A Guessing Game...... What Is Next?

[GeorgesGal]

Many lines charge for ice cream and fresh squeezed orange juice. Hopefully HAL does not adopt that policy!

[sail7seas]

I too am seriously considering Oceania. I have a b-2-b Noordam cruise this January and' date=' if I find what others have experienced recently then I will be finding a new 'home'.

 

It's a shame because I loved HAL, but the only way to affect change in these areas is with your pocketbook!![/quote']

 

 

Hi Bear :)

 

It's true the best way to vote is with one's pocketbook but if we don't buy that suite, there is someone else who will.

 

Same as there were those who came before us, there will be those who follow us.

 

[ASIWISH]

It seems a bit counterintuitive. Book early to save money on flights, and book late to save money on cabins.

 

The strategy seems to be to book flights early and wait until the last minute to book the cabin.

 

I travel extensively. So I understand that the business flyers make it easier for the vacation traveler to get ultra low fairs. With cruising, I wonder how much more expensive the fares would be without the last minute deals offered to fill the ship. At the end of the day, the early bookers need the late bookers.... IMO.

 

I usually book 4-6 months out, but my last two have been within the final payment window. Ultra cheap cruise rates, but airfair was expensive (thankfully, I have points).

 

I think HAL needs to find ways to reward early bookers, because Sail's point is very valid.

[RuthC]

What next, chinet plates in the MDR? Removal of cloth face clothes in the public washrooms. No room service after 9 p.m. Rationing of toilet paper:rolleyes:. No more Yum Yum Boy. No more shower jel, shampoo and conditioner in the bath tub (bring your own). No chocolate on the pillow (hope Ruth doesn't read this). This list could be endless...

She did. ;) And she is not amused by the thought.

 

I hate the cutbacks, the nickle & diming. I want to sail the HAL that I got used to over the decades, not some faint representation of HAL. HAL sets a price for my cabin; I pay it. I don't question how they arrived at the price, but it should cover what a HAL cruise costs for that cabin. If it doesn't---not my fault.

 

I want the "HAL experience" as I knew it, but it doesn't have to be HAL that furnishes it. I do have an Oceania cruise booked. We'll see how they do.

[cruz chic]

The bargain rates are not for those of us booking "S" and "SA" cabins months in advance. We are paying very high rates, I agree.

 

The 'bargains' are those who book very late, usually after final payment but not always, and they either get very low cost upsells or free upgrades. If the "SA, SB and SC" cabins are not filled at final payment, HAL starts giving them are prices no where near what we paid.

 

I don't mind all that much once or twice but it has happened on so many of our recent cruises that it is starting to get under my skin. It is adding up to a great deal of money. When I start to feel like a fool for the bookings we make, it is time to give it more thought.

 

We are penalized for booking early. DH is not retired so we don't book last minute. Because we do HAL the favor of booking early and they know that is one less cabin they have to sell, we ultimately learn many others are in the same cabin as us and paid a lot less than we paid.

 

It is starting to get very old.

Our on board experience is still wonderful. We feel very well treated and enjoy every cruise. We agreed the price they charged us was worth that amount of money to us or we would not have booked the cruise, however, time and time again, I read here of others who rave at the great deal they get. I'd like for HAL to give some pricing consideration to those of us who over and over book early. Don't penalize those who fill your ship the earliest. We wouldn't dream of booking early if DH was retired or we didn't have to worry about booking air. I'd like to save a bit on our cruise fare, too.

 

There are NO MORE LOYAL GUESTS than DH and me but this is starting to be an issue for me.

Before Internet and the information age, they could do these things and few knew about it. Now we know due to forums such as this.

 

 

 

That's the problem. We all know that this has happened in the past but lately it's an every day thing.....sometimes multiple times a day. Of course they have to discount to fill but it nuts lately. Why not give decent (not give away prices) at the beginning? I had a Celebrity cruise booked for Nov originally. I believe I booked the 2 week cruise on a lower end balcony single supp for around $3400. HAL wanted $4200 for that same balcony at that time! Months passed and finally in about February 2012 HAL dropped the price to around $3400. It was basically the same as Celebrity so I jumped. Since that time I've upgraded to a VB and paid that price and shortly after the price dropped $500 which of course I couldn't get back. That's life. In the end that VH balcony (originally booked) ended up being $2300 if I had booked about a month ago. That's why I get upset. Why not start at around $3000 and maybe they would fill up. I pay $3000, double would get it at $1500, that pretty reasonable.

[Randyk47]

She did. ;) And she is not amused by the thought.

 

I hate the cutbacks, the nickle & diming. I want to sail the HAL that I got used to over the decades, not some faint representation of HAL. HAL sets a price for my cabin; I pay it. I don't question how they arrived at the price, but it should cover what a HAL cruise costs for that cabin. If it doesn't---not my fault.

 

I want the "HAL experience" as I knew it, but it doesn't have to be HAL that furnishes it. I do have an Oceania cruise booked. We'll see how they do.

 

Very well said! Our exact sentiments.

[cruz chic]

I totally agree with Sail as well. And FWIW, I believe one of the next cuts or changes will be to room service..... paying a fee if you order after a certain time of night. That's already done on some cruise lines. RCI being one of them... but we are in the process of booking a cruise with RCI again after being loyal to HAL for quite a few years. Too many of the same issues on too many of the ships, which are being band-aided.

I don't think HAL is going to be able to do to much with room service. Their hours are so limited in the lido I think that is why they are generous with the room service. If they are going to cut that then they need to compensate in other ways.

[vbmom87]

I know no one in Seattle will like this post but I am aware of that. It is disappointing to keep removing the touches that made HAL refined, dignified, tasteful and with grace. I understand they are a for profit company but raise the 'dam' prices before you dilute the product to something we don't recognize.

 

I'm sorry for those I may be offending but give it some thought, please.

 

My first cruise was in 2008, so I have not experienced cruising as many of you have. However, even I am disappointed to see cut back after cut back, and the extra charges announced on these forums. When I began cruising I got the feeling that HAL was a step above the other crusie lines. When we sailed on NCL we had to agree that we enjoyed HAL more. However, going back on HAL in 2011 we noticed many changes that disappointed us. From all I have read it seems that HAL is choosing to blend in rather than stand out.

 

In the end they are going to do what they think they need to do to be profitable. HAL must have decided that in order to be profitable they need to nickle and dime us.

 

What upsets me even more than these add on charges, is how overworked the employees are. It seemed bad before, but now it seems so much worse for them. I do not like taking a lovely vacation and then witnessing how overworked the people are who are providing me with this experience. The argument I keep reading is that these people would be so much worse off if they were living in their home countries. I simply don't buy this. Everyone should be treated how we would want to be treated if we had to do similar work. How would we feel if our daughters, sons, spouses, grandchildren had to work in these condiitions? We tip extra, but somehow that just doesn't seem like enough.

[Typhoon1]

399.00 is better than an empty cabin.

[vicocala]

The answer for those who book early is that HAL needs to offer what they do on Carnival in their Super Saver rates. Your deposit is non-refundable and if you find a lower price later you submit for a lower final payment. If prices fall after final payment and you find it in a published fare, you get OBC.

 

While your rate is non-refundable, you start out less expensive and go from there.

 

Buying late can be a great experience, as it is in my isolated case. However, I do not get my choice of cabins and I risk not being able to get a reasonable rate after final booking. Many popular dates the prices actually go up.

 

It is standard risk vs reward. Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. It is like having a bad cruise when someone gets a lower price, you hear about it. No one wants to admit they paid double by waiting to get on the ship, you only hear about the good deals.

 

I don't think the nickle and diming has as much to do with room rates is the fact that they have a captive audience and therefore can and do hit you in other areas.

 

If they are going to copy Carnival, this would be a good one to do it. It protects those who book early and may give them a bit of a pause when offering low rates because the super savers will get the benefit too. JMHO

[startwin]

We book early - typically one year to 18 months out. And fares usually go up closer to cruise time, in our experience. It could possibly be because of the itineraries we choose, and we don't do Caribbean cruises - which are extremely cheap - as it's too difficult to get there from here.

 

Another thought I had along the lines of "What's next?" is what happened on the Zaandam recently. Cancelling the dry dock then doing much of the work while the ship was loaded with paying passengers.... maybe we'll be seeing this happen more often. Certainly more cost-effective to HAL in the short term, but likely to send many customers to other lines.

[Cruzin Terri]

Hey! We're trying Oceania next. After the Zudierdam cruise we recently went on, we're done. I can't even believe I am saying this. We loved HAL. I keep reading here hoping things are going to change for the better, but so far, it doesn't look that way. It boggles my mind what's been going on in the past year or so. And it's not just one issue or even one ship ... there are all sorts of issues.

Good to hear from you and you know I respect your opinion. I will be happy to hear your take on Oceania.

 

Terri

[cruz chic]

 

What upsets me even more than these add on charges, is how overworked the employees are. It seemed bad before, but now it seems so much worse for them. I do not like taking a lovely vacation and then witnessing how overworked the people are who are providing me with this experience. The argument I keep reading is that these people would be so much worse off if they were living in their home countries. I simply don't buy this. Everyone should be treated how we would want to be treated if we had to do similar work. How would we feel if our daughters, sons, spouses, grandchildren had to work in these condiitions? We tip extra, but somehow that just doesn't seem like enough.

I totally agree.

[sail7seas]

I don't think HAL is going to be able to do to much with room service. Their hours are so limited in the lido I think that is why they are generous with the room service. If they are going to cut that then they need to compensate in other ways.

 

 

I agree they shouldn't cut Room Service but that doesn't mean they cannot and will not. I've heard nothing that indicates that is pending but

it wouldn't shock me. There is a point where even the most loyal customer says 'enough' and will accept no more.

 

They are very bright, able people running this cruise line. There is nothing dumb about them. They are aware of the reaction they will get to all of these changes they make and I am sure they carefully evaluate before implementing. They know what they are doing. If WE don't like it, that is our problem.

 

They will lose a certain percentage of guests and they will get a whole new batch of guests. I have a notion it would not be a negative for those of us who 'remember what it used to be like' to fade away. They KNOW what it used to be like. They might prefer we not tell 'newbies' what they are missing out on. :D

 

IMO........

 

[/b]

 

 

 

 

 

<snip>

 

 

What upsets me even more than these add on charges, is how overworked the employees are. It seemed bad before, but now it seems so much worse for them. I do not like taking a lovely vacation and then witnessing how overworked the people are who are providing me with this experience. The argument I keep reading is that these people would be so much worse off if they were living in their home countries. I simply don't buy this. Everyone should be treated how we would want to be treated if we had to do similar work. How would we feel if our daughters, sons, spouses, grandchildren had to work in these condiitions? We tip extra, but somehow that just doesn't seem like enough.

 

 

Thank you for saying this. It bothers me more and more each cruise to see how much work so few people are required to do. We always sit in the same dining room section and hae for years. We fully know how many stewards used to work those exact same tables and how many are now doing it. It is drastic the change and yet the stewards keep their professional, pleasant demeanor and we know they are racing around trying to serve everyone. I don't like to see that.

 

There are times if a steward brings the wrong thing or forgets something, we don't say anything as we don't want him to have to return to the galley on our behalf. That is wrong. We shouldn't be made to feel we should 'do without' on our vacation. If I ordered the salmon and green beans, it's because that is what I wanted. I don't want the baked potato that sometimes is delivered...... for example. Yet, I don't mention the green beans as that is more work for the steward.

 

[michmike]

Can't wait to be retired in 15 months and spending my winters in Fl and getting in on these $399 deals. Color me GONE! and I'll gladly pay for the cappucino.

 

Putting it to the loyal customer is something that Direct TV has reduced to a science. Not surprised to see HAL using it as a case study. Same thing with the retail operations offering discounts to the facebook crowd. Why do I have to surrender my privacy to be considered an important customer?

 

Biggest deal breaker for us (and what will ultimately encourage us to look at other lines) is the staffing changes over the past 10 years in the dining room and lounges. Service just stinks (reference previous comments re getting tea or decaf).

 

The past 4 or 5 trips, I'd likely have had at least one more cocktail a nite (and sometimes 2) if service had been more attentive (or even available!) Multiply me by how many other customers experiencing that same thing and the lost sales become significant.

 

We sail in less than 4 weeks on Nieuw Amsterdam. Will be interested to see what our experience is, even compared to a year ago. Will report back upon our return.

[lvz2cruz]

I do Surf and Surf.... does that count as a double?

 

... and I believe Cappuccinos should be free.... it's a principle thing.:cool:

 

 

It evens out because I do turf and turf:)

[ASIWISH]

Service must have really been wonderful in the past, because I can't imagine it being any better now!

 

Honestly, I can go through my past "live froms" but I don't believe we have never been disappointed.

 

... oh, the days of the past.

 

(I tried to sound really old when I typed that!:D)

[ASIWISH]

it evens out because i do turf and turf:)

 

:d:d:d

[yukongold]

Well, for what it's worth - I am really disappointed to hear this - we don't order it that much - it's not that big of a deal - but if the waiters are already overworked - then how are they going to have time to write up the bills:eek:

This was always one of HAL's nice touches - I don't even want to venture what's next - the flowers:eek: paper towels in the public washrooms:eek::eek:

 

I'm hoping this was an anomoly and will not be repeated (ok, I can dream can't I;))

 

Actually, it may work the other way. With charging for these drinks may reduce the order for them - lessening the work load for the wait staff.

[RuthC]

I get a discount on cappuccino if ordered in Explorations Cafe.

I wonder if I would get the same discount when I order it in the dining room???

[sail7seas]

Actually, it may work the other way. With charging for these drinks may reduce the order for them - lessening the work load for the wait staff.

 

 

Yes, ^^^^ That.

 

I think the likely reason for this is not revenue but they know they do not have enough staff and they hope to reduce the request for these coffees. The dining staff cannot run and work any harder or faster.

 

I'm not sure where the guest fits into that whole equation. :rolleyes:

 

 

[sail7seas]

I get a discount on cappuccino if ordered in Explorations Cafe.

I wonder if I would get the same discount when I order it in the dining room???

 

 

Good question. :D

I think their goal is to cut down on the number of orders for espresso/cappuccino in the MDR but if a discount applies, that likely will slow the stewards down more. :eek:

 

[G&G]

Yes, ^^^^ That.

 

I think the likely reason for this is not revenue but they know they do not have enough staff and they hope to reduce the request for these coffees. The dining staff cannot run and work any harder or faster.

 

 

Maybe not so.

 

We just got off the Statendam and for fourteen (14) days in the MDR our assistant waiter kept trying to sale us and others in his area special treated/filtered water even though we told him the first day we did not want to pay for water. Needless to say this consumed a lot of time trying to sale and bringing water to the table :mad:

[twinkletoes4445]

Please come back and tell us how Oceania was. It's a line we're considering too.

 

I'll let you know how it goes. We probably won't cruise Oceania until 2014. Have several things already planned for next year. If you want to do a river cruise, I can tell you all about Uniworld. It was the best vacation ever. Food, service ... boat ... it was all amazing. And really, not all that much more than we were spending on our HAL SA. I know they are two different types of experiences, but cost wise and the total overall experience for the amount of money, there was no comparison, Uniworld won hands down. Oceania seems like it will be a good fit for us. Regent was another one we talked about, but we're going to try Oceania first. We are getting out from under the Carnival umbrella of cruise lines.

[twinkletoes4445]

Maybe not so.

 

We just got off the Statendam and for fourteen (14) days in the MDR our assistant waiter kept trying to sale us and others in his area special treated/filtered water even though we told him the first day we did not want to pay for water. Needless to say this consumed a lot of time trying to sale and bringing water to the table :mad:

 

Something I'd forgotten about until you mentioned this is on our cruise, when I ordered a drink, they always asked if we wanted and extra shot of booze. I don't recall them ever pushing the "more liquor" thing in the drinks. It's a foo-foo drink. I don't want to get hammered!!