Sick to death off kid haters!!!

[tnebell]

I'd say I have it pretty lucky so far. (knock on wood! ;) ) I'd say my son has a meltdown maybe once or twice every week or so. He has a very large vocabulary though which does wonders. We've been doing signing together since he was 7 mos old and now are up to about 60 words.

Thankfully, most of his tantrums are just from when he doesn't get what he wants (and Mommy won't give in to him) That's when he all out collapses on the floor crying. LOL

Luckily, for his teachers, DS doesn't supposedly ever do that for them. They can't believe me when I tell them that he has those moments at home. LOL

Actually it's funny you bring that up about the long dinners. Last cruise the staff on the Spirit were amazing...and somewhat annoying! They'd come by and actually pull our son out of his highchair and walk around with him in their arms and introduce him to the other guests!! It was cute but rather frustrating when you're trying to get your little one to eat!

[larronry]

I'd say I have it pretty lucky so far. (knock on wood! ;) ) I'd say my son has a meltdown maybe once or twice every week or so. He has a very large vocabulary though which does wonders. We've been doing signing together since he was 7 mos old and now are up to about 60 words.

Thankfully, most of his tantrums are just from when he doesn't get what he wants (and Mommy won't give in to him) That's when he all out collapses on the floor crying. LOL

Luckily, for his teachers, DS doesn't supposedly ever do that for them. They can't believe me when I tell them that he has those moments at home. LOL

Actually it's funny you bring that up about the long dinners. Last cruise the staff on the Spirit were amazing...and somewhat annoying! They'd come by and actually pull our son out of his highchair and walk around with him in their arms and introduce him to the other guests!! It was cute but rather frustrating when you're trying to get your little one to eat!

I started signing with my son at 6 months. I didn't expect him to pick it up I just thought I would start signing to him because I knew sign. He picked up milk very quickly. And that was where it ended. He has modified his sign for milk to want and gestures want in the direction of the item he wants and that is all he will do. I have taught signs to autistic children but can't to my own son.

 

As far as meltdowns we have several a day, either because I don't understand what he wants, I can't get it fast enough, or I have told him no. At home I just walk away and they tend to end very quickly. But if I were to do that on the ship, based on comments on the board, I would be accused of not parenting my child because I ignored his behavior. Now I would say oh it's just people on the board except that even the nurses at my pediatricians office freak out when I ignore his tantrums and they go and coddle him. The pediatrician has said to not coddle him after he is told "no" and although I disagree with a lot of what the pediatrician tells me "behaviorally" I agree with him there. I will say that I try and redirect when I'm out in public instead of telling him "no" so that he won't tantrum. At home I tell him "no" all the time.

 

Now what I don't understand is that I can give him a very complicated command & he will follow through, but if I tell him OK mommy will get it and it takes me a minute he has a meltdown. I am so desperately trying to figure out how to reduce them before the cruise.

[tnebell]

My problem currently is potty training and motivation for DS. We have no clue what to use as motivation for him. I so want him potty trained during the day before the cruise!!!

[larronry]

My problem currently is potty training and motivation for DS. We have no clue what to use as motivation for him. I so want him potty trained during the day before the cruise!!!

Well you are going on Carnival so it's not the worst thing in the world if he's not potty trained. However, biggest question is is he ready. I met the author of a book called The Potty Training Answer Book by Karen Deerwester. I picked it up Barnes and Nobel for the cheapest price. It's pretty good. I don't necessarily agree with everything in it but it does have a very good comparison of all the techniques and she has a very extensive list of readiness skills. Also, she goes into the personalities of children which I thought was very insightful. She talks about different potty plans for different personalities as well as different schedules of parenting. Like you said you worked so she has a plan where you can potty train on the weekends only. She is an early childhood educator. Anyway it might be worth looking into.

[tnebell]

Hhhmm. I have a 15% off certificate from Barnes & Noble that I'll use to get that. Maybe I'll go tomorrow! Thanks! :)

Did you ever read The Baby Whisperer or Toddler Whisperer? Those are awesome books!

[larronry]

A friend loaned those to me. I ended up liking the happiest baby on the block and the happiest toddler on the block better. But whenever I put anything to practice I tend to pull a little from here and a little from there. Which ever seems most appropriate to the particular situation. Although for my son the Happiest Baby on the Block worked like a charm. Maybe I need to pull out the Toddler Whisper again.

 

BTW I think you can go onto B&N.com and see if you local store has it in stock. The one closest to me didn't have it so I went to the next closest one.

[tnebell]

I do the same (regarding pulling bits from different books) for my son. Whatever seems to work in the certain situation. I tend to reread many of those books every so often to get a different view on things. Sometimes it clears up things.

 

As for the B&N, well if this store doesn't have it, the only other options I have is either Walmart, the local grocery store or Amazon.com We're growing up here in Fairbanks but we're still a small town. :)

[larronry]

I forgot you said you lived in Fairbanks. You can see if the store can order it for you too sometimes that's cheaper then Amazon. A friend of mind used to live in Kodiak. I think you are in far better shape then she was. I am so sorry I never visited her when she lived there but arranging air travel while they were living there was always so complicated and extremely expensive.

[tnebell]

Oh yeah! We're much better off than Kodiak when it comes to shopping. We're kind of in a cozy middle state. Not too big, like Anchorage with it's hustle and bustle, but not too small either.

Our travel arrangements down to the lower 48 (that's what we locals up here call the rest of the US) cost way more. Luckily enough my husband is military and he's done an overseas tour in Iraq so we're entitled to 3 free plane tickets to his home in Tennessee. I'm the manager of the travel agency on base so I'm going to change those into 3 tickets to Tampa instead. :D :D :D We're essentially getting a free vacation out of all this! (however of course we paid for it since DH was deployed for 16 months) :(

[larronry]

My friends husband is Coast Guard and when they were in Kodiak he was gone for months at a time. When they were here in Florida he was home every night. Since then he's done another tour in Florida and one near San Francisco.

[NoelsCat]

Sharon -- next time you book a cruise you should try to book on the same as our family. :) Not only are our sons about the same age -- but your dvd player is welcome at our table (as long as my son can see the screen, too.)

 

Not to go off topic -- but I truly agree with you about the frustration pre-verbally. Our son was the most easy-going baby and then suddenly became a wreck at about 14 months. I thought I was going to become nuts. At the time he was only speaking about 25 words. Then, at 16/17 months he had a language explosion! And that was the end of tantrums. SO, since all kids have different personalities, different verbal skills that develop at different rates, etc -- I don't really think it's fair to assume that other parents aren't "laying down the law" or are too lenient. As a matter of fact, I have found that the statement, "I would never let MY child do [insert any action]" often ends in my eating my words later... :)

 

TNE -- I think our sons are the same age. My son was born December of 2005... and we are potty training/learning, too. So far, it has been my 13 year old SIL who has had the most success. He worships her. We have several videos and books about going potty -- and he goes with all of us to the potty. He has had some sucesses -- and we use cloth diapers so I know he "feels" wet. He definately understands being wet vs being dry and verbalizes when he has to "poot" -- however its usually right as/after he already has. I really wanted him to be trained by the time of our cruise so he could swim in the pool. I have let go of that dream, however. LOL.

[larronry]

Sharon -- next time you book a cruise you should try to book on the same as our family. :) Not only are our sons about the same age -- but your dvd player is welcome at our table (as long as my son can see the screen, too.)

 

Not to go off topic -- but I truly agree with you about the frustration pre-verbally. Our son was the most easy-going baby and then suddenly became a wreck at about 14 months. I thought I was going to become nuts. At the time he was only speaking about 25 words. Then, at 16/17 months he had a language explosion! And that was the end of tantrums. SO, since all kids have different personalities, different verbal skills that develop at different rates, etc -- I don't really think it's fair to assume that other parents aren't "laying down the law" or are too lenient. As a matter of fact, I have found that the statement, "I would never let MY child do [insert any action]" often ends in my eating my words later... :)

 

TNE -- I think our sons are the same age. My son was born December of 2005... and we are potty training/learning, too. So far, it has been my 13 year old SIL who has had the most success. He worships her. We have several videos and books about going potty -- and he goes with all of us to the potty. He has had some sucesses -- and we use cloth diapers so I know he "feels" wet. He definately understands being wet vs being dry and verbalizes when he has to "poot" -- however its usually right as/after he already has. I really wanted him to be trained by the time of our cruise so he could swim in the pool. I have let go of that dream, however. LOL.

Gosh my son was born Oct 2005 and has no potty training readiness. Then again he has to be able to talk. Right now I'd say he maybe and that is a big maybe has 4 very unclear words. He says ney ney ney for no but he'll say it when he means yes which is why I say maybe.

 

I would love to cruise with you and your son. :) Maybe you should try the new Carnival ship we are trying (especially if you live on the east coast) before it takes up it's permanent residence in LA. I didn't think I could get excited about a Carnival cruise until I started reading about that ship. And it's not even cruising yet.

[CanadianTwosome]

As a matter of fact, I have found that the statement, "I would never let MY child do [insert any action]" often ends in my eating my words later... :)

 

TNE -- I think our sons are the same age. My son was born December of 2005... and we are potty training/learning, too. So far, it has been my 13 year old SIL who has had the most success. He worships her. We have several videos and books about going potty -- and he goes with all of us to the potty. He has had some sucesses -- and we use cloth diapers so I know he "feels" wet. He definately understands being wet vs being dry and verbalizes when he has to "poot" -- however its usually right as/after he already has. I really wanted him to be trained by the time of our cruise so he could swim in the pool. I have let go of that dream, however. LOL.

 

I generally go by the rule 'never say never', but I'm very comfortable saying that I never say 'My child would never...'. Goodness knows if nothing else, they're unpredictable! ha ha ha

 

Now, potty training... Since you've opened the door to discussing methods, we used the 'bare bottom' method. Have you ever housetrained a puppy? You know, you take it outside at specific times that you know it's 'time' so they get the idea that they go out to do their business? Well, with kids, potty time can be fairly predictable too, but forcing them to sit on a potty and wait can be detrimental to your efforts because, of course, they're kids, so they have this real 'thinking for themselves' issue! ha ha ha

 

Okay, back to the point... how this method works is that you anticipate when potty time is 'likely' to happen, and remove their bottoms. It worked like a charm for us; she never once went anywhere other than the potty when her bottom was bare. She already had a bit of an idea about sitting on the potty because we had already tried some other methods by then, so when she felt the urge and knew she had no diaper to catch it, she knew where to go. Obviously we weren't perfect with the timing, so it took a month or so, but after that she was great. I completely agree that the sensation of being wet is good for training - our biggest problem was that using a diaper in between gave her the option of not using a potty if she was busy and didn't want to be bothered. (my mom thought this was particularly amusing since I was the same way, even in cloth diapers!) BMs of course, were easy - once she figured out that she didn't have to have that in her pants, she never soiled a diaper 'that way' again.

 

The only thing that did happen that we didn't anticipate was that she really liked having a bare bottom! ha ha ha For about a month or two after she was trained, I'd come home from work and my mom, who came and sat with her two days a week, would just be shaking her head, saying, 'She took her pants off to go potty and refused to put them back on.' ha ha ha As I said, it only lasted a couple months, and she only did it at home - never at anyone else's house (including my mom) or at daycare, so it wasn't a huge thing, but it was funny. (although as a good parent, I gritted my teeth and deprived myself the laughter so as not to encourage it!) All kids are different, so what worked for mine might not work for anyone else's... but I thought I'd share in case you wanted to try it.

 

Ah, potty training. Sooooooooooooo glad it's over. Sooooooooooo glad we'll never have to change another diaper! (okay, hopefully we'll have a few to do when we're grandparents, but that's different!)

 

Good luck!!

[NoelsCat]

I do live on the east coast! What is the ship?? I would love to read more about it. I had steered away from carnival because of it's party-ship reputation --- but the more I read about them the more I think a longer cruise with family might be nice. I have read GREAT things about their kid's program...

 

No worries about the words. My SIL (who is now a delightful thirteen year old) was a later talker. As a matter of fact, even when she was talking she was hard to understand until she was nearly 5. Let me tell you, she is VERY verbal now -- smart and popular. Probably the nicest thirteen year old I know. :)

In my opinion, language acquisition is something that happens on an individual's own time schedule and NOT the result of good parenting -- otherwise there would be about 70 percent of the population unable to speak. LOL.

 

It sounds to me like you are blessed to be educated in dealing with language with children. So I am sure I am not telling you anything you don't already know more about than me. ---

 

I also LOVE the Harvey Karp books... Happiest Toddler is great. We are pretty crunchy and his way of handling things are light hearted and down to earth.

[larronry]

Canadian Twosome the book I mentioned does talk about a bare bottom method and that may be useful on my son. Too soon to tell. If my son's shorts are off and he wets his diaper he will pull it off and run around naked so I think he may be like your little one there. :D

 

NoelsCat here is a link to the ebrochure for the Splendor http://www.carnival-brochures.com/Splendor/default.asp?id=14703&trackingid=17313

 

The ship was originally built for Costa and it's sister ship is the Concordia. As far as is known it will be the only one built for Carnival. I know the Party reputation of Carnival and I'm hoping my sail date of 12/6 will be not too partyish. But it's such a big ship I am also hoping you can get away from it. I've never been on a ship this big.

 

The Buffet area is two stories. Not only do you have the normal buffet but you have the Italian, Asian, and Deli section. And like Celebrity they have a Sushi bar. What I don't know is the hours of the Sushi bar. I also like that they have 4 dining times instead of 2. So we requested the later of the earlier times.

 

OK Now I'm selling for Carnival LOL I'm going on a cruise next month and I'm more excited about a cruise next year this ship looks so interesting. There is a water park. It has a movie screen like the Princess ships does by the pool and if there is inclement weather there is a glass enclosure for that area. And the Kids club for the 2-5 year old is 5500 Sq Ft. The area for the other kids is in another part of the ship. That is not good for those with siblings though.

 

The layout of the ship seems better then a lot of the Carnival ships but I am definetly afraid of getting lost. I am not sure this e-brochure is printed yet because when I talked to my PVC last week she said the brochure she had for the ship gave no information.

[Onessa]

DD is now 12YO. But as bad of a rap daycare gets, her daycare teacher (Miss Sue -- a brillant 22YO responsible for a room of eight little girls) -- one at a time potty trained each of her charges. DD was the youngest (by three weeks) and so was the last of that group -- Sue said bring in five outfits tomorrow and I'll train her. We sent the five outfits -- DD came home in "day care clothes" having wet the other six :D but the next day, she came home in the same clothes that we sent her in. Not another diaper since then. God bless Miss Sue (still a daycare teacher, no longer a Miss and with two little ones of her own)!

 

Good luck with your training struggles -- at least it's worth the effort!

[tnebell]

DD is now 12YO. But as bad of a rap daycare gets, her daycare teacher (Miss Sue -- a brillant 22YO responsible for a room of eight little girls) -- one at a time potty trained each of her charges. DD was the youngest (by three weeks) and so was the last of that group -- Sue said bring in five outfits tomorrow and I'll train her. We sent the five outfits -- DD came home in "day care clothes" having wet the other six :D but the next day, she came home in the same clothes that we sent her in. Not another diaper since then. God bless Miss Sue (still a daycare teacher, no longer a Miss and with two little ones of her own)!

 

Good luck with your training struggles -- at least it's worth the effort!

 

Oh my Goodness Onessa! YOU ARE SO LUCKY! My son, Nick, has a very good morning teacher but she definitely is not big on potty training. Mostly because it's pretty rare for my son's age around here to be potty trained. (1-2 yrs)

I keep hoping and praying that he'll get into the Toddlers room soon where potty training is more prevalent so he'll want to go on the potty and not in his diaper. I know he'll miss Ms. Kim, his teacher, but I just would really love to put the day of diapers behind us.

[Onessa]

Oh my Goodness Onessa! YOU ARE SO LUCKY! My son, Nick, has a very good morning teacher but she definitely is not big on potty training. Mostly because it's pretty rare for my son's age around here to be potty trained. (1-2 yrs)

I keep hoping and praying that he'll get into the Toddlers room soon where potty training is more prevalent so he'll want to go on the potty and not in his diaper. I know he'll miss Ms. Kim, his teacher, but I just would really love to put the day of diapers behind us.

 

Don't I know it! DD has pretty much refused to learn anything from her parents (from tieing her shoes, to her golf grip, to riding a bike) -- Miss Sue was a godsend!

 

Good luck with your son -- and I agree that peer pressure will help.

 

PS - I run into one of DD's infant room teachers regularly at the grocery store, and even though DD doesn't remember her, Miss Amy certainly does remember DD as well as every other child who was in the room at that time. Daycare doesn't pay much but the care providers we had over the years have all been marvolous!

[tnebell]

LOL Same here about our son learning things from us. Only thing he seems to pick up no problem is signing. Then he's like "Whoa man! Look! Another word to make with my hands!" (tonight we learned "medicine" and "boat")

Thankfully, peer pressure has worked, but backwards in our case. We're adament that DS uses "please" and "thank you" so supposedly now all the other students are doing it as well as a way of getting the goodies that DS gets so easily when he says those things. LOL

 

LOL I tell my son in the morning to get him moving a bit faster "Let's go see Ms. Kim and get some breakfast" Usually gets him moving. Not always but 80% of the time! LOL If I say "pancakes" then he'll get moving even faster!!! LOL

[pavteam]

I know this started as a kid hater thread and turned into potty training and I'm responding to the kid hater part. I'm not a cranky old lady, I'm 50, my kids are in their 20's and I have no grandchildren yet and I'm not in a hurry for that. We enjoy cruising and I don't mind kids on cruises, I do have a problem with Bad Parents. On our last cruise, one lady (I can't call her a Mom - she showed NO Motherly skills) ingnored her4 year old and just let him roam from pool to hot tub while she sat bonding with her 12 year old son - they were smoking their cigarettes together! I guess she showed some motherly instincts by placing swimmies on the little one. One day he was in the hot tub ALONE - no one else in it - and since it was elevated, she could not even see him. Fortunately another adult saw the situation and kept an eye on the little one. Then there was the Korean family in the hot tub (3 adult women and 3 kids) there were 4 other adults in there as well (picture a pretty full tub) the 3 kids had their goggles on and were trying to swim laps and that was ok with the moms & grandma - but not with me - I thought it was TOTALLY RUDE! I also do not like the shoes with wheels on cruise ships either. I saw one old lady almost get knocked over by 2 kids on those and the mom of those kids turned to her hubby and said "did you see how shocked that lady was that the kids were rolling along?" I should also add that this was in the buffet dining area! Totaly inapproiate place for those shoes! And mom was clueless as to why the lady had a shocked look on her face - it was because she almost got run over! Last year we were on the Liberty the week before Christmas and there was 800 kids under 16 on the ship. The problem there was Elevator tag. We had my 79 year old MIL traveling with us and our kids and their spouses/friends. We learned early on that we sent the kids via stairs to get seats for the show and we planned early for the elevator - AND - not to stand near the doors. The kids were taking up ALL the elevators and would then burst out when the doors opened - not a real safe environment for the elderly or little ones. So, I would say in most cases it is an issue of POOR PARENTING and Not Rotten kids, although one is a reflection of the other, but the blame lies on the parents.

[scubagirrl]

I know this started as a kid hater thread and turned into potty training and I'm responding to the kid hater part. I'm not a cranky old lady, I'm 50, my kids are in their 20's and I have no grandchildren yet and I'm not in a hurry for that. We enjoy cruising and I don't mind kids on cruises, I do have a problem with Bad Parents. On our last cruise, one lady (I can't call her a Mom - she showed NO Motherly skills) ingnored her4 year old and just let him roam from pool to hot tub while she sat bonding with her 12 year old son - they were smoking their cigarettes together! I guess she showed some motherly instincts by placing swimmies on the little one. One day he was in the hot tub ALONE - no one else in it - and since it was elevated, she could not even see him. Fortunately another adult saw the situation and kept an eye on the little one. Then there was the Korean family in the hot tub (3 adult women and 3 kids) there were 4 other adults in there as well (picture a pretty full tub) the 3 kids had their goggles on and were trying to swim laps and that was ok with the moms & grandma - but not with me - I thought it was TOTALLY RUDE! I also do not like the shoes with wheels on cruise ships either. I saw one old lady almost get knocked over by 2 kids on those and the mom of those kids turned to her hubby and said "did you see how shocked that lady was that the kids were rolling along?" I should also add that this was in the buffet dining area! Totaly inapproiate place for those shoes! And mom was clueless as to why the lady had a shocked look on her face - it was because she almost got run over! Last year we were on the Liberty the week before Christmas and there was 800 kids under 16 on the ship. The problem there was Elevator tag. We had my 79 year old MIL traveling with us and our kids and their spouses/friends. We learned early on that we sent the kids via stairs to get seats for the show and we planned early for the elevator - AND - not to stand near the doors. The kids were taking up ALL the elevators and would then burst out when the doors opened - not a real safe environment for the elderly or little ones. So, I would say in most cases it is an issue of POOR PARENTING and Not Rotten kids, although one is a reflection of the other, but the blame lies on the parents.

 

I'm with you. I don't hate kids, I just can't stand indulgent or neglectful parents. I realize there are a few parents who really have a handle on thier children and their antics.. but it's far from the norm.

[CanadianTwosome]

Wow, you've had some bad experiences. I think most of us here agree with you, though; it is bad parenting. Of course, there are exceptions, but generally those are outbursts where you can see a parent paying attention to their child and looking distraught. Incidents like those you describe are fairly straightforward.

 

I agree about the lack of motherliness... smoking with a child? Allowing a four year old unsupervised in WATER??? If only there was a test for parenting BEFORE someone was allowed to be responsible for another person's life and development!!!

[CanadianTwosome]

I'm with you. I don't hate kids, I just can't stand indulgent or neglectful parents. I realize there are a few parents who really have a handle on thier children and their antics.. but it's far from the norm.

 

I disagree. I don't think it is far from the norm. I just think the 'bad' ones are more noticable and memorable. Most of the kids I know and encounter regularly are quite well behaved. As I've said, I haven't had any bad encounters on cruise ships. I'm not saying I've never seen misbehaving kids, because I have - they're everywhere... I just don't think they're the 'norm' yet... and hopefully never will be!

[tnebell]

So, I would say in most cases it is an issue of POOR PARENTING and Not Rotten kids, although one is a reflection of the other, but the blame lies on the parents.

 

 

TOTALLY agree with you. Okay I have to admit I don't like "judging" others. (that old saying "do not judge lest you be judged" keeps ringing in my ear) but some of the things I've seen parents let their kids do just astounds me. It just makes me want to compliment the responsible parents who are raising good, well-mannered children all the more!

It just amazes me how bratty some kids are now a days! :mad:

[larronry]

So, I would say in most cases it is an issue of POOR PARENTING and Not Rotten kids, although one is a reflection of the other, but the blame lies on the parents.

 

 

TOTALLY agree with you. Okay I have to admit I don't like "judging" others. (that old saying "do not judge lest you be judged" keeps ringing in my ear) but some of the things I've seen parents let their kids do just astounds me. It just makes me want to compliment the responsible parents who are raising good, well-mannered children all the more!

It just amazes me how bratty some kids are now a days! :mad:

So as an older parent (40s) of a 2 year old who wants to raise a well mannered child who ends up looking distraught more than I want to any advice. And let me tell you my son is one of those tough ones who wants his way. I don't give him his way and he screams, goes to the ground, and hits (objects and people- including mommy). Then comes to mommy for comfort because mommy got mad at him. Mommy doesn't give him comfort which is really hard because he looks so damn cute with his arms held up to be picked up. I look away. I have no idea where he learned all this from. It really did start overnight. He was such a good baby and then bang the terrible twos hit.

 

At home and friends houses its easy to do the right thing to ignore. In public of course ignoring means I'm a bad parent for not parenting so then I feel like I'm in a catch 22. I pick him up to walk out of the restaurant and I just gave him want he wanted and I'm encouraging the behavior. But I have to do that because it's not fair to the other people having a nice dinner.

 

Oh if I ever find my son playing elevator tag so help him. And no roller shoes or whatever they are called on ships. I think I'll make sure my neighbor knows that one, but I bet she doesn't pack them for her daughter.