Cunard Formal Nights

[Salacia]

Everyone on this board has the right to give away as much, or as little, personal information as they feel comfortable with.

 

No-one has the right to bully anyone into being more open about their private life than they are happy with. And, equally, no-one should tell someone they are being too open (with the possible exception in the form of a security warning, some people are too trusting/naive).

 

Some are happy to: Post pictures of themselves. Real name (sometimes incl. surname). Where they reside. email address. Age. Sex. Nationality. Sexual orientation. Cabin number (in advance of sailing). I've even seen 'phone numbers given out. Private details about spouse and family. That is their choice.

 

Others give nothing away. They are NOT hiding anything, they are choosing, as anyone may, not to "go public". That is their choice.

 

No-one from either position has the right to judge another from the opposite camp.

 

Rant over :o .

 

Pepper, I agree with you. In fact, I believe no one has the right to bully anyone about anything, ever. Cheers, -S.

[Salacia]

I normally don't post preferring just to read this forum but talk of the iconic Sydney Opera House got the better of me. I first visited Sydney only in 2012 and was a world cruise passenger on Queen Mary 2. The liner circumnavigated the continent and on our second visit to the city that has everything my OH and I decided we would go to the opera. We looked at the price of the ship-board tickets and thought they were pricey so after QM2 had docked in Circular Quay we hopped, skipped and jumped around the water's edge (still practising walking on water!) and enquired about tickets for that evening's performance. It was Turandot. The lady behind the ticket counter explained they had only a few seats left unsold and these were "up high". We weren't bothered just as long as we got to witness a performance. We dressed up as you would if you went to Covent Garden in London. My OH and I weren't the only ones in evening dress - I counted two dozen other gents in "full rig" which I thought was good considering the Aussies "don't do dressing up very much or very often" according to a colleague who has lived in Sydney for the past 25 years. But what did really impress us was the attire of 99.9 per cent of the audience that night - men in jackets and many sporting ties and ladies in their finery. Who says the Aussies are slobs? Not I. Only one man in shorts did I spy.

But speaking of ladies in their finery a funny thing happened after we had taken our seats in the "gods". Picture the scene. There I am in DJ, multi-coloured bow tie and patent leather shoes and my wife in one of her bespoke dresses. Just minutes before curtain up this woman shuffled along the row (we were near the middle) and plonked herself beside me on my right. No sooner had she sat down than she turned to me and said "you didn't stand up!" I looked her up and down and said "Madam, YOU DIDN'T DRESS UP!" Had she been properly attired I most certainly would have stood but as she was wearing trainers (which were soiled), cropped cargo pants and a T-shirt I thought I wouldn't bother. My act of chivalry would have be wasted.

Needless to say not another word was spoken. At the first interval she left her seat next to me and I spotted her hovering around halfway down the auditorium. Just before the second act she sat down in what appeared to be a vacant seat in a more expensive part of the auditorium only to have to move when the person who'd paid for it returned to take his place.

Before the third act I spotted her walking down almost to the front row and park her ample frame in a vacant seat. Was she a "seat tart"?...pay little and progress towards the front in the hope you are not found out! We are in Sydney Opera House again in early 2014...I'll be watching out for her!

 

Portholepete, that's a funny story :)

Thanks to you & Buzzaw for the info regarding the Sydney Opera House. While the Metropolitan Opera House here in NY is only a cab ride away, perhaps some day I'll get to Sydney too :) Cheers, -S.

[bazzaw]

Portholepete

 

Yes -- funny story.. I did not really understand the bit about "you did not stand up" -- with my limited understanding and knowledge of Aussie women (as I am a man) that does not sound to me like anything an Aussie woman would ever say, except in jest -and jesting is something that ALL Aussies do all the time. :) Well - at least Aussies as I understand them.

 

As regards the moving to empty seats :) -- SO! -- that still happens. :) It's wonderful to see old traditions maintained over the years.

 

I was first introduced to Opera over 30 years ago. At that time , I wasn't exactly a student -- but let us just say that my financial resources were restricted :) At that time, the Sydney Opera House used to sell last minute, standing - room only tickets for $5. There used to be a BIG queue up the stairs to the ticket office of people wishing to avail themselves of this. I spent a lot of hours in that queue over the years. I have seen Dame Joan Sutherland many times in the standing position :) Of course, even then, there were the "watchers" -- these were standing patrons who would spy out unoccupied seats during the first act -- and then!>>>>>> :) Oh, for the good old days !

 

Barry

[Louise D]

Everyone on this board has the right to give away as much, or as little, personal information as they feel comfortable with.

 

No-one has the right to bully anyone into being more open about their private life than they are happy with. And, equally, no-one should tell someone they are being too open (with the possible exception in the form of a security warning, some people are too trusting/naive).

 

Some are happy to: Post pictures of themselves. Real name (sometimes incl. surname). Where they reside. email address. Age. Sex. Nationality. Sexual orientation. Cabin number (in advance of sailing). I've even seen 'phone numbers given out. Private details about spouse and family. That is their choice.

 

Others give nothing away. They are NOT hiding anything, they are choosing, as anyone may, not to "go public". That is their choice.

 

No-one from either position has the right to judge another from the opposite camp.

 

Rant over :o .

 

Pepper, well said. I agree with your wise words (as always). :)

 

I believe that a few posters have become overly inquisitive as to personal matters in recent times. This really has no place on a Board devoted to discussion of cruising and the ships of the Cunard Line.

[pmb1]

Pepper, well said. I agree with your wise words (as always). :)

 

I believe that a few posters have become overly inquisitive as to personal matters in recent times. This really has no place on a Board devoted to discussion of cruising and the ships of the Cunard Line.

Snoops, like the poor, will always be with us. But while (whilst) there is no shame in being poor, snoops are something else again; snoops, unlike the poor, may be ignored by the righteous.

[keithm]

Hmm -- I heard that some of them wear shorts in the Grills Dining Room for lunch?? If so - that would be shameful,unheard of in Brittania MDR.

 

Barry

A lot of pax wore shorts in the Grills at lunch time(my self included)Often we came back from an early excursion. A nice pair of shorts & polo style(or other nice shirt)are fine at lunch.It's after 6PM that I feel that the dresscodes should be properly adhered to.We've seen plenty of casual dressed pax as we've walked by King's Court on our way to dinner. We dress according to the night's dresscode whenever we did the "tasting" in KingsCourt or the Lido on the QV.

[keithm]

Portholepete

 

Yes -- funny story.. I did not really understand the bit about "you did not stand up" -- with my limited understanding and knowledge of Aussie women (as I am a man) that does not sound to me like anything an Aussie woman would ever say, except in jest -and jesting is something that ALL Aussies do all the time. :) Well - at least Aussies as I understand them.

 

As regards the moving to empty seats :) -- SO! -- that still happens. :) It's wonderful to see old traditions maintained over the years.

 

I was first introduced to Opera over 30 years ago. At that time , I wasn't exactly a student -- but let us just say that my financial resources were restricted :) At that time, the Sydney Opera House used to sell last minute, standing - room only tickets for $5. There used to be a BIG queue up the stairs to the ticket office of people wishing to avail themselves of this. I spent a lot of hours in that queue over the years. I have seen Dame Joan Sutherland many times in the standing position :) Of course, even then, there were the "watchers" -- these were standing patrons who would spy out unoccupied seats during the first act -- and then!>>>>>> :) Oh, for the good old days !

 

Barry

"The last opera I saw, had the Marx Brothers in it"-Oscar Madison

[keithm]

Regarding using real names:

 

 

When you registered on our forums, we asked you to agree to the following information. This is the entire unedited text of that agreement:

 

Forum Rules

 

Important: Do Not Use Your REAL NAME as your USER NAME

 

Most internet forums would request you do not use personal information on a public board. This is a matter of safety. So, in fact, those who do not post personal names are following CC's rules and those who do are not.

 

 

 

Often I do, too. I don't understand what the point is to come to a forum and call people 'snobs, etc.' This type of postings (no matter who does it) adds nothing to civil discourse and enjoyment of the forum in my opinion. I also believe 'name-calling' is against the rules.

 

 

 

I just don't understand why something like this would be done. It doesn't matter where someone lives or their income level...and it never should. What purpose does a post like the above serve? It is hurtful and helps no one.

 

best regards,

seasidegal

Well said.

[keithm]

So you're saying that unless the avatar we use is a picture of ourselves and we use our real names on here we're hiding? That's ridiculous.

 

Since when is anyone on Cruise Critic required to use their own picture as an avatar? Since when is anyone required to use their own name as their cruise critic 'handle'?

 

In fact, for everyone reading this, I'll tell you a little 'fun' anecdote about Bazzaw and I, which should serve as a reminder to be mindful of what personal information you share on here.

 

Way back when, on a dress code thread a long time ago, Bazzaw posted the suburb (he thought I lived in) right here in Cruise Critic, for everyone to see. He then went on to say that it was not a well off area and pointed out the contradiction (in his mind) of my support for Cunard's dress code and formal nights - and the less than salubrious circumstances in which I (supposedly) live.

 

Bazzaw repeatedly calls me a snob, seemingly ignorant to the blindingly obvious snobbery that entails him, in so many words, telling me "you live in a poor area, who do you think you are liking the dress code".

 

Which is another reason why he calls me a "wannabe", it's because I (supposedly) live in a poor area and like dressing up on formal nights on a Cunard ship - just who do I think I am!

 

So for those of you that weren't aware of the background story regarding Bazzaw and I, there it is.

 

P.S. A lot of people on here complain about bullying & harassment etc. Until someone has publicly (without your permission) posted the suburb (they think you live in) on here and then told everyone how poor it is - don't talk to me about being bullied or harassed on here.

You add a true touch of class & good humour to this site. If others call you a snob etc.then it's themselves who are being brought down to a base level. We all can disagree on issues, but when it gets personal that's where we should draw the line.

[Pushka]

I really am a beach. There, I'm outed.

[Salacia]

I really am a beach. There, I'm outed.

 

:D And I'm a city person - there! I outed myself :eek::D

[turquoise 6]

You add a true touch of class & good humour to this site. If others call you a snob etc.then it's themselves who are being brought down to a base level. We all can disagree on issues, but when it gets personal that's where we should draw the line.

LOL, :D in what circles ?LOL, Not Transatlantic Cunard

[bazzaw]

A lot of pax wore shorts in the Grills at lunch time(my self included)Often we came back from an early excursion. A nice pair of shorts & polo style(or other nice shirt)are fine at lunch.It's after 6PM that I feel that the dresscodes should be properly adhered to.We've seen plenty of casual dressed pax as we've walked by King's Court on our way to dinner. We dress according to the night's dresscode whenever we did the "tasting" in KingsCourt or the Lido on the QV.

 

Hmm -- I will agree that the advice regarding the Cunard dress code is quite poorly written and hence somewhat ambiguous.

 

Re breakfast and lunch --"During the day casual shirts, shorts, trousers and beachwear are ideal. The main restaurants require a casual wear dress code for breakfast and lunch, however you may wear shorts in either the Kings Court (Queen Mary 2) or Lido Restaurant (Queen Victoria & Queen Elizabeth)."

 

I have always interpreted this to mean -- shorts on men in the Kings Court/and or Lido only - Long casual trousers in the main dining rooms.

 

"It's after 6PM that I feel that the dress codes should be properly adhered to" In other words and as per others here who have stated much the same thing, the dress code is open to your personal interpretation -- which is that you "feel" that the dress code only applies at night??. Some may then "feel" that the dress code should only apply during the day??

 

Barry

[Whitemarsh]

It is not worth wasting time trying to make sense of the statement in question. Just ignore it, and all the other similar posts.

 

Good advice, although it's saddening that the behaviour of a few on here has degenerated to such depths that people are now being openly mocked due to the country they come from.

 

One the one hand you have people discussing fashion and posting pictures - nothing out of the ordinary on a dress code thread, whilst others have:

 

1. Called people names - "snobs".
   
2. Stated that people are hiding behind false names and avatars - whilst simultaneously mocking them saying that the exposure (if they did use their real names & photos) would be too much for all concerned.
   
3. Openly mocked others due to their nationality.
   

 

None of this has anything to do with any Cruise Critic topic, it's clearly just personal. I'm all for robust debate, but when some have reduced themselves to name calling and mocking people based on their nationality, they might want to take a good long hard look at themselves.

 

And whilst they are doing that, here's a starting point for the gentlemen that love to chat about me - ask yourselves why two grown men seem to love chasing a younger man around on here, endlessly talking about him.

 

Strangely, one the most repetitive posters on any Cunard dress-code thread is someone who's repeatedly said they have no intention/are unlikely to ever sail with Cunard again - Bazzaw - whose contributions seem to revolve around calling people names and insulting people based on the amount of money they have. I didn't realise that the reason Cunard changed it's dress code was to broaden it's clientele base away from "middle class wannabes with a yearning for nostalgia" that (apparently) currently fill its ships - well according to Bazzaw anyway.

[Whitemarsh]

Oh, and to everyone who posted a supportive message in relation to me:

 

 

:):):)

[Pushka]

I agree that the dress code warning is ambiguous. I think that its difficult for companies to balance telling people how to dress, potentially coming across as dictatorial in nature, versus making suggestions and trusting people to understand the meaning.

 

Slightly off topic but we are currently staying in a Club suite in Intercontinental in Bali which specifically states on its website, an entitlement to an Adults only pool. However the board next to the pool says something like "we trust our guests with children will respect the tranquility of this pool and will be more comfortable in the pools designed for children." Well, of course that depends on the respect that others have. It means there have been loud, noisy splashing children and even babies in nappies in the Adults only pool. One day was dreadful.

 

Now, we have travelled with our now grown up children and we would never have subjected other adults to their excited play in an adults only area. Sadly, this generation really couldn't give a damn.

 

One European man makes it a point to stand in front of families and glare at them. We are good friends. We heard him complain vigorously to management. But nothing changed.

[CountessOz]

Here here Louise D. I could not agree more.

[balf]

"]gentlemen that love to chat about me[/url] - ask yourselves why two grown men seem to love chasing a younger man around on here, endlessly talking about him.

 

.

 

Whitemarsh, it's all about you, that's the problem, even to the big red thank you. And I am sure I am not the only one to discover (very recently) that you are male and only now that you are "younger" though why that would make any difference I don't know.

 

David.

[123sealordfalkland]

Portholepete

 

Yes -- funny story.. I did not really understand the bit about "you did not stand up" -- with my limited understanding and knowledge of Aussie women (as I am a man) that does not sound to me like anything an Aussie woman would ever say, except in jest -and jesting is something that ALL Aussies do all the time. :) Well - at least Aussies as I understand them.

 

As regards the moving to empty seats :) -- SO! -- that still happens. :) It's wonderful to see old traditions maintained over the years.

 

I was first introduced to Opera over 30 years ago. At that time , I wasn't exactly a student -- but let us just say that my financial resources were restricted :) At that time, the Sydney Opera House used to sell last minute, standing - room only tickets for $5. There used to be a BIG queue up the stairs to the ticket office of people wishing to avail themselves of this. I spent a lot of hours in that queue over the years. I have seen Dame Joan Sutherland many times in the standing position :) Of course, even then, there were the "watchers" -- these were standing patrons who would spy out unoccupied seats during the first act -- and then!>>>>>> :) Oh, for the good old days !

 

Like Portholepete I, too, rather read than post on this forum but I think I may have some (un)helpful insight for our Antipodean cousins. I take it the remark about having limited knowledge of Aussie women isn't meant to suggest they have no class or manners or style! This women encountered by portholepete and his lady obviously had heard of things some gentlemen do out of politeness or she wouldn't have made the remark "you didn't stand up!" She may not have been a picture of sartorial elegance but knew that in some circles gentlemen, especially when in evening attire, stand up when a lady approaches a seat next to him. Just like gentlemen do at dinner on cruise ships even in the MDR and not only on formal nights . In fact when we cruise we always like to be seated at a table for 8. That way the conversation doesn't dry up after a week or two. If I happen to be at the table first then when the other passengers on the table arrive I stand up as a matter or courtesy. If a lady on the table leaves to go and powder her nose then I'll stand when I see she is about to get out of her seat and stand up again when she returns. It's just something that one has been brought up to do. Not a question of money, wealth or rank just plain good manners. I hope this helps.

[Whitemarsh]

Whitemarsh, it's all about you, that's the problem, even to the big red thank you. And I am sure I am not the only one to discover (very recently) that you are male and only now that you are "younger" though why that would make any difference I don't know.

 

David.

 

Oh really? Actually, that's not true, you've always known that I'm a man. Here's the proof.

[balf]

. If a lady on the table leaves to go and powder her nose then I'll stand when I see she is about to get out of her seat and stand up again when she returns. It's just something that one has been brought up to do. Not a question of money, wealth or rank just plain good manners. I hope this helps.

 

You are obviously, like me, from another world that does not exist anymore. However I think most women would be mildly embaraced if this was done at table these days. Women no longer need or expect different treatment in these days of euality.

 

Customs (and dress codes) change and we need to change as well.

 

David.

[CountessOz]

I believe a real man has manners. That is the difference between a male and a man. The same applies for a lady rather than a woman. Good manners shows good breading and it does not have any relationship to wealth or status in life. I have 3 sons and they would do the same for their wives and any other lady. This includes walking on the outside of the footpath.

[missfrankiecat]

 

You are obviously, like me, from another world that does not exist anymore. However I think most women would be mildly embaraced if this was done at table these days. Women no longer need or expect different treatment in these days of euality.

 

Customs (and dress codes) change and we need to change as well.

 

David.

 

I think there is a difference between what we 'expect' and what we 'appreciate'. It is now relatively unusual for men to stand when a woman arrives at or leaves table but I am never remotely embarrassed when one does so and appreciate that the gesture is one of respect. I do think the - apparently very commonly held - belief that male good manners will be interpreted hostilely by women is mistaken (or sometimes a cop-out?) I am thankful as a woman to live in an age and society that recognises I should be paid the same wage for doing the same job as a man, for example, and have the same opportunities but that doesn't mean that courtesies are 'sexist'.

[Louise D]

You know, I'm not sure, but I did ask about marriage status a little time ago and didn't really get very far.

 

Ah well Ausi is a long way away.

 

David.

 

So you are repeating your proposal? I thought you were rebuffed the first time.

[MadScientist_01]

So, LoeyCruiser, I hope that answered your question :D