Underhanded Marketing HAL

[donh1]

Just experienced their very unfair marketing ploy. There has been numerous discussions about price drops and the fact that HAL will credit you back the difference. That does not include balconies or suites. Take a look at their brochure and you will see that the VH cabins and SZ suites in the brochure are not available. When the ship is not selling well these 4 cabins and 2 suites come available at the new lower price. In our case the price I paid for the lowest balcony on the Westerdam was $799. Two days after the final payment date they had a sale selling balconies for $649. I tried to get an adjustment and was told no because I had a higher priced cabin. Family traveling with us were able to get a room credit because they booked an HH lowest ocean view cabin.

 

Just take a look at their brochure and you will see the lowest balcony and also suite are not available. Something as bold as this has to be definitely legal but I wonder if it playing fair with those customers who book early.

 

So next time you hear that someone got free upgrade from a SZ to higher suite or from a VH upwards you can be assured that they bought there cabin at a bargain basement price and there was no place else to put them other than up.

 

I am certainly going to continue to travel with HAL but I am a little wiser.:mad:

[brucory]

Just experienced their very unfair marketing ploy. There has been numerous discussions about price drops and the fact that HAL will credit you back the difference. That does not include balconies or suites. Take a look at their brochure and you will see that the VH cabins and SZ suites in the brochure are not available. When the ship is not selling well these 4 cabins and 2 suites come available at the new lower price. In our case the price I paid for the lowest balcony on the Westerdam was $799. Two days after the final payment date they had a sale selling balconies for $649. I tried to get an adjustment and was told no because I had a higher priced cabin. Family traveling with us were able to get a room credit because they booked an HH lowest ocean view cabin.

 

Just take a look at their brochure and you will see the lowest balcony and also suite are not available. Something as bold as this has to be definitely legal but I wonder if it playing fair with those customers who book early.

 

So next time you hear that someone got free upgrade from a SZ to higher suite or from a VH upwards you can be assured that they bought there cabin at a bargain basement price and there was no place else to put them other than up.

 

I am certainly going to continue to travel with HAL but I am a little wiser.:mad:

 

Sorry to hear about your dissapointment. I always thought that once you went past final payment as you did, that there was no discussion about credit back of the difference. You mentioned booking a "higher category". What did you book? I assume they are now offering VH guarantees at the lower price? I can certainly understand they need to have a way to sell spare rooms without having to refund everyone the difference. If they did this, they would have very poor yields.

 

Hope it doesn't spoil your plans and have a great cruise!!!

 

:D:D:D

[coffeeclutch1]

If you were happy with the price when you booked it, you should still be happy. You can't worry about how much it might came down later. Enjoy your trip!

[PennyAgain]

You are paying to get selection and choice. People who book later don't have those options.

 

Once I make a booking decision, I don't look back. Aggravating yourself over a few dollars isn't worth it. My mental vacation starts with the booking decision.

 

Aggravated I can get at work!

[happy cruzer]

My experience is that HAL and Princess did not do the price drops ever. Rebook it you like and take a chance on losing your room. also could rebook after final payment if the drop was worth it.

 

RCL, etc. were the ones doing price drops. and they have new policies really limiting them doing it now. The industry seems to be changing in this regard.

[Candy]

...snip... So next time you hear that someone got free upgrade from a SZ to higher suite or from a VH upwards you can be assured that they bought there cabin at a bargain basement price and there was no place else to put them other than up. I am certainly going to continue to travel with HAL but I am a little wiser.:mad:

 

SZ cabins are sold as GTYs (kind of a holding category for Superior Suites and above). Since there are only 2 of them on Vista ships, ALL but the 2 get upgrades.

[jtl513]

... ALL but the 2 get upgrades.

Or maybe ALL get upgrades, and some Vx gets the SZ. :)

[kakalina]

I've only had HAL drop the price before final payment was due. Never after regardless of the cabin category.

[donh1]

I am now simply a smarter consumer. Anyone such as myself who is booking a guarantee room has only one thing in mind. VALUE FOR YOUR MONEY.

If by chance you are lucky enough to get one of these sales after the final payment date there is large savings. On my sailing our balcony would have been almost 25% cheaper $300 and almost a certain chance of an upgrade due to the minimal numbers available. Holland America remains my Cruise Line of choice and as always we should have a great cruise.

[catl331]

I've only had HAL drop the price before final payment was due. Never after regardless of the cabin category.

Before final payment, is it necessary to cancel and rebook to get a price drop, or is there another strategy that can be used? Like: ask for OBC's for the difference? If you cancel and rebook do you lose the HAL CPP premium and have to pay that again?

[brucory]

Before final payment, is it necessary to cancel and rebook to get a price drop, or is there another strategy that can be used? Like: ask for OBC's for the difference? If you cancel and rebook do you lose the HAL CPP premium and have to pay that again?

 

This is where a good booking agent comes in (whether they be internet or bricks and mortar, or HAL PCC). Price drops should be honored before sailing, however some people have received OBC or upgraded to the next category. That would be the choice of the purchaser and the agent, depending on the intended outcome.

 

It is really worthwhile to check other cruise sites before final payment to see if there is better pricing available, but there really is no point after final payment unless the difference is substantial enough to take on the cancellation penalty and rebooking saving.

 

:D:D:D

[bepsf]

Some folks go on and on and on about how they've found a lower price for their cruise after they've booked or after they've made final payment - and how awful and unscrupulous the cruiseline is for not giving them the lower price...

 

...so I wonder - do these folks do the same thing when they make other purchases?

 

After they buy a car and take it home, then see a rebate or special financing deal advertised on TV a few weeks later that wasn't available when the purchase was made - do they go back to the dealer and insist on getting the rebate/better financing deal?

 

When they buy clothing or something for the home and see at the end of the season that the store is having a clearance sale - do they go back and insist on being refunded the difference?

 

If they buy a box of cookies at the grocery store on Thursday and see a coupon in the following Sunday paper for 25 cents off that same box of cookies - do they take the box and coupon to the store Monday and try to get that 25 cents off the box they bought last week?

 

 

It's the same with upgrades: If someone buys a new Buick, do they grumble when the dealer doesn't hand them the keys to a Cadillac? When they order a Hamburger in a restaurant, are they disappointed when the waitress doesn't deliver a Steak? Do they fuss and complain to the Airline and anyone else who will listen when they don't get bumped up to First Class on a Coach ticket?

 

I just wonder what's the difference with cruises that makes some folks into such awful money-grubbers?

[Pete Jackson]

It probably goes in cycles; if a cruise line will drop fares as much as needed just before sailing just to avoid having empty cabins, but won't offer these reductions to early bookers, then they shouldn't be surprised if they have difficulty selling bookings well in advance. If they promise early bookers that they will receive any price reductions that occur later, then they will get more early bookers. Either way, the nature of the contract should be made clear when people book, so that people don't become disgruntled when big price reductions are made later.

 

Problems arise when both pax and cruise lines try to have it both ways.

 

I think that the best solution is for the cruise lines to make a commitment about 90 days before sailing - decide what the final price will be and sail with empty cabins if that is the result.

[Nasmas]

I think most people are aware that they are taking a chance when they book early BUT they will get the cabin they want by booking early. If you wait too long, waiting for the price to go down, you risk not getting the cabin you want or in some cases, a booked cruise. We usually book when we get the urge and if the price goes down, so be it. I'd think the cruise lines have to sell some cabins at a higher price. It might not sound fair but that's life. You buy a car in the spring, you can bet the price is going to come down in the fall when the new models come out, but that's just the way it is. Most companies can't sell everything at discounted prices and expect to stay in business. The cruise lines have to sell X number of cabins to break even. I don't think anyone could expect them not to try to fill the rooms. You might be surprised on a plane if you surveyed the pax. There probably won't be two on the flight that paid the same price. They need to sell seats to stay in business. I agree they could be a little nicer about it but that's just fact.

[Tricia724]

It's just like at the casino.....how much of a gambler are you?

 

Will the price of your cruise go up or down, and are you willing to take the chance?

 

Do you care whether you sail on this particular cruise at this particular time or do you have a Plan B and Plan C if the prices rise dramatically or the cruise sells out?

 

Do you care about the size of your cabin, or the deck, or whether it is fore, aft, or midship or near the elevators or under the pool or over the thrusters?

 

Do you care whether you get early or late seating for dinner, or is open seating fine for you?

 

There are all kinds of options that factor into booking a cruise. Everyone has different priorities and tolerance levels. BUT once you make the final payment, don't look back.

 

There will always be someone who got a "better deal" if you look hard enough and want to drive yourself crazy. We have also seen prices drop and others get a break we did not get. In a couple of cases we got the break. You just have to make your decision about what is important to you, go with it, and let the chips fall where they may.

[Candy]

I think most people are aware that they are taking a chance when they book early

Some TAs, who work on commission, will infer that if you buy a GTY cabin, you will get an upgrade to a much nicer cabin. They fail to advise that you could very well get the worst cabin in that category.

BUT they will get the cabin they want by booking early. If you wait too long, waiting for the price to go down, you risk not getting the cabin you want or in some cases, a booked cruise. We usually book when we get the urge and if the price goes down, so be it.

We book about 6 months out in order to get the best cabin selection. We usually book 8099 on Vistas and hope for an upgrade/upsell offer. If it isn't offered, we are TOTALLY comfortable in 8099 at the price we paid. I suffered through a Norway GTY and after several months, was totally satisfied with a PH.

The cruise lines have to sell X number of cabins to break even. I don't think anyone could expect them not to try to fill the rooms.

On a 7-day cruise, even if the ship sails at 120%, it doesn't break even until day 5, and sometimes not at all. It's always about onboard revenue. They have goals in every department that must be met, and that's why you see more sales at the end of the week.

 

Candy the ZuiderPrincess

[bepsf]

Some TAs, who work on commission, will infer that if you buy a GTY cabin, you will get an upgrade to a much nicer cabin.

 

Those are some dumb TA's...

 

They should instead state honestly that upgrades rarely if ever happen - and persuade clients to book better/more expensive cabins so that their commission will be greater!

[Candy]

Those are some dumb TA's... They should instead state honestly that upgrades rarely if ever happen - and persuade clients to book better/more expensive cabins so that their commission will be greater!

GTY upgrades happen quite often; the SZ always. In the lower cat GTYs the upgrade will reflect the same cabin in maybe a better location. The rarer upgrades are inside to balcony or better.

 

I wonder if there are some TAs out there who get a flat rate for a booking (like if they work in a boiler room for a company)? If so, it's easier to sell a cheap GTY than a suite.

 

Candy

[JimVrhovac]

We have recieved price reduction on the cabins prior to final payment but never after final payment.

 

We book early and get the cabin we want and if the price goes down the better, if not, we are satisfied.

 

We think the people expect their cabins to be discounted and this is not always corret.

 

Ruth & Jim

[cruisecrasy]

Some folks go on and on and on about how they've found a lower price for their cruise after they've booked or after they've made final payment - and how awful and unscrupulous the cruiseline is for not giving them the lower price...

 

...so I wonder - do these folks do the same thing when they make other purchases?

 

After they buy a car and take it home, then see a rebate or special financing deal advertised on TV a few weeks later that wasn't available when the purchase was made - do they go back to the dealer and insist on getting the rebate/better financing deal?

 

When they buy clothing or something for the home and see at the end of the season that the store is having a clearance sale - do they go back and insist on being refunded the difference?

 

If they buy a box of cookies at the grocery store on Thursday and see a coupon in the following Sunday paper for 25 cents off that same box of cookies - do they take the box and coupon to the store Monday and try to get that 25 cents off the box they bought last week?

 

 

It's the same with upgrades: If someone buys a new Buick, do they grumble when the dealer doesn't hand them the keys to a Cadillac? When they order a Hamburger in a restaurant, are they disappointed when the waitress doesn't deliver a Steak? Do they fuss and complain to the Airline and anyone else who will listen when they don't get bumped up to First Class on a Coach ticket?

 

I just wonder what's the difference with cruises that makes some folks into such awful money-grubbers?

 

YES...if they had not taken actual possession of the 'item' and hadn't already used it..which is obvious with a cruise!

 

I have asked for rebates and so I guess I am one of those 'moneygrubbers' ' as u put it..however, I take exception to being called 'awful'!! Besides, whats wrong with wanting a deal anyway?? Its the foundation for the business world....:)

 

If u don't want to 'moneygrub' thats your choice...others do and thats their choice!

Seems to me if more folks had 'moneygubbed' a few yrs ago the economy might not be in as bad a shape now..:(

 

The cruiselines are offering deals so folks certainly shldn't then be critizied for asking for the deals...or being disappointed & venting a bit when they don't get them as the OP is - IMO anyway!

 

Happy cruises & lots of 'em!

[brucory]

 

...so I wonder - do these folks do the same thing when they make other purchases? Do they fuss and complain to the Airline and anyone else who will listen when they don't get bumped up to First Class on a Coach ticket?

 

I just wonder what's the difference with cruises that makes some folks into such awful money-grubbers?

 

I get what you are saying Brian, but have to admit something. If I book a coach ticket on an airplane and there is the opportunity to get a credit if the price drops, or an upgrade to first, I am happy to check it out, and ask for it. Anyone who doesn't is missing out at their own loss...

 

That said, there is no point checking prices if there is not a policy for any change, as was the case with the OP.

 

:D:D:D

[jhannah]

I'm often chagrined at the great deals last-minute bookers receive. And yet I blow it off because by booking 10-12 months out I got the cabin/location and dining preference I wanted.

[Jade13]

. When the ship is not selling well these 4 cabins and 2 suites come available at the new lower price. In our case the price I paid for the lowest balcony on the Westerdam was $799. Two days after the final payment date they had a sale selling balconies for $649.

 

I think the key here is that you tried to get an adjustment after the final payment due date. As far as I have known HAL has never adjusted prices for clients after the final payment date. RCCL/Celebrity is the only cruise line that I know who will make an adjustment after the final payment due date if requested. Maybe not that many people ask so they just do it upon request. On my HAL cruises as far as I know they have all been sold out and prices went up before that.

 

If this is the Caribbean, well that is another situation because of competition prices are lower for just about all cruise lines as they try to fill their cabins. The reason given for no adjustment is another story but that was unusual that HAL adjusted prices after final payment for some of your family members. I have never heard of that. Did they book directly with HAL or through an outside TA?

[Jade13]

 

RCL, etc. were the ones doing price drops. and they have new policies really limiting them doing it now. The industry seems to be changing in this regard.

 

What is RCCL new policy now? We received two price drops on Celebrity last year after final payment.

[world~citizen]

Just experienced their very unfair marketing ploy. There has been numerous discussions about price drops and the fact that HAL will credit you back the difference. That does not include balconies or suites. Take a look at their brochure and you will see that the VH cabins and SZ suites in the brochure are not available. When the ship is not selling well these 4 cabins and 2 suites come available at the new lower price. In our case the price I paid for the lowest balcony on the Westerdam was $799. Two days after the final payment date they had a sale selling balconies for $649. I tried to get an adjustment and was told no because I had a higher priced cabin. Family traveling with us were able to get a room credit because they booked an HH lowest ocean view cabin.

 

Just take a look at their brochure and you will see the lowest balcony and also suite are not available. Something as bold as this has to be definitely legal but I wonder if it playing fair with those customers who book early.

 

So next time you hear that someone got free upgrade from a SZ to higher suite or from a VH upwards you can be assured that they bought there cabin at a bargain basement price and there was no place else to put them other than up.

 

I am certainly going to continue to travel with HAL but I am a little wiser.:mad:

 

HAL is a line that gives you what you pay for.

 

I have never received an adjustment if cabin prices lower after final payment. On the other hand, I have received some wonderful upgrades. I have sailed other lines where I have never received an upgrade. They did, however, extend price cuts to my booking even after final payment.

 

I think you are suggesting that HAL isn't applying policy in a consistent (or fair?) fashion. If there is anything HAL likes doing more than setting wacky rules it is defending them as if the life of their first born depended on it.

 

It is their HALmark so to speak. :D

 

Smooth sailing to you...