Concierge compensation thoughts...

[roveer]

We sailed on the Jewel a few weeks ago. My concierge told me he takes care of 47 cabins on-board. I'm assuming that is all of the suites on the entire ship? In any event, I did some simple math and determined that either I'm looking at this the wrong way, or these guys are making a fotune.

 

47 cabin's per week. Let's say every cabin tipped him 100 bucks (probably not going to happen, but some will tip more, some less), that's 4,700 per week before autotip and base pay. That's 18,800 per month in just tips (give or take, even if it were off by 50%, it's still 9k per month in tips

 

Where am I going wrong.

 

I'm not bashing, I'm not flaming, I'm just trying to get my head around the numbers...

 

Roveer

[pieshops]

The concierge is not included in the auto tip, same with the butlers and kids club people

[justcake]

We sailed on the Jewel a few weeks ago. My concierge told me he takes care of 47 cabins on-board. I'm assuming that is all of the suites on the entire ship? In any event, I did some simple math and determined that either I'm looking at this the wrong way, or these guys are making a fotune.

 

47 cabin's per week. Let's say every cabin tipped him 100 bucks (probably not going to happen, but some will tip more, some less), that's 4,700 per week before autotip and base pay. That's 18,800 per month in just tips (give or take, even if it were off by 50%, it's still 9k per month in tips

 

Where am I going wrong.

 

I'm not bashing, I'm not flaming, I'm just trying to get my head around the numbers...

 

Roveer

 

Don't forget that the income you are stating is also tax free isn't it??? I agree with your analysis completely. Sure the conceirge does not receive anything from the auto tips but they do receive some form of base pay. I think the people that work on cruise ships sacrafice a lot and work very hard but like you said, the numbers are the numbers.

[Planer's Edge]

We sailed on the Jewel a few weeks ago. My concierge told me he takes care of 47 cabins on-board. I'm assuming that is all of the suites on the entire ship? In any event, I did some simple math and determined that either I'm looking at this the wrong way, or these guys are making a fotune.

 

47 cabin's per week. Let's say every cabin tipped him 100 bucks (probably not going to happen, but some will tip more, some less), that's 4,700 per week before autotip and base pay. That's 18,800 per month in just tips (give or take, even if it were off by 50%, it's still 9k per month in tips

 

Where am I going wrong.

 

I'm not bashing, I'm not flaming, I'm just trying to get my head around the numbers...

 

Roveer

 

...and since they have an assistant they have to tip out accordingly. I also think you estimates are a tad bit high considering some of the threads around here.

 

So, if you take the auto tip (DSC) out of the equation (since they do not share in that), let's just say that they make $2,000/week (still high in my estimation, that would be $88,000/year (counting a ten month contract and 2 months for vacation). Considering they are basically on call 24/7 and away from home for 10 months at a time, I think that is fair compensation. Personally I don't know that I would do it for that.

 

PE

[Planer's Edge]

Don't forget that the income you are stating is also tax free isn't it??? I agree with your analysis completely. Sure the conceirge does not receive anything from the auto tips but they do receive some form of base pay. I think the people that work on cruise ships sacrafice a lot and work very hard but like you said, the numbers are the numbers.

Yes, as far as American taxes go. But, I would imagine they have tax responsibilities back home.

 

PE

[BikerAl]

Based upon many of the posts on this board, I would expect your math is a bit high, but there is more to it. The concierge tips out those people that make his or her job easier to serve us the cruiser, and that can be a substantial amount. The concierge also works as much as 16 hours a day, 7 days a week for that nine months.

 

Al

[mpk218]

They dont get anything close to $100 per cabin..

I'd estimate less than $50 average. Many do not use them and of those that do some dont tip at all. Its one of those possitions that gets a bit bent, kind of like the Maitre d' in the dining room.

You'd be surprised ;)

[roveer]

They dont get anything close to $100 per cabin..

I'd estimate less than $50 average. Many do not use them and of those that do some dont tip at all. Its one of those possitions that gets a bit bent, kind of like the Maitre d' in the dining room.

You'd be surprised ;)

 

I felt bad after I gave 100 when I came back and looked at the boards. I travelled with 6 (4 kids, 2 adults) and had already paid 504 dollars in "service charge". I gave 100 ea to concierge, butler & room steward. We did use the concierge but not like I saw other people. call, call call all day long. He actually kept coming to us with his little tricks and shortcuts which was nice.

 

Unfortunetly I felt so shaken down by the end of the trip it was hard to keep giving. I did feel a little cheap, but that was over 800 bucks in tips for 7 days.

 

I guess if the numbers are more in line with 2k per week, then it's not all that great, at 4k it's 160k at which point I say where do I sign up. Of course it is hard work, and not everyone treats the guys like my wife. She kept asking them it they'd like to come in and sit down and if she could get them a glass of wine. She's dead serious when she says it and they always looked at her a little funny. She even asked one of the guys if they wanted to use the hot tub. We wouldn't have minded at all. They were very good to us, all of them.

 

Roveer

[dwjoe]

I would tip a concierge based on services rendered... that could be a lot or a little depending on how much they did for you. $100 average seems high, but there may be some pax who tip even more. Being a problem solver for wealthy people can pay very, very well. I don't begrudge a concierge their earnings... all of the concierges I've met have been bright, organized, and very good at what they do.

[newmexicoNita]

They dont get anything close to $100 per cabin..

I'd estimate less than $50 average. Many do not use them and of those that do some dont tip at all. Its one of those possitions that gets a bit bent, kind of like the Maitre d' in the dining room.

You'd be surprised ;)

 

Exactrly: there have been a few times when we have not used ours at all. Normally we simply asked them to make a reservation or two for us. If we use them or if they are very attentive we give them $25.00. I would guess most tip them $20 to $50 depending on the situation.

 

Nita

[MMastell]

I have to say that I like Freestyle and NCL but I do feel that NCL is cutting their own throats with the tipping in their suites. I have also sailed on Seabourn and greatly enjoyed it.

 

As an example:

 

You can do a Seabourn, seven day, Caribbean cruise for around $2800. This is all inclusive.

 

On NCL you can get an AB for about the same price. However, you will still have your onboard bill which would probably be around $500. You add to that $168 for the service charge, $100 for the Butler, $100 for the Concierge and $50-$100 for other service staff. You now have a cruise that is almost $1000 more than a Seabourn cruise.

 

If people enjoy suites, fine wines, cocktails and excellent service many people will look at the dollars and decide that they may be able to get more value with another line.

 

Yes: This may not be a true apples to apples comparison, depending on sailing date, time of year and category of cabin but it does make the point.

 

Take care,

Mike

[Sea Monster 2]

I have to say that I like Freestyle and NCL but I do feel that NCL is cutting their own throats with the tipping in their suites. I have also sailed on Seabourn and greatly enjoyed it.

 

As an example:

 

You can do a Seabourn, seven day, Caribbean cruise for around $2800. This is all inclusive.

 

On NCL you can get an AB for about the same price. However, you will still have your onboard bill which would probably be around $500. You add to that $168 for the service charge, $100 for the Butler, $100 for the Concierge and $50-$100 for other service staff. You now have a cruise that is almost $1000 more than a Seabourn cruise.

 

If people enjoy suites, fine wines, cocktails and excellent service many people will look at the dollars and decide that they may be able to get more value with another line.

 

Yes: This may not be a true apples to apples comparison, depending on sailing date, time of year and category of cabin but it does make the point.

 

Take care,

Mike

 

Hi Mike, I think what you say is very important. I have also sailed Seabourn, DCL concierge suites, and soon we are trying an Epic DOS. I know there is going to be a BIG difference in the atmosphere on the ships, but with a young son we hope this will be a good compromise between luxury sailing and entertainment of the type that is not offered on Seabourn. But yes, I have been surprised to notice that we could have sailed Seabourn for significantly less. Our suite on Epic does look more spectacular than what we've had on Seabourn, and we hope the entertainment for our son makes it all worth the difference in price!! ;)

[2Cruise4Ever]

They dont get anything close to $100 per cabin..

I'd estimate less than $50 average. Many do not use them and of those that do some dont tip at all. Its one of those possitions that gets a bit bent, kind of like the Maitre d' in the dining room.

You'd be surprised ;)

 

That is why we tip far above the $50 average... he/she works SOOOOOO hard for the passengers. And, the majority of that money goes home to feed/clothe/house the family. We try to do what we can to help out. Sometimes we use the concierge a fair amount..... other times not so much. So, we tip accordingly. But, $50 is not close to the minimum we have given.

[jebuell]

Considering they are basically on call 24/7 and away from home for 10 months at a time' date=' I think that is fair compensation. Personally I don't know that I would do it for that.

 

PE[/color']

 

I just had flashbacks to my days as a rover in the wardrobe department of a television show. I worked both first and second units which means 6 days a week at 14 hours a day. Of course, I was able to go home every night, had 12 hour turn-arounds, and the average hiatus was 3 months, not 2.

 

It was fun but I didn't make anyway near $80,000!! That would've been nice! I doubt cruise ship members make that much either. Probably closer to $50,000. Which is still a nice paycheck, especially since $50,000 goes a lot further in the countries a lot of crew members come from, but you have to wonder if it's worth it.

 

You really have to appreciate how much work they do!

[sjbdtz]

I just had flashbacks to my days as a rover in the wardrobe department of a television show. I worked both first and second units which means 6 days a week at 14 hours a day. Of course, I was able to go home every night, had 12 hour turn-arounds, and the average hiatus was 3 months, not 2.

 

It was fun but I didn't make anyway near $80,000!! That would've been nice! I doubt cruise ship members make that much either. Probably closer to $50,000. Which is still a nice paycheck, especially since $50,000 goes a lot further in the countries a lot of crew members come from, but you have to wonder if it's worth it.

 

You really have to appreciate how much work they do!

 

 

I guess this would explain why many are from poorer countries.

 

There's almost no way someone earning $50,000 could afford to live in Toronto. I think that the bare minimum for city living is $75k/year.

 

When you figure that the average rent on a 1 bdrm apt is $1800, and that banks expect your rent+utilities to equal no more than 32% of your income, then:

 

$1800 + $200 heat/hydro = $2000/mth housing expenses.

 

$2000/.32 = $6,250 monthly = $75,000 / year.

 

And that's for a basic 1 brdrm. If you have a family, costs go up from there.

[beachchick]

I have to say that I like Freestyle and NCL but I do feel that NCL is cutting their own throats with the tipping in their suites. I have also sailed on Seabourn and greatly enjoyed it.

 

As an example:

 

You can do a Seabourn, seven day, Caribbean cruise for around $2800. This is all inclusive.

 

On NCL you can get an AB for about the same price. However, you will still have your onboard bill which would probably be around $500. You add to that $168 for the service charge, $100 for the Butler, $100 for the Concierge and $50-$100 for other service staff. You now have a cruise that is almost $1000 more than a Seabourn cruise.

 

If people enjoy suites, fine wines, cocktails and excellent service many people will look at the dollars and decide that they may be able to get more value with another line.

 

Yes: This may not be a true apples to apples comparison, depending on sailing date, time of year and category of cabin but it does make the point.

 

Take care,

Mike

 

These are reasonable thoughts, except that you need to compare suites that are of comparable size and with balcony. Even with the added costs for an AB or other full suite on NCL, the total for suites of the same size and type on Seabourn will almost always be more. Not that this is a bad thing, just an observation. We'd love to cruise Seabourn in a balcony suite. That would be sweet indeed.

 

beachchick

[Globaliser]

Yes' date=' as far as American taxes go. But, I would imagine they have tax responsibilities back home.[/quote']I think that most countries don't levy income tax on ships' crew who spend most of their time at sea, because they're non-resident for tax purposes.

 

US citizens working on ships used to benefit from the same approach, but I think that it's now different for them because they've been included in the US policy of taxing all US citizens worldwide, irrespective of where they live.

[newmexicoNita]

These are reasonable thoughts, except that you need to compare suites that are of comparable size and with balcony. Even with the added costs for an AB or other full suite on NCL, the total for suites of the same size and type on Seabourn will almost always be more. Not that this is a bad thing, just an observation. We'd love to cruise Seabourn in a balcony suite. That would be sweet indeed.

 

beachchick

 

yep, my thoughts as well. There are suites and there are suites.

 

Nit

[jebuell]

I guess this would explain why many are from poorer countries.

 

There's almost no way someone earning $50,000 could afford to live in Toronto. I think that the bare minimum for city living is $75k/year.

 

When you figure that the average rent on a 1 bdrm apt is $1800, and that banks expect your rent+utilities to equal no more than 32% of your income, then:

 

$1800 + $200 heat/hydro = $2000/mth housing expenses.

 

$2000/.32 = $6,250 monthly = $75,000 / year.

 

And that's for a basic 1 brdrm. If you have a family, costs go up from there.

 

Oh yeah, it's ridiculous! I used to live in San Diego and it's about the same there, maybe a little cheaper. I moved to Phoenix and it was like night and day. I have a HUGE 1 bedroom apartment and I only pay $450/month (and that's with my pet rental for my dog and gas and water). I'm moving back to CA soon but only because we were given a REALLY nice house as an sort of inheritance. Otherwise I'd be staying far, far away from California!

 

So for us $50,000 is nothing. But for others in poorer countries $50,000 is a really nice yearly salary. Of course, there's a lot of sacrifice that's involved. But I guess if you can save half of it and only work on the cruise for 5 years you'll come out with a nice buffer to live off of for a few years.

[stanmoto98]

US citizens working abroad are tax exempt up to a certain dollar amount. It used to be $150,000 but I think it's around $80,000 now.

 

We've never sailed in a suite on anything under an 11-day cruise. We always inevitably say to the butler and concierge that "we hope we haven't been to demanding!?" The comment has always elicits a sly grin and an assurance that we have not, letting us know that there are many passengers who are much more demanding than us.

 

That being said, the minimum amount we've tipped the concierge is $50. And we typically only use their services sparingly.

 

Most of the butler and concierge staff we've met were single and without families, and did not keep a permanent residence of their own where ever their home of record was located. In conversations we've had with those who served us they told how they stayed with family or friends when on vacation if they went "home". Their room and board while working is free of charge. And they have limited opportunity to spend the money they make except for a few hours in port if they are not on duty.

 

Having served in the US Navy, I can certainly relate to the life of the crew members onboard any cruise ship.

[dwjoe]

US Citizens residing abroad are entitled to exclude up to ~$90k of foreign earned income (wages, not investments). But you have to be a resident of a foreign country to claim the exclusion. You can't reside nowhere. :)

[jdvmd]

We gave our concierge $20 but didn't really use him for anything. Handed to him as we were leaving the ship with the other suite guests he was escorting. Not one other person gave him anything.

[Planer's Edge]

We gave our concierge $20 but didn't really use him for anything. Handed to him as we were leaving the ship with the other suite guests he was escorting. Not one other person gave him anything.

We always tip the Concierge the night before disembarkation just in case we do not see him/her. We rarely get off when they are taking the "VIP's" off the ship anyway.

 

PE

[hateswaterloves2cruise]

We gave our concierge $20 but didn't really use him for anything. Handed to him as we were leaving the ship with the other suite guests he was escorting. Not one other person gave him anything.

 

We gave out concierge $150 but did it the night before disembarking in an envelope with a note thanking him for all his attentions. He very nicely included our friends, who were not in a suite, in a couple of things we did (chocolate buffet, NOT Cagney's). On our first suite cruise we never saw the concierge except when we were with other suite guests and he did nothing for us. We still gave him $50 in an envelope as well. I believe they have assistants and probably share the tips with them as well.

[goldmom]

Here's something else I've wondered about. The Concierge always seems to pretty much be able to get his suite guests reservations. Do you think that they also give something to the Matre D's in the various restaurants, to insure that they have tables for them? Or do you think they just do it for the Concierge as part of their job? Anyone have any thoughts or insight on this?