Lawsuits filed in the fuel surcharge against Carnival

[TwinMom7]

Most cruises leave from what is already a vacation destination and in most case other cruiselines leave from there. In other words, lots.

 

Kind of tough when you have 40 people booked and paid in full on a Family and Friends cruise - including non refundable airfare for 20 of us. Try getting all of those rebooked at the same rate given to us nine months earlier - when you're 90 days out.

 

By the time our notification came in November, our airfare went from $205 to $420 per person.

 

$70 compared to $420 - Carnival knew we wouldn't cancel. I wasn't about to let $70 stand between me and a wonderful cruise. Am I happy about it? Of course not. Will it ruin my week? Of course not. Will I cut back on my expenditures on board? You'd better believe it. Less photos and no Carnival based excursions. I've booked three excursions through private vendors. I've recouped my $70 on one excursion alone. One way or another, I'll get my $70 back.

 

That being said, I'm looking forward to a wonderful cruise.

[TwinMom7]

Looks like we're in yet ANOTHER fuel surcharge forum. LOL!!! :D

 

How many does this make? :rolleyes:

 

One too many - that's for sure! I just can't seem to resist!!

[SaltyBunni]

It's an interesting Lawsuit. My bet is it will turn out meritless.

 

So... let's contrast this suit with Banks, when Banks raise their ATM fees.

 

Bank XYZ announces publicly that they are going to raise fees $3, and the next day all the other Banks announce they are also because they do not want to be at a disadvantaqge and miss out on any potential revenue that Bank XYZ would make.

 

Is this price fixing, or just competiveness.. charging what the market will bare?

 

We have a winner.

 

The suit alleges price fixing.

 

For that to be true, we would have to believe that Carnival and every other cruise line that implemented a fuel supplement sat down over lunch and discussed how much they were going to charge and how they were going to do it.

 

I see it more as a matter of opportunity, with Carnival opening the can of worms first.

 

But the thing is, Carnival has had mention of a possible fuel supplement for at least two or more years in the brochure.

 

(I read some of the previous postings and happened across an old brochure I still had printed back in 2006. Sort of surprised me actually)

 

I don't know if Royal had this in old brochures, and that may be why they did the refunds.

 

I don't know what Carnival will do, if anything.

 

But I'm pretty sure I'll read it here first :P

[cathyoo]

I'm not going to let an additional $80 (two of us) ruin our cruise. However, I do think it was a very poor business decision. I would think that if it was $1 surcharge. Nothing to do with the $ amount, it has to do with building trust and relationships between you and your customer.

 

When I read the old brochures my take on the wording is they are talking about fuel surcharges imposed by the government. So if additional taxes were levied on their fuel those surcharges could be passed on to the consumer. I don't think it pertains to "we did not forecast our expenses well, so lets make the customer pay for that" It is why people book early to lock in a good price.

[TwinMom7]

I'm not going to let an additional $80 (two of us) ruin our cruise. However, I do think it was a very poor business decision. I would think that if it was $1 surcharge. Nothing to do with the $ amount, it has to do with building trust and relationships between you and your customer.

 

When I read the old brochures my take on the wording is they are talking about fuel surcharges imposed by the government. So if additional taxes were levied on their fuel those surcharges could be passed on to the consumer. I don't think it pertains to "we did not forecast our expenses well, so lets make the customer pay for that" It is why people book early to lock in a good price.

 

Exactly my argument!!!!! The $ amount means nothing to us. It's the way it was imposed.

[tinlizzy]

I couldn't get the other link to work - this one works

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/stories/2008/02/11/daily41.html

[kobecat]

I don't know how Gtalum figures that other countries have not had the price hike that the US has.

 

In Australia we do litres so I did the sums:

 

1US gallon = 3.79 litres.

 

This week in the Perth, Western Australian metropolitan area we have been paying AU$1.48 per litre for fuel (the highest it has EVER been).

 

Therefore we are paying $5.476AU equivalent for a US gallon of fuel.

Let's convert that now: We get about 90 cents in the US for our AU$ -

 

and the answer is: We pay just over US$5 a gallon for fuel.

 

Now I know you have had a massive hike, but believe me you are not alone!

 

We are booked on the Splendor for the 49 night cruise (which Carnival counts as three cruises) to South America January 2009 and are in the same situation as most posters -booked and deposited prior to the announcement - so we are also hoping that they will rescind it. We certainly won't cancel because of a $210 each surcharge, but it smacks of being unethical.

 

Beryl

[CruzVinnieCruz]

We have a winner.

 

The suit alleges price fixing.

 

For that to be true, we would have to believe that Carnival and every other cruise line that implemented a fuel supplement sat down over lunch and discussed how much they were going to charge and how they were going to do it.

 

I see it more as a matter of opportunity, with Carnival opening the can of worms first.

 

But the thing is, Carnival has had mention of a possible fuel supplement for at least two or more years in the brochure.

 

(I read some of the previous postings and happened across an old brochure I still had printed back in 2006. Sort of surprised me actually)

 

I don't know if Royal had this in old brochures, and that may be why they did the refunds.

 

I don't know what Carnival will do, if anything.

 

But I'm pretty sure I'll read it here first :P

 

Like this has never happened in the travel industry before. Airlines have paid substantial fines for collusion involving the fixing of airline ticket prices. More recently more than a dozen airlines are being investigated for possible price fixing of fuel surcharges at their cargo businesses. Some European carriers have already been fined for their part.

[gtalum]

The point is no one is making you pay a surcharge you have a choice.

 

Indeed. I got Carnival to "refund" my fuel surcharge by giving me an equivalent OBC. :)

[gtalum]

I don't know how Gtalum figures that other countries have not had the price hike that the US has.

 

In Australia we do litres so I did the sums:

 

1US gallon = 3.79 litres.

 

This week in the Perth, Western Australian metropolitan area we have been paying AU$1.48 per litre for fuel (the highest it has EVER been).

 

Therefore we are paying $5.476AU equivalent for a US gallon of fuel.

Let's convert that now: We get about 90 cents in the US for our AU$ -

 

and the answer is: We pay just over US$5 a gallon for fuel.

 

 

I don't dispute that you pay more for gasoline than we do in the US. I dispute that you have seen as large of an increase in prices as we have. In the past 6 months, US average fuel prices have increased nearly 25%. In the same time frame in Australia, according to this website, fuel prices have increased by only 9%. The roughly 40% decline in the value of the US dollar to other major world currencies, including the Australian dollar, have exacerbated the increases in oil prices for us.

[bdtmoult]

Well, it appears that Carnival is really going to fight this. Here is an article from the Orlando Newspaper today. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/custom/tourism/orl-carnival2608mar26,0,1971010.story

 

We really have the most messed up government here in Florida. Not to make this political ... but I really hope that Charlie Crist becomes Vice President just to get him out of here. Florida is a mess!

[Mikel1733]

Well, it appears that Carnival is really going to fight this. Here is an article from the Orlando Newspaper today. http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/custom/tourism/orl-carnival2608mar26,0,1971010.story

 

We really have the most messed up government here in Florida. Not to make this political ... but I really hope that Charlie Crist becomes Vice President just to get him out of here. Florida is a mess!

 

Interesting article. So we are supposed to believe Carnival that their $250,000 contribution (the biggest in 10 years) just happened to be received by the GOP right after they were told they had approval for the fuel surcharge. Screw the customers and pay the politicians.

[oats]

None of those groups raises your price after you sign the contract.

 

 

 

Agreed, if they were honest this is what they'd do.

 

 

 

Not really. Most of the increase in oil prices is due solely to the collapse of the US dollar. Other countries haven't seen the precipitous rise in fuel costs that we have. Thank our nation's incompetent leadership for that.

What have you been smoking have you been to those other country's and see what they have paid for gas the last decade.

[Earthworm Jim]

The fuel price was inserted at a time that everybody could CX their cruise if it bothered them. You had a choice.

 

Yeah, great choice when you already have your flights arranged, which may be non-refundable. You'd pay more to change your flights than the cost of the surcharge.

 

If the price of fuel went down, would they have given us a credit? Then why should we pick up their extra cost when fuel went up? They were the ones that gambled and lost on the price of fuel. They set a price for the cruise, and didn't lock fuel at a lower price on the futures market (however that works, but I know it's possible). They took a gamble, and now they want us to pay for their lost gamble.

[sea_u_onboard]

Like oil is ever going to be below $70 a barrel. What a joke!

 

And even if the conversation happened and things were agreed on they broken one of them by charging people who were already booked.

 

40 million and people said, "Carnival ain't making that much by having already booked passengers pay."

 

The article did have some flaws since they said $70 per person and $140 a cabin. Someone needed to check some facts before publishing.

[oats]

Yeah, great choice when you already have your flights arranged, which may be non-refundable. You'd pay more to change your flights than the cost of the surcharge.

 

If the price of fuel went down, would they have given us a credit? Then why should we pick up their extra cost when fuel went up? They were the ones that gambled and lost on the price of fuel. They set a price for the cruise, and didn't lock fuel at a lower price on the futures market (however that works, but I know it's possible). They took a gamble, and now they want us to pay for their lost gamble.

 

Carnival most likely hedges their fuel cost that means if fuel goes down they offset their cash price,a true hedge is not a profit center it just locks in your fixed cost in of that commodity. Long term trends have to be charge to the consumer. There is no way that you would lock in fuel prices for 3 years that why we just started seeing prices increases this last year while oil prices have been up for the last five years bottom line if fuel goes down what they make on the cash side is lost on the paper trade.We can not get around todays fuel prices unless you just choose to not go.So buck up are stay home.:D

[NotAPirate]

The article did have some flaws since they said $70 per person and $140 a cabin. Someone needed to check some facts before publishing.

Actually, it's correct for the 14-day cruises Carnival has. It's a supplement of $5 per day per person. So $70 is 14 days, so a maximum of $140 per cabin.

[sea_u_onboard]

Actually, it's correct for the 14-day cruises Carnival has. It's a supplement of $5 per day per person. So $70 is 14 days, so a maximum of $140 per cabin.

True - I forgot about the longer cruises.

[Monkeythyme]

 

Collapse of the US dollar is a hidden tax for bailing out people who took on mortgages they could not repay and the mortgage companies who helped them falsify their income so the deals would pass. One of my former tax clients, at the suggestion of his loan officer, asked me to do a tax return four years ago overstating his income and then amend it after the deal was closed. I am pretty sure he found someone who would do it, because he got the loan.

[tess2cruz]

It is killing me all this whinining about the Fuel Surcharge!!! They are asking an extra $35 for a week on board a ship, when I put that much in my car twice a week!!! And most people don't bat an eyelash pulling up to the pump to fill their SUV's, which is half sucked out by the time they get the vehicle in their garage!! We are really screwed up!! :eek:

[oats]

Collapse of the US dollar is a hidden tax for bailing out people who took on mortgages they could not repay and the mortgage companies who helped them falsify their income so the deals would pass. One of my former tax clients, at the suggestion of his loan officer, asked me to do a tax return four years ago overstating his income and then amend it after the deal was closed. I am pretty sure he found someone who would do it, because he got the loan.

 

 

Good point.

[Mikel1733]

It is killing me all this whinining about the Fuel Surcharge!!! They are asking an extra $35 for a week on board a ship, when I put that much in my car twice a week!!! And most people don't bat an eyelash pulling up to the pump to fill their SUV's, which is half sucked out by the time they get the vehicle in their garage!! We are really screwed up!! :eek:

 

I think the majority of us understand the fuel surcharge and the necessity of it or an increase in the cruise price to cover the rise in prices. It was the way Carnival imposed it that has fueled the controversy.

[jason534]

I think the majority of us understand the fuel surcharge and the necessity of it or an increase in the cruise price to cover the rise in prices. It was the way Carnival imposed it that has fueled the controversy.

 

Exactly!

[tess2cruz]

I think the majority of us understand the fuel surcharge and the necessity of it or an increase in the cruise price to cover the rise in prices. It was the way Carnival imposed it that has fueled the controversy.

 

 

I can understand that, if you booked before they implemented it, and now have to pay. When I booked my cruise, it was already a done deal, no surprises. It still just seems like such a small amount to make such a big deal about.

[Mikel1733]

I can understand that, if you booked before they implemented it, and now have to pay. When I booked my cruise, it was already a done deal, no surprises. It still just seems like such a small amount to make such a big deal about.

 

It seems small but if you read the posts of many here they have more than one room, in some cases family groups are involved. So the total charge can be a fair sum. You have to realize many folks stretch the budget to take a cruise. Sometimes folks that live within driving distance of a port have no clue what many pay to cruise. Airfare, taxi, hotel, meals all before you get on the ship.......and that multiplied by several family members. Now you have to go the day before because you can no longer trust airline service. And the airlines have surcharges for baggage now. then the government says you need a passport so several family members pay $99 for a passport and then find out they really didn't need it.