Just back from Westerdam

[peaches from georgia]

Oh, I'm very aware of the reasons. My fear is when things do get better and HAL's revenue stream from fares increases, they will be too entrenched in mediocrity to ever get back to where they once were. By then, it will have become the new standard for them and I will probably have moved on to another line.

What the expressions 'You can't go hom again' or 'You only have one chance to make a first impression'. HAL made a choice to lower standards and go from premium to mass market. It will take forever if not longer to get their reputation back if they even try. HAL opened the door and Oceania walked right in.

[mariner]

The cruise lines have trained a new group of passengers whose expectations are far lower than previous passengers. These new passengers also have no loyalty to a brand, just price.

 

It will never go back to the way it was.

 

HAL is building larger ships.The bigger the ship, the less the service.

 

Fact is, you can all-inclusive ashore with better food and service for far less than a suite. That never was the case in the "old days."

[cruz chic]

Did you ever try eating Eggs Royale tweny-one days in a row?

I can think of worse things but why would you have to? There was be 20 things or more to choose from.

 

What is the attraction with the jars of jelly? Is that something fancy to you?

[Pettifogger]

There weren't twenty cruise ship breakfasts to choose from; there were a bunch of foreign breakfasts, a bunch of diner breakfasts and Eggs Royale. (Eggs Benedict and Eggs Royale are so similar that if the steward brought one when I had ordered the other, I wouldn't bother to tell him.) I can still remember the special breakfasts, they were so hard to choose between.

 

I just like little jars of jelly; I'm very middle-class and they epitomize luxury to me. (And washed out after use, they're ideal for holding various pills if one has to take a lot of pills.)

[pms4104]

As long as they have to offer $349 seven night cruises and lots of gtys and upgrades to fill up their boats, I don't see that happening. They are on a slippery slope to mediocrity.

And if/when the economy improves, HAL won't want to hack off the new group of passengers who became loyal Mariners due to the bargain prices now offered to fill the ships. So, I'm not sure that the service or prices will return to the premium days.

[cruz chic]

There weren't twenty cruise ship breakfasts to choose from; there were a bunch of foreign breakfasts, a bunch of diner breakfasts and Eggs Royale. (Eggs Benedict and Eggs Royale are so similar that if the steward brought one when I had ordered the other, I wouldn't bother to tell him.) I can still remember the special breakfasts, they were so hard to choose between.

 

I just like little jars of jelly; I'm very middle-class and they epitomize luxury to me. (And washed out after use, they're ideal for holding various pills if one has to take a lot of pills.)

OK, I'm so lost. A bunch of foreign breakfasts?? A bunch on diner breakfasts?? I just don't understand what you expect.

 

Some of the things I remember are:

Bagels, cream cheese and salmon (my favorite)

Southwest omelette

Denver omelette

Make your own omelette

Egg white frittata

3 kinds of benedict

Pancakes

Waffles

French toast

All American Breakfast

Corned beef hash

Multiple "foreign" breakfasts

 

Then they have:

Pasteries and muffins

Toast

Oatmeal

Grits (?)

Yougart

Fruit

Yougart parfait

 

I'm pretty sure I've forgotten a lot. Seriously, how much do you want them to supply? Wouldn't you be able to buy pill containers at home and have your very own supply of jelly or jam there as well?

[Pettifogger]

I don't expect anything more than I'm getting now until cabin prices go back up. I've been waiting three or four years and I can wait at least four more, if necessary. But when I resume paying premium prices, I'll want the same kind of little jelly jars and premium breakfasts we used to get. Am I asking too much?

[cruz chic]

I don't expect anything more than I'm getting now until cabin prices go back up. I've been waiting three or four years and I can wait at least four more, if necessary. But when I resume paying premium prices, I'll want the same kind of little jelly jars and premium breakfasts we used to get. Am I asking too much?

Ok I'm still having problems about the premium breakfasts. I'm really trying to understand. I think the MDR breakfasts are much improved from what they used to be. Is it just that you don't get the little jars? That's what I am sensing. I think regardless if the pricing goes up those little things will never return. What HAL needs to do is reward it's customers that commit early with decent pricing instead of gouging early bookers and giving away the farm for the late bookers. For my Oct cruise I've seen a couple of discounts because the price was nuts! I am not purchasing my airfare until closer to the cruise. I will be watching the price and if it's not where I want it to be I will cancel and book again after final payment. If they want to play this dirty game then lets play. I book a guarantee so it doesn't matter at all where I end up on the ship. I also think they should limit wine people bring on board to a few bottle instead of allowing cases and cases. That might help their bottom line regardless how that crowd argues differently.

[sail7seas]

I don't expect anything more than I'm getting now until cabin prices go back up. I've been waiting three or four years and I can wait at least four more, if necessary. But when I resume paying premium prices, I'll want the same kind of little jelly jars and premium breakfasts we used to get. Am I asking too much?

 

 

Pay the high premium prices we pay for "S" Suites, have breakfast in Pinnacle and you just might see the little jelly/jam jars. ;)

 

Those of us who book early and book the deluxe veranda and penthouse suites are paying premium fares. No bargains in the pricing unless you book late or get a free upgrade/low cost upsell.

 

[Pettifogger]

lorekauf:

 

I can appreciate your dissatisfaction with the current flexible ship-filling cabin pricing policy, but I doubt that HAL likes it any better than you do. I think they would much prefer, apart form the difference in price levels, to go back to the procedure they followed up through 2007 for setting and maintaining cabin prices, but these are not easy times for the cruise industry or any other industry dependent on discretionary spending and I don't think they're free to do whatever they like.

 

Whenever I come upon a reason for dissatisfaction with HAL, I tell myself that i'm going to need them for a few more years and whatever it takes to make that possible, I should try to accept.

[startwin]

Oh boy, I hope if I ever am able to book the PH or deluxe suites, I can refrain from constantly referring to it on here. I'm just happy to be onboard, in my humble Verandah, oceanview or even inside.

[LindaSSF]

We sailed on the Westerdam this year to Alaska, in an SA suite. We were unfortunately a bit too late in booking to get a seat in fixed seat dining in the MDR. Our experience with anytime (open) dining in the lower MDR was awful for the first 2 nights.

 

The first night, our server was surly and slow. People seated after us with a different server were finishing while we were still waiting on our first course. Our meals arrived and were incorrect, but we were afraid to send them back - we might have never gotten dinner! 3+ hours for dinner was far too long, with long empty periods with nothing on the table and no attention from anyone in the MDR.

 

After the first night, we spoke with the Neptune concierge, asking to be seated with a reservation for anytime dining in a different location away from that server's station. The server at the next night's table was only slightly better in that he brought the right things. Thank goodness for good table companions and good conversation as we sat once again for more than 3 hours for dinner. He was certainly not overwhelmed with tables - I've seemed competent servers at a land-based dining room easily handle what he struggled with.

 

With the help of the Neptune concierge, we spoke to the manager for dining the next morning who was extremely apologetic. As part of service recovery, we were offered a bottle of fairly good wine and seating reservations in open dining with "his best waiter". Subsequent nights, we had the service we expected. We enjoyed the meals and tipped the waiter well for the service we had for the rest of the cruise, well above the autotips. He remembered our names, preferences, made suggestions for what we might like that night, even brought out a few "special" dishes not on the menu for us to try.

 

The wine stewards were a lost cause. Our first two nights, our ordered wine never arrived. We enjoyed the wine the dining manager personally brought us the third night, but we only finished about 1/2. We asked the wine steward to put away the remainder for the next night. Night 4 - the wine was lost... Nobody could find it. Half way through dinner, a sheepish wine steward brought us a new bottle of the same wine. After that, we gave up on wine with dinner.

 

Pinnacle Grill was excellent as was room service and what was available in the Neptune lounge.

 

The Lido felt like a cattle call. I have trouble walking after multiple ankle & knee surgeries. I don't enjoy circling the room looking for a place to sit, balancing cooling food. We had one lunch there when we got back late from an excursion and decided that it wasn't worth trying again.

 

We never tried the Cannaletto - we live in an area where there are excellent mom & pop Italian restaurants. We wanted to try other things.

 

Honestly, the poor service with the MDR the first two nights had us worried that we had made a horrible mistake booking the cruise. Speaking with friends we had made on board, it seemed that fixed dining in the upper dining room had far fewer problems.

 

Linda

[Pettifogger]

Before your next cruise you might want to inquire as to whether suite passengers have a right to fixed dining.

[LindaSSF]

We thought the anytime dining might be ok & didn't worry over it when we booked.

 

We have fixed dining for our Panama Canal trip coming up! One more chance with dining. HAL.

[sail7seas]

Oh boy, I hope if I ever am able to book the PH or deluxe suites, I can refrain from constantly referring to it on here. I'm just happy to be onboard, in my humble Verandah, oceanview or even inside.

 

My reference is only and always has only been because of the constant mention of what low prices everyone is paying and the repeated reminders we are 'getting what we pay for'. While it is true, many fares are very low it is not true that all are.

 

It has nothing to do with anything but for that exception to the 'rule' of cheap fares.

 

Not All fares are very low. Some are actually high.

No matter whata cabin you are in, All of us want value for our money.

 

[cruz chic]

lorekauf:

 

I can appreciate your dissatisfaction with the current flexible ship-filling cabin pricing policy, but I doubt that HAL likes it any better than you do. I think they would much prefer, apart form the difference in price levels, to go back to the procedure they followed up through 2007 for setting and maintaining cabin prices, but these are not easy times for the cruise industry or any other industry dependent on discretionary spending and I don't think they're free to do whatever they like.

 

Whenever I come upon a reason for dissatisfaction with HAL, I tell myself that i'm going to need them for a few more years and whatever it takes to make that possible, I should try to accept.

Yes, I get that they need to fill up the ship. I just came off a cruise on the N.A. I originally booked a cabin on the Celebrity Eclipse. The price for me for 2 weeks in an ordinary balcony was $3400. Hal wanted $4200. Is the $4200 a bargain to you? This is what I'm talking about when I say HAL is gouging people. Why do they have to charge such a stupid price? If I waited until after final I would have paid about $2400 for the same cabin. Why can't they come out of the gate at around $3000. That is still PLENTY for that cabin. Meanwhile Celebrity's price went up way over the $3400. They are both in the same economy so tell me who has a better price strategy overall.

[sail7seas]

Yes, I get that they need to fill up the ship. I just came off a cruise on the N.A. I originally booked a cabin on the Celebrity Eclipse. The price for me for 2 weeks in an ordinary balcony was $3400. Hal wanted $4200. Is the $4200 a bargain to you? This is what I'm talking about when I say HAL is gouging people. Why do they have to charge such a stupid price? If I waited until after final I would have paid about $2400 for the same cabin. Why can't they come out of the gate at around $3000. That is still PLENTY for that cabin. Meanwhile Celebrity's price went up way over the $3400. They are both in the same economy so tell me who has a better price strategy overall.

 

 

I Get it, Lorekauf.

If we wait until after final payment date, we, too, would pay a fare more like what others pay.

I get tired of being so penalized for booking early.

 

 

[cruz chic]

My reference is only and always has only been because of the constant mention of what low prices everyone is paying and the repeated reminders we are 'getting what we pay for'. While it is true, many fares are very low it is not true that all are.

 

It has nothing to do with anything but for that exception to the 'rule' of cheap fares.

 

Not All fares are very low. Some are actually high.

No matter whata cabin you are in, All of us want value for our money.

 

The only people that are getting low fares as far as I can see are those that are booking after final payment while gouging those that commit early. They need to change their strategy because this game is getting tiresome. I really don`t care where I end up on the ship so if this is how they want to play I`ll be happy to oblige. I`ll be happy to keep $1000 in my pocket instead of theirs.

[Bearnaise]

The only people that are getting low fares as far as I can see are those that are booking after final payment while gouging those that commit early. They need to change their strategy because this game is getting tiresome. I really don`t care where I end up on the ship so if this is how they want to play I`ll be happy to oblige. I`ll be happy to keep $1000 in my pocket instead of theirs.

To loosely paraphrase Ripley's famous sucker quote, hey, if they can sell cabins to people for an extra $1,000, why not? There are always people who pay full retail for everything. Other people wait until there's a sale on.

[sail7seas]

To loosely paraphrase Ripley's famous sucker quote, hey, if they can sell cabins to people for an extra $1,000, why not? There are always people who pay full retail for everything. Other people wait until there's a sale on.

 

 

And there are those who do not have the luxury of booking last minute. My DH is not retired and must schedule his vacations a good deal in advance. Those who must book in advance are not suckers nor fools..... they are responsible professionals, in many cases. We travel at least 4-7 times a year and he has to do his scheduling around his office responsibilities.

 

You also need to consider that those who book last minute for savings on the cruise fare but need to fly often have to pay far more for the airfare and the savings are lost. The further out one books air, often the better the price.

If one does not need air and can book last minute, they are 'lucky'.

 

[cruz chic]

To loosely paraphrase Ripley's famous sucker quote, hey, if they can sell cabins to people for an extra $1,000, why not? There are always people who pay full retail for everything. Other people wait until there's a sale on.

Of course. Those that are picky can pick their cabin and dining that they like and need to pay for that. Why not take the approach that Celebrity seems to. They start with decent prices and get higher towards the end. They likely drop at final payment too but overall they probably end up with more money over all. HAL maybe gouges 20% of their clients and gives the farm away to 80%. If they keep this up I will be one of the 80% because I will not be paying a premium for a mediocre experience. I will happily accept that experience for $1000 less.

[CruiseWhere]

Ok I'm still having problems about the premium breakfasts. I'm really trying to understand. I think the MDR breakfasts are much improved from what they used to be. Is it just that you don't get the little jars? That's what I am sensing. I think regardless if the pricing goes up those little things will never return. What HAL needs to do is reward it's customers that com mit early with decent pricing instead of gouging early bookers and giving away the farm for the late bookers. For my Oct cruise I've seen a couple of discounts because the price was nuts! I am not purchasing my airfare until closer to the cruise. I will be watching the price and if it's not where I want it to be I will cancel and book again after final payment. If they want to play this dirty game then lets play. I book a guarantee so it doesn't matter at all where I end up on the ship. I also think they should limit wine people bring on board to a few bottle instead of allowing cases and cases. That might help their bottom line regardless how that crowd argues differently.

 

How on earth would bringing "cases and cases" of wine affect your cost of your cruise, when we at the last minute albeit 2 months out, book full fare for our Deluxe Verandah Suites or Penthouses?

[Cruisin' GranAnn]

Just wanted to say that our Thanksgiving cruise on the Westerdam was great in every respect. Cabin, crew, Lido, aft pool, MDR, service, et.al.. Our experiences on that particular ship sailing with Capt. P.J. have all been delightful, and we will continue to select HAL as our preferred cruise line. Yes, there have been cutbacks as compared with a few years ago when the economy was better; however, this is true in most areas of service related matters. That old adage of "the glass is half full" seems a good way to look at life these days and we are thankful we can continue to enjoy our vacations on the ships.

[cruz chic]

How on earth would bringing "cases and cases" of wine affect your cost of your cruise, when we at the last minute albeit 2 months out, book full fare for our Deluxe Verandah Suites or Penthouses?

When HAL is missing that revenue they will have to make it up in other ways. I wouldn't think it would be all that hard to understand. If people are drinking that much you can't tell me if they couldn't bring it on they wouldn't drink at all. If you are booking 2 months out you are absolutely not paying full fare. What would lead you to believe you are?

[jd1966]

We must have very low expectations! I respect everyone's opinion but we got off the Westerdam this morning (our first HAL cruise and 20th overall) and thought the food (MDR and Lido) was better than anything we've had on any other cruise. Also, the Pinnacle food and service was exceptional!! I would also add that the service and friendliness was excellent in all ways. I do agree that the casino is too small, smoky and has old slots with a very limited selection.