Sandytoes Posted July 12, 2007 #101 Share Posted July 12, 2007 If there is one standard rule in tipping it is this: If someone renders special service to you along the way, show your appreciation with a tip. Most of the crew rely on your handouts to make a living. They should never be punished monetarily for something they can't control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maracucha Posted July 12, 2007 #102 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Although I access this website frequently to find specific information about an upcoming cruise, I never signed up to actually participate in the forums. But, after reading these two particular entries, I felt compelled to join just so I could comment that I've never read anything so mean-sprited and contemptuous. ----Thought the forum system would quote the entry I was referring to---Happyscot's comments. Sorry, you can tell I'm new at the forum game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regnig Posted July 12, 2007 #103 Share Posted July 12, 2007 I have a firm grasp on the cultural differences on the issue of “tipping”. For land based services that discussion will and can go on forever. There are merits to both sides of the issue. BUT if there is one aspect to this debate on auto-tipping aboard a cruise ship (Princess isn’t the only line that does that folks) that I don’t understand it is the statement made loud and long by some that the auto-tip amount should just be part of the “cruise fare” so that the cruise line can pay their service employees a decent wage. This implies that these folks are willing to pay the extra amount as long as it is included in the “fare”. Why, if that is true, do they balk so when it is added to their shipboard account as auto-tip? If one is so willing to pay the extra amount as part of their “fare” so that all employees can be fairly paid what is the big deal with it being called auto-tip and billed at the end of the cruise? Just leave the darn thing in place and consider that it is part of your “fare” that you don’t have to pay until after your cruise. Or, heavens above, is the removal of the auto-tip just an attempt to get something for nothing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARGIN Posted July 12, 2007 #104 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Although I access this website frequently to find specific information about an upcoming cruise, I never signed up to actually participate in the forums. But, after reading these two particular entries, I felt compelled to join just so I could comment that I've never read anything so mean-sprited and contemptuous. ----Thought the forum system would quote the entry I was referring to---Happyscot's comments. Sorry, you can tell I'm new at the forum game. You have to take Happyscot's comments with a grain of salt. He has a warped sense of humor :D:D:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyscot Posted July 12, 2007 #105 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Although I access this website frequently to find specific information about an upcoming cruise, I never signed up to actually participate in the forums. But, after reading these two particular entries, I felt compelled to join just so I could comment that I've never read anything so mean-sprited and contemptuous. ----Thought the forum system would quote the entry I was referring to---Happyscot's comments. Sorry, you can tell I'm new at the forum game. Thank you sir/madam, I'm happy to make an impression in any way I can. But I think you're going to have to be a little more specific in order for me to understand and repent fully all my sins. You should never feel compelled by anything you read on the internet you know......................... :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare arxcards Posted July 12, 2007 #106 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Although I access this website frequently to find specific information about an upcoming cruise, I never signed up to actually participate in the forums. But, after reading these two particular entries, I felt compelled to join just so I could comment that I've never read anything so mean-sprited and contemptuous. ----Thought the forum system would quote the entry I was referring to---Happyscot's comments. Sorry, you can tell I'm new at the forum game. Contemptuous - absolutely! Mean spirited - No, you have missed the point! His Sarcasm, Irony, humour come from the other side of the world. Before you condemn a man you do not understand, click on his name and view some more of his posts. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globaliser Posted July 12, 2007 #107 Share Posted July 12, 2007 BUT if there is one aspect to this debate on auto-tipping aboard a cruise ship (Princess isn’t the only line that does that folks) that I don’t understand it is the statement made loud and long by some that the auto-tip amount should just be part of the “cruise fare” so that the cruise line can pay their service employees a decent wage. This implies that these folks are willing to pay the extra amount as long as it is included in the “fare”. Why, if that is true, do they balk so when it is added to their shipboard account as auto-tip? If one is so willing to pay the extra amount as part of their “fare” so that all employees can be fairly paid what is the big deal with it being called auto-tip and billed at the end of the cruise?It's because it's called a tip. Perhaps you have no idea how abhorrent some people find the whole idea of tipping anyone anything. Putting the same amount into the fare stops it being called a tip and makes it OK. It may not be a wholly rational response. Money is money, after all. But then the US experience of being made to feel like a bad person if one does not tip is not wholly rational, either - particularly in situations where a tip is being demanded or requested by a person who's been perfectly adequately paid already. So it's all part of the same cultural thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyscot Posted July 12, 2007 #108 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Now look you two, just pack it in. I can't be sarcastic and unpleasant to all these tipping, be-suited non-smoking cruisers if you're going to be all lovely and supportive. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaah. It would bring a tear to a glass eye. Cuddles across the oceans. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyscot Posted July 12, 2007 #109 Share Posted July 12, 2007 It's because it's called a tip. Perhaps you have no idea how abhorrent some people find the whole idea of tipping anyone anything. Putting the same amount into the fare stops it being called a tip and makes it OK. It may not be a wholly rational response. Money is money, after all. But then the US experience of being made to feel like a bad person if one does not tip is not wholly rational, either - particularly in situations where a tip is being demanded or requested by a person who's been perfectly adequately paid already. So it's all part of the same cultural thing. Also, we do it every day for goods and services you pay less for, because wages are lower, and you make it up with tips. In higher-wage economies like ours, prices are much higher, and nobody expects you to tip. The bizarre thing is, staff would get more. We'd pay the $10 in the fare, and then, because the element of compulsory tipping (which makes as much sense to us as compulsory facial tattoos, say) had been removed, most Brits would tip when they received excellent service. I did, on my last holiday. Cultural differences are fine. We have, as nations, completely separate approaches to pure carbon - we put it in pencils, you serve it with pancakes and maple syrup and eat it. And to sport - you only show winning American teams on tele, we don't because we don't have any. Vive le difference, I say. Wonder what that actually means? Is that new man/lady still out there - scary.................... xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ldoc31 Posted July 12, 2007 #110 Share Posted July 12, 2007 If there is one standard rule in tipping it is this: If someone renders special service to you along the way, show your appreciation with a tip. Most of the crew rely on your handouts to make a living. They should never be punished monetarily for something they can't control. What exactly do you consider a special service that is above and beyond the job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opinions Posted July 12, 2007 #111 Share Posted July 12, 2007 AZ - it's simple. If they are paid the equivalent of what they take home in tips through direct charge, then there is more taxable income to go around (wait a minute, I thought Canada had progressed beyond tipping, except when in canoes). In the US, those wages would also be subject to FICA withholding, with the employer having to match that 7-1/4% or whatever it is, provide benefits, a 401K program, etc. Tips are subject to income taxes,social security and Medicare taxes in the USA... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maracucha Posted July 12, 2007 #112 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Also, we do it every day for goods and services you pay less for, because wages are lower, and you make it up with tips. In higher-wage economies like ours, prices are much higher, and nobody expects you to tip. The bizarre thing is, staff would get more. We'd pay the $10 in the fare, and then, because the element of compulsory tipping (which makes as much sense to us as compulsory facial tattoos, say) had been removed, most Brits would tip when they received excellent service. I did, on my last holiday. Cultural differences are fine. We have, as nations, completely separate approaches to pure carbon - we put it in pencils, you serve it with pancakes and maple syrup and eat it. And to sport - you only show winning American teams on tele, we don't because we don't have any. Vive le difference, I say. Wonder what that actually means? Is that new man/lady still out there - scary.................... xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Scared by forum submission??? Well, the post above will do as an example as well as #63. As far as figuring out whether I'm male or female...as the resident cultural expert, you should have no trouble in solving the mystery. After all, you do have 30-40 trips under your belt--and only one involved dollars. Very confused by your TV comment. Not sure what American TV channels your satellite captures, but most every sporting event on U.S. TV has both a winning and losing team/player, be that poker, baseball, tennis, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Haynes Posted July 12, 2007 #113 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Yes, tips are subject to taxes, from the employee not the employer. In America if you stiff a waitress in a coffee house, the next time you visit this restaurant I guarantee you will be waiting a long time before being served. Why? None of the waitresses want to serve you. That is the way it is here in America. You can be nice when you stiffed them and say you double tip the next time if you are a regular customer. Make up for the stiff. That is why tipping stays. I say do as the Romans do. You tip in America and I won't in Australia. Oh, I will agree having a lesser minimum wage is wrong. But its constitutional here. No one works for crumbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyscot Posted July 12, 2007 #114 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Scared by forum submission??? Well, the post above will do as an example as well as #63. As far as figuring out whether I'm male or female...as the resident cultural expert, you should have no trouble in solving the mystery. After all, you do have 30-40 trips under your belt--and only one involved dollars. Very confused by your TV comment. Not sure what American TV channels your satellite captures, but most every sporting event on U.S. TV has both a winning and losing team/player, be that poker, baseball, tennis, etc. Oh dear. Don't think you get it. It's all for fun. Anyway, still don't know if you're male or female, no idea what's wrong with post 63, you have to be a bit more specific, love you loads, good luck in all you do. Come to Scotland, you'll be very welcome. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyscot Posted July 12, 2007 #115 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Yes, tips are subject to taxes, from the employee not the employer. In America if you stiff a waitress in a coffee house, the next time you visit this restaurant I guarantee you will be waiting a long time before being served. Why? None of the waitresses want to serve you. That is the way it is here in America. You can be nice when you stiffed them and say you double tip the next time if you are a regular customer. Make up for the stiff. That is why tipping stays. I say do as the Romans do. You tip in America and I won't in Australia. Oh, I will agree having a lesser minimum wage is wrong. But its constitutional here. No one works for crumbs. The Sea Princess trip I am booked on will be 90% Brits. The boat is registered in Britain. It actually docks frequently in the port of Rome. Can I stiff the Romans please Caligula? xxxxxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolksOfMeans - ByNoMeans Posted July 12, 2007 #116 Share Posted July 12, 2007 The Sea Princess trip I am booked on will be 90% Brits. The boat is registered in Britain. It actually docks frequently in the port of Rome. Can I stiff the Romans please Caligula? xxxxxxx Happy -- Can I yell on this thread:confused: Or, psst - Should I whisper:confused: Go ahead and stiff them:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maracucha Posted July 12, 2007 #117 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Contemptuous - absolutely! Mean spirited - No, you have missed the point! His Sarcasm, Irony, humour come from the other side of the world. Before you condemn a man you do not understand, click on his name and view some more of his posts. Cheers, Took your advise and found the following: “Sanctimonious twaddle from people who won't pay the taxes or vote for the government that will solve the problems of poverty, perferring instead to look big by throwing pennies at servants.” “They are a lovely lot really - arch-conservative, all apple pie, early to bed, don't drink til you're 105, vote for Hitler if he wasn't so darned left wing, but essentially kind-hearted, caring people who try to help new cruisers. Bloody weird though - yanks, yah know? One guy signs off every time "nothing good happens after midnight". People actually say things like "God bless America" - don't get me started.” Sarcasm? Irony? Don't think so. Please explain the "point" I apparently missed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maracucha Posted July 12, 2007 #118 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Oh dear. Don't think you get it. It's all for fun. Anyway, still don't know if you're male or female, no idea what's wrong with post 63, you have to be a bit more specific, love you loads, good luck in all you do. Come to Scotland, you'll be very welcome. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx I do "get it" as do you. You're a little old to play the naivete card. The "all in good fun" excuse always proceeds an intentional insult being passed off as a joke. No need to respond. I'm opting to return to my lurking status and use the site for what was intended...sharing travel information. To be perfectly truthful, I'm sorry I submitted any comments. This is not a very nice playground. I will wish you good luck as well. However, since we've never met, I don't think I'll presume to send you "loads of love". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebritisharecoming Posted July 12, 2007 #119 Share Posted July 12, 2007 If you paid them a decent wage you would still have workers.!!! I bet you are walking away with a good wage. Why don't you pay your people? Charge me what the real cost is and let me decided if I want to eat at your place or not. I will decided if it is worth the price or not. If anyone is cheap it is the businesses that do not pay their help a decent wage and compalin that others are not making it up for them. Who said socialism was dead was dead in the old US Karl would be proud:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZbeachboy Posted July 12, 2007 #120 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Took your advise and found the following: “Sanctimonious twaddle from people who won't pay the taxes or vote for the government that will solve the problems of poverty, perferring instead to look big by throwing pennies at servants.” “They are a lovely lot really - arch-conservative, all apple pie, early to bed, don't drink til you're 105, vote for Hitler if he wasn't so darned left wing, but essentially kind-hearted, caring people who try to help new cruisers. Bloody weird though - yanks, yah know? One guy signs off every time "nothing good happens after midnight". People actually say things like "God bless America" - don't get me started.” Sarcasm? Irony? Don't think so. Please explain the "point" I apparently missed. You are having a pipe dream if you think any government is going to solve problems. By their nature the cause them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZbeachboy Posted July 12, 2007 #121 Share Posted July 12, 2007 Who said socialism was dead was dead in the old US Karl would be proud:cool: Sorry my british friend, but that is not a socialistic comment. It is a comment about business ethics. The person I was responding to said he would lose all his workers if others did not pay (or give a wage suppliment as I prefer to call it, to his resturant" My response is only that I could make the choice to pay a higher price for his service or not. His choice is to pay a decent wage or let his employees find other employment. That is very free market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maracucha Posted July 12, 2007 #122 Share Posted July 12, 2007 You are having a pipe dream if you think any government is going to solve problems. By their nature the cause them. I believe you posted a response on the wrong thread. My message was a response was to a message from Arxcards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongerob Posted July 13, 2007 #123 Share Posted July 13, 2007 Tips are subject to income taxes,social security and Medicare taxes in the USA... Only if reported...;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Patches Posted July 13, 2007 #124 Share Posted July 13, 2007 I would think it would be difficult to get away with under reporting your tip income for any prolonged period of time. A server must report his tip income both to the IRS and his employer. If you consistently report 5% tips and your coworkers are reporting 15% tips then the IRS and your employer would probably get suspicious. I understand the IRS does not hesitate to audit servers. Secondly, the IRS has something called "allocation of tips", which essentially means that if the employees of an establishment report less than 8% of the gross sales in tip income then the employer must make up the difference. If your employer is stuck holding the bag on your under reporting of tips I imagine he would single out the offending employee (the one reporting 5% in tips rather than 15%) and fire them fairly quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chivalrygirl Posted July 13, 2007 #125 Share Posted July 13, 2007 I would think it would be difficult to get away with under reporting your tip income for any prolonged period of time. A server must report his tip income both to the IRS and his employer. If you consistently report 5% tips and your coworkers are reporting 15% tips then the IRS and your employer would probably get suspicious. I understand the IRS does not hesitate to audit servers. Secondly, the IRS has something called "allocation of tips", which essentially means that if the employees of an establishment report less than 8% of the gross sales in tip income then the employer must make up the difference. If your employer is stuck holding the bag on your under reporting of tips I imagine he would single out the offending employee (the one reporting 5% in tips rather than 15%) and fire them fairly quickly. You can actually fire people in the US as easy as that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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