22 Passengers Robbed On Excursion...

[cdamion]

[quote name='Nutz N Bolts']Thinking Carnival should allow guns on board if you have concealed carry permit. Guns prevent crime....[/QUOTE]

Crime in Mexico, Bahamas, etc. would not stop me from cruising.

Guns on board the ship in the hands of blitzed passengers would.

[Rottweiler Puppy]

[quote name='cdamion']Crime in Mexico, Bahamas, etc. would not stop me from cruising.

Guns on board the ship in the hands of blitzed passengers would.[/QUOTE]

This. And I carry a concealed weapon daily.

[cdamion]

[quote name='ib4cruzn']So it's better to be robbed in the jungle instead of a coordinated effort in plain sight on a bus?

Cartels?? I'm sorry but I just about busted a gut on that one. I'm sure there's much more money to be had in robbing tourists than one could make in the drug trade.

You had me for a while...[/QUOTE]

Not for the money - for the intimidation. The crime in Mexico is largely to scare the public and send messages to the government (and other crime groups).

Read up on what is going on there. It is just not about people getting money, it is about control of the country. As others have said, it is bordering on a civil war of sorts.

It is really a form of terrorism. Think about the casino from Monterrey that burned killing a ton. That wasn't a robbery that was a message.

[cathyz]

[quote name='cdamion']Here is what makes it better for me personally:

Any idiot anywhere can rob somebody with a knife, machete, or gun. Mexico, Chicago, Mayberry, anywhere. Worrying about who is behind every tree would be overly sensitive.

However an organized robbery of a group of people by several banditos with automatic weapons as originally reported is much scarier and much more brazen on behalf of the robbers. Blocking a road and robbing a bus takes more planning and a complete disregard for law enforcement or passers by, which to me would be a sign that maybe the cartels are moving towards the tourist areas.[/QUOTE]
This very thing happened to me about 20 years ago in Jamaica, blocked road by burning tires and furniture, resort shuttle bus surrounded by Jamaicans banging on the windows and door to get in, the driver almost ran over some backing out of there, they never got on the bus, but also didn't have guns. Needless to say, I'm never going back to Jamaica!

[cdamion]

[quote name='ib4cruzn']So it's better to be robbed in the jungle instead of a coordinated effort in plain sight on a bus?

Cartels?? I'm sorry but I just about busted a gut on that one. I'm sure there's much more money to be had in robbing tourists than one could make in the drug trade.

You had me for a while...[/QUOTE]

Answering further - if I had a choice between being robbed on a bus and being robbed on a bus I would pick neither.

And answering further on the drug trade. If the cartels cripple the government by killing tourism, having the press, police, judges, and citizens too scared to do anything, the only source of income left would be from the drug trade.

[mikehn]

[quote name='waldocruiser1']Because in Las Vegas, Orlando, and Myrtle beach, you NEVER here of a bus being held up at gun point.

So if it is not news worthy, why are you reading about it?[/quote]

I didnt even know this happened until I read it on Cruise Critic.

Its still winter in most of the country and people have nothing better to do than go online and promote hysteria. I predict all will be forgotten once spring rolls around.

[FightOnRon]

[quote name='CWcruisers'][I]The ill-fated tour took [/I][URL="http://www.cruisecritic.com/reviews/review.cfm?ShipID=375"][I]Carnival Splendor[/I][/URL][I] passengers to El Nogalito, an area some 40 miles outside of Puerto Vallarta known for its lush natural setting. While they were returning to the ship, masked assailants stopped the bus and robbed the cruisers of their money, watches, cameras and other valuables. A statement from Carnival said there were no injuries, and all passengers returned safely to the ship.[/I]

My question is, now that we know they were not on the bus and it was a lone attacker, why is this misinformation still being printed? The story broke the same way in the San Diego Union Tribune this morning. A passenger was interviewed that was one of the 22 and confirmed it was on a walking trail.[/quote]

I know you are a cheerleader for Mexico and that is fine,,I will be there in a month and a half and I am actually going to El Nogalito for a zip tour. But I too wonder about this.

Today, this morning, the story was shown again on channel 4 (NBC) local morning news how a tour bus was stormed by masked gunmen that took over the bus and robbed the passengers. Yes they were robbed but a bus being stormed by masked gunmen makes it sound worse then 1 guy in the parking lot. One guy in a parking lot happened to my SIL at anARCO a few months back. Even a lady being interviewed that was one of the 22 said she was madder at the guy then being scared.

I will admit though,,I am apprehensive about going to the scene of the crime but my wife and the other couple traveling with me say let's just do it,,so we are.

[StillPooh]

[quote name='FightOnRon']a lady being interviewed that was one of the 22 said she was madder at the guy then being scared.
[/QUOTE]In that event you would think 22 people could take out one guy armed only with a handgun.

At my age, I'm so temperamental I'd have beaten him to death with my purse.

[MyThirdGen]

[quote name='FightOnRon']I know you are a cheerleader for Mexico and that is fine,,I will be there in a month and a half and I am actually going to El Nogalito for a zip tour. But I too wonder about this.

Today, this morning, the story was shown again on channel 4 (NBC) local morning news how a tour bus was stormed by masked gunmen that took over the bus and robbed the passengers. Yes they were robbed but a bus being stormed by masked gunmen makes it sound worse then 1 guy in the parking lot. One guy in a parking lot happened to my SIL at anARCO a few months back. Even a lady being interviewed that was one of the 22 said she was madder at the guy then being scared.

I will admit though,,I am apprehensive about going to the scene of the crime but my wife and the other couple traveling with me say let's just do it,,so we are.[/QUOTE]


Mexico sucks. I live right on the border and it's a dirt hole. However, the interior and resorts really aren't that bad. There was a robbery in St Kitts a couple years back. I don't care, I'll still go. There was a ring robbing houses in upstate NY near my hometown, I'll still go. No since in being afraid of everything. Just stay vigilant and aware. Have fun zip-lining. I'd like to do the same when I go back.

[Notreallyacruiser]

[quote name='cdamion']Off topic, but I was just thinking about the State Department warnings posted for Honduras that I linked before. Right after arriving in Honduras we were in a (sort of) taxi on our way up to Copan from San Pedro Sula.

If you look at the warnings, tourists there are getting robbed (1) in taxis from the airport and (2) on the road to Copan which (3) you should never be on after dark.

So here we are going on the road to Copan when the taxi blows a tire. We pull over to change the tire. I get out to help the driver and in the trunk is a little weenie wheel, a crowbar, and two broken jacks. The driver couldn't get service on the cell and we are stranded (1) in a taxi from the airport (2) on the road to Copan and (3) now it is starting to get dark.

Three big guys with machetes now emerge from the hills and come towards us. I figure we are done now. They come up and start talking to the driver. One guy partially fixed the jack with the machete and rocks somehow, then all 3 helped lift the car enough to get the tire changed.

In so many different ways that story could have ended differently, but as it turns out despite the terrible crime in that country, the people who live there are very very friendly and helpful.[/quote]

We spent a few weeks traveling thru Nicaragua, hired 4x4 pickup truck, picked up many locals. Many had machetes, at the same time women and children piled into the bed of the truck, its a bit commonplace with machetes in Central America and not necessarily threatening but of course could be. I would not bill Nicaragua with the "safety" seal of approval but its definitely better than Honduras, ESPECIALLY near San Pedro Sula. Guatemala is very dangerous too. The Honduran islands Roatan, Utila are much better but stay alert, more crimes of opportunity there.

[Notreallyacruiser]

I think the big problem with people's confusion of Mexico's danger is confusing regular street crime with the major drug wars going on there. Yes US cities have crime, lots of it, we also have drug cartels but there is no comparison to the problems in Mexico. They aren't fighting for states the size of Texas or massacring civilian, beheadings, torture. Or how about in Veracruz dumping some 36 bodies blatently in the middle of rush hour. Yes they say its just drug wars between the drug cartels and Mexican Gov't, doesn't effect tourists. Thats a bunch of crap, it can and will with time. These cartels are uncontrollable, murder rates in Mexico have skyrocketed. They say police are providing protection in resorts but if they can't control the drug cartel problem what makes people think the can ultimately keep tourist areas safe? Its a matter of time till it spills over. Seriously consider other places to travel. While we don't always have a choice where we live (higher crime rate US cities) but we do have a choice where we vacation. Travel smart and take care.

[luvtheships]

good thing we only wear costume jewelry on vacation...

and carry little cash..............

and have backup credit cards..................

Not sure how to avoid having a gun pointed at you though other than staying on the ship:(

[luvtheships]

[quote name='Notreallyacruiser']We spent a few weeks traveling thru Nicaragua, hired 4x4 pickup truck, picked up many locals. Many had machetes, at the same time women and children piled into the bed of the truck, its a bit commonplace with machetes in Central America and not necessarily threatening but of course could be. I would not bill Nicaragua with the "safety" seal of approval but its definitely better than Honduras, ESPECIALLY near San Pedro Sula. Guatemala is very dangerous too. The Honduran islands Roatan, Utila are much better but stay alert, more crimes of opportunity there.[/quote]

And you did this.why?

[Rottweiler Puppy]

[quote name='cathyz']This very thing happened to me about 20 years ago in Jamaica, blocked road by burning tires and furniture, resort shuttle bus surrounded by Jamaicans banging on the windows and door to get in, the driver almost ran over some backing out of there, they never got on the bus, but also didn't have guns. Needless to say, I'm never going back to Jamaica![/QUOTE]

I was probably there. Were they wearing red sashes or red bandanas?

[Notreallyacruiser]

[quote name='luvtheships']good thing we only wear costume jewelry on vacation...

and carry little cash..............

and have backup credit cards..................

Not sure how to avoid having a gun pointed at you though other than staying on the ship:([/quote]

Its all the environment. You could wear real jewels on the ship and no one would steal them from you unless you gave them an opportunity, otherwise locking things in cabin safe is pretty safe.

For shore excursions, most if they have booked thru cruiseline need little cash.

There is nothing you can do with a gun pointed at your head but comply and hope for the best.

safe travels

[Notreallyacruiser]

[quote name='luvtheships']And you did this.why?[/quote]

Because the locals were headed in the direction we were going and the bus system sucks in Nicaragua, they all want to grab the first ride. You have to remember I mentioned women and children getting into the back of the pickup, if they didn't have a problem with it we sure didn't...they know better than us and wouldn't risk their kids for ride. It was an awesome trip, I'd do it again in heartbeat, very culturally fulfilling.

[Notreallyacruiser]

[quote name='Rottweiler Puppy']I was probably there. Were they wearing red sashes or red bandanas?[/quote]

Jamaica is a horrible place but what makes it worse is it could be wonderful place, it has great beauty, culture and history...the crime makes it unbearable.

[cdamion]

[quote name='FightOnRon']I know you are a cheerleader for Mexico and that is fine,,I will be there in a month and a half and I am actually going to El Nogalito for a zip tour. But I too wonder about this.

Today, this morning, the story was shown again on channel 4 (NBC) local morning news how a tour bus was stormed by masked gunmen that took over the bus and robbed the passengers. Yes they were robbed but a bus being stormed by masked gunmen makes it sound worse then 1 guy in the parking lot. One guy in a parking lot happened to my SIL at anARCO a few months back. Even a lady being interviewed that was one of the 22 said she was madder at the guy then being scared.

I will admit though,,I am apprehensive about going to the scene of the crime but my wife and the other couple traveling with me say let's just do it,,so we are.[/QUOTE]

LA Times reported something similar. I mentioned their inaccuracy in a comment and they have promptly deleted it.

[cdamion]

[quote name='Notreallyacruiser']We spent a few weeks traveling thru Nicaragua, hired 4x4 pickup truck, picked up many locals. Many had machetes, at the same time women and children piled into the bed of the truck, its a bit commonplace with machetes in Central America and not necessarily threatening but of course could be. I would not bill Nicaragua with the "safety" seal of approval but its definitely better than Honduras, ESPECIALLY near San Pedro Sula. Guatemala is very dangerous too. The Honduran islands Roatan, Utila are much better but stay alert, more crimes of opportunity there.[/QUOTE]

I LOVED Honduras. Yes it was dangerous, but it is full of wonderful people and amazing sights from Copan to the rainforest outside of La Ceiba to Roatan and Utila. Fantastic place. I had 2 serious safety concerns (not the flat tire incident) and still wouldn't trade the experience for the world.

I flew into San Pedro Sula and was on the road to Copan when we got the flat. Our last night in the country was in San Pedro Sula too. The beginning of the coup was happening in the plaza across from the hotel. Less than a week after we got back the coup happened. Next up (I think) is Nicaragua - make our way across the country for a few days, then end up in the Corn Islands for several days.

[cdamion]

[quote name='Rottweiler Puppy']I was probably there. Were they wearing red sashes or red bandanas?[/QUOTE]

Jamaica has a history of violence against the tourists. Nothing to do with robbing them and much more about political statements.

[Equest]

[quote name='Nutz N Bolts']Thinking Carnival should allow guns on board if you have concealed carry permit. Guns prevent crime....[/quote]
You are correct

[McMacy]

Idea: Carnival Crime Excursions. Bring your own guns and ammo and troll around looking helpless. Maybe Carnival could sell ‘Unlimited Ammo’ cards. It would be FUN to do the Carnival Somalia Pirates Cruise.

Checking with my PVP now to see if I can bring my AR’s. I’ll probably pack the shotgun , too, in case zombies are pouring over the starboard rail.

[FONT="]Mexico doesn’t allow its citizens to have guns and protect themselves. Leave it the tourists. [/FONT]

[Rottweiler Puppy]

[quote name='McMacy']

[FONT="]Mexico doesn’t allow its citizens to have guns and protect themselves. Leave it the tourists. [/FONT][/QUOTE]

They can have guns. Just not in military calibers. Lots of 1911's in .38 super down there. .38super is extremely effective.

[Notreallyacruiser]

[quote name='cdamion']I LOVED Honduras. Yes it was dangerous, but it is full of wonderful people and amazing sights from Copan to the rainforest outside of La Ceiba to Roatan and Utila. Fantastic place. I had 2 serious safety concerns (not the flat tire incident) and still wouldn't trade the experience for the world.

I flew into San Pedro Sula and was on the road to Copan when we got the flat. Our last night in the country was in San Pedro Sula too. The beginning of the coup was happening in the plaza across from the hotel. Less than a week after we got back the coup happened. Next up (I think) is Nicaragua - make our way across the country for a few days, then end up in the Corn Islands for several days.[/quote]

Yes I agree Honduras is great. You will love Nicaragua too. We really enjoyed Ometepe, the islands in Lake Nicaragua and up north the Esteli area was spectacular. We didn't stay in Managua but did stay in Granada and San Juan del Sur, both nice. Didn't make it to Leon or Corn Islands. If you rent a vehicle, go thru Budget, we arranged to pick up the vehicle at the Hotel Plaza Colon in Granada which has a Budget desk at the hotel, then we could drop it at the airport on departure a few weeks later. It worked well because our arriving flight into Managua on AA came in at night so instead of driving ourselves at night we arranged an airport pick up, taken to Granada (about 45min) then got the vehicle next morning there. Do rent a 4x4, very few except main roads are paved and there's alot of creek and river crossings without bridges. Great trip, I'd go back in a heartbeat.

[cambio]

[quote name='ib4cruzn']So it's better to be robbed in the jungle instead of a coordinated effort in plain sight on a bus?

[/QUOTE]

It makes a difference to me. The likelihood of my wife and I hiking in the jungles of Mexico is zero, with or without this event.