

With rock-climbing walls, ice skating rinks, etc., it seems like more and more the "sea" is being taken out of "sea cruising". With megaships cruising to increasingly crowded ports (last time in Cozumel there were 7 ships there) they are turning them into Americanized stop-off points (few actual Mexicans in sight).

 

I fell in love with the Spirit-class ships (PRIDE in May and again the LEGEND in September) and would hope they don't ever get any bigger than the Conquest-class, which I cruised a year ago October (GLORY).

 

I see a larger problem cruiselines face in the future North American market. They're running out of ports of call. How many different ports can a cruise ship go to in a 7 day period ? They've exhausted the possibilities and now find them filling up ports with 7 ships at a time. The megaships carrying 4000-5000 paxs can only exacerbate this Americanization process of what ports there are.

 

I do definitely see this becoming the era of "Walmart" cruisers, in that a huge hotel (the megaships) complete with food and transportation provided, take paxs, very inexpensively, to these crowded ports, dump them off so they can drown their brain in alcohol while listening to the classic rock of the 70s and 80s and purchase worthless trinkets. :rolleyes:

 

The "sea", unfortunately, is relegated to just being the "highway". :(

 

"If you can't be kind . . . at least have the decency to be vague" anonymous

[Runner Girl]

It's not just the cruise industry. I've been house hunting. Good heavens, if you want a newly constructed home for less that 1/2 mill, expect to have a neighbor's house no more than a 40 X 110 lot! You better have nice neighbors and they better not move! It's disgusting!

[Cruising89143]

(my emphasis)

 

Excellent post, seaventurer. I quite agree with you also. My first cruise was also on a tiny (by today's standards), French POS ship of the Pacquet Line, probably 30,000 tons.

 

With rock-climbing walls, ice skating rinks, etc., it seems like more and more the "sea" is being taken out of "sea cruising". With megaships cruising to increasingly crowded ports (last time in Cozumel there were 7 ships there) they are turning them into Americanized stop-off points (few actual Mexicans in sight).

 

I fell in love with the Spirit-class ships (PRIDE in May and again the LEGEND in September) and would hope they don't ever get any bigger than the Conquest-class, which I cruised a year ago October (GLORY).

 

I see a larger problem cruiselines face in the future North American market. They're running out of ports of call. How many different ports can a cruise ship go to in a 7 day period ? They've exhausted the possibilities and now find them filling up ports with 7 ships at a time. The megaships carrying 4000-5000 paxs can only exacerbate this Americanization process of what ports there are.

 

I do definitely see this becoming the era of "Walmart" cruisers, in that a huge hotel (the megaships) complete with food and transportation provided, take paxs, very inexpensively, to these crowded ports, dump them off so they can drown their brain in alcohol while listening to the classic rock of the 70s and 80s and purchase worthless trinkets. :rolleyes:

 

The "sea", unfortunately, is relegated to just being the "highway". :(

 

"If you can't be kind . . . at least have the decency to be vague" anonymous

My first cruise back in 86 was on NCL's little ship called the Starward. The ship was 525 feet in length and only came in around 16,000 tons. That was one of the best ships that I have ever cruised. The service, food and even the entertainment was great. Nothing out there today in the mainstream arena could touch this ship.

 

Today cruiselines like Carnival, Princess and more so with RCI are doing away with the "sea" experience. Their aim is to bring landside resorts to sea and bring those customers with it but we are losing the whole concept of what cruising used to be. I know that things change and we move forward in life but I do not call building ships in the range of 200,000 tons progress. It all comes down to the almighty dollar and to see how many passengers we can cram on one ship. Carnival wins that award hands down. As stated above we are overloading the islands now with passengers. I have seen as many as 10-12 ships in Cozumel at one time. You cannot even move.

 

It will be interesting to see what happens ten years down the road with cruising. We are already seeing the prices starting to climb and I feel that within two years the prices will be back to what they were in the late 80's and early 90's. The demand is now back with more new people coming on board daily to try out this new vacation destination it will only grow.

[mnsawyer]

MotherofMeg - finally, someone who agree with me about self-service laundry! Plus, no irons!! That's one of the reasons why I won't book with RCCL plus the cabins are smaller and it's more expensive. Just priced out two cabins (oceanview) for the same week but not quite same itinerary (western) and RCCL was $800 higher! Sorry but that's a lot to us!! Sailed on the Celebration in 1990 and it was huge to us then but sailed the Triumph in 2003. It's big and yes, there are lines but wouldn't want to sail on anything smaller now.

[kkorman]

Today cruiselines like Carnival, Princess and more so with RCI are doing away with the "sea" experience. Their aim is to bring landside resorts to sea and bring those customers with it but we are losing the whole concept of what cruising used to be. I know that things change and we move forward in life but I do not call building ships in the range of 200,000 tons progress. It all comes down to the almighty dollar and to see how many passengers we can cram on one ship. Carnival wins that award hands down. As stated above we are overloading the islands now with passengers. I have seen as many as 10-12 ships in Cozumel at one time. You cannot even move.

 

Some people will think that a 200,000 ton ship is progress. Not me, but I can think of many I know that would like this. For now, if there is someone who likes the more traditional cruising experience and just loves the sea, you will have that option. All that being said, there are not enough of these people to fill even the smaller ships consistently, so the cruise lines need to evolve. Especially since it has become such a family vacation. Most would not go back on a cruise if they were bored on their cruise. So, for the cruise ines, having these amenities, is necessary for them to fill ships. You can argue just to make smaller ships, but then the bottom line comes into play again.

 

 

As for the other statments above, I think that Carnival and RCI have gotten too far away from the cruise experience I am looking for, so I do not consider them in my travel planning. I'd prefer a walk around the promenade deck looking at the ocean than to climb walls or use the water slides. But, I am the minority, and if everybody wanted to do this, the deck would be crowded and I would not want to do it anymore. The Spirit-class ships are nice, but not nice enough to draw me back to the "Carnival experience". I like to have options though and that is what the cruise industry is offering. In that respect progress has been made.

[mojo4trav]

I've never been on Carnival, but thought some might find a few images interesting...cannot confirm whether the designs are for Carnival or RCCL, but they appear to be for ships in the 180-200,000 tonnage class.