Air-Business up grade

[Hawaiidan]

This may be well known, however, in reading the fine print, the up grade is only for those portions of the flight(s) which are international

 

Thus a flight from Los angeles to say Rome, where a change of planes takes place in NY or Washington, only the portion from Washington/NY to Rome would be up-graded. The LA to Washington or NY would be in economy coach...a full half of the flight!

So read the fine print at what you get for your 700 to 800 one way up grade

[wripro]

It might be worth the deviation fee to get a non stop light across the pond.

[YoHoHo]

Yes, that seems to be common practice but it is good to point it out for those not reading what they are buying.

 

If a 3rd segment was involved that too might be economy. Direct from airline I booked premium economy. The 'international' segment, actually over-the-seas portion - 'international' can be a misnomer, is PE but the final leg, Frankfurt to Barcelona, was coach simply because there is no PE. But one might not notice that when booking the flight.

 

Bottom line is to read the fine print as tiresome as it is OR hopefully a good TA would remind you of this when discussing purchasing the upgrade, especially when travelling such a long domestic portion as in your example.

[YoHoHo]

It might be worth the deviation fee to get a non stop light across the pond.

There might not be non-stop LAX to say, BCN. That is one good thing of flying out from here up north. The first segment is often 'international' from YVR to (Europe) over a 'polar' route rather than domestic to the east coast.

 

Regardless, a deviation is the only way to arrive the day before embarkation so IMHO it is the wise choice especially for an overseas flight in any case. if one can add in a non-stop as you suggest and the problem is resolved.

[Hawaiidan]

It might be worth the deviation fee to get a non stop light across the pond.

 

From many destinations now, I am observing that non-stop long haul flights are becoming more and more rare Flying to Frankfurt or London from the west coast gives very few possibilities and zero from Hawaii. There are about 10 to 12 multi flights a day but only 1 non stop from SFO

 

The same is happening to aisian flights with a new trend of stopping off in Honolulu on the way to China and Japan or Singapore.

 

Suprising, the flight from mainland USA to Hawaii ( a 5 to 10 hour) flight is all considered domestic..not international. Only the segments Hawaii to Japan/China are considered international.

 

The same holds true with the return so flying from Hong kong to Chicago, a 13 hour flight, one might get a suprise after 6 hours when the plane landed enroute in Honolulu.....:eek: and have the next 7 hours in coach.

With the line looking for their best pricing from the airlines (inclusive or deviation) the airlines are going to offer them the best prices for these multi-segment flights.

 

I have seen this too in even getting award seats for miles. Multi-segment flights are easily available for the "saver rate" whereas the non stops for long hauls are withour exception the regular rate ( 2x times higher).

Airlines have realized the business travler wants the nonstop and is willing to pay$$$$$$ for it. It makes little sence thus, to give these seats away to awards or contract rates/

[Paulchili]

There might not be non-stop LAX to say, BCN. That is one good thing of flying out from here up north. The first segment is often 'international' from YVR to (Europe) over a 'polar' route rather than domestic to the east coast.

 

Regardless, a deviation is the only way to arrive the day before embarkation so IMHO it is the wise choice especially for an overseas flight in any case. if one can add in a non-stop as you suggest and the problem is resolved.

 

Actually there is a non stop from LAX to MAD (IB) for the very long portion of the flight; the short MAD-BCN in economy is no hardship.

Whether O air would choose these flights is a different matter.

BTW - in your example from YVR to BCN you have to fly via FRA for the most direct routing (or YYZ or YUL for 2 stops). :)

I definitely agree with the idea of arriving early and non stop whenever possible.

[Merriem]

We had that on another cruise line to Asia. However, our flight to LA was only one hour, so no big deal. We have an Oceania TA booked, and I found out about the business class only being on the international flight..since our trip doesn't have the low business upgrade, and the air credit isn't even a dent, we will see what we come up with.

[YoHoHo]

Actually there is a non stop from LAX to MAD (IB) for the very long portion of the flight; the short MAD-BCN in economy is no hardship.

Whether O air would choose these flights is a different matter.

BTW - in your example from YVR to BCN you have to fly via FRA for the most direct routing (or YYZ or YUL for 2 stops). :)

I definitely agree with the idea of arriving early and non stop whenever possible.

That is a good choice Paul, to work-around the OPs issue. I've learned a lot about air from your posts and others on the Cruise Air board. While not a non-stop is does make that very long leg the 'business class' segment. Even if there was smallish air surcharge on top of the upgrade cost it might well be worth it. But then I am sure you can do better with some of your famous flyer points methods.

 

Just in reply to your 'btw'. I have taken both YVR -> FRA -> BCN and YVR->YYZ->BCN.

IMO YVR->FRA is much better because that whole segment is 'international', better everything on board. The other route via Toronto was a 4 1/2 (feels like 8) hour flight on A/C domestic with the ensuing sandwich surcharge, less amiable crew, etc. That is the only time I flown a 'non-polar' route flight and w/o a good reason will not do again.

 

The FRA->BCN is not unlike your MAD-BCN example. Though longer it is still less than the 4 1/2 (feels like 8) hour segment and is fine in economy (and nice scenery.)

 

Plus, at that point, at long last, the destination is just over the horizon. Seems like a 2 hour flight to the port is a lot quicker and more enjoyable than the same flight en-route home. I think Einstein had something to say on that.

[Paulchili]

Yes - Einstein was a wise man :D

I have "worked" very hard for many years for my free FF miles and enjoyed every single one of them to the fullest.

Sadly, I am reaching the bottom of this well and the game has changed now forever :(

[vaitape]

Yes - Einstein was a wise man :D

I have "worked" very hard for many years for my free FF miles and enjoyed every single one of them to the fullest.

Sadly, I am reaching the bottom of this well and the game has changed now forever :(

 

Yo tambien! We feel your pain....

[Hawaiidan]

Yes - Einstein was a wise man :D

I have "worked" very hard for many years for my free FF miles and enjoyed every single one of them to the fullest.

Sadly, I am reaching the bottom of this well and the game has changed now forever :(

 

Paul and I differ in that he contends his miles are free and do not cost him to$$$ spend.

I, on the other hand believe that I paid real$$$ or someone did for me in order to get me my miles which I regard as real money...my money.

I had to pay one way or another to get every mile. To my knowledge in 30 years I never received any for free.

While it is still possible to get miles I do agree that it is getting harder than it was in the 80 and 90's. And I don't sleep well with less than 400,000 miles available. With normal usage of about 100,000 a year I find it easy to maintain that level...so can you.. but you have to start small and be patient for the first several years

 

Yet by careful spending and planning well in advance you can still amass several hundred thousand miles in a few years, providing you don't waste them. Paying for EVERYTHING from taxes to beans will surprise you with the miles you earn. You must vow to only use cash as a last resort using your airline of choice exclusive credit card and hotel of choice credit card.

You don't have to fly to earn.... just pay your regular bills at home to win huge rewards

[Paulchili]

Paul and I differ in that he contends his miles are free and do not cost him to$$$ spend.

 

Dan,

They are FREE. I don't know why you have such a difficult time with this concept.

When a bank offers you 50, 75 or even 100,000 miles with an airline for opening a credit card with them, these miles are free.

Granted, they may require you to spend $1,500 in 3 or 6 months. This is money I would spend anyway (just like you do) for groceries, gas, 6 months of car insurance, eating out, travel/cruise, etc - I just make sure I do it on this "new" card. I would spend that money anyway for my normal expenses - I don't buy things I don't want or need just to satisfy the spending requirement.

If I use one of my "older" cards, I get 1 or 2 miles/$ spend. If I use this "new" card for the same expenses, I still get the 1 or 2 miles/$ spent but I also get the BONUS of 50, 75 or 100,000 miles.

Are you with me?:D

[spindrift]

And don't forget to consider the luggage. In economy, you must pay for extra bags or for all bags when usually in BC, there is no charge for the luggage, so when you fly economy domestic to, say, Newark, and then BC overseas, you will be paying for the luggage because of the first leg of the flight.

 

On our trip to Papeete, we paid for our luggage in Houston and they checked it all the way to Papeete, but in LA, they made us pay again, and even more. We got the shaft on this one.

[Paulchili]

Certain credit cards (Citi MC with American Airlines and Chase Visa with United) will give you free first luggage and priority boarding when paying for your ticket with their card. If you travel more than once a year, the annual fee more than pays for your luggage fees for 2 people (and then some).

So you don't even have to have elite status with the airline to get this benefit. :)

[no fuss travel]

You were kidding about the luggage fee I hope when flying to LA and on to Papeete. When we flew Vancouver to LAX and on to Papeete, it was classified as an international flight so we did not have to pay luggage fees. We flew Air Canada and they normally charge for any flight that lands in the US.

[PaulMCO]

Dan,

They are FREE. I don't know why you have such a difficult time with this concept.

When a bank offers you 50, 75 or even 100,000 miles with an airline for opening a credit card with them, these miles are free.

Granted, they may require you to spend $1,500 in 3 or 6 months. This is money I would spend anyway (just like you do) for groceries, gas, 6 months of car insurance, eating out, travel/cruise, etc - I just make sure I do it on this "new" card. I would spend that money anyway for my normal expenses - I don't buy things I don't want or need just to satisfy the spending requirement.

If I use one of my "older" cards, I get 1 or 2 miles/$ spend. If I use this "new" card for the same expenses, I still get the 1 or 2 miles/$ spent but I also get the BONUS of 50, 75 or 100,000 miles.

Are you with me?:D

 

Unfortunately I agree with Dan. The miles cost somebody something. The price of the miles are built into the cost of your air fare, hotel bill or car rental. Want miles with your rent a car. Check your bill an the fine print. You just paid for them.

[Jancruz]

This may be well known, however, in reading the fine print, the up grade is only for those portions of the flight(s) which are international

 

Thus a flight from Los angeles to say Rome, where a change of planes takes place in NY or Washington, only the portion from Washington/NY to Rome would be up-graded. The LA to Washington or NY would be in economy coach...a full half of the flight!

So read the fine print at what you get for your 700 to 800 one way up grade

 

You are correct and that $799 per person one way upgrade is only available on certain cruises!!

Jancruz1

[Jancruz]

Actually there is a non stop from LAX to MAD (IB) for the very long portion of the flight; the short MAD-BCN in economy is no hardship.

Whether O air would choose these flights is a different matter.

BTW - in your example from YVR to BCN you have to fly via FRA for the most direct routing (or YYZ or YUL for 2 stops). :)

I definitely agree with the idea of arriving early and non stop whenever possible.

 

I try to avoid FRA as it is a very large and inconvenient airport!!

Jancruz1

[Jancruz]

I also hoard miles but was about to run out when I started talking to friends and found out some of them had lots of miles which they dont use so I was able to purchase them at rock bottom prices..so try your friends and family..

Jancruz1

[Paulchili]

Unfortunately I agree with Dan. The miles cost somebody something. The price of the miles are built into the cost of your air fare, hotel bill or car rental. Want miles with your rent a car. Check your bill an the fine print. You just paid for them.

 

Paul,

I usually agree with you but not this time.

We are comparing apples to oranges. I am not talking about getting miles for rental cars.

Here is one example (this is just an example - it could be any other credit card for UA, BA, AA miles):

Let's say, for argument's sake, that I spend $500 on my credit card each month on my regular, everyday purchases.

For 3 months I use my "old" UA Visa Card and spend $1,500. What do I get for that? 1,500 UA miles - not bad, but no big deal.

Now I get an offer from Citi to open an AA Visa with a bonus of 50,000 AA miles after spending $1,500 in 3 months.

Obviously, this is no problem for me - that is what I normally spend anyway.

After 3 months with this new card I have 1,500 AA miles PLUS 50,000 BONUS AA miles. I'd say that is quite a difference from the first 3 months of spending the same amount of money.

Of course, these miles cost Citi money as they bought them from AA - but do I care? No, because they cost me nothing beyond my normal, everyday expenses. With those 50,000 miles I get a business class ticket to Europe; do the same "trick" for my DW and we both fly business. Let's say this is a flight from LAX to BCN ONE way for my TA cruise. A quick check shows that those tickets would cost me around $7,300 PER PERSON with AA, BA or IB (as it is one way). Was it worth to open this credit card - you tell me? Did that ticket cost me anything beyond my "normal" monthly expenses? NO.

 

Do you want another example? A couple of years ago Chase offered a Hyatt Visa card which gave you 2 free nights at ANY Hyatt after the first purchase (ANY purchase - could be a Big Mack). I used those 2 free nights to book my 2 nights in the Park Hyatt Sydney where rooms start at $800/night.

BTW, the first year's annual card fee was waived (so my nights cost me the price of a Big Mack) - but even IF I had to pay the $75 fee I still got $1600+ worth of rooms in Hyatt for $75.

That's the kind of business I am talking about - not getting a few miles from Hertz for renting the car.

As I have said previously, there had been numerous offers for 50K, 75K and even 100K miles before. One day I opened 2 Citi card each yielding 75K AA miles and the same for my DW - for a grand total of 300,000 AA miles in a single afternoon; another time we each got a Chase BA card for $100,000 BA Avios each. And so on and so on over the years - just think of where this will take you in First or Business :D

I have over 2 million AA miles giving me lifetime Platinum - I flew less the 50,000 of those miles on paid tickets. The rest were the kind of "gifts" I described above.

But we are way off topic here :D

[Paulchili]

Corrections to my above post.

Of course, I was talking about a Big Mac (not Mack).

Also, my business class ticket LAX to BCN cost me $5 (as in FIVE) in taxes - so technically you are right - it wasn't free :D

[globevest]

+1. I agree, apples and oranges.

[PaulMCO]

Paul,

I usually agree with you but not this time.

We are comparing apples to oranges. I am not talking about getting miles for rental cars.

Here is one example (this is just an example - it could be any other credit card for UA, BA, AA miles):

Let's say, for argument's sake, that I spend $500 on my credit card each month on my regular, everyday purchases.

For 3 months I use my "old" UA Visa Card and spend $1,500. What do I get for that? 1,500 UA miles - not bad, but no big deal.

Now I get an offer from Citi to open an AA Visa with a bonus of 50,000 AA miles after spending $1,500 in 3 months.

Obviously, this is no problem for me - that is what I normally spend anyway.

After 3 months with this new card I have 1,500 AA miles PLUS 50,000 BONUS AA miles. I'd say that is quite a difference from the first 3 months of spending the same amount of money.

Of course, these miles cost Citi money as they bought them from AA - but do I care? No, because they cost me nothing beyond my normal, everyday expenses. With those 50,000 miles I get a business class ticket to Europe; do the same "trick" for my DW and we both fly business. Let's say this is a flight from LAX to BCN ONE way for my TA cruise. A quick check shows that those tickets would cost me around $7,300 PER PERSON with AA, BA or IB (as it is one way). Was it worth to open this credit card - you tell me? Did that ticket cost me anything beyond my "normal" monthly expenses? NO.

 

Do you want another example? A couple of years ago Chase offered a Hyatt Visa card which gave you 2 free nights at ANY Hyatt after the first purchase (ANY purchase - could be a Big Mack). I used those 2 free nights to book my 2 nights in the Park Hyatt Sydney where rooms start at $800/night.

BTW, the first year's annual card fee was waived (so my nights cost me the price of a Big Mack) - but even IF I had to pay the $75 fee I still got $1600+ worth of rooms in Hyatt for $75.

That's the kind of business I am talking about - not getting a few miles from Hertz for renting the car.

As I have said previously, there had been numerous offers for 50K, 75K and even 100K miles before. One day I opened 2 Citi card each yielding 75K AA miles and the same for my DW - for a grand total of 300,000 AA miles in a single afternoon; another time we each got a Chase BA card for $100,000 BA Avios each. And so on and so on over the years - just think of where this will take you in First or Business :D

I have over 2 million AA miles giving me lifetime Platinum - I flew less the 50,000 of those miles on paid tickets. The rest were the kind of "gifts" I described above.

But we are way off topic here :D

 

 

You sound like my dear Brother. Has 3 MM AA miles and never has flown them for revenue. :) Yes off topic but funny

[wripro]

Unfortunately, Paul, the bonuses offered are getting smaller and the spending requirements higher. Still, your process is very wise.

[Hawaiidan]

Paul,

I usually agree with you but not this time.

We are comparing apples to oranges. I am not talking about getting miles for rental cars.

Here is one example (this is just an example - it could be any other credit card for UA, BA, AA miles):

Let's say, for argument's sake, that I spend $500 on my credit card each month on my regular, everyday purchases.

For 3 months I use my "old" UA Visa Card and spend $1,500. What do I get for that? 1,500 UA miles - not bad, but no big deal.

Now I get an offer from Citi to open an AA Visa with a bonus of 50,000 AA miles after spending $1,500 in 3 months.

Obviously, this is no problem for me - that is what I normally spend anyway.

After 3 months with this new card I have 1,500 AA miles PLUS 50,000 BONUS AA miles. I'd say that is quite a difference from the first 3 months of spending the same amount of money.

Of course, these miles cost Citi money as they bought them from AA - but do I care? No, because they cost me nothing beyond my normal, everyday expenses. With those 50,000 miles I get a business class ticket to Europe; do the same "trick" for my DW and we both fly business. Let's say this is a flight from LAX to BCN ONE way for my TA cruise. A quick check shows that those tickets would cost me around $7,300 PER PERSON with AA, BA or IB (as it is one way). Was it worth to open this credit card - you tell me? Did that ticket cost me anything beyond my "normal" monthly expenses? NO.

 

Do you want another example? A couple of years ago Chase offered a Hyatt Visa card which gave you 2 free nights at ANY Hyatt after the first purchase (ANY purchase - could be a Big Mack). I used those 2 free nights to book my 2 nights in the Park Hyatt Sydney where rooms start at $800/night.

BTW, the first year's annual card fee was waived (so my nights cost me the price of a Big Mack) - but even IF I had to pay the $75 fee I still got $1600+ worth of rooms in Hyatt for $75.

That's the kind of business I am talking about - not getting a few miles from Hertz for renting the car.

As I have said previously, there had been numerous offers for 50K, 75K and even 100K miles before. One day I opened 2 Citi card each yielding 75K AA miles and the same for my DW - for a grand total of 300,000 AA miles in a single afternoon; another time we each got a Chase BA card for $100,000 BA Avios each. And so on and so on over the years - just think of where this will take you in First or Business :D

I have over 2 million AA miles giving me lifetime Platinum - I flew less the 50,000 of those miles on paid tickets. The rest were the kind of "gifts" I described above.

But we are way off topic here :D

 

However, I and the other Paul still believe they are ALL derived from real money ( our money) regardless of who where how or why. I spend thus my miles at though there were actual dollars given to me. Even if given stuff free it still retains a purchase value in real dollars. If I got a Rolex for opening a credit card I would still regard it as having a worth of real value..... Heat rises, water runs down hill and their is no free lunch.

 

And yes UAL card gives you free bags. and 35000 miles for sign up get one for your spouse and you get 70,000 !!