RCI ships to follow Celebrity Century?

[MattInFLL]

I just read another article that confirmed my thoughts - Royal has a memorandum of understanding with Ctrip to manage the operations of Century after it is sold, and that they are looking at a broader joint venture with Ctrip in China. This is by no means a straight sale of the ship.

 

If they do start a joint venture for a new Chinese brand, they could do newbuilds like they are doing in Europe, not just move a Vision class ship (or two) over. Seems hard to believe that after bringing Quantum over to a homebase in China, they think they could have another brand in the market with lots of older ships without such amazing amenities.

 

But all of this is all speculation at this point.

[north29]

From what I know, could be wrong, and I do think it was on this board, but RCL does not own the ships they sail, such as the Oasis. The ships are owned by other large investment groups, some place in the world. RC just manages them.

[Clarea]

From what I know, could be wrong, and I do think it was on this board, but RCL does not own the ships they sail, such as the Oasis. The ships are owned by other large investment groups, some place in the world. RC just manages them.

I believe Royal owns their ships. They may use holding companies (such as with Brilliance) for some of the operating companies, but I'm pretty sure they ultimately own the ships. Not being an accountant, I'm probably not using the right terminology, but their annual report sure shows a bunch of debt related to ship purchases.

[Eng23]

That would be something. Spin off an entire class of ship. May not be all at once but probably not far off that. I give the Vision class 5-7 years before they are all gone.

 

 

 

It will be interesting to see what direction RCI takes with it's next class of ships.

 

 

 

Will it be large - somewhere between Freedom and Oasis or will it be more along the size of the Radiance but with some of the newer features yet designed more for the ports.

 

 

The next class of ships is already here. Quantum Class ship due this year and next. Bigger than Freedom but smaller than Oasis.

 

 

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Edited September 3, 2014 by Eng23

[Ken at the beach]

The next class of ships is already here. Quantum Class ship due this year and next. Bigger than Freedom but smaller than Oasis.

 

 

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Sorry, was referring to after the Quantum class.

[Ken at the beach]

I believe Royal owns their ships. They may use holding companies (such as with Brilliance) for some of the operating companies, but I'm pretty sure they ultimately own the ships. Not being an accountant, I'm probably not using the right terminology, but their annual report sure shows a bunch of debt related to ship purchases.

 

Brilliance is the only ship (at least for RCI) that I am aware of that they have a strange set up for. I believe that it was initially set up separately due to tax implications sailing from the UK but not 100% sure. There was quite a lengthy and wordy passage on it in the annual report.

[kwazi07]

I would not want the Vision class to leave but I highly see it happening. On the speculation of a new Radiance Class type ship, I wonder if a smaller version of the new Mille project is possible. They could have a lower pool then maybe something like Central Park or Boardwalk at the top. Even something like the X lawn club would be cool.

 

http://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-magazine/feature-magazine-articles/67-articles/9453.html

 

The Radiance and Vision classes are great. There are so many beautiful views. It is a shame that many new builds are so inward facing.

 

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Edited September 3, 2014 by kwazi07

[kwazi07]

MSC seems to be toying with the idea as well:

http://www.cruiseind.com/2014/05/22/msc-orders-fincantieris-project-mille-prototype/

 

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[nelblu]

In reading the article Royal is taking a $20 million non cash loss.

Can't see how this is nice chunk of cash ?

 

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I don't understand the loss as these older ships probably have been fully depreciated, therefore, 0 asset balance on their balance sheet.

[Eng23]

Sorry, was referring to after the Quantum class.

Gotcha. :)

[MattInFLL]

There are only so many ports than can handle an Oasis sized ship and Quantum class is still pretty darn big, so you would think there is room for a Radiance+plus size ship. If there's an optimum number of passengers in a space with an optimum number of venues that bring in extra revenue, it could make business sense to them.

 

That Fincantieri design that MSC ordered is interesting, although I doubt Royal is going to do business with Fincantieri :)

[The Big Booper]

I don't understand the loss as these older ships probably have been fully depreciated, therefore, 0 asset balance on their balance sheet.

 

Celebrity did extensive renovations on this ship several years ago. Per GAAP, this cost is capitalized and written off over a set number of years via a yearly depreciation charge against income. The non-cash loss probably arises from the remaining balance of the improvements not yet depreciated.

[dancinman66]

The next class of ships is already here. Quantum Class ship due this year and next. Bigger than Freedom but smaller than Oasis.

 

 

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I think they were meaning next after quantum as whole vision fleet is soon for replacement

 

 

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[Cuizer2]

RCCL just announced the sale of the Celebrity Century to a group that will sail in the Chinese market. Rumours according to this article are that another ship or two could follow. Speculation on the Celebrity board that it could be Legend or Splendor.

 

http://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/11515.html

 

I would expect that the Majesty would be the next to go.

[MattInFLL]

Everyone who sails on Majesty regularly (crew and pax) think otherwise. She was supposed to go to Pullmantur, but many are convinced she is with us into at least 2017. A ship of her age, with the tiny cabins, in a market with a Quantum class and good competition from other cruise lines looking to get into the Chinese market - I just don't see her being competitive there. If they turn around Pullmantur, she works there, with her sister ships.

[3dog]

It is a wonder where all these large ships will go, as there are so many ports that cannot accommodate them.

 

Ports are adjusting, so there are more ports than you might think that can handle these large ships. Both Oasis and Allure are doing some decent Mediterranean itineraries out of Barcelona that didn't require serious changes to the ports (and none being tendered ports).

 

As the mega ship becomes common, the ports will need to update or be left behind.

[3dog]

I agree but it seems all the lines new builds are going that way except for like if seaborne Oceania. Crystal etc

Pity as those small ship ports are the ones I like.

 

There may be hope. TUI cruises the joint venture between the German tourist firm TUI AG and RCCL is currently in the process of building a number of new ships that are all about 99,000 tons which puts them at slightly larger than the Radiance class.

 

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/TUI_Cruises

 

It's just my opinion, but the major lines are just not going to build anything smaller than 3000 pax (maybe not even smaller than 4000 pax), as they are more financially productive than the smaller ship. Small/minor lines will as they are either trying to fit a specific niche or only have the resources to build the smaller ships.

 

If you like small new ships, you will likely eventually need to migrate to these smaller (and in some cases more expensive) lines.

[0ldog]

It will be sad to see this ship retire from Celebrity's fleet. It was the first and almost the last cruise ship I was on. We had booked her for our honeymoon and it was the end of August 2002. We were at early seating in the dining room when the ship started to list. I felt this funny sensation like I was starting to tip, I looked down at my glass and the water was starting to pour out of it. The ship strated to correct itself, came level and then listed even further. Now things were starting to slide off the tables, our waiter was hugging a large stand holding a serving bowl of some description. Things were crashing to the floor all over the ship. Perfumes and booze tumbled off the shelves in the street of shops. Broken souvenir glassware covered the floor like it was ice. Then as quickly as it started, the ship righted itself.

 

Everywhere the ship was a mess. In the holds where cargo was no longer strapped down everything imaginable was piled on the floor. To the crews credit next morning the ship was once more immaculate. It was as if last night never happened. Something wrong with the rudder, we were told.... RIGHT.

[RSLeesburg]

It's just my opinion, but the major lines are just not going to build anything smaller than 3000 pax (maybe not even smaller than 4000 pax), as they are more financially productive than the smaller ship. Small/minor lines will as they are either trying to fit a specific niche or only have the resources to build the smaller ships.

 

 

 

If you like small new ships, you will likely eventually need to migrate to these smaller (and in some cases more expensive) lines.

 

 

Although with all the consolidation, the smaller lines are now almost all owned by the bigger lines, so you have to wonder if those ships will start to increase in size too. Instead of 700-1000 passenger ships, they grown to 1800-2000 passenger ships.

 

 

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[Biker19]

It's just my opinion, but the major lines are just not going to build anything smaller than 3000 pax (maybe not even smaller than 4000 pax), as they are more financially productive than the smaller ship. Small/minor lines will as they are either trying to fit a specific niche or only have the resources to build the smaller ships.

 

If you like small new ships, you will likely eventually need to migrate to these smaller (and in some cases more expensive) lines.

+1, and for RCI they'll look like the Solstice class ships (as evidenced in the Quantum class). Both RCI and Celebrity have ships approaching the end of their usefull life and I can see a common 3000pax model between the two (like a Ford and Lincoln model off the same platform).:cool:

[3dog]

Although with all the consolidation, the smaller lines are now almost all owned by the bigger lines, so you have to wonder if those ships will start to increase in size too. Instead of 700-1000 passenger ships, they grown to 1800-2000 passenger ships.

 

Indeed, there is a lot of consolidation going on. But the observation I take from this comment is that it does appear that everyone is building bigger ships, even those known for their small ships. Seven Seas next ship is larger than all of their previous, and even Viking's launch into ocean cruises are pretty large by the standards of the last century. The 50,000 ton ship - once very large - are the effectively the smallest being built.