Disney Magic has not lowered drinking age in MED

[OceanLiner]

At what point does a cruise line apply given jurisprudence to its fleet? The lines tend to adhere to a set of policies that are set forth through maritime law and very firm and consistent guidelines without which it would be very difficult to govern a ship.

It would seem most unwise to decide that since a ship is in a given location, then some subset of local rules would apply. Where would you draw the line? Many different local laws might allow or prohibit many aspects of social behavior. Drinking, drugs, social contact, clothing, food service, etc….all are at risk to greater or lesser degrees.

Remember, the countries whereby you might drink at 18 will certainly contain laws for which you never want to adhere, and you will not get to pick and choose. Be careful for what you wish.

[98Charlie]

It would seem most unwise to decide that since a ship is in a given location, then some subset of local rules would apply. Where would you draw the line? Many different local laws might allow or prohibit many aspects of social behavior. Drinking, drugs, social contact, clothing, food service, etc….all are at risk to greater or lesser degrees.

But, that is what cruise lines do.

 

Some cruise lines that have a "No Alcohol Under 21" policy when sailing from US ports make alcohol available to 18 and up (with parental consent I believe) when sailing from European ports. That is really the basis for OP's complaint.

 

It is not local laws/rules/mores that are being applied. Just a modification of the rules of the cruise line.

 

Charlie

[flagger]

I love how everyone has this assumption that 18-20 year olds from Europe will be falling down drunk if DCL serves them booze.

 

It has always been the older adults that I have seen that have been the most obnoxious. It is not the 21 year olds who can drink.

[Sarah's Dad]

Disney doesn't base it's fares on what it costs to operate the cruise line, they base their fares on the maximum amount that they can charge and still nearly fill the ship.

The presence or absence of casino revenue or their selling drinks to 18-20 year olds will have nothing to do with the fares that they charge. It's all about demand.

 

I wrote the lack of casino was a "contributing factor" which means it is just one of many factors that comes into play when considering how DCL can generate revenue for its cruise line.

 

I never wrote that they base their fares on operating costs. DCL chooses to forego the profits that could be generated by a casino (not an operating cost) and in turn more than likely offsets that lack of revenue by raising fares.

[Sarah's Dad]

I love how everyone has this assumption that 18-20 year olds from Europe will be falling down drunk if DCL serves them booze.

 

 

I don't care how old someone is if they don't drink then they won't be "falling down drunk". But then again I guess some people just can't enjoy Disney family cruise without drinking.

[flagger]

But then again I guess some people just can't enjoy Disney family cruise without drinking.

NO that has nothing to do with it for some people. It is just strange to suddenly not be able to do something in basically your own backyard when most other cruiselines have 18 and up able to drink beer and wine. They assumed it would be the same for the Med cruises. Their first chance to try Disney without incuring a high Euro cost for airfare across the pond to Orlando!

[Nobbi]

It is sad that this subject is so important. We go for the family experience and all the pixie dust that comes with it. I guess there are a lot of people that just can't have fun without alcohol regardless of age.

 

 

It is sad that there is so much flaming on this board.

 

As someone who was born in Europe, having beer or wine with meals is normal. I don't enjoy food with sweet, sticky soda. For me alcohol was never a taboo, so I never got totally blastered. I usually choose to go to restaurants where I can have beer or wine with my meal which in California is not really an issue. I'm a foodie and these complement the meal.

 

Given the probable high US to Non-US young adults ratio on the cruise, perhaps it is a good idea to not lower the drinking age. As previous posters have pointed out this country does not have such a good record when it comes to drunk youth. I do believe that the general attitude toward alcohol in the US is at least part reason.

 

I do agree that if one does not like the policy just take another cruiseline. I would not fly middle eastern air carriers where I cannot have my wine with my meal. Were I a woman, I would not travel to Moslem countries where I would have to cover my face.

 

DCL is my favorite cruise line. I just took the QM2 in Queens Grill across the Atlantic. DCL's service is better, the food at least as good, and the ship way more spectacular, both inside and out.

 

And people, stop attacking each other. That's neither "family-friendly" nor "disneyesque".

[dahuffy]

So you can fight for your country, and vote at eighteen. So where does it say you can drink alcohol? If your friends are so dissapointed, why are they even going on Disney? Some cruise lines have no smoking rules, and I'm over twenty one, have voted in numerous elections, and have elected not to cruise on those lines. The way things are going about this and that, it won't be long before McDonald's has a scale you have to get on before you, SUPERSIZE IT. And who says the EUROPEANS are correct about their drinking age? Your not going to find much sympathy for your friends teenage drinkers on this forum. Right or wrong, it's Disney, and I'll cruise with them. There will be no policy change, and if your friends choose to give their teenagers alcohol, while on-board, Disney security will handle it. Metrowon

 

Here-Here!:)

[Host Mick]

I wrote the lack of casino was a "contributing factor" which means it is just one of many factors that comes into play when considering how DCL can generate revenue for its cruise line.

 

I never wrote that they base their fares on operating costs. DCL chooses to forego the profits that could be generated by a casino (not an operating cost) and in turn more than likely offsets that lack of revenue by raising fares.

 

So conversely, if they had a casino, they could reduce fares?

Not likely, they'll continue to charge as much as they can to maximize their profit until the higher fares begin to cause a drop in demand and profit; going over the top of the curve so to speak.

However, if the casino increased or decreased demand for the cruise, it would affect fares. It's all about the demand.

[OceanLiner]

This argument of whether Disney should allow drinking at age 18 while in the Mediterranean, and that the OP’s friends feel cheated for DCL adhering to their age 21 policy is patently a false argument and I cannot believe that I did not see through this at an earlier date.

DCL sails throughout the Caribbean where the drinking age is consistently 18 years of age except for US possessions. Mexico, the Bahamas, and Saint Maarten are all 18 years of age. The policy of age 21 while on board DCL is strictly and consistently enforced without exception in all of these waters without negative criticism.

So the idea that DCL has unexpectedly enforced a policy of age 21 in an area where the drinking age is lower is completely without merit, because DCL sails its ships every day to waters where the age limit is lower than the ships rules. It is their ship and therefore their rules and none of this should come as surprise to anyone. Also, if the OP’s friends know so much about the policies of other ships it would seem that they should have also researched the DCL policy.

[flagger]

I am sorry but the above argument is completely without merit. The Caribbean cruises are primarily marketed to an American crowd where the drinking age is 21. As Magic has never sailed in the Med before except to sail TA from Fincantieri on its maiden passengerless voyage, Europeans booking on this cruise would have no idea what to expect.

 

I don't blame them from being a little irked, but I know there parents will accomodate them.

[HurricaneSally]

I am sorry but the above argument is completely without merit. The Caribbean cruises are primarily marketed to an American crowd where the drinking age is 21. As Magic has never sailed in the Med before except to sail TA from Fincantieri on its maiden passengerless voyage, Europeans booking on this cruise would have no idea what to expect.

 

I don't blame them from being a little irked, but I know there parents will accomodate them.

 

 

It is really obnoxious when you insist your friends will break the rules so their kids can drink. So what if they drink, just be quiet about it, for goodness sake.

[Rudi610]

I am sorry but the above argument is completely without merit. The Caribbean cruises are primarily marketed to an American crowd where the drinking age is 21. As Magic has never sailed in the Med before except to sail TA from Fincantieri on its maiden passengerless voyage, Europeans booking on this cruise would have no idea what to expect.

 

It is my understanding that the Disney Med cruises are being marketed mainly to the American crowd as well. A chance for them to get a taste of Europe--Disney style (family style). For those that have been on the Disney Med cruises, where are most of the passengers from. Those posts that I have read seem to point to American's making up most of the passengers. Thus I also applaud Disney and their choice of keeping the drinking age at 21. And Europeans that are surprised by this rule obviously did not do their homework. I would also bet that most Europeans sailing on these cruises are not between the ages of 18 and 21, thus the rule does not affect them (however, I guess your friends fall into that small minority). So this rule really will affect a very small minority of the passengers.

[Disneycruisers]

This argument of whether Disney should allow drinking at age 18 while in the Mediterranean, and that the OP’s friends feel cheated for DCL adhering to their age 21 policy is patently a false argument and I cannot believe that I did not see through this at an earlier date.

DCL sails throughout the Caribbean where the drinking age is consistently 18 years of age except for US possessions. Mexico, the Bahamas, and Saint Maarten are all 18 years of age. The policy of age 21 while on board DCL is strictly and consistently enforced without exception in all of these waters without negative criticism.

So the idea that DCL has unexpectedly enforced a policy of age 21 in an area where the drinking age is lower is completely without merit, because DCL sails its ships every day to waters where the age limit is lower than the ships rules. It is their ship and therefore their rules and none of this should come as surprise to anyone. Also, if the OP’s friends know so much about the policies of other ships it would seem that they should have also researched the DCL policy.

 

Great point!!

 

Rob

[metrowon]

I love how everyone has this assumption that 18-20 year olds from Europe will be falling down drunk if DCL serves them booze.

 

It has always been the older adults that I have seen that have been the most obnoxious. It is not the 21 year olds who can drink.

You won't hijack this webste concearning DCL. Metrowon

[xlRacerXlx]

Why does this matter? I've never seen anyone get ****-faced drunk, besides in route 66, on a DCL ship, and it's usually some idiot 40-year-old, not someone younger. People don't come on DCL to drink/party, they come for Mickey, and pixie dust, and DISNEY.

 

If you want to drink, or party, or whatever, there are 15 other cruise lines that offer cheaper rates, younger drinking ages, and more party animals.

 

I don't see why this is a factor. If an 18 year old wants to get as drunk as possible before keeling over, they can do it inland. If they want a simple drink, they can do it in the privacy of their stateroom, and not get caught. I'm sorry if lack of a glass of wine or a beer completely ruins your dining experience, but it really shouldn't.

[RachieLnnn]

Grow up! Most of the world has a much lower drinking age. The US is probably one of the strictest at 21. In Canada it's either 18 or 19. You can drink alcohol with parental purchase at a young age in most of Europe. And the normal drinking age is 18, often with meals it's as low as 16.

 

The reason that so many people have so much trouble with drinking is that their parents shelter them and make it taboo. Instead of teaching the right time and place for alcohol, they are told it is a forbidden fruit and then when they overreact to finally being legally allowed to have some, they go over the deep end.

 

The incidence of alcohol abuse are higher in the US despite the fact that they generally get to drink 2 to 3 years after Canadians can legally drink. I wonder if there is a connection between preventing them to drink and alcohol abuse? Hmm.... Wonder which country has the highest incidence of abuse among students in the western world? You guessed it, the US.

 

And if you want to talk about the original reason for raising the drinking age to 21 was to avoid drinking and driving... well, the country with the lowest decline in drinking and driving in the Western world was.... you guessed it, the United States.

 

(I'm sorry, I get a little upset when people don't use any real FACTS to back up their comments. Prove to me that limiting alcohol to those over 21 actually works and I'm with you, but all the data suggests that not only does it not work, it's actually detrimental. Not to mention that anyone who isn't American on the ship is subject to a silly rule that doesn't make sense for them. A 19 year old Canadian can purchase alcohol legally at home and legally at a port of call, but not on the ship? Get real!)

 

Actually, your comments are not 100% backed up, either. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I did not see any quotes or articles mentioned to back up your opinions. I happened to just read a very interesting article in Newsweek about teen binge drinking. Guess what country had the highest rate? Denmark, then France, then England, then the U.S. way down the line. To tell you the truth, I was surprised.

 

Before I read that article, I would have agreed with you that alcohol can be a "forbidden fruit" to teens. I thought that it was more likely for kids will go "crazy" when going to college if they suddenly had the freedom to drink for the first time in their lives. In some cases, sure, this can be true, but I think more often than not teens mimic their parents when it comes to responsibility about alcohol. I think the feeling of being drunk for the first few times is a novelty to many teens (no matter what country they are from), and if they can get their hands on it, they will drink it.

 

Looking back, I've realized that I never drank as a teen because I knew my parents would be extremely upset (to say it mildly) if I did. However, when I got to college, I didn't go crazy. By that time in my life, I had grown up enough to realize that there are alot of ways to have fun, and not all have to involve alcohol. Sure I drank now and then, but I always was responsible.

 

I have seen some parents go too far in the opposite direction and provide alcohol to their teenagers and their teen's friends so that they seem like cool hip parents. In my opinion, this is just wrong.

 

I think we basically agree because I also think the drinking age should be lowered to 18 or 19... I would just draw the line at letting high school aged kids drink because they aren't adults yet, and their bodies may not be able to process it properly. I just can't condone letting high schoolers binge drink so that they get "used" to the feeling merely to prevent them from later in life becoming alcoholics. That makes NO sense to me whatsoever. (Not saying that you said that, either, JMO)

 

I would be interested in any articles you have on the subject regarding alcoholism in the U.S. vs. Europe.

 

To get back to the original subject, I don't think there is an easy answer for cruise lines. In an ideal world, people would be responsible for themselves and their children. Unfortunately there are those who overindulge no matter what age, hence why cruiselines have to make rules.

[Oihane]

Pfft. Deal with it. I don't care what the drinking age is in the country that the Magic or Wonder happens to be in, or where you're from. This isn't about what the drinking age should be and where. This is DCL's policy, and if you can't stand not having a drink for what, 11 days? doesn't seem quite right to me...seems a little sad, imo. Besides, it isn't even actually the full 11 days, as you can drink at the ports....so, big freakin' deal. I don't care if this is just about principle..."I could drink where I live and then suddenly I can't"...it's the policy of the cruise ship. they have their reasons for doing this, and like many other posters said, if you don't like it, then go on a different cruise line. If you really can't enjoy yourself without drinking, then that's sad to me.

 

I don't have a problem with drinking itself, I think it's fine as long as you do it responsibly (though too many don't). And yeah, the US is alone in their high drinking age, and whether or not it's the right thing to do (with alcohol abuse levels, etc), that isn't the point. It's DCL's decision, so deal with it. It should still be a great cruise anyway.

 

I don't mean to be offensive about this, though I'm pretty sure you will take it that way, but seriously, complaining about this like it pretty much is going to ruin your cruise is rather ridiculous. there's a lot more to life than alcohol.

[Nobbi]

I'm sorry if lack of a glass of wine or a beer completely ruins your dining experience, but it really shouldn't.

 

I'm not underage, but this would be exactly my point. I don't need to get drunk at port. I don't want to have all my meals in my room. The DCL dining room experiences are great. I don't need to get drunk in my room onboard.

 

I believe that many US residents just don't get it. In order to enjoy a good meal, one doesn't want some yucky sweet soda which will turn chicken bones into rubber. Some want a nice glass of Zinfandel or Syrah or a Malbec. If I can't have that, it will ruin my dining experience. Perhaps some won't understand. That's fine.

 

And I do believe that people should not book this cruise if this affects them.

 

But I love the DCL cruises. If it were to affect me, I'd be upset. I remember my parents taking me to the Empress Lily at the Buena Vista Shopping Village in the 70's. (Y'all know what that is now.) He ordered wine for all of us. I was around 14. He "informed" the waitress that I was 18, the drinking age at the time. When she balked, he insisted on having me drink from his glass. I actually did not want to at the time since I wanted to "obey" the law and not make a scene at 14.

 

So, do y'all get the point. :) :) Probably not.:p But I understand. I'm a shrink after all. :D

[babyher]

I'm not underage, but this would be exactly my point. I don't need to get drunk at port. I don't want to have all my meals in my room. The DCL dining room experiences are great. I don't need to get drunk in my room onboard.

 

I believe that many US residents just don't get it. In order to enjoy a good meal, one doesn't want some yucky sweet soda which will turn chicken bones into rubber. Some want a nice glass of Zinfandel or Syrah or a Malbec. If I can't have that, it will ruin my dining experience. Perhaps some won't understand. That's fine.

 

And I do believe that people should not book this cruise if this affects them.

 

But I love the DCL cruises. If it were to affect me, I'd be upset. I remember my parents taking me to the Empress Lily at the Buena Vista Shopping Village in the 70's. (Y'all know what that is now.) He ordered wine for all of us. I was around 14. He "informed" the waitress that I was 18, the drinking age at the time. When she balked, he insisted on having me drink from his glass. I actually did not want to at the time since I wanted to "obey" the law and not make a scene at 14.

 

So, do y'all get the point. :) :) Probably not.:p But I understand. I'm a shrink after all. :D

 

 

I understand what you are saying

I was not brought up in Europe , but I grew up with grandparents that were. (Italian) Alcohol was never some big taboo thing.

 

When I was kid if you had a fever , you were given tea with a little whiskey and sent to bed to sweat it out . You had a belly ache, you got a little shot of blackberry brandy. You rubbed a little wine on a babies gums when they were teething. A liitle juice glass of wine at a family meal especially with pasta . The same little juice glass with a little beer in it was a right of passage watching the ball game with your dad and your uncles.

 

And guess what? Not an alocoholic in the whole (rather large) family.

 

OK one uncle , but like my grandfather warned my aunt "You marry out of your own kind and you get what you get" *LOL*

[Nobbi]

I understand what you are saying

I was not brought up in Europe , but I grew up with grandparents that were. (Italian) Alcohol was never some big taboo thing.

 

When I was kid if you had a fever , you were given tea with a little whiskey and sent to bed to sweat it out . You had a belly ache, you got a little shot of blackberry brandy. You rubbed a little wine on a babies gums when they were teething. A liitle juice glass of wine at a family meal especially with pasta . The same little juice glass with a little beer in it was a right of passage watching the ball game with your dad and your uncles.

 

And guess what? Not an alocoholic in the whole (rather large) family.

 

OK one uncle , but like my grandfather warned my aunt "You marry out of your own kind and you get what you get" *LOL*

 

 

Your post makes me smile. :) It reminds me of my childhood before moving to the US. At around 6 or 7, after coming in from the snow all cold, my dad would have me take a hot foot bath and drink a shot of "Schnaps" which which is a German eau de vie/aquavit made from fruit. (It's clear, not sweet, closer to Vodka or Grappa.)

 

BTW, just booked another Disney cruise for my birthday next June. :p

[Sarah's Dad]

I believe that many US residents just don't get it. In order to enjoy a good meal, one doesn't want some yucky sweet soda which will turn chicken bones into rubber. Some want a nice glass of Zinfandel or Syrah or a Malbec. If I can't have that, it will ruin my dining experience. Perhaps some won't understand. That's fine.

 

I don't drink alcohol or soda with dinner, but I guess some need alcohol with dinner. I guess you can own it up to taste just like smokers who say they smoke for the taste.

 

The OP was disappointed that 18 - 20 year old cruisers couldn't drink on the Med cruises. Out of all the things to be concerned or disappointed about in regard to 18 - 20 year olds this isn't on my radar.

 

Maybe you're right...Americans place way too much importance on alcohol so perhaps the parents who will give these cruisers drinks need to reevaluate what is important.

[Sarah's Dad]

So conversely, if they had a casino, they could reduce fares?

Not likely, they'll continue to charge as much as they can to maximize their profit until the higher fares begin to cause a drop in demand and profit; going over the top of the curve so to speak.

However, if the casino increased or decreased demand for the cruise, it would affect fares. It's all about the demand.

 

It is funny to read a dissenting opinion on this subject.

 

There are hundreds of factors that go into determining how much a company will charge for their service, but you seem to know best and I am not going to bother teaching a class in business economics so I am wrong and of course you are absolutely correct. :p

[babyher]

Your post makes me smile. :) It reminds me of my childhood before moving to the US. At around 6 or 7, after coming in from the snow all cold, my dad would have me take a hot foot bath and drink a shot of "Schnaps" which which is a German eau de vie/aquavit made from fruit. (It's clear, not sweet, closer to Vodka or Grappa.)

 

BTW, just booked another Disney cruise for my birthday next June. :p

 

 

My grandfather used to make grappa, along with homemade wine.

I remember he had a huge fruit and vegetable garden and he would slice up the fruit Peaches, cherries etc. and soak them in brandy I believe in jar. Oh God they were so good.

 

Well, let me be the one to wish you a very early Happy Birthday for next June, and have a great cruise :)

[Nobbi]

My grandfather used to make grappa, along with homemade wine.

I remember he had a huge fruit and vegetable garden and he would slice up the fruit Peaches, cherries etc. and soak them in brandy I believe in jar. Oh God they were so good.

 

Well, let me be the one to wish you a very early Happy Birthday for next June, and have a great cruise :)

 

 

Molto grazie per tutti! Vielen Dank fuer alles! Many thanks for all!

 

I'm enjoying a wonderful American brandy which rivals any French Cognac.