What will the Luxury cruise segment be like in 5 years??

[Jaffa]

I was going to post this on the Seabourn board thread re: their change in dress code.

But by the time l wrote it the thread had been closed.

Because it is relevant to SS as well l will post it here instead.

 

 

 

Here's my take on this, for what its worth.

 

RSSC has always placed it market alongside Crystal due to ship size, and Seabourn competes more with Silversea for the same reason.

 

To differentiate themselves from their main compeditors RSSC has downgraded their dress standards whilst still trying to stay Lux, therefore offering a big change to Crystal while staying in the same price range.

They now have introduced partial all inclusive and due to the GFC have included shore X's (even if only for a short time).

They have also taken into account the fact that Crystal was doing very well with the family/childrens market and have now gone family friendly year round (rather than just summer and holidays) with advertising and marketing to match. They have also taken the bold step and gone completly smoke free.

 

Seabourn has also downgraded its dress standards to stand out from its major compeditor SS.

I would hazard a guess that with all the new capacity coming online with Seabourn this is probally a sound business decision as well. It will have far more berths to fill than SS will. Even though l don't think this will please Seabourn regulars l don't think they really have a choice here.

 

Silversea has moved in a more radical direction by taking on a totally new product via their expedition ship the PA11 and has started to sell extra dining options onboard the Spirit, (which none of the other Lux lines are doing). SS regulars are not to happy in having to pay more for choice dining.

 

Both Seabourn and SS have moved to a larger ship size as well, with it seems, very mixed results. Although Seabourn is doing it in a big way, there does not seem any plans for SS to add another Spirit in the distant future, as they canceled their option late last year.

 

My opinion is Silversea will not drop its dress code. In fact it may see an advantage to keep its existing standard to differentiate itself from Seabourn.

 

Reading the Regent board l see many regulars are making the move to Seabourn and SS due to the drop in dress code, smoking policy and the welcoming of familys year round. But they are picking up more business with the Lux family set and the non smokers.

 

Now that Seabourn are also lowering dress, SS are likely pick up some of those that like to dress from both cruiselines.

 

I predict that in the next few years when the Seabourn triplets are retired. Seabourns main compeditor will change from SS to Regent.

 

Silversea will then stand quite alone and their prices will rise accordingly. (much to my dismay).

 

I think over the next 5 years the Lux segment of the cruise industry is going to have a pretty big shake up. I would enjoy the present moment while we can, as l believe everythings about to change.

For better or for worse.

 

The sheer volume of capacity increase means something will have to give. Be it service, price or standards.

 

Of course this is only my opinion, who knows, l could be completely wrong. But l do know our definition of Luxury cruising today is about to change significantly.

[jerblu]

You seem to equate Luxe with Dress Code. I could not care less. I will wear my tux on formal nites, etc., but it doesnt give me any special thrill.

 

I define luxe differently. The food is probably paramount. The attention to detail. The attitude toward guests, to make certain that each guest's personal needs are met. On Crystal, the lectures.

 

Tell me what I've missed. I dont know how the raters decide that one ship is 3 stars and another is 4. It's obvious what differentiates 3 stars from 6, but what do you see the difference between 5 stars and 6? Is is the dress code? The number of passengers? (Again, I think of that as irrelevant, but I know that some people are vehement about the number of people on board, crowds, shudder, shudder.)

 

So, besides dress code, how do you define Luxe?

[Jaffa]

My post was in reference to the changes in dress code on Seabourn and RSSC & how the lux lines are reinventing themselves with a raft of new changes over the last year.

Some people like to dress, but now only Crystal and Silversea at the Lux level will offer this experience as a matter of policy.

Add to this the changes in capacity in the lux sector, (next year the sector will have increased by just under 42%) and the GFC.

 

I was crystal ball gazing so to speak.

 

I define the luxury segment as,

 

Antisipating your needs and delivering the same in a warm, sincere and prompt manner.

Using only the best quality products at all times, both those that are seen and unseen.

Personal service levels that are 1 on 1 not 1 to 20.

Exceeding your expectations repeatedly.

Delivering inclusivity and exclusivity as the need arises.

Indulgence.

Offering the enjoyment of rich, comfortable and sumptuous experiences

Delivering more than the basic necessitys in a way that delights.

Well apointed.

Security and confidentuality.

Lavish environments and surroundings.

Benifits and advantages outside of what one would view as normal.

Leaving the client feeling special, important and graciously valued.

A genuine sincerity in serving you.

 

Others will have more to add i'm sure.

[lord of the seas]

Jaffa,it is not written in stone that Seabourn are getting rid of formal nights.

As times change then so will the dress code on all luxury lines.Silversea is no different in the type of guests that sails with Seabourn.I use both lines and dress the same on both.

 

With the introduction of slightly larger ships for both lines, comes the problem of filling the suites.

The dress code has changed in most top restaurants around the world but the same people are still using them.Younger patrons prefer to dress down but still spend vast amounts of money on casual clothing.

Clothes as they say do not maketh the man.

So,the cruise lines have to move with the times to fill their ships and make a profit which has become harder in this climate due to heavy discounts.

Dress codes will in fact become what the majority of guests choose to wear when onboard, and will make it's own level.This can go either way and will also be dictated by itinerary and time of year.

The enforcement of a strict dress code is just about finished on luxury lines and particularly on the larger, newer ships.

Lines only have a "suggested" dress code which is a bit vague with "Elegant casual" becoming more popular,but if you ask a hundred guests what this means,you will have many interpretations of this theme.

I did suggest that for those amongst us that really enjoy formal evenings,Seabourn and Silversea should enforce a more strict dress code and have a lot more formal evenings but only on the smaller,older ships and keep the more relaxed informal dress code on the newer,larger,cooler,trendy,ships that they hope will be filled by a new,younger, affluent type of cruiser that will look to dress differently from their parents that already know cruising well.

[dusababy]

I did suggest that for those amongst us that really enjoy formal evenings,Seabourn and Silversea should enforce a more strict dress code and have a lot more formal evenings but only on the smaller,older ships and keep the more relaxed informal dress code on the newer,larger,cooler,trendy,ships that they hope will be filled by a new,younger, affluent type of cruiser that will look to dress differently from their parents that already know cruising well.

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Thank you -- it really annoys me to see "gentlemen" at dinner in The Restaurant without a coat. I can handle jacket with nice shirt and no tie -- but not bare arms. Makes me want to exercise my right (to bear arms)!

 

Dusababy

[TLCOhio]

You seem to equate Luxe with Dress Code. I could not care less. I will wear my tux on formal nites, etc., but it doesnt give me any special thrill.

I define luxe differently. The food is probably paramount. The attention to detail. The attitude toward guests, to make certain that each guest's personal needs are met. On Crystal, the lectures.

Tell me what I've missed. I dont know how the raters decide that one ship is 3 stars and another is 4. It's obvious what differentiates 3 stars from 6, but what do you see the difference between 5 stars and 6? Is is the dress code? The number of passengers? (Again, I think of that as irrelevant, but I know that some people are vehement about the number of people on board, crowds, shudder, shudder.)

So, besides dress code, how do you define Luxe?

 

Excellent thread and outline of "crystal ball" predictions/guesses by Jaffa. I am personally more with jerblu about the viewpoints on dress code focus. For me it is about where the ships go, ports visited, etc. I want very good food and nice facilities. Worrying about how fancy people are dressed is not my concern. Younger audiences do view those rigid standards of the past as much less important. I don't want people dressing and acting like slobs, but it's not that important to me on how formal is the dress code going to be. The market place is changing and the upcoming economic impacts will also be very, very significant. The excessive debt of Greece and other Europe countries is not happening just there with the euro. It's in the USA and those economic "realities" will also impact the travel marketplace. Great point on the growing luxury ship capacities in the market and how they fill them. It will be interesting to watch.

 

I do lots of market research and you can see it in many areas (like newspaper readership, Internet use) how those younger are so totally different in how they approach such "traditions of the past". There is no one right or wrong way to do things.

 

THANKS! Enjoy! Terry in Ohio

[BILLP1]

I think that you have to look a few years ahead to see what your customer base will be and probably that is what Regent has done and decided to go more casual. Most people under 55 do not want to dress formally especially in warmer climates or in restaurants much less when they are on vacation. Dress codes have relaxed in many work places over the last few years and I do not think that people will want to wear more formal clothes while on vacation then they do at work. Throw in the restrictions the airlines are putting on luggage and people will be looking for more relaxed dress codes .

 

Good Food and the all inclusive pricing as well as the smaller ships and with less people and individual service will always be the reason for us to sail on the premium cruise lines. We will dress as required by the cruise line that we are sailing on but it will never be the determining factor for us but I am not sure that will be the case in the future for many people.

[TLCOhio]

We will dress as required by the cruise line that we are sailing on but it will never be the determining factor for us but I am not sure that will be the case in the future for many people.

 

YES, Bill, this is a perfect summary point for my viewpoint. Well stated.

 

THANKS! Enjoy! Terry in Ohio

[Sweetpea711423]

Count me among those people who will remain loyal to Silversea in large part because of their continuation of formal nights. My husband and I love dressing up, and this is our only opportunity to do so. It is a major part of our cruise enjoyment. It's just fun, and part of what makes it different from everyday life. As long as Silversea continues it, they will continue to earn our loyalty.

[lord of the seas]

Count me among those people who will remain loyal to Silversea in large part because of their continuation of formal nights. My husband and I love dressing up, and this is our only opportunity to do so. It is a major part of our cruise enjoyment. It's just fun, and part of what makes it different from everyday life. As long as Silversea continues it, they will continue to earn our loyalty.

 

So,are you saying that if Silversea get rid of formal evenings, that you will stop sailing with them?

[chicagogal]

Count me among those people who will remain loyal to Silversea in large part because of their continuation of formal nights. My husband and I love dressing up, and this is our only opportunity to do so. It is a major part of our cruise enjoyment. It's just fun, and part of what makes it different from everyday life. As long as Silversea continues it, they will continue to earn our loyalty.

 

Agree with you Sweetpea, except that we also attend several black tie events every year at home. I rue the day that people will be in jeans (designer or not) and baseball caps in the diningrooms of luxury ships because they are "young and entitled. "

 

PS I am mid 50s not an octogenarian. My husband and I happen to like civility.

[Sweetpea711423]

So,are you saying that if Silversea get rid of formal evenings, that you will stop sailing with them?

 

 

If Silversea stopped having formal evenings, I would certainly consider other luxury lines that might still continue them. And if none did, I would consider other land-based types of trips instead of cruising. As I said, this is part of what makes cruising different and fun for us. If it were no longer available, that would eliminate for us a major reason for cruising. I realize that everyone is different, but that's how we feel about it.

[Sweetpea711423]

Agree with you Sweetpea, except that we also attend several black tie events every year at home. I rue the day that people will be in jeans (designer or not) and baseball caps in the diningrooms of luxury ships because they are "young and entitled. "

 

PS I am mid 50s not an octogenarian. My husband and I happen to like civility.

 

 

My husband and I are the same age group, and just enjoy, as you say, this bit of "civility".

[cechase]

Interesting topic, so will throw my two cents worth in. Even though I have been retired for over eight years, and as an attorney was always required to wear a suit and tie - wearing such on Silversea is not considered a burden and is welcome. In fact today it is nice to see people well dressed on occasion - Remember that Silversea is not a mass premium cruise line nor a McDonald's nor a Johnny Rockets [RCCL].

 

Several things attract me to Silversea. First it is all inclusive - no chits, and on the last day of the cruise having a pow-wow to determine tips. Second, no lines, no art auctions, no bingo, etc. But to narrow it down to the luxury cruise lines, I enjoy having a cigarette now and then on my veranda or on the pool deck at the designated places or in The Bar at the appropriate place, chatting with my fellow passengers. In looking at the brochures of the other luxury lines ad nauseum, the suites on Silversea seem to be much better laid out. I would offer Silversea's Silver Suites against any of their competition! Since my dear wife passed away, I had a veranda suite, and it was absolutely wonderful for one person, with a big deck and plenty of room.

 

But there is one more and very very important reason that I would come back and back to Silversea. Unlike Celebrity, I have never experienced rudeness, pushing or shoving on Silversea [as in the buffet]. All of the Silversea passengers that I have interacted with seem to be friendly, polite and very comfortable with the fact that they can afford such a wonderful cruise line. You would be hard pressed on Silversea to figure out who is the High School Janitor or the CEO!

 

From being an avid reader of the posts on Cruise Critic, I don't get that impression from the other Luxury cruise lines. As to my bad habit which is greatly diminished, Regent is out, as well as Oceania [which probably should not be discussed with respect to luxury cruise lines.

 

The bottom line for me in selecting Silversea is the passengers, and I doubt that will change in the next five years.

[Kagehitokiri]

hopefully more like nomade yachting...

 

some of the people behind the world are planning another similar ship.

 

if four seasons ocean residences gets done, any rental program will have 1 month min.

 

keep hope alive seabourn returns to alaska.

[PennyAgain]

The people who cruise on Crystal are very loyal (as a general rule) and very much an older group of folks.

 

After having a miserable experience with our assigned dinner table companions who only discussed religion (theirs) and illnesses and disease; my husband said that he would never again cruise on a ship with assigned dinner companions and a set time for dinner.

 

We don't mind dressing up but husband will not travel with a tux ever again. He is a man with strong opinions.

 

We prefer the smaller to small ship type of experience and don't care about the art auctions and lectures. We want a quiet and civil atmosphere with freedom to dine when and with whom we please.

 

The mega ships horrify me. We won't ever book one for a vacation, but I do have a meeting scheduled on a medium mega ship which I will have to attend.

 

In 5 years I predict the 'lux' market will be more so and the mass market will be much less nice that it is now.

[dusababy]

.

 

In 5 years I predict the 'lux' market will be more so and the mass market will be much less nice that it is now.

 

I shall quote Judy Abbott (long time favorite Cruise Director) who said, about her career cruising the world:

 

"Thank God I saw the world (read - luxe market) before we ruined it."

 

Me too.:cool: