As You Wish Dining - Opinions, Comments and Discussions

[SharonN]

No, you were not. It depended on whether early or late dining was still available at the time you booked. If you booked early enough, both were available. Later, only one was available. The current system is only a little different in that it seems that, in this first year of the program, the traditional seatings are booking-up earlier than before. However, the point of my message was that if there isn't availability, and it is a critical aspect for you, then don't book.

 

Part of the problem is they announced the new system after some of us had booked so we didn't have the choice to not book if we couldn't get the type of dining we wanted. I booked a Jan cruise in June and was put on the Waiting list for Late Upper Seating. My worst case at that point was I'd get a different time which I could certainly live with. However, now they've announced that AYW will start on the Rotterdam on my sailing. So now my worst case is I could get stuck with AYW and that won't be ok for me. I've checked with my PCC who said I'm within the top 20 on the waiting list so I "should" be ok but that doesn't mean I'm not going to worry about it some until I know for sure. In the future I definitely won't book unless I know I can get Traditional Dining but that doesn't help for this trip.

[RevNeal]

Part of the problem is they announced the new system after some of us had booked so we didn't have the choice to not book if we couldn't get the type of dining we wanted. I booked a Jan cruise in June and was put on the Waiting list for Late Upper Seating. My worst case at that point was I'd get a different time which I could certainly live with. However, now they've announced that AYW will start on the Rotterdam on my sailing. So now my worst case is I could get stuck with AYW and that won't be ok for me. I've checked with my PCC who said I'm within the top 20 on the waiting list so I "should" be ok but that doesn't mean I'm not going to worry about it some until I know for sure. In the future I definitely won't book unless I know I can get Traditional Dining but that doesn't help for this trip.

 

Don't forget, Sharon ... you'll be aboard the Rotterdam with RuthC, myself, and several other great CCers who are going to try and arrange our dining times together. Hence, IF we get AYW then we'll just have to arrange our dining times together, at the same time and at the same table, so as to ameliorate the discomfort and dissatisfaction and circumvent the nominal inconveniences of not having Traditional. :) In short ... we won't be subject to the chance of eating alone even if we get AYW.

[SharonN]

And that is a shame. People shouldn't be made to feel bad about making the best decision for themselves.

 

It was even worse than that. They were downright nasty. They personally attacked some people and "laughed behind our backs" on another board because they couldn't understand our reasons for wanting Traditional Dining. I was already having a difficult time dealing with the 1st anniversary of my husband's death and certainly didn't need those type of comments. Yes I understand I put myself up for it by posting in the first place so I backed off for a couple of weeks. It shouldn't be that hard to understand why those of us traveling solo would prefer Traditional Dining. Even if my husband were still alive I'd still prefer it but now that I have to travel solo it's that much more important. I don't think any of us has a problem with HAL adding the AYW option as long as it doesn't impact us being able to have the Traditional Dining we want. I know we'll have to wait and see but that's going to take a while at this point!

[SharonN]

Don't forget, Sharon ... you'll be aboard the Rotterdam with RuthC, myself, and several other great CCers who are going to try and arrange our dining times together. Hence, IF we get AYW then we'll just have to arrange our dining times together, at the same time and at the same table, so as to ameliorate the discomfort and dissatisfaction and circumvent the nominal inconveniences of not having Traditional. :) In short ... we won't be subject to the chance of eating alone even if we get AYW.

 

Thanks! I guess that's making the best of the situation! :) I'm looking forward to meeting all of you and I'm sure it will be a great trip. It's always a bit difficult to try something new like this on my own but the other options (i.e. staying home and not traveling) are definitely worse!

[hammybee]

Okay so does HAL still have the baked alaska/farewell song with AYW dining? If so, how does it work? I guess if you have 2nd sitting it is less chaotic, but if early I am sure it is confusing and harried (if they still have it).

 

I really hope they do.. I haven't had any in years..12 to be exact:eek: These are going to be the longest 5 mos. of my life...lol..trying to talk dBF into a tux. Some progress made though... he actually tried one on :cool:

 

Laura

 

Sorry Laura , I cannot answer this question. I am uncomfortable with the whole Parade of the Baked Alaska thing and avoid the dining room, on this night.

[hammybee]

Prices haven't really come down here, but the absorption rate (time places are on the market) is long. We are getting a Trump Tower here though so that is the talk of the town.

 

Laura

Feel free to email me at lyndouglas@sbcglobal.net so we can take shop talk, off-line.;)

[NHBob]

Have we beaten this subject to death yet? Probably, so I think I'll shut up for a while. After all, I have until the 12/31 final payment date to decide whether to cancel and absorb the non refundable insurance cost and fee for cancelling a frequent flier ticket. I'm tempted, having just learned that the Music of Your Life folks are in final contract negotiations for a Caribbean cruise with a group led by Buddy Morrow on Fred. Olsen's new Balmoral (former Norwegian Crown) in March 2008.

 

I continue to hope things will work out, even if I don't have traditional dining confirmation before boarding and decide to go anyway. In the past when I have wanted to change something on board, the Maitre d' has always been accommodating, usually seating me at an officer's table on Crystal and Cunard Caronia. I guess there is some advantage to being a solo male passenger - there are not a lot of us. As I said, I don't have to make a go-no go decision until December.

 

Bob

[HeatherInFlorida]

Originally Posted by HeatherInFlorida

............YES we were assured of our choice.

 

No, you were not. It depended on whether early or late dining was still available at the time you booked. If you booked early enough, both were available. Later, only one was available. ................

 

 

Bicker, I really don't want to go back and forth with you on this, but YES WE WERE assured of our choice at the time we booked. I'm not sure why you're bickering with me about this.

 

What I said was that we received a reservation with the words "Confirmed" on it which (to me) is assurance that we are confirmed for our choice. So I can't understand why you are saying we were NOT.

 

The difference from that currently, as I explained earlier, is that a few posters have said that this is no longer necessarily the case. They are told they're "confirmed" Traditional but once on board, there is not room for them in "Traditional".

 

I'm only reporting what I have read ... not a personal experience. So here on this thread, all I am trying to say is that if this is true, it's not fair.

 

As to what was in the past and what is now, I'm confused that you're posting about this because I'm sure I you posted earlier that you were "new" to all this on HAL. Not sure if that was a post on this thread or one of the others, but you definitely said you were "new". So how would you know what's different about the current system as opposed to the former system?

 

As an individual, I am not meaningless. I may be to HAL, but I am not to me. And all we're doing here on this board is discussing our own personal reaction to change that affects us personally. At the end of the day, I am paying for my cruise ... HAL is not paying me. So I get to choose what I want on our cruise. When the day comes that HAL ceases to give me what I want, I will no longer cruise on HAL ... no loss to HAL ... I understand that.

 

I'm not nearly there yet, but along the way as more and more change and adjustment is forced on me, I will fight to the death for what I prefer.

 

I may not get it and I understand that, but I won't go down quietly. And that will come as no surprise to anyone who knows me here;) :D.

[bUU]

Bicker, I really don't want to go back and forth with you on this, but YES WE WERE assured of our choice at the time we booked.

I wasn't talking about a change that might have been inflicted on you. I was referring to the fact that booking a cruise a passenger hasn't ever been assured their choice of dining time, before they booked. It was always based on availability.

 

What I said was that we received a reservation with the words "Confirmed" on it which (to me) is assurance that we are confirmed for our choice.

I agree completely.

 

As an individual, I am not meaningless. I may be to HAL, but I am not to me.

My comment was with regard to significance to the market.

 

no loss to HAL ... I understand that.

A lot of people don't. Credit to you.

[HeatherInFlorida]

..... I was referring to the fact that booking a cruise a passenger hasn't ever been assured their choice of dining time, before they booked. It was always based on availability.

.............

 

Yes, of course. However, in the past when I receive my reservation after making my deposit, I get a "confirmation". On that paper it has always stated whether I am "waitlisted" or "confirmed" for my dining choice.

 

If I'm not happy with "waitlist" at that time, I can cancel and my deposit is refunded.

 

What has been expressed here is that with this addition of a "choice" of Traditional or AYW, people are booking 8, 10, 12 months out and even now being told they are waitlisted for Traditional. And we're told this is because they are only confirming a small number so that they allow room for groups, suites and the like.

 

And these people may not be told whether or not they'll get their choice until AFTER they've made final payment when it's too late to get their money back.

 

That is my only issue with this ... I have no problem at all with AYW dining as long as I can dine as I wish :).

[DougK]

I'm one of those that is actively looking forward to open seating being implemented on all HAL ships. In fact, it's one of the factors that is moving me away from being a Celebrity loyalist, and nudging HAL ahead. Although I have not had the pleasure of having open seating on a large ship yet, I have sailed on Windstar a few times, and loved the open seating there. And I'm scheduled for Azamara later this year.

 

Although we won't know for certain until it's fully implemented, my expectation is that there will not generally be long waits for tables. Open seating simply involves a more efficient use of table space. Under traditional, there's no use for a table after the first diners have left until the time for the second seating rolls around, no matter how much later that is. Nor is there any usage of tables at all when people choose to dine elsewhere (Lido, Pinnacle Grille, or room service). As these other options grow, that's a significant waste of space. On my cruise last week, I looked around the dining room and saw numerous empty tables each day (except for the days when I myself wasn't there to see because I was eating elsewhere). Even under so-called traditional seating, it's clear that many people are choosing alternative options. My guess is that open seating is intended, in part, to eliminate the demand for those other alternatives -- especially room service. I assume room service has to be the most costly way to deliver food, and I know that I will be less likely to use room service if instead I can just go to the dining room when I want. Note also that the hours for open seating are somewhat longer than traditional dining, starting 15 minutes earlier and running 45 minutes later. Some people will surely want to use those times, decreasing demand during the peak periods.

 

I doubt service will suffer much, if at all. My personal experience has been that the days of developing a relationship with your waiter are already past. With reductions in staff, they're simply too busy to do so. While I remember that fondly from my first cruises, and can still recall those early waiters, I have no memory of more recent waiters, just as I have no memory of waiters at most of the restaurants I go to. I remember in general how good or poor service has been overall, but not much in personalities because we haven't had the opportunity to talk much.

 

I similarly doubt there will be much effect one way or the other on tipping. Many people will just leave the auto-tip in place, as many do now. But if the overall level of service is high, the auto-tip will be adjusted upward. That's how I've dealt with it on Windstar -- I don't try to figure out particular people to tip extra, but instead recognize that it's a team effort and reward the team accordingly, usually well beyond the recommended amount. On my most recent HAL cruise I left the auto-tip in place because I didn't feel like I received service out of the ordinary.

 

Doug

[DougK]

Logistically, I think open seating has to mean the end of the Baked Alaska parade. That, by itself, is enough reason to cheer the coming of open seating. IMO.

 

Doug

[bermuda triangle]

Doug,

Even on NCL, room service is still available and there is no additional charge for it. So even with their multiple dining options people still opt for it. Many people with balconies choose to use it in place of breakfast in the dining room or the buffet.

Laura

[hammybee]

I doubt service will suffer much, if at all. My personal experience has been that the days of developing a relationship with your waiter are already past. With reductions in staff, they're simply too busy to do so. While I remember that fondly from my first cruises, and can still recall those early waiters, I have no memory of more recent waiters, just as I have no memory of waiters at most of the restaurants I go to. I remember in general how good or poor service has been overall, but not much in personalities because we haven't had the opportunity to talk much.

 

Doug

 

Thank you Doug, for your thoughtful analysis of the situation. Long ago, I accepted that when I choose to cruise, I am sharing my vacation with 1000-2000 other people and it's going to mean somewhere along the line, something I wish for , gets compromized along the way. That I continue to pay the same or less than I did ten years ago, for a better appointed cabin helps me rationalize a lot of stuff.

[HeatherInFlorida]

......................

My personal experience has been that the days of developing a relationship with your waiter are already past. With reductions in staff, they're simply too busy to do so. ....................Doug

 

I'm afraid I can't agree. This may be true of your experience on HAL, but it's not true on all lines. I hate to keep applauding Celebrity, but there are 2000 people on their M-class ships (very comparable to HAL's Vista) and the relationship between waiter and passenger hasn't suffered at all.

 

They know my name, they know the food I like, they remember my iced tea or that I love chocolate for dessert, they remember to bring cheese and crackers before dinner, they even flirt a little bit (which I happen to love because it reminds me of the good old days). It is exceptional.

 

That said, I have no complaints about HAL's DR service so far (except on the Prinsendam, but that was a fluke I think) ... I just don't think it's that personal and it can be a bit rushed.

 

I don't agree with Hammybee. The service I receive on a 2000 passenger ship has not changed from the service I received on one with 650 passengers. In some ways it's better ... certainly in the cabin. Let's not forget that it's the crew to passenger ratio that counts, not how many passengers on the ship.

 

I expect to give up nothing and I haven't. Maybe my "wish list" is shorter, but so far it's always been fulfilled:) .

[hammybee]

I don't agree with Hammybee. The service I receive on a 2000 passenger ship has not changed from the service I received on one with 650 passengers. In some ways it's better ... certainly in the cabin. Let's not forget that it's the crew to passenger ratio that counts, not how many passengers on the ship.

 

:) .

 

Oh Heather, I did not make myself clear. I meant that when I choose to share my vacation with 1000-2000 others, it's not all about me. I would feel the same if the number was 500.

[hammybee]

Logistically, I think open seating has to mean the end of the Baked Alaska parade. That, by itself, is enough reason to cheer the coming of open seating. IMO.

 

Doug

 

I too don't care for the Parade of the Baked Alaska and avoid the entire dining room. So even though we had AYW dining on our last cruise, I ate elsewhere on that night. Our cabin was above the fixed seating Dining Room and I can tell you that the Parade happened as usual, in that venue.

 

I think there are more people who enjoy this than not, and it will persist.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Oh Heather, I did not make myself clear. I meant that when I choose to share my vacation with 1000-2000 others, it's not all about me. I would feel the same if the number was 500.

 

LOL! Well, I agree there!:D It's not all about me either. But it stopped being about me a lot of years ago;) . It was a little bit of a shock, but somehow I handled it. It's only all about me when I go to sleep at night. :)

[DougK]

I'm afraid I can't agree. This may be true of your experience on HAL, but it's not true on all lines. I hate to keep applauding Celebrity, but there are 2000 people on their M-class ships (very comparable to HAL's Vista) and the relationship between waiter and passenger hasn't suffered at all.

 

 

It just goes to show how each of our experiences differ. My first two cruises over a decade ago were on Celebrity, and I had wonderful waiters that we talked with and had a good relationship with. But two more recent cruises on Celebrity had much different experiences -- professional service, but rushed and with no time to chat. One was on the Zenith, and one on the Mercury; I haven't yet been on a M-class ship. In addition to the variable of the waiters themselves, I wonder if table size is also a factor. I've always been at small tables (2 or 4); is your experience at a small table or a larger table?

 

Doug

[HeatherInFlorida]

Doug, table size could make a difference and my more recent Celebrity cruises were on M-class ... those are the ones I'm talking about. In 1997 on Horizon, the service was minimal ... not even memorable. We were stuck in a corner and basically forgotten.

 

The cruises that were so wonderful were on the Millennium in 2003 and the Summit in 2005.

 

And we tables for 8, but each time we had only 6. The waiter each time only handled 3 tables (2 6's and a 4, I think). So you can imagine how good the service would be.

 

Our waiter told us that he could choose from 3 to 5 tables. He personally liked 3 because he'd rather do a great job at 3 than average or worse at 5. My guess is that because of that choice he did much better with tips, too. Sometimes less is more:) .

[DougK]

Again, we have a variance in personal experience. Both of my memorable waiters were on the Horizon, first in 1995 (Pedro) and again in 1997 (Marco). Service was excellent and personal. I'm sorry you received minimal service on the same ship at the same time.

 

Doug

[Odd Ball]

Yes, of course. However, in the past when I receive my reservation after making my deposit, I get a "confirmation". On that paper it has always stated whether I am "waitlisted" or "confirmed" for my dining choice.

 

If I'm not happy with "waitlist" at that time, I can cancel and my deposit is refunded.

 

What has been expressed here is that with this addition of a "choice" of Traditional or AYW, people are booking 8, 10, 12 months out and even now being told they are waitlisted for Traditional. And we're told this is because they are only confirming a small number so that they allow room for groups, suites and the like.

 

And these people may not be told whether or not they'll get their choice until AFTER they've made final payment when it's too late to get their money back.

 

That is my only issue with this ... I have no problem at all with AYW dining as long as I can dine as I wish :).

 

I also want to Dine As I Wish. :) I don't want to be told I have to wait to see what dining I have.

In the past I would not book a cruise unless my dining time could be comfirmed. I pay good hard earned money for my cruises and not knowing or being put on a waitlist is not exceptable. I have always booked far out and I do not like the idea of being waitlisted so far in advance. :mad:

[Marmarjudy]

I'm one of those that is actively looking forward to open seating being implemented on all HAL ships. In fact, it's one of the factors that is moving me away from being a Celebrity loyalist, and nudging HAL ahead. Although I have not had the pleasure of having open seating on a large ship yet, I have sailed on Windstar a few times, and loved the open seating there. And I'm scheduled for Azamara later this year.

 

Although we won't know for certain until it's fully implemented, my expectation is that there will not generally be long waits for tables. Open seating simply involves a more efficient use of table space. Under traditional, there's no use for a table after the first diners have left until the time for the second seating rolls around, no matter how much later that is. Nor is there any usage of tables at all when people choose to dine elsewhere (Lido, Pinnacle Grille, or room service). As these other options grow, that's a significant waste of space. On my cruise last week, I looked around the dining room and saw numerous empty tables each day (except for the days when I myself wasn't there to see because I was eating elsewhere). Even under so-called traditional seating, it's clear that many people are choosing alternative options. My guess is that open seating is intended, in part, to eliminate the demand for those other alternatives -- especially room service. I assume room service has to be the most costly way to deliver food, and I know that I will be less likely to use room service if instead I can just go to the dining room when I want. Note also that the hours for open seating are somewhat longer than traditional dining, starting 15 minutes earlier and running 45 minutes later. Some people will surely want to use those times, decreasing demand during the peak periods.

 

I doubt service will suffer much, if at all. My personal experience has been that the days of developing a relationship with your waiter are already past. With reductions in staff, they're simply too busy to do so. While I remember that fondly from my first cruises, and can still recall those early waiters, I have no memory of more recent waiters, just as I have no memory of waiters at most of the restaurants I go to. I remember in general how good or poor service has been overall, but not much in personalities because we haven't had the opportunity to talk much.

 

I similarly doubt there will be much effect one way or the other on tipping. Many people will just leave the auto-tip in place, as many do now. But if the overall level of service is high, the auto-tip will be adjusted upward. That's how I've dealt with it on Windstar -- I don't try to figure out particular people to tip extra, but instead recognize that it's a team effort and reward the team accordingly, usually well beyond the recommended amount. On my most recent HAL cruise I left the auto-tip in place because I didn't feel like I received service out of the ordinary.

 

Doug

 

This post reflects our very positive experiences on Princess with the anytime dining.

 

Bonding with the wait staff is not an important part of our cruising experience, especially knowing that most of it is a shallow, repeated act on their part to increase their tips. Do you really think they like to answer those personal questions about their family, country, etc., over and over?? Would you ask those questions to a waiter in the States that you will never see again? That is their job, to be polite and subserviant, and no offense to them, but it is painful for us to watch. The expereince with the wait staff has actually been just the opposite for us on several assigned seating cruises....we were stuck with adequate but irritating servers for the entire cruise. They weren't bad enough to ask for a table change, but sure didn't add to the dining experience.

 

A few times on Princess, with anytime dining, we found a wait team we loved in the anytime dining room and requested them for the rest of the cruise, at a time of our choosing. In those cases, we tipped that team additional directly. On other cruises, we just left the auto tip in place.

 

A couple of other important points that I don't think have been brought up about the anytime dining: It seems the food is much fresher.......especially the main course....it hasn't been sitting there waiting to be served to the masses at a certain time. It is brought out for you, when you order it, and hasn't been piled on a tray with 15 others. You also don't have to wait for the other tables to give their order, be finished before you get your next course, etc. The dining experience is that of a good restaurant instead of a banquet hall.

 

I truly hope all of you traditional dining lovers get your choice of traditional, but please understand that not all cruisers enjoy the regimentation/cattle call of assigned traditional. You can turn the anytime into traditional with a chat with the maitre de. Traditionals quickly change their mind once they understand the flexibility available, which explains the large numbers of traditionals on Princess that switch to anytime when they understand the concept. Please keep an open mind.

 

Speaking from the experience of 20+ cruises, on most every major line, except Holland, which we are now considering....

 

Judy

[RevNeal]

I truly hope all of you traditional dining lovers get your choice of traditional, but please understand that not all cruisers enjoy the regimentation/cattle call of assigned traditional. You can turn the anytime into traditional with a chat with the maitre de. Traditionals quickly change their mind once they understand the flexibility available, which explains the large numbers of traditionals on Princess that switch to anytime when they understand the concept. Please keep an open mind.

 

Judy, thank you for your observations. However ... and I'm trying to be gentle in saying this ... please be VERY careful about the "regimentation/cattle call" language. It's pejorative, negative, and non-reflective of what Traditional Dining on HAL all all been about. Indeed, it is mostly just a stereotype of Traditional that has been generated by a marketing agency to sell cruises. Also, please note that some of us Traditionalists have very specific reasons for not liking the AYW/anytime schemes; many of us solo/single cruises, for instance, have very SPECIFIC and highly particular reasons for not wanting to be a part of the AYW system. Flexibility can very well be nice -- and it has long-existed on HAL in the Lido and, more recently, in the Marco Polo and Pinnacle Grills -- but when the trade-off for flexibility is an uncomfortable uncertainty about with whom/where/when a solo diner will be eating, night after night, the benefits of "flexibility" dim. I eat alone most nights in my life ... I cruise for the socialization, getting to know and enjoy a while cruise with my dining partners. Changing dining partners every night -- or eating along because there's not anyone who wants a lone guy to join their couple/family/group for dinner -- is not my idea of "fun."

 

Contrary to what you suggest, we DO have open minds. But we also have reasonable, rational, real concerns about AYW and how it will be implemented and how we solo-cruisers will be treated in the process. In other words, please realize that these concerns do not make us closed-minded.

[NHBob]

Judy, thank you for your observations. However ... and I'm trying to be gentle in saying this ... please be VERY careful about the "regimentation/cattle call" language. It's pejorative, negative, and non-reflective of what Traditional Dining on HAL all all been about. Indeed, it is mostly just a stereotype of Traditional that has been generated by a marketing agency to sell cruises. Also, please note that some of us Traditionalists have very specific reasons for not liking the AYW/anytime schemes; many of us solo/single cruises, for instance, have very SPECIFIC and highly particular reasons for not wanting to be a part of the AYW system. Flexibility can very well be nice -- and it has long-existed on HAL in the Lido and, more recently, in the Marco Polo and Pinnacle Grills -- but when the trade-off for flexibility is an uncomfortable uncertainty about with whom/where/when a solo diner will be eating, night after night, the benefits of "flexibility" dim. I eat alone most nights in my life ... I cruise for the socialization, getting to know and enjoy a while cruise with my dining partners. Changing dining partners every night -- or eating along because there's not anyone who wants a lone guy to join their couple/family/group for dinner -- is not my idea of "fun."

 

Contrary to what you suggest, we DO have open minds. But we also have reasonable, rational, real concerns about AYW and how it will be implemented and how we solo-cruisers will be treated in the process. In other words, please realize that these concerns do not make us closed-minded.

 

Well said!

Solo Cruiser Bob