Viking Bonds highly speculative; how do you protect your vacation?

[JVilleGal]

The topic is "...how do you protect your vacation?" Being in line with other creditors in a bankruptcy proceeding does't leave me feeling protected or comfortable.

 

 

Ditto, which is why you want to insure your trip but NEVER with Travel Insurance purchased thru your cruise line.... Outside vendor and must be purchased within a very specific (most companies 14 days) from initial deposit. Lots of rules regarding this so be sure and ask!

[biker1972]

The insurance either from the cruise line or an outside vendor can be purchased almost up to the day you leave. The 14 day requirement is so that pre-existing conditions will be covered. Generally purchase should take place before final payment to protect against cancellation penalties that kick in around 90 days prior to the start of the trip.

 

I have personal experience through a broken arm and the required surgery that went with it about 3 weeks prior to an Alaskan cruise. My doctor felt that missing 3 weeks rehabilitation therapy while on the cruise would not be wise. Insurance paid everything, including air, except for the insurance policy cost. :D

[No Spin]

The topic is "...how do you protect your vacation?" Being in line with other creditors in a bankruptcy proceeding does't leave me feeling protected or comfortable.

 

OK, but I was answering your question to me as to which lines sell insurance.

 

No disagreement that you take a risk with a company that self-insures, but UniWorld does indeed sell insurance. They call it "protection", most likely to get around state insurance laws, except in NY apparently.

[Host Jazzbeau]

The insurance either from the cruise line or an outside vendor can be purchased almost up to the day you leave. The 14 day requirement is so that pre-existing conditions will be covered.

 

My Allianz policy clearly states that financial default coverage is only available if the policy is purchased within 14-days of the initial deposit:

Financial Default

of a tour operator, airline or cruise line provided that:

a. On the Policy effective date, the tour operator, airline or cruise line was approved for the Financial Default coverage by the Company. For a current list of approved suppliers refer to

http://www.allianztravelinsurance.com

or call 1-800- 284-8300; and

b.

The insurance was purchased within 14 calendar days of the initial Trip deposit or payment

.

[biker1972]

Jazz, you might think of possible default as a pre-existing condition of the cruise line or travel agency. If a company is going under there are certainly people who know this. They may not broadcast this to outsiders and they may "cook" the books so that investors or insurance companies don't know what is going on. This is one of the reasons insurance that covers default is not offered to people using suspect lines or agencies. (See ABC Travel Club) If your can't get default insurance on your line of choice it might be wise to take it off your list. ;)

[Host Jazzbeau]

Jazz, you might think of possible default as a pre-existing condition of the cruise line or travel agency. If a company is going under there are certainly people who know this. They may not broadcast this to outsiders and they may "cook" the books so that investors or insurance companies don't know what is going on. This is one of the reasons insurance that covers default is not offered to people using suspect lines or agencies. (See ABC Travel Club) If your can't get default insurance on your line of choice it might be wise to take it off your list. ;)

 

I agree, and am happy that even though I bought the river cruise insurance through AMA (and so don't actually have supplier default coverage) they are listed as one of the eligible providers for Allianz -- I hope you are right that that means Allianz has assurance of AMA's good financial standing!

[TravelerThom]

This has been an interesting thread. I never realized that insurers have companies that they will and will not cover, but that certainly makes sense. Always good to learn these things.

 

Actually I have NOT been getting trip insurance:eek:, for the following reasons that apply to me (and certainly don't apply to many people):

 

1) I am in good health

2) I have no parents or children who might need me suddenly

3) I usually grab last minute deals (I did GCCL Bordeaux last month; purchased 13 days before the trip started)

4) I pay by credit card, and can get a refund since I am booking close in (and my AARP credit card gives me a 3% rebate on travel:))

5) I have good health insurance, and have a substantial annual policy covering medical evacuation

 

When I get older and less healthy I will reconsider getting trip insurance, but doing maybe 10 trips a year I would have spent thousands of dollars on insurance and never had a claim. Sure, there is a chance that I'll get burned one day, but those thousands that I have not spent would more than cover most eventualities. YMMV

 

Thom

[biker1972]

TravelerThom, I work in management for a quick service restaurant company. I was 3 weeks away from an Alaskan cruise and thus in the 100% penalty range. Well over $10,000 had been spent. I fell at work and broke my arm which required surgery. My doctor thought it best not to go. I lost the insurance premium of $618 but got back the other monies in entirety because I had insurance! Perhaps you can afford to lose $10,000, but I could not. This is the reason I purchase insurance. Generally it runs about 6% of the overall cost of a trip. That 6% covers unknown events both before and during my trips. A small price that would take 16 trips with no insurance to recover the $10,000 I would have lost.

[biker1972]

Careful reading of the Moody's rating for MISA's B1CFR bonds says that it was for an additional $300 million be added to $250 million 8.5 % senior unsecured notes. These notes are creating capital to start a joint venture and build two boats to cruise the Mississippi with Viking holding 25% ownership of the JV. These bonds have nothing to do with operations of Viking River Cruises. Moody's notes that Viking maintains a $515 million cash balance and Viking continues to increase this cash balance. The Moody's rating is for these notes only and not a reflection of Viking's financial stability.

Edited June 10, 2015 by biker1972
spelling

[TravelerThom]

TravelerThom, I work in management for a quick service restaurant company. I was 3 weeks away from an Alaskan cruise and thus in the 100% penalty range. Well over $10,000 had been spent. I fell at work and broke my arm which required surgery. My doctor thought it best not to go. I lost the insurance premium of $618 but got back the other monies in entirety because I had insurance! Perhaps you can afford to lose $10,000, but I could not. This is the reason I purchase insurance. Generally it runs about 6% of the overall cost of a trip. That 6% covers unknown events both before and during my trips. A small price that would take 16 trips with no insurance to recover the $10,000 I would have lost.

I readily acknowledge that what appears good for me does not apply to many people. For the last five years we have averaged about 12 weeks a year of cruises (both ocean and river), and for the 7 years prior to that we cruised about 4 weeks a year. Admittedly there is a lot of variation in prices for the various cruises, but if assumed an average price per week and multiplied that ($ per week)(.06)(12 weeks/year)(5 years) plus ($ per week)(.06)(4 weeks/year)(7 years) I have saved enough not buying insurance to pay for over 5 weeks of cruises, and all through that time, not once would we have collected. Basically I am looking at the odds and figure that FOR ME self insuring makes sense.

 

Thom

 

PS you would be correct if you assumed that we both retired a little over 12 years ago:)

[biker1972]

Thom: yes, I agree, with that kind of travel experience and time, you are ahead by not getting insurance. You are spreading the risk over multiple trips while I spread the risk by joining a large group and paying a fee. :)

[Host Jazzbeau]

I can understand your approach, but to me you are particularly in need of a medical evacuation policy. You can get a Medjet family plan through AARP for less than $300 a year (would cover all your trips). That would allow you to minimize out of pocket medical expenses by flying back to the US where your regular health insurance would apply.

Edited June 11, 2015 by Host Jazzbeau

[Mark_T]

I can understand your approach, but to me you are particularly in need of a medical evacuation policy

 

I think he may already have that:

 

5) I have good health insurance, and have a substantial annual policy covering medical evacuation

[TravelerThom]

Careful reading of the Moody's rating for MISA's B1CFR bonds says that it was for an additional $300 million be added to $250 million 8.5 % senior unsecured notes. These notes are creating capital to start a joint venture and build two boats to cruise the Mississippi with Viking holding 25% ownership of the JV. These bonds have nothing to do with operations of Viking River Cruises. Moody's notes that Viking maintains a $515 million cash balance and Viking continues to increase this cash balance. The Moody's rating is for these notes only and not a reflection of Viking's financial stability.

Perhaps I read too much into that bond rating, and Viking River has safely shielded themselves from liability if the JV turns bad. In Viking River's favor I see that Allianz will write default insurance on Viking, and I certainly hope that Allianz has looked into Viking's finances better than I have:rolleyes: Another river cruise line that I have used eight times is Grand Circle Cruise Line - and Allanz does NOT list them as coverable (which I think is a red flag). Fortunately the recent trips I have taken on GCCL have been "Last Minute Deals" in a short enough time that my credit card company would give me a refund in case of default.

 

Thom