RCCL New Smoking Policy Discussion (merged)

[yogimax]

So long as there are other cruise ships allowing smoking in staterooms we will patronize them. Just like I said bye-bye to Westin and Marriott properties !!!

 

Il navigante pazzo

 

Umm... Westin and Marriott do not seem to be suffering.

 

If anything, they have profited from their smoking restrictions in increased booking from non-smokers and reductions in the cost of staff and materials needed to clean rooms occupied by smokers.

[dc-snoopy]

The feel good move by RCI. The only place where you would not bother someone else smokeing, thats what they ban. So it really won't change anything for the complainers. But it looks good.

 

I'm sorry, but this is true for non-smokers who just don't like the smell. For those that are allergic and have various reactions to it (ranging from rashes, migraines, asthmatic like breathing problems to anaphalactic shock), the stateroom is the one place that it is vital that there be no smoking. For all the rest, the victim can avoid the area or leave the area. The one area you cannot avoid is your cabin. You have to sleep somewhere. And smoke gets into all the porous surfaces including the curtains, the bedclothes, the sofa, the carpet, the wallpaper. And even though most people (even those who are allergic) cannot smell the smoke, it is still there and can still cause an allergic reaction. Yes, you can still have a reaction even after glycolizing (e.g. Ozium) or ionization. It might be milder because the number of allergens (e.g. tar and nicotine samples) is reduced, but it might still cause a problem.

 

My wife and I regularly learn which areas on board that we have to avoid due to smoking, but at least we will always have a cabin that does not contain allergens for her. We are still prepared for an allergic reaction, but this is an important comfort for us. So, i think that the staterooms is the one place that it was important to have non-smoking. Apparently RCI agreed.

[wraithe]

They're not banning smoking, so no, they won't stop selling smoking materials, since people want to buy them. Good job stirring the pot though.

[Mark_K]

I've never had that issue, but it makes sense that, if any place would be exposed to smoke from the stack, it would be at the very back of the ship. I've definitely never seen it drift down to the pool area, which was being suggested by the poster I was replying to. It's not impossible, though, during docking and such, when the ship is not moving much. But still, it's not really a valid comparison to passive cigarette smoking.

When you consider the amount of time, and amount of, second hand smoke you're exposed to, it's probably a very valid comparison. Also, diesel exhaust sounds a lot like tobacco smoke:

 

The components of diesel exhaust (DE) emissions are a public concern for the following reasons:

 

• Emissions from diesel engines include over 40 substances that are listed by the EPA as hazardous air pollutants.
  
• Components of DE contain potential cancer causing substances such as arsenic, benzene, formaldehyde, nickel, and PAHs.
  
• The diesel particulate matter (DPM) is very small (90% are less than 1um by mass), making DPM easy to respire into the deep lung.
  
• DPM has hundreds of chemicals adsorbed to their surfaces, including many known or suspected carcinogens.
  
• There are many irritants and toxic chemicals in the gaseous phase of DE.
  
• Oxides of nitrogen, component of urban smog, are in the gaseous phase of DE.
  
• There is a likelihood that people in both ambient and occupational settings can be exposed to DE.
  
• DE has the potential to cause adverse health effects including cancer, pulmonary and cardiovascular diseases.
  
• Studies show workers exposed to higher levels of DE are more likely to develop lung cancer.
  
• In 1990, the state of California identified DE as a chemical known to cause cancer.
  
• The International Agency for Research on Cancer has concluded that DE probably causes cancer in humans.
  
• The EPA has proposed classifying DE as a probable human carcinogen.

[SomeBeach]

With the new ban on smoking do you think RCCL will stop selling cigarettes in the convenience store on board? Will cigarettes be one of the banned items they will check your bags for like liquor?

 

Just a thought!

 

Have the airports?! ;) :p

[alcheme]

When you consider the amount of time, and amount of, second hand smoke you're exposed to, it's probably a very valid comparison.

 

I didn't think so, because I've never seen the diesel fumes drift down to the deck level on the ships I've sailed. If that does happen regularly, then I would agree with you. Something should be done to prevent that, as well.

[jc foster]

Am i a smoker? NO, and I sure dont want to be one. Would I light up inside a cabin on vacation if i were one? You betcha. THis is merely a company policy. Its not a criminal law. If the cabin steward knocks on the door simply tell him your naked and then spray some "NO SMOKE" air freshner around the room. MY wife and I once had a room that smelled of smoke and the cabin steward completed eliminated the smell with some type of this stuff. Lets remember that these people have rights too. It seems as though weve become a nation of cowards. we are afraid of industrial polution, the ozone layer, a big mac with fries , etc. . Heck Ive got a cousin who checks every car she gets into to make sure that its got an air bag. I personally dont like big brother telling me everything that i can and can not do , and Im not even a smoker.

[OGCFreddie]

In all honesty I have not had the time to read all posts.

 

That being said, I am not sure that this issue has been addressed. I am one of many who is extremely allergic to cigarette smoke, I become quite sick and can be incapacitated if exposed for a very long time.

 

We were on the Serenade of the Seas in February and we were shocked that smoking was allowed in a public area like a bar. Another poster suggested that the people who are vehemently opposed to smoke may take it upon themselves to instruct an overweight person to reduce their food intake. That person is not affecting anything other than the space others in the area may use, which is a non issue, however, a smoker is affecting the very air that we breathe.

 

Smoking is an addiction. I will readily admit that I am addicted to the caffeine in my coffee and enjoy it wholeheartedly. But I do not force it on anyone and if the smell of it was making someone ill or causing them difficulty breathing, I would remove myself from their presence.

 

Most cities in Canada have banned smoking from public places. Most hospitals request that for the safety of their immune compromised patients that those entering do not wear perfume or scented products.

Smoking is a personal choice but it is not done in isolation, it affects all of us who are within the perameters that the smoke can travel.

JMHO

Dee

Good afternoon, Dee. You make some very valid points in your argument, but again I have to stress that it is not our job to make the rules. We can either accept them, or take our business elsewhere. I am truly sorry that you have to experience the effects of cigarette smoke and it affects you, and many others, in such a way. I know how sick I used to feel when both of my parents would chain smoke in the car with the windows up and I was younger. But it was their car and I didn't really have a choice. Of course, that was back in the late sixties/early seventies and parents weren't as informed as they are today.

 

This entire thread is NOT about if smoking is bad or good. It's not about whether someone gets ill around smokers or not. It's not about what hotel chains still allow smoking or how the casinos are going in Las Vegas or Atlantic City or how to smuggle booze or stash cigarettes. It is about RCI's new policy and, I believe, the intent of the OP was to inform us about it.

 

As a previous poster stated, every new policy that comes along generates a massive response, both for and against. RCI has lived through them in the past and, I firmly believe, they will get through this won as well. I just hate to see so much effort being wasted for something that, ultimately, is out of our hands. RCI, or for that matter any cruiseline, will NEVER be able to make everyone else happy. That's human nature. But they do run and operate their ships. The hate and the anger that is demonstrated on some of these topics is very apparent. Sad, isn't it? All this hassle because a few people can't get together and compromise on a solution. Although I suppose I shouldn't be that surprised, should I. After all, that's how wars start.

 

As always, JMHO

[Mark_K]

I didn't think so, because I've never seen the diesel fumes drift down to the deck level on the ships I've sailed. If that does happen regularly, then I would agree with you. Something should be done to prevent that, as well.

I have. The cost to prevent it, is not worth the marginal benefit derived from preventing occasional, intermittent exposure. It's just like tobacco smoke, but without the bad PR and irrational attitudes regarding occasional low level exposure.

[alcheme]

MY wife and I once had a room that smelled of smoke and the cabin steward completed eliminated the smell with some type of this stuff. Lets remember that these people have rights too.

 

And I would guess that you and your wife do not have allergies to tobacco smoke. The smell can be covered up, if that's all that bothers you. I don't care what you spray in the room to cover up the smell, though, if someone's been smoking up the room, I'm not going to be able to sleep comfortably in it, due to allergic reactions. No, it's not going to kill me, but it will make me feel miserable.

 

A lot of people seem to think that, if it doesn't affect them much, then the one's who say it does affect them must just be whining liars. Do you believe that some people are allergic to peanuts, even if you're not? Do you believe that some people has asthma, even if you don't? Newsflash! We're not all the same.

 

This is not such a difficult rule, and I don't know why some people are so passionately against it. You can still smoke, just not in the cabins. Why not in the cabins? Because it causes problems for some of the people who use that cabin next, it costs extra money for cleaning and it's a fire hazard.

[alcheme]

I have. The cost to prevent it, is not worth the marginal benefit derived from preventing occasional, intermittent exposure. It's just like tobacco smoke, but without the bad PR and irrational attitudes regarding occasional low level exposure.

 

Well, I bet nobody is going to be pumping that diesel exhaust into my future cabin the week before I cruise. ;)

[coy860]

I have heard all sorts of things from my balcony neighbors, like mumbling things under there breath to the good old "fake cough". We "smokers" are real people too, you may just be surprised at how far a simple "hello neighbor, we are non-smokers and are really bothered by smoke, do you think we would be able to work something out" might get ya.

 

THAT may have been the case before, but as a smoker, my reply would now have to be that hey, you NON smokers have almost the entire huge ship. I cannot smoke in my room. THIS balcony is a designated smoking area, so how about YOU finding a non smoking area.

I have cruised 34 times, and now have a bad knee, and I am NOT going to walk all over the ship to get to a designated smoking area, when I PAID for my balcony. Previously, if people came out on their balcony, I would take my cigarette and go into my room..no more.

[cegmar]

Am i a smoker? NO, and I sure dont want to be one. Would I light up inside a cabin on vacation if i were one? You betcha. THis is merely a company policy. Its not a criminal law. If the cabin steward knocks on the door simply tell him your naked and then spray some "NO SMOKE" air freshner around the room. MY wife and I once had a room that smelled of smoke and the cabin steward completed eliminated the smell with some type of this stuff. Lets remember that these people have rights too. It seems as though weve become a nation of cowards. we are afraid of industrial polution, the ozone layer, a big mac with fries , etc. . Heck Ive got a cousin who checks every car she gets into to make sure that its got an air bag. I personally dont like big brother telling me everything that i can and can not do , and Im not even a smoker.

 

The "Big Brother" references always make me laugh. I would hope that people who consider this a "Big Brother" type action never find themeselves living in a country where human rights are not measured on whether I am aloud to smoke in a cabin on a cruise. :rolleyes:

[Dena]

 

THAT may have been the case before, but as a smoker, my reply would now have to be that hey, you NON smokers have almost the entire huge ship. I cannot smoke in my room. how about YOU finding a non smoking area.

 

I would take my cigarette and go into my room..no more.

 

This is why the policy is DUMB. It is backwards. Smoking should have been banned on the balconies, but allowed in the rooms (if anywhere).

[TEXASMUNK]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

Nope, they will not stop elling cigarettes

[cruisin from florida]

If this policy is enforced with the same enthusiasm as rules about chair hogging, dress code, kids in the solarium, etc., I doubt that anyone will see any actual change to the cruise experience.

[cegmar]

This is why the policy is DUMB. It is backwards. Smoking should have been banned on the balconies, but allowed in the rooms (if anywhere).

 

What you fail to understand is that the policy change has little to do with the well being of the passengers, and more with the monetary savings in not having to deal with the added cleaning costs associated with smoking in the rooms.

[Schplinky]

If this policy is enforced with the same enthusiasm as rules about chair hogging, dress code, kids in the solarium, etc., I doubt that anyone will see any actual change to the cruise experience.

 

I suspect that what will happen is that folks will be assessed cleaning fees after they have left the ship and it will turn into a big brou-ha-ha. I wonder how long it will be before folks boast about tipping their room attendants for turning a blind eye (or nose) to their smoking.

[yogimax]

Heck Ive got a cousin who checks every car she gets into to make sure that its got an air bag.

 

Wow - I never thought of that!

 

With over 40,000 fatalities each year in automobile accidents, that's a very wise thing to do.

 

Thanks for a great suggestion!

[yogimax]

What you fail to understand is that the policy change has little to do with the well being of the passengers, and more with the monetary savings in not having to deal with the added cleaning costs associated with smoking in the rooms.

 

Yes, you are correct in asserting that RCCL has done this partially for monetary savings.

 

It costs money to clean up after smokers. Additional time is needed by the staff and there are hard costs associated with cleaning materials, etc..

 

BUT... what is wrong with that?

 

RCCL has made a business decision which will reduce their overall maintenance costs.

 

In addition, they have taken the lead in giving the impression that they are a non-smoking cruise line. When Northwest Airlines took the initiative to ban smoking on flights, they experienced an immediate economic benefit arising from non-smokers who changed their allegiance from other airlines to NW.

 

Well done RCCL!

[isujim]

You can't smoke in the grocery store but they still sell them:) This isn't a ban on smoking........just in your cabin........they will sell away!!

[NOT my real name]

...you may just be surprised at how far a simple "hello neighbor, we are non-smokers and are really bothered by smoke...

 

It's not JUST an issue of being "bothered" by second hand smoke. If that were all it was there could be more room for toleration. But it is a much more serious issue. Death and disease caused by second hand smoke is more that just a "bother". The article below from the Surgeon General speaks to this:

 

http://www.hhs.gov/news/press/2006pres/20060627.html

[crusinmama06]

Are you kidding? Their VITALITY program that they are so excited about wouldn't gel with the loss of profits from cigarettes sales. So OF COURSE they will continue to sell cigarettes onboard. ;)

[Lynnees]

This is just too much to read.

 

Has anyone checked out the poll that CC is running on the home page? Interesting numbers.

[Barbee524]

They stopped letting you pay a corkage fee to take alcohol back to your cabin, yet they still sell it in the shops on board.

 

The key word here is SELL. As long as you are willing to buy it they will sell it.