Quarantine on board the Dream

[650cs]

I just got back from a 7-day cruise on the NCL Dream. I never got sick but 100-200 people on board were very sick. After word spread that if you went to the ship's doctor you would be quarantined, many said they just stayed in their room until they felt better. Many were quarantined in their rooms for 24-48 hours, depending on what day you started getting sick. Several were hooked up to IV's in the sick bay. One woman said only her husband was ill but she wasn't allowed to leave her room either. Another said she tried to leave the ship in Cancun to buy formula for her baby (who didn't get sick, the baby was on formula only) and her card had been flagged and they told her to return to her room. It was scary.

The only offical word from NCL was a notice on the TV to report any gastro-intesinal problems. No annoucments over the loud speaker and of course, no indication that any problems because of NCL.

On the last day, everyone on the ship had to fill out a form detailing what they ate the previous Sunday and Monday. Participation was mandatory from the CDC.

[Another Cruise Addict]

Off the subject, is 650CS short for F650CS?

[650cs]

It sure is! I just got it a couple of months ago and I love the way it handles

[Another Cruise Addict]

Congratulations! My wife has one too and she likes hers as much as you like yours.

[uneamie]

I just got back from a 7-day cruise on the NCL Dream. I never got sick but 100-200 people on board were very sick. After word spread that if you went to the ship's doctor you would be quarantined, many said they just stayed in their room until they felt better. Many were quarantined in their rooms for 24-48 hours, depending on what day you started getting sick. Several were hooked up to IV's in the sick bay. One woman said only her husband was ill but she wasn't allowed to leave her room either. Another said she tried to leave the ship in Cancun to buy formula for her baby (who didn't get sick, the baby was on formula only) and her card had been flagged and they told her to return to her room. It was scary.

The only offical word from NCL was a notice on the TV to report any gastro-intesinal problems. No annoucments over the loud speaker and of course, no indication that any problems because of NCL.

On the last day, everyone on the ship had to fill out a form detailing what they ate the previous Sunday and Monday. Participation was mandatory from the CDC.

Hmmm.:rolleyes: I can't begin to imagine what you all went through. I have to wonder if vacationing on a cruise ship does not have far too many risks. While I myself have never encountered any...I am hearing too many incidents lately that have me wondering. :rolleyes:

[swoosh2005]

http://www.cdc.gov/travel/other/cruiseship_recommend.htm

 

here's the CDC site re: cruise ship gastro-ills.

I read on this board a while back (last year?) that it has to be a certain percentage of pax getting ill before there is a warning put out.

I always bring the anti-bacterial hand stuff for ashore and wash my hands alot. I will say that NCL, at least on the Dawn, had those dispensers everywhere you looked-coming and going, at all the restaurants.

[grabbit97]

http://www.cdc.gov/travel/other/cruiseship_recommend.htm

 

here's the CDC site re: cruise ship gastro-ills.

I read on this board a while back (last year?) that it has to be a certain percentage of pax getting ill before there is a warning put out.

I always bring the anti-bacterial hand stuff for ashore and wash my hands alot. I will say that NCL, at least on the Dawn, had those dispensers everywhere you looked-coming and going, at all the restaurants.

 

YOU BET THEY DID, WHEN YOU ENTERED THE CAFE.. OUTDOOR UPPER DECK BUFFET AREA.. THEY WON'T GIVE YOU A PLATE AND SIVERWARE ON A TRAY TIL YOU USE THE BACTERIAL STUFF... AND ENTERING AND LEAVING THE SHIP, THEY GOT THEM ALL OVER, THE ONLY PLACE THEY DID NOT HAVE THEM WAS ENTERING THE MAIN DINING ROOMS, WHICH SURPRISED ME, SINCE WE WERE ON RCCL'S BRILLIANCE OF SEAS IN SEPTEMBER, AND THEY HAD THEM EVERYWHERE.. EVEN ENTERING AND LEAVING THE MAIN DINING ROOMS..

[Philip217]

Swoosh,

Keep using the anti-bacterial stuff. It will help prevent illnesses that are bacterial.

But you need to realise that nearly all these Gastro-intestinal problems and Noro-viruses are exactly that - Viral. Anti-bacterials will have zero effect on them. The hand cleaners you saw on the Dawn are very expensive anti-viral compounds that do kill viruses on contact.

 

The CDC has done extensive research on all these viruses on ships - and in hotels, prisons, and schools. Last year in North America there were 170 MILLION reported cases of Noro-virus. Who knows how many millions more were considered the "three day flu" and not reported at all. Of that 170 Million cases, only about 5,000 were reported on cruise ships. Most cases occurred in enclosed places like nursing homes, prisons, and schools (where the occupants are not the cleanest people in the world). There are also several big hotels in Las Vegas that reported about 20,000 cases in 2004. By comparison, a cruise ship seems far safer.

 

Most of these viruses are known as Fecal-Oral transmission types. (That is "A** to Mouth" in plain English) You normally contract the virus by coming in contact with someone who does not wash his hands after using the toilet.

 

The CDC did a worldwide survey in 2003 (Your tax dollars at work) to determine -by nationality- who washes their hands after using the toilet.

Mainland China came in last, with 17% of the public washing their hands.

The good old USA came in next to last, with 21% washing their hands.

Is anyone surprised that cruise ships with primarily American Passengers are the ones that usually seem to have the viral problems??

Cruise ships that carry primarily European or Japanese passengers almost never see Noro-viruses.

 

How can you avoid catching these viruses?

- Do not touch hand rails and avoid self-service buffet utensils.

- Wash your hands very very often, up to the elbows.

- Do not use your fingers to put food into your mouth.

- Use anti-viral products frequently.

- Chlorine bleach mixed with water at 1000ppm will kill noro-virus on contact.

- Travel on ships that do not carry Americans.

[CruisinMatt]

Same thing happened back in 2003 on my 15 night NCL Dream cruise. My mother came down with a severe case of Norwalk and had to have 2 IVs. I was fine but we were both quaranteed for 2 days. We obeyed, but I know most of the others didn't that got sick, thus is spread rampant throghout the ship.

 

Also - two of the ships doctors on board gave a talk on Noroviruses and mentioned that in some cases it is airborne....

[Happy ks]

Cruise ships do tend to make the news far more often than just about any other venue. I guess because it is considered a luxury and people like to hear sensational news. Only about 3% of the pax and crew need to come down an with intestinal virus to require reporting. The main reason it is hard to contain on a cruise ship is because pax and crew will not quarantine themselves voluntarily. Anyone else staying in their cabin is more than likely a carrier of the virus, too.

 

Can I add a couple more precautions to Philip217, please? Always, always use a paper towel (or your elbos if none available) to turn off the water at the public bathroom sink and use a paper towel to open the door, don't touch the doorknobs, it is covered with germs. Not only do not put your fingers in your mouth, leave them out of your nose and eyes, too. Avoid shaking hands, if possible or wash your hands after shaking with a stranger. Don't touch handrails, or if you must, wash your hands thoroughly afterwards, use your knuckle to push elevator buttons, or a sleeve covered finger. Handwashing should consist of very warm water, soap and friction scrubbing your hands (sing the ABC song at the very minimum). The friction from a paper towel also helps to rid of germs. I have read somewhere that at least 30% of all people do not wash after usuing the bathroom, plus many who do don't bother with soap and merely rinse.

[WaxonWaxov]

If I wanted to leave the ship and they told me to go back to my room, I would go back, pack, then LEAVE the ship and find my own way home.

 

 

There are laws against illegal imprisonment.

 

 

As far as the gastro-intestinal thing goes, it’s probably 100% due to people eating/drinking stuff ashore while in foreign countries. This whole anti-bacterial hand wash thing is just window dressing, just like all this ridiculous post-911 security stuff.

 

 

By the way, anti-bacterial means just that BACTERIAL. This will NOT help with viruses, which is what seems to be the problem.

 

[650cs]

I don't think it is "window dressing" to have the anti-bacterial gels on the ship. Most people do not wash their hands (at all or properly) after using the bathroom. Then these same people get in the buffet line, handle the utensils, deposit fecal matter (yuk) and then you are next in line to touch that same untensil. Later, when you are eating that cookie, roll etc you ingest the stuff. Gross but true.

 

At least by requiring people to use the anti-bacterial gel before entering the buffets, the bacteria is limited and reduced on the serving utenils.

 

What part of this doesn't make sense?

 

Imagine how much bacteria is on the casino chips and cards! Use the anti-bacterial gel in the casino and don't put your hands near your mouth!

 

Wash your hands often and long enough with soap. Each time, imagine that there really is someone's fecal matter on your hands :eek:. When you are at the sink, how long would you wash/rinse?

[smeyer418]

If I wanted to leave the ship and they told me to go back to my room, I would go back, pack, then LEAVE the ship and find my own way home.

 

 

There are laws against illegal imprisonment.

 

 

As far as the gastro-intestinal thing goes, it’s probably 100% due to people eating/drinking stuff ashore while in foreign countries. This whole anti-bacterial hand wash thing is just window dressing, just like all this ridiculous post-911 security stuff.

 

 

By the way, anti-bacterial means just that BACTERIAL. This will NOT help with viruses, which is what seems to be the problem.

 

 

 

There are CDC and Health department rules, which include isolation which may aslo require you to stay in your cabin until cleared. This is not inprisonment. Federal law makes it a crime to violate these rules and not obey orders of the crew. Washing hands properly will also stop the spread of viruses. No one likes to be told what to do, but sometimes it necessary for the health and safety of others.

[WaxonWaxov]

OK. I’ll play.

 

 

So why don’t people get their panties in a wad in every day life? I used to take a commuter train and my pet peeve was people sitting on the train would be reading a newspaper holding it with both hands. Then they would sneeze without covering their mouth... :eek: My personal favorite was one time this guy sneezed like that and blew bogies all over this Wall Street Journal... priceless!

 

 

As far as getting sick goes, my attitude is If it doesn’t kill ya, it will make you stronger.

[salty dingo]

This may sound gross, but I understand the viruses infect in a manner known as the "fecal-oral" route. It doesn't take much imagination to know that this happens when people do not wash their hands.

 

It could be unsupervised children or perhaps elderly or drunk people who cannot remember to do basic hygiene.

 

So, the hand-sanitizers are put out and an attempt is made to require the passengers to wash their hands. As in many cases, a few bad apples spoil the whole bunch.

[CastorFache]

We just visited the Travel Clinic this morning and got the lectures from the doctor who said:

 

"Anti-bacterial washes will help fight off most cases of the runs, but not virus-caused cases. Cruise lines do have some limited anti-viral washes, though they are not universal."

 

With this being said he gave us our shots for Hepatitis A, warned us about Hep B, gave us a prescription for Malaria pills and another for antibiotics for any stomach bacteria we may pick up.

 

WaxonWaxov...I usually agree with "what doesn't kill you, will make you stronger." but in this case in close quarters it could hurt someone else, so better to be cautious.

 

By the by...Malaria pills...make sure to tell the doc all the meds you are taking before he/she prescribes a treatment.

[TheDivineMsM]

When I was on The Dream, the 'do-nothig' crew did nothing to enforce using the anti-bacterial gel or the hand-wipes, so l am not surprised in the least that they are having problems.:eek:

[CastorFache]

Yes Ms M...we are all well aware you were on the "worst cruise ever" aboard the Dream.:rolleyes: I truly do hope your next vacation is better, really I do...

 

Washing ones hands should not have to be enforced...it should be done with common sense and courtesy. I know not everyone will do it, but I know I will, and I wish everyone else would. But then again the old saying says "wish in one hand poop in the other, see which fills first" :D

[WaxonWaxov]

Luckily for me, I was in the Navy for ten years so I've been vaccinated against pretty much everything including anthrax.

[mhenry]

One thing I have learned from reading these boards is that unless you are dying and desperately need medical attention, do not report to cruise personnel that you are not feeling well. Darn if I'm going to have my vacation (as well as my traveling companions) ruined because of Norwalk paranoia.

 

There are many things that have similar symptoms to Norwalk and most pass very quickly and are not contagious, especially on vacation when you may be consuming foods that your system is not used to. I will use my own good judgement as to when I am fit to be around other passengers.

 

I think the cruiselines have become over-zealous in their efforts to reduce Norwalk virus, oftentimes guarantining people unnecessarily or for longer periods than are necessary. This level of protection may be wise if we were talking about the plague or some other deadly disease, but we are talking about a simple viral infection that to the vast majority of people is nothing more serious than a little nausea and diarrhea.

 

Most of us have had Norwalk virus at some point in our lives without even realizing it, simply passing it off as a stomach virus or upset tummy. How come, then, when on a cruiseship it is talked about as if equivalent to the smallpox epidemics of the 1800's?

[WaxonWaxov]

well said.

 

I've decided that the only way I, or anyone in my group, is going to the medical folks on the ship is if we're having tightening in our chest with shooting pain down our left arm.

 

Funny thing about this whole Norwalk vs. Stomache flu thing is this: Years ago when I was in the Navy there was a big out-break of "stomache flu" far too many to be statistically viable. Funny thing was that it was noticed that all these people were on the same Saturday duty shift (in port everyone else was off) and they all had the same thing for lunch. So did the Navy cover-up a rash of food poisoning? Only the ship's doctor and head cook know for sure. Do the cruise lines cover-up bad food issues with cries of Norwalk virus? Only they know for sure.

[GregInCharlotte]

On the (second to the) last cruise I was on (not NCL), a dinning room table mate of ours described how his wife went to the ships clinic complaining of stomach difficulty and they confined her to her cabin for 72 hours. The woman later told us she felt fine after 24 hours and felt she was almost punished - 3 days in her cabin - for going to the clinic.

 

My wife and I decided right then and there if we had any symptoms we'd rather snort ground up Tums then miss Helsinki, Stockholm and Oslo.

 

Is it possible the ship makes it clear (as they subsequently did) "if you get sick you will be quarantined" to reduce the number of reported cases?

[WaxonWaxov]

Is it possible the ship makes it clear (as they subsequently did) "if you get sick you will be quarantined" to reduce the number of reported cases?

Years ago when I was in the Navy I cut my hand. It was a superficial cut that required a band-aid only.

 

As I had no band-aids I asked the ship's doctor for one.

 

After pulling my record he said "looks like you're due a typhiod booster"

 

A typhoid booster litterally incapacitates your arm for 24 hours.

 

I did NOT need the shot. I was punished for asking for a band aid. I was too young and naive to realize it at the time. If I had, I could've had that doctor's commision.

 

So my answer to your question is a resounding YES.

 

One more reason to be against socialized medicine.

[dosi]

When we were on the Star I realized I had not packed enough of my medication and wanted to see if the infirmary stocked it. When I asked our steward how to get to the doctor the steward wanted to know who was sick, what was the nature of the illness, etc etc. I think all of the ships staff are mandated to keep a close eye on passengers if they suspect any type of easily transmittable illness.

[Philip217]

All international cruise ships are required by international law to report any and all observed and reported illnesses to port authorities at least 24 hours before arrival. Failure to do this gets them into lots of trouble.

Several months ago the Norwegian Sky reported their illnesses to Vancouver authorities only 20 hours before arrival. There were very few ilnesses to report - and none of them was serious. But the Canadians made them pay a huge fine and even considered denying permission for the ship to dock in Canada.

The ships management is justifiably concerned and obligated to investigate every case they discover.