HAL Ryndam insult to British & American passengers

[cbr663]

It is most unfortunate that HAL did not adequately respond to your feedback on your cruise. I know that when I take the time to provide HAL with feedback that I do expect a complete response that addresses all my concerns. This is, IMO, poor customer service.

[chrispb]

My wife and I sailed with Holland America Line (HAL) MS Ryndam to the Norwegian Fjords on 31st May 2014. The Captain had already told us that 70% of the passengers were British and the remainder were mainly American's or Canadian's. On Friday 6th June the theme in the main dining room was International Around the World and each table had a flag setting. I asked the waiter where the Union Flag was as we were 5 British people but he just shrugged. My friend & I checked the upper level of the dining room and could find only 1 Union Flag & 1 American flag so I complained to the person in charge of the upper level. I asked him if he knew the relevance of the day and he said it was the 70th anniversary of D-Day. I told him that I felt insulted that in the pre-dinner announcements no mention was made of the anniversary and that the Union flag was represented on only 1 table. The response I got was that he would pass on my comments. I e-mailed HAL with my complaints and have had a response but with no mention of my complaint re-lack of Union flags & D-day.

 

I know other passengers were suitable disgusted at Ryndam's apparent inability to amend the normal Around the World night to recognise such an important Anniversary relevant to the overwhelming majority of it's passengers.

 

It is interesting to note that the captain of the Ryndam is British although he now lives in the USA.

 

NB I would have written quite a good review of Ryndam (excluding dreadful organisation on outside decks & in the Lido alternative dining area) if it had not been for their totally unacceptable response to my criticisma of their treatment of 70th Anniversary of D-Day

 

I, too, think you are overreacting. If the theme in the dining room was International Around the World, I'm not sure why you permitted yourself to be offended. If you were cruising the France and the Normandy beaches then I expect there would have been recognition of D Day and flags of all Allies involved.

 

Would you have been offended if you happened to be cruising in Alaska or Panama Canal and D Day wasn't acknowledged?

[lazey1]

You take a cruise on the lovely Ryndam, through gorgeous Norway, and this is your takeaway?

You have blown the lack of specific flags all out of proportion.

 

Ruth, as usual you have hit the nail on the head.

 

OP, "International" means far more than just British and American. One flag for each country seems quite appropiate.

Edited June 15, 2014 by lazey1

[SeaBands]

we just went to another table and asked if we could change a flag as our grand kids grew up in NZ. No one seemed to have a problem. Thinking only the allied flags should be placed that evening is pretty jingoistic.

I visited the Arizona a few years ago and was upset that there was so many Japanese on the vessel. When they threw their flowers into the water I felT ashamed that I was so upset seeing them. Many of us have memories of WW2 and that's what they are, MEMORIES.Not all the world is American or British.

Edited June 15, 2014 by SeaBands

[IRL_Joanie]

we just went to another table and asked if we could change a flag as our grand kids grew up in NZ. No one seemed to have a problem. Thinking only the allied flags should be placed that evening is pretty jingoistic.

I visited the Arizona a few years ago and was upset that there was so many Japanese on the vessel. When they threw their flowers into the water I felT ashamed that I was so upset seeing them. Many of us have memories of WW2 and that's what they are, MEMORIES.Not all the world is American or British.

 

Joanie

Edited June 15, 2014 by IRL_Joanie

[Sam.Seattle]

You take a cruise on the lovely Ryndam, through gorgeous Norway, and this is your takeaway?

You have blown the lack of specific flags all out of proportion.

 

He has NOT blown anything out of porportion. We each have the right to state what we think is important and we also have the right to say nothing when someone is sharing their thoughts.

 

It is important to remember and remember with accuracy and respect.

 

In April and May 1944, the Allied air forces lost nearly 12,000 men and over 2,000 aircraft in operations which paved the way for D-Day.

 

The Allied casualties figures for D-Day have generally been estimated at 10,000, including 2,500 dead. Broken down by nationality, the usual D-Day casualty figures are approximately 2,,700 British, 946 Canadians, and 6,603 Americans. However recent painstaking research by the US National D-Day Memorial Foundation has achieved a more accurate - and much higher - figure for the Allied personnel who were killed on D-Day. They have recorded the names of individual Allied personnel killed on 6 June 1944 in Operation Overlord, and so far they have verified 2,499 American D-Day fatalities and 1,914 from the other Allied nations, a total of 4,413 dead (much higher than the traditional figure of 2,500 dead). Further research may mean that these numbers will increase slightly in future. The details of this research will in due course be available on the Foundation's website at http://www.dday.org. This new research means that the casualty figures given for individual units in the next few paragraphs are no doubt inaccurate, and hopefully more accurate figures will one day be calculated.

Edited June 15, 2014 by Sam.Seattle

[Mytime2014]

OP i respect your opinion, but as you knew when boarding your ship what day D-Day fell on and since you are so strongly moved by the day, why didn't you take an opportunity to speak to the cruise director or whomever would be appropriate and remind them that it is an important day. Or did you not realize International Dinner was part of your cruise - what a great opportunity for you to actively memorialize that day by bringing the focus of the staff to the Day.

 

I will admit to forgetting which date those very important memorials fall on - I forget what day of the week it is sometimes. But I never fail to try to honor those who have served in the military - on the street, on the phone [my patient base includes a lot of veterans], and I support/pray for our active troops. If I wasn't on FB I would probably have missed D-Day as the day, but am moved to tears when I read accounts, memorials, and speeches from great leaders in the past. [not so much the current ones]

 

I also served post Viet Nam. My honor is in my heart.

[TraelorMex]

There is a huge difference between an insult and an oversight.

 

This was not an insult.

 

There is a huge difference between a mountain and a molehill.;)

[Vict0riann]

When we've had an International Dinner, there have usually been two or three flags on the table, if I remember rightly. Don't you think that possibly those British, American and Canadian flags might have been "acquired" by previous passengers who helped themselves to the table decorations?

[SilvertoGold]

You take a cruise on the lovely Ryndam, through gorgeous Norway, and this is your takeaway?

You have blown the lack of specific flags all out of proportion.

 

Yes, I agree.

This says it all, simply and politely.

[luddite]

Yes, I agree.

This says it all, simply and politely.

 

This.

[kazu]

Is all this negative feedback at the OP really necessary?

 

This one voice is done reading this thread....

 

Because people disagree does not mean that it is negative feedback.

 

They just don't happen to think the same way. It's opinions and everyone is entitled to one.

 

You don't have to like them or agree, but everyone is entitled to express theirs just as you have yours;)

[solocanadian]

When we've had an International Dinner, there have usually been two or three flags on the table, if I remember rightly. Don't you think that possibly those British, American and Canadian flags might have been "acquired" by previous passengers who helped themselves to the table decorations?

I think not Anne. At The International dinner I attended on May 17/14 I was hard pressed to see more than one Canadian flag. Really don't think they have that many. I don't believe the passengers pinch them. The second week of my cruise I did not attend the ID. Went to Canaletto. Really don't care for the menu. I prefer to say my fond farewell the night before and go to Pinnacle or Canaletto.

[SilvertoGold]

I think not Anne. At The International dinner I attended on May 17/14 I was hard pressed to see more than one Canadian flag. Really don't think they have that many. I don't believe the passengers pinch them. The second week of my cruise I did not attend the ID. Went to Canaletto. Really don't care for the menu. I prefer to say my fond farewell the night before and go to Pinnacle or Canaletto.

 

I've never seen many Canadian flags around the DR on International night.

 

On the last cruise I said, jokingly, "but we're Canadians". The waiters laughed and shrugged.

We heard the table behind us demand a South African flag. The poor waiters had to go find one.

It is always sort of interesting to try to identify the flags.

[Vict0riann]

Well, be that as it may, with the number of tables in the dining room, and at least 3 flags on each table, there must be more than one Union Jack on board! We need POA to do the math!:D

 

[cruz chic]

I've never seen many Canadian flags around the DR on International night.

 

On the last cruise I said, jokingly, "but we're Canadians". The waiters laughed and shrugged.

We heard the table behind us demand a South African flag. The poor waiters had to go find one.

It is always sort of interesting to try to identify the flags.

 

I feel sorry for the waiters when people go overboard with something like that. Wow, life is too short to get so bent about something so small.

[babyher]

I've never seen many Canadian flags around the DR on International night.

 

On the last cruise I said, jokingly, "but we're Canadians". The waiters laughed and shrugged.

We heard the table behind us demand a South African flag. The poor waiters had to go find one.

It is always sort of interesting to try to identify the flags.

 

 

 

 

Why I would last 5 minutes as a waiter. Everything else I had to do, I have to go hunt down flags.

[kazu]

I feel sorry for the waiters when people go overboard with something like that. Wow, life is too short to get so bent about something so small.

 

I agree. To be clear, we didn't ask for ours. The assistant dining room manager knew and was "fixing" things.

[sun~]

If you were to pay a visit to Juno Beach and the nearby Canadian cemetery you would feel a connection that would move you to tears. We did and we were. Last year.

 

It is something we have talked to our sons about. It would be an excellent learning experience.

[CowPrincess]

Why I would last 5 minutes as a waiter. Everything else I had to do, I have to go hunt down flags.

 

You would be a better waiter than I would -- never mind looking for flags -- I'd be looking for an axe ;)

[babyher]

You would be a better waiter than I would -- never mind looking for flags -- I'd be looking for an axe ;)

 

*LOL*

 

 

 

My DD waitresses a few years while in school. She would come home with some stories . Some people are just an assault charge waiting to happen. *LOL*

[summersigh]

What was being done on other ships and cruiselines? What was being done at hotels,resorts etc?

 

While at home we recognized the anniversary date and sacrifices made, and honored those soldiers and families. If I were somewhere else like on the ship, I would probably not react angrily and be insulted, but privately and/or at my table, talk about the event and offer words of respect. No need for ceremony.

 

I think that night was a scheduled dinner theme as on every cruise. Just landed on the D Day date. So I wouldn't feel insulted.

 

I have to agree. A comment made along with the daily announcements might have been nice but I would not have expected more.

My dad (now 87 years old) quit high school to serve in WW2 on an aircraft carrier. I honor the day by honoring him and say a prayer for all those other brave veterans - no matter what country of origin - that served to protect our freedoms.

[PathfinderEss]

You would be a better waiter than I would -- never mind looking for flags -- I'd be looking for an axe ;)

I'd be looking for more then an axe.......:D:D:D

[Copper10-8]

Well, be that as it may, with the number of tables in the dining room, and at least 3 flags on each table, there must be more than one Union Jack on board! We need POA to do the math!:D

 

 

Argentina and Peru ;)

[Vict0riann]

Argentina and Peru ;)

 

Care to take a guess on the two that are hiding? :D