wayne_trisha

12 minutes ago, FrostyJoe said:

I didn't know it was the Harmony.  I was wondering if it was the Meraviglia. What caused Harmony to to be in the hot zone?

 

I thought KSC and especially the bus tour was fascinating!  But once maybe twice will be enough--unless I'm rocket guy or a Musk fan.  Yea, I've wondered the same what else as PC as a port of call. 

I'm turning into a space buff and loving my job helping the launch providers get their rockets into space. So much to see on CCSFS and KSC that a tour will never show you. Years ago I got to do some off roading in a Humvee. It was great and the things I learned! WOW. 

Going to book Meraviglia departing next  month. My options:

1. Have a TA who does not like MSC. Told her we might book this and said "no way, just had a client who is a big time cruiser and hated every minute of their cruise." but she is a family friend and gives up some of her commission towards OBC.

2. Called MSC and told the agent I wanted Aurea balcony on this date and this ship. Gave him my MSC rewards number and asked for military discount. After awhile came back with a cabin that was not aurea based on what I know, was $100 more than what I could book. Said military discount would be figured after I booked.

3. Book online with MSC. Last time I did this my entire demographic profile was given to a guy in Virginia and I had his. I called him and we talked. Told hm what was going on and we agreed he would handle it as his cruise date was closer.

4. Book online with another TA and PRAY, PRAY, PRAY we don't go through the ridiculousness my daughter just went through on the Seashore. SIX cabin changes and the linked cruise with their friends didn't mean ***** as each time they either moved closer or further away. Actually ended up one cabin above the other four decks apart. LOVED their cruise. 

So which do you book? We are RCCL cruisers and have a cruise on Divina. We loved our Divina cruise but damn! the lead up to an MSC cruise is a mess. The conversation between the guy who had our info was hilarious. He was just as shocked I had all his info as I was when I saw it in my online booking.

18 minutes ago, FrostyJoe said:

I am so jealous 🥺!!!  I do like PC for the convenience and ease and less crowded feel….but something about that POM sailing out just screams “I’m cruising now!!!”  I think it’s the views out of POM

 

If I was near PC/POM, I’d be like that “weekend cruiser” YouTuber having a bag always ready to go at a moments notice!  Sooo jealous 

Many weekend cruises booked days in advance. Was great to have that option. I have no inside information (unless you want to know why Harmony of the Seas caused a launch to get scrubbed) but I think a lot of people want to do the theme parks before/after a cruise. I'm still curious what people do when PC is a port stop on their cruise. Go to KSC and..... I don't know. 

On 1/31/2022 at 10:50 AM, FrostyJoe said:

Shhhhhhhhhh  let's keep the secret confined to these boards!!!

 

My unresearched/uneducated guess is that PC based cruises attracts more families or folks within driving distance vs. Miami based cruises....and a generally more conservative approach when it comes to travel during covid??   If one is okay with flying (which I would imagine higher percentage of Miami based cruisers are flying to Miami vs. PC), it's a different crowd vs. I-shalt-not-fly-during-covid crowd to begin with....

 

Pure speculation

I live close to PC and drive around it to work on Cape Canaveral SFS. PC is becoming the premiere port in Florida. Carnival, RCCl ,NCL, Disney are porting their brand-new ships here. I think because it is a fabulous port to go out, easy enough to get here from Orlando (so days spent in Orlando), the surrounding area is a nice small-town community. I'm excited about having all the new ships here. Less driving and anxiety of getting to the port on time. 

19 minutes ago, Kathscof said:

 

And beyond the explanations already given that could have been possible, you’ll have to ask the people in charge of the boat...

Winner winner chicken dinner. How did this happen is a question answered by whoever was navigating the ship.   I don’t know why flamingos cannot understand this. 

The hazard area was published early last week. Since this launch had the same launch window day after day no changes were made to the coordinates of the hazard area nor the times it was active.

On Friday, Sunday, and Monday numerous cruise ships left the port without entering the hazard area. Obviously the hazard area was avoidable. There were also plenty of boats that stayed out of the hazard area.

SpaceX starts fuel loading around 35 minutes prior to launch.

Many launches, including this launch that was scrubbed, have very short launch windows. This window was 11 minutes but it the T-0 was 6:11. It was either launch at 6:11 or scrub. No time to recycle and try again.

Rockets are scheduled based on orbital mechanics. They must launch at a specific time and trajectory to reach their intended destination in space.

Harmony OTS did not surprise anyone. They were a known target well before the launch was scrubbed.

I have no idea why Harmony went into the hazard area. I think the captain owes me some drinks as this violation directly results in more work for me for each launch.

20 minutes ago, Rayhorn said:

Thanks for you first hand info about the timeline. That’s very interesting to know.

 

I knew the Coast Guard wasn’t calling for the scrub. My original wording was not clear at all. I had been talking about the coast guard and then subsequently said “once she crossed over they called for the abort”. I see now that to anyone reading my phrasing, it would appear as though I was saying the CG called for the abort. The “they” that I was referring to was actually the launch team but as I didn’t specify that, it wasn’t clear at all.

 

Thank you for your very interesting insight on this thread. It’s really neat to hear from someone who is involved with the launch.

Thanks! It is really interesting as an insider to see the general public's perception of what happened. I started to type up a nice long post about what happened but decided this might not be a great idea. I coordinated the sea space hazard area and while I have verified I was 100% correct on the times/coordinates, I might be a part of the investigation. 

But based on what I heard, not WATCHED as my side only watches air targets, I think the sea surveillance people and the USCG are 100% NOT at fault.

10 hours ago, Rayhorn said:

@alfaeric

 

I think harmony crossed into the exclusion zone just prior to the abort.

 

The coast guard was aware of her position and it sounds like they were attempting to get her to turn away but once she crossed over they called for the abort. 

Your narrative is very close. Your timeline is about 30 minutes off.

The Coast Guard is a great member on our launch team but they have zero authority to scrub a launch. They do have authority to redirect watercraft and were actively directing Harmony OTS out of the hazard area.

2 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

 

Sheriff's boat has no jurisdiction past the jetties.  USCG does not have a VTS (vessel tracking service) in the Miami area, so they would not be tracking vessels like air traffic control does.  Not sure if there were cutters out patrolling the area.  It is not that the USCG would be "relaying risk factors" to the Captain, but if a cutter determined that the ship was inside the zone, they should have been calling on 16 and telling them to get out.  It is not a matter of "risk factor", that exclusion zone is a matter of law, and violation can lead to fines, as I've said earlier, up to $250k.  As a law enforcement agency, the USCG has every right to notify the Captain of a vessel that he is in violation of a regulation.

I heard the USCG working diligently to get Harmony out of the hazard area. We have one or two USCG personnel in our room for launches because they have the authority to tell ships/boats what to do. 

1 hour ago, flamingos said:

No ships tonight: she's up!

It was an interesting night in the surveillance room. There were numerous targets of interest including four cruise ships. Fortunately for all of us on the launch team they stayed out of the hazard area.

4 hours ago, dandee2 said:

pretty Clear on the NOTAM

The air and sea hazard areas are similar but not the same. Nice to see both of my maps in this discussion. 

37 minutes ago, lovesthebeach2 said:

The Orlando sentinel wrote in todays paper that both harmony and an MSC ship were in the path….. the MSC was in the Port Channel, Harmony was offshore.

It was not MSC. The port channel is not in the hazard area.

13 minutes ago, Rayhorn said:

That’s awesome. My knowledge of the maritime stuff is extremely basic. However as a former airline pilot, TFRs I understand. I’ve heard many calls on guard for pilots (almost always private aircraft) busting TFRs and it always amuses me. Some people never check the NOTAMs. Your friendly neighborhood F16 will wake you up pretty quick. That’s very cool to hear of someone on the other side. Anyway….waaay off topic. 😜

These launches with southern trajectories have hazard areas hugging the coast for quite a distance. Easy enough for a fishing boat to end up in the hazard area. I never expected a cruise ship. I also know the NOTMARs (notice to mariners) and NOTAMs (notice to airmen) were published days in advance because I made the requests and received responses 5 days before the Thursday launch attempt and they covered through today's launch attempt. 

4 hours ago, molly361 said:

 

According to the news and photos here in Central Florida it was the MSC ship

1 hour ago, Rayhorn said:

It was definitely harmony. I just looked at the launch hazard area in the notice to mariners. The MSC ship was in the harbor channel at the time of the abort. The harbor was not in the launch hazard area. However, harmony just crossed over the border of the hazard area at the time of the scrub. Harmony could have been fine if she had traveled more south until the maritime exclusion zone expired (after rocket landed) but it seemed to not alter course from its normal, direct course. 
 

The purple box is the maritime exclusion zone. I used marine traffic to show the position of the two vessels at abort time. 
 

I am the creator of this map. I worked last night in the room conducting sea surveillance but I am on the air side. We definitely were not watching football.

22 minutes ago, Ginlyn said:

It wasn’t Harmony but MSC.  I was on the beach waiting for the launch.

It was definitely Harmony OTS.  

3 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

Rest well 

Too crazy for that. I'm hunting Santa Claus. I think he didn't give me enough gifts.

4 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

There is help for this type of anger.  It’s not healthy.

Maybe I should just wear a mask and shut up? You get scared of facts? RCL is a BILLION dollar corporation and I was on a ship that costs over a BILLION dollars yet it could not afford one of the most important games of the college football season late in the season the last week before conference playoffs started but with my $14 internet package I could watch it on my device. You are either ignorant of college football or you you suck the Royal something or other. you decide. I'm definitely not angry. 

so much BS and I will probably get another naughty gram cuz some here got their feelings hurt. If I can stream a game because I have a $20 a month internet streaming package you would think a multi BILLION, B BILLION$, not M $million$, $B capitol$ B$ BILLION$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ corporation just might be able to show the sports people might want to see. 

My last cruise on the $$$$$BILLION dollar Harmony of the Seas was Nove 28th - Dec 5th. Do you thonk they shows the Alabama vs Georgia game on A single damn TV any on the ship?? $$$$$$$BILLION DOLLAR SHIP and I watched it on their $15 a day internet package. 

Really don't understand how RCCL can show EVERY other game that day but not the biggest game of the day. But I have grown to understand how damn(not the F word cuz I might get reported for hate crimes or some other b something.) stupid it is not watch significant events on RCCL. Good thing they are opening sports bars to show rugby and cricket. STUPID STUPID STUPID decisions. 

8 hours ago, goldengirl said:

There’s a lot of people out there that can’t go on the cruise and just enjoy the trip without drinking sounds to me like he could just stay home and drink and have your vacation at home there’s plenty of us to go on a cruise just to enjoy ourselves and we don’t need any alcohol to have a great time that’s a big extra expense $60 a day times seven day $420 for one x 2= $840?? That could be another cruise for some of us

Sounds to me you should keep your judgy self at home. 

We actually BOTH won casino t-shirts one cruise. I guess it was time to get rid of them.

35 minutes ago, Sunshine3601 said:

Maybe that will help the problem of those machines always being broken.😉

We can only hope. The only real diamond benefit my wife truly enjoys and often it is broke!

2 hours ago, donnalack said:

Greetings.

We are on Independence, leaving December 27, from Port Canaveral. As I understand the current RCCL Covid requirements, we’re required to take a test 2 days before. Unfortunately, two days before ends up being Christmas Day. Nothing is open where I live on Christmas Day, not CVS, not Walgreens, nothing!  This is the first time we’ve cruised in 18 months, and I’m really not sure how to handle this. I would welcome your suggestions. Thank you very much!

No LONGER than 2 days prior. You can test morning of your cruise. Sadly I will probably be driving past IOTS on my way to work.

3 hours ago, Cigar King said:

Search is your friend and it has all the answers you seek.

Is that a diamond benefit? SWEET 🙂

6 hours ago, Birdnutty said:

I'd like to think so.  I crushed up a few walnuts and pumpkin seeds and tried to scatter them among some of the plants the birds seemed to be hanging out in.  If the birds find them, it could be a small source of protein, but hardly enough to sustain them for long.

Pretty sure any birds in central park love all the scraps from the park cafe as people drop food or leave food on their table as they walk away. 

$196 for 7 nights on Harmony Nov 28th.