Fire on Carnival Triumph. No engines, running on emergency generators.

[j1b7733]

From pg 21 of Carnival Shareholder Report compiled by Griffin Consulting Group (pub. 4.11.12)

“Carnival has a notably worse safety record than other cruise companies. While there is no public database of major cruise accidents such as the Costa Concordia disaster, the Center for Disease Control does track all major viral outbreaks on cruise lines. In the 2009-2011 period, Carnival-owned companies accounted for 56% of all viral outbreaks, compared to a 48% average market share (p=.11).i Additionally, Princess Cruises had 10 outbreaks, or 20% of total outbreaks, despite only having a 6% market share (p=.001). The company is also thought to have a worse safety record for persons lost at sea, especially in the Carnival brand: of the 179 disappearances since 2000, Carnival Cruise Line alone accounts for nearly 30% of them.6

These statistics suggest that risk is not simply inherent to the business of cruising: it varies across company and even more strongly across brand lines. The single largest step Carnival could take is integrating safety as a key value in its corporate culture. Carnival’s current values are summarized on a recruiting website: “Quality. Service. Hospitality. Friendliness”.7 Adding a corporate focus on safety is not a short-term solution, but if successfully implemented in the long term Carnival could significantly reduce downside risk.”

 

 

Read the full report @

http://economics-files.pomona.edu/jlikens/SeniorSeminars/Likens2012/reports/Carnival.pdf

 

 

I love it. 2 threads in a row this got posted as some sort of smoking gun. The document you are citing was written by a college student at Pomona College as part of a seminar class where they 'formed' a consulting company.

 

"Spring 2012

 

The members of the senior seminar will form a management consulting company and provide strategic advice for major corporate clients. Each of the fifteen students in the seminar, as a partner in the firm, will lead a three-person consulting project for one of our clients. Each partner will also serve as a member of two additional three-person consulting teams. Distinguished alumni of the Pomona economics department will serve as representatives of the client companies. The firm’s income will depend on the clients’ assessment of the consulting reports. The partners will decide how to divide the firm’s earnings among themselves. At the end of the seminar the partners will choose one person to become the firm’s CEO."

 

 

http://economics-files.pomona.edu/jlikens/SeniorSeminars/

[jonbgd]

Update on Carnival Triumph February 13' date=' 2013 – 2:30pm EST[/size']

 

We are mobilizing approximately 200 people to be on the ground in Mobile to support the Carnival Triumph’s arrival and guests’ travel home.

 

We are currently finalizing travel arrangements for guests from Mobile.

Carnival Triumph guests were given the option of boarding buses directly to Galveston or Houston, Texas, or to spend the night in a hotel in New Orleans, where they could rest before flying out on private charters the next day.

Carnival will cover all travel related and incidental expenses.

 

Carnival has reserved and arranged the following: approximately 100 motor coaches; more than

1,500 New Orleans hotel rooms

; multiple charter flights from New Orleans to Houston on Friday; and transportation from Houston to the Port of Galveston so that guests may retrieve their cars if they drove to the port.

 

There are 3,143 guests and 1,086 crew on board.

 

Upcoming Voyages

Carnival Cruise Lines has also announced the cancellations of 12 additional voyages of the Carnival Triumph. The 12 cancelled cruises, which encompass sailings from Feb. 21 through April 13, 2013, are in addition to two previously cancelled voyages scheduled to depart Feb. 11 and Feb. 16.

 

 

I would think most would want to stay in a CLEAN hotel and SHOWER before heading back home. :rolleyes:

IIm not sure I would want to get on a 8 hr bus ride with 50 other pax that havnt showered for 4+ days

But I do understand for those that need to get home thursday instead of friday

[pbsteve]

We still do not know much people, while the problems may be related... A fire in the engine room, and propulsion problems seem a bit far apart. If your car needed a spark plug change, would you not drive on it until you make sure that the battery doesn't start on fire?

 

Lets assume that something was replaced before the ship left dock with a brand new part. Lets say that part was defective, and caused the wiring to heat up, and start insulation on fire, should we not than blame the company who made the part, and the company making the wire, and the company hired to build the ship for not running the wire's individually so it never happens. When you start pointing fingers without information, you look like an idiot.

 

I am going to start blaming this whole thing on Albert Ballin, after all, he was the first person to design a cruise ship, if he hadn't done that, then there never would have been a fire on carnival.... Sound silly right... so do speculators.

 

If it's carnivals fault, I'll blame them, if not, I'll blame whoever caused it

[RuthlessBoss]

Ummm...

 

http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=140690&p=irol-index

 

Carnival Corportion and PLC owns

Carnival, Costa, Princess, Holland, others and makes up 50% of the worlds cruise line fleet.

 

"Carnival Corporation & plc is a global cruise company and one of the largest vacation companies in the world. Our portfolio of leading cruise brands includes Carnival Cruise Lines, Holland America Line, Princess Cruises and Seabourn in North America; P&O Cruises (UK), and Cunard in the United Kingdom; AIDA Cruises in Germany; Costa Cruises in Southern Europe; Iberocruceros in Spain; and P&O Cruises (Australia) in Australia."

 

...and of course good old wiki

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnival_Corporation_%26_plc

"The constituent corporation and plc are separate listed companies and have different shareholder bodies, but they jointly own all the operating companies in the group."

I was just about to post the other lines too, you beat me to it:D

[Tutankhamen]

If Carnival CORP and Costa survived the Concordia accident, they will certainly survive this incident. CCL is down less then 10% off their 52 week high..

[jackinbox]

So, tell us exactly what you think Carnival could have done to deal with this situation better?

I would like to know how this would be handled on a Transatlantic cruise? Tugboats aren't going to cut it in the middle of the Atlantic with rough seas. There has to be a better way.

[ducklite]

Would you jump from a three story building?

 

When I was a teen I was on a dive team and routinely dove from a 10 meter platform. Does that answer your question?

[freezerboy]

its amazing this thread has reached 100 pgs with the level of censorship in this forum. GET A LIFE MODS!:mad::mad::mad::(:(:(

[Earthworm Jim]

Carnival Cruise Lines does not own Costs Cruises. So lumping them together hardly seems reasonable.

 

Carnival Corporation owns both Carnival Cruise Lines and Costa Cruises, a fact that I'm sure you are well aware of. Chevy doesn't own GMC, but if there was a problem with Chevy Silverados, you know darn well that problem affects GMC Sierras as well.

[jimboridesmtb]

They still have the merchandise? :)

 

Why should Carnival pay for someone's expensive watch or diamond ring that they are taking home with them? If that was the case everyone would want to shop free too.

[pattymo]

I think CCL should pull their latest commercial..the one with the middle age couple on a land vacation in their car with bears pounding on their car and the man screaming throw the food out and then they saying never again whilst on a far better vacation...a carnival cruise. I'll bet alot of triumph cruisers are saying never again at this very moment

I am concerned over the sanitary conditions...cold water doesn't cut it and hand sanitizers ( if there are any left) do not kill all organisms.. There has to be hundreds if not thousands of cruisers/staff with gastointestinal symptoms or worse. This ship is one big virus./ petrie dish .I do hope the board of health boards the ship and does a thorough inspection and interview the passengers.

[Max Circus]

Asked and answered several times.

 

Tendering from a boat without lights belowdecks and any form of thruster control or stabilization is EXTREMELY risky and is done only when there is no other option. If you have ever tendered to a port in even moderate wind conditions, you have some idea of what's involved. Now imagine doing this with 3000 people over about 60-70 trips. Probably more, because people will insist on taking some basic clothing, etc. Imagine the risk to the crew that has to perform these operations as well.

 

A gangway is not an option because you cannot stabilize the disabled ship.

 

The people on board are not in life threatening conditions. Miserable yes, but you don't risk lives because of miserable conditions.

 

The right thing to do (and what they are doing) is Shelter in Place. See to immediate needs of safety and minimal sustenance. An analogy would be the blizzard in New England. If the power goes out in your house, you don't go out in the blizzard to go to another house unless your life is at risk. The hazards of moving, outweigh the risks of staying.

 

 

Fantastic post!!

[ducklite]

might be wrong but IM thinking it is closer to 5 stories at a minimum

 

Front the top more like 10. From a tender door, maybe 20 feet or so.

[dockmaster]

its amazing this thread has reached 100 pgs with the level of censorship in this forum. GET A LIFE MODS!:mad::mad::mad::(:(:(

 

This is one of the most tame forums and threads I have ever been on!!

 

billd

[adaptabl]

I have noticed that you come on all these threads and say the same thing about how Carnival has failed in how they handled this. Several people have asked you what more they could have done or what they could have done differently in your opinion and you have yet to give a clear answer. So, tell us exactly what you think Carnival could have done to deal with this situation better?

 

Oh - and I am not a cheerleader, just want a clear answer from you.

 

They could of canceled another cruise and used that ship to transfer pasengers to once they realized the ship could not be run on engines for power. They could use the Life boats if needed for the transfer. Those who did not want to leave would be in much beter conditions with fewer people to care for until the ship was towed to port. Forcing 4000+ people living in those conditions is not the way to do it.

 

Yes things happen but how you deal with it is what matters. I would be upset if I was forced to be on a disabled ship for that period of time in those conditions when other options are available. Imagine how upset you would be seeing other ships leave you there after dropping off some supplies and you were forced to stay on a dead ship with no power, no air conditioning or sanitation and very limited food.

 

A cancelled vaction is not fun but a whole lot better than having people live in sub 3rd world conditions.

 

I have cruise booked in April but I am concerned that if something did happen Carnival would not do everything possible to prevent hardship.

[jonbgd]

Carnival Corporation owns both Carnival Cruise Lines and Costa Cruises, a fact that I'm sure you are well aware of. Chevy doesn't own GMC, but if there was a problem with Chevy Silverados, you know darn well that problem affects GMC Sierras as well.

Thats it, you crossed the line dont be putting my GMC truck in the same class as a chevy

AS IF:p:D

[ducklite]

That would be pretty cruel of Carnival to do, to park them outside of cell range. If they do that intentionally then it will be another strike against them. In my experience they'd have to be within ~10 miles to get a signal, closer for a solid one.

 

While I agree with you, I'm not sure at that point that it will be up to Carnival, but rather it will be the harbormasters call.

 

I would imagine texts would go through as soon as they are within full site of land.

[broberts]

When I was a teen I was on a dive team and routinely dove from a 10 meter platform. Does that answer your question?

 

Only in the sense that it appears diving from a 10m platform into a smooth surfaced pool and jumping/diving (take your pick) from the 3rd deck of a heaving & tossing ship into six foot swells are being equated.

[airmj2123]

From the Onion:

"GULF OF MEXICO—Following an onboard fire that has left more than 4,000 Carnival cruise ship passengers and crew without electricity, water, and operational bathroom facilities, feces-covered, urine-stained traveler Jason Spaulding told reporters Wednesday that he is determined to enjoy the remainder of his high seas vacation. “Look, I’ve been looking forward to this cruise for months, and I’m not about to let a little utilities hiccup ruin my good time,” said a waste-drenched Spaulding, who in the past three days has been forced to urinate and defecate off the side of an immobile Carnival cruise liner whose backed-up restrooms sources confirmed are leaking raw sewage throughout the vessel’s living quarters and main deck. “The fact is, the sun is shining, the breeze is blowing, and I’m out here in the middle of the Gulf of Mexico on a boat. Uncontrollable torrents of human excrement or no, I’m going to make the best of it.” At press time, the optimistic Carnival passenger had decided to “cool off” by taking a dip in the cruise ship’s lukewarm, feces-clouded pool."

 

 

Funny, sad, true, or all the above?

WARNING:

The Onion is satirical (these are not real quotes).

[jackinbox]

They could of canceled another cruise and used that ship to transfer pasengers to once they realized the ship could not be run on engines for power. They could use the Life boats if needed for the transfer. Those who did not want to leave would be in much beter conditions with fewer people to care for until the ship was towed to port. Forcing 4000+ people living in those conditions is not the way to do it.

 

Yes things happen but how you deal with it is what matters. I would be upset if I was forced to be on a disabled ship for that period of time in those conditions when other options are available. Imagine how upset you would be seeing other ships leave you there after dropping off some supplies and you were forced to stay on a dead ship with no power, no air conditioning or sanitation and very limited food.

 

A cancelled vaction is not fun but a whole lot better than having people live in sub 3rd world conditions.

That's definitely a better way to handle it. Totally agree.

[Tonka's Skipper]

If Carnival CORP and Costa survived the Concordia accident, they will certainly survive this incident. CCL is down less then 10% off their 52 week high..

 

 

Just saying.....but the Concordia is far from over....The Maritime investigation by many international authorities, including but limited to, IMO, Solas committees, UDCG, Class, Pand I and other insurnaces groups are part if it. The investigation is now investigating Carnival Inc. in Miami. I am sure the recent problems with the desteny and the Troumph will become part of the overall investigation.

 

AKK

[johneeo]

Clearly by your response you don't invest much and have no idea how the stock market works and what impacts movement of stocks

 

Really ..... NOBODY does.

[Tutankhamen]

I think CCL should pull their latest commercial..the one with the middle age couple on a land vacation in their car with bears pounding on their car and the man screaming throw the food out and then they saying never again whilst on a far better vacation...a carnival cruise. I'll bet alot of triumph cruisers are saying never again at this very moment

I am concerned over the sanitary conditions...cold water doesn't cut it and hand sanitizers ( if there are any left) do not kill all organisms.. There has to be hundreds if not thousands of cruisers/staff with gastointestinal symptoms or worse. This ship is one big virus./ petrie dish .I do hope the board of health boards the ship and does a thorough inspection and interview the passengers.

 

Would be a good commercial for the a state to use.

 

Commercial opens with ship floating. Captain giving the Mayday call. CG ships circling ship. Smoke pouring out of lower decks. Alarms sounding threw out a dark ship. Strobe lights flashing. Crew handing out poop bags. Fights breaking out for crumbs. Shanty town of tents on deck. Poop and pee splashing around on floor. People coughing and getting sick.

 

Break to a couple sitting on a beach with a cocktail as they gaze at the ocean, with a ship bellowing smoke off in the distance with a bio-hazard boat racing towards it "never again"

 

Close with Florida beaches.

[mousey]

Wow this is my favorite ship and love the crew!

 

Ditto!

[kybluecruiser]

They could of canceled another cruise and used that ship to transfer pasengers to once they realized the ship could not be run on engines for power. They could use the Life boats if needed for the transfer. Those who did not want to leave would be in much beter conditions with fewer people to care for until the ship was towed to port. Forcing 4000+ people living in those conditions is not the way to do it.

 

Yes things happen but how you deal with it is what matters. I would be upset if I was forced to be on a disabled ship for that period of time in those conditions when other options are available. Imagine how upset you would be seeing other ships leave you there after dropping off some supplies and you were forced to stay on a dead ship with no power, no air conditioning or sanitation and very limited food.

 

A cancelled vaction is not fun but a whole lot better than having people live in sub 3rd world conditions.

 

I have cruise booked in April but I am concerned that if something did happen Carnival would not do everything possible to prevent hardship.

 

Even the media who has been showing nothing bit negative views have said this wouldn't have been a safe solution. The media experts said this would have been highly dangerous and it was safer to keep them on the triumph.