Ship Size Versus"Feeling Crowded"

[tkportersat]

The older I get, the less I like crowds...so I find ways to avoid them. I avoid the buffet and eat breakfast in the Dining room. I don't feel the need to be on the Lido deck and head to Serenity/Lanai or back of the ship. If I really need to get away I go relax on my balcony. There is usually one port I skip now so I can spend a day on the ship enjoying things without lines and the hassle of getting on/off ship with everyone else.

[tandemcruzr]

Anybody know a site that posts square-feet-per-passenger?

 

It's cruisedeckplans dot com. It shows the Space Ratio which is Gross Tons divided by Maximum Passenger count.

 

For example, for the Breeze it's 130,000 tons divided by 4,428 max passenger which gives you 29.

 

The higher the number is better.

[stevenr597]

In most cases it comes down to the number of square feet allotted to each passenger. Blogs such as Cruise Ships.com tend to give this information out. Carnival tends to have the most passengers/square foot meaning that they will most often be the most crowded. Celebrity is generally the most spacious. Interesting note: The Mega Ships such as Allure and Oasis are, surprise, are not nearly as crowded as Carnival. However, these ships have a great habit of steering the passengers to pay as you go events.

[Tapi]

However, these ships have a great habit of steering the passengers to pay as you go events.

 

 

Can you provide examples of how they steer people to pay events?

[jimbo5544]

Not surprisingly, the Spirit class is a Holland America design. But I'm a bit confused about your statement. I did look at the various tables and the only cruise that line that didn't have any ships with a PSR higher than the Spirit class was NCL (well, and Costa. But Costa ships are basically Carnival ships with a yellow funnel). Otherwise, all other cruise lines mentioned have several ships (sometimes the entire fleet) with a better PSR, ranging from 35 to 41.

 

 

There are a lot here who would argue that the Spirit class feel the most uncrowded (me among them). Just more backup to what PSR really means (or does not mean). Not sure, but did HAL come up with the Spirit class (the call it something else I think) before Carnival? I know they are based on the same, and it is a trivial point. Also, I think the Spirit class ships are the only Carnival (at least Fantasy and above) that were not built by Fincantieri but instead a Finnish ship yard. Are HAL ships built there (I don't think so but don't know).

[skyeman27]

. However, these ships have a great habit of steering the passengers to pay as you go events.

Steer me? How! They couldn't steer me to the Last Supper if it was possible...

[Heirloom]

Not surprisingly, the Spirit class is a Holland America design. But I'm a bit confused about your statement. I did look at the various tables and the only cruise that line that didn't have any ships with a PSR higher than the Spirit class was NCL (well, and Costa. But Costa ships are basically Carnival ships with a yellow funnel). Otherwise, all other cruise lines mentioned have several ships (sometimes the entire fleet) with a better PSR, ranging from 35 to 41.

 

 

Huh ?

 

All Spirit are 41. ( Higher than 95% of all others. And higher than all of Carnival/RC/NCL/Holland/Disney/Celebrity/Princess and others).

[Tapi]

Huh ?

 

 

 

All Spirit are 41. ( Higher than 95% of all others. And higher than all of Carnival/RC/NCL/Holland/Disney/Celebrity/Princess and others).

 

 

Hmmm. the Spirit shows a PSR of 34, but I now realize that it's based on max occupancy. At the same time, Disney Magic is showing a PSR of 34 on the same chart, but upon doing the math it's also at max occupancy. At double occupancy, the Spirit has a PSR of 41 and the Magic has a PSR of 47. [emoji848]

[Tapi]

Not sure, but did HAL come up with the Spirit class (the call it something else I think) before Carnival? I know they are based on the same, and it is a trivial point.

 

 

The design was conceived for Holland America as the Vista class in the late 1990's while Holland was still receiving deliveries of their Rotterdam class ships (last one to be delivered in 2000). The first Vista class ship was slated for delivery in 2002.

 

Carnival was looking at a new class of ship that would have some of the amenities found on their Destiny/Triumph design (like balconies) but that would be small enough to fit through the Panama Canal and with a higher max speed that would give it more flexibility. This would allow Carnival to move ships from the east to west coast easily and tap into markets like Alaska.

 

However, the first Spirit class ship was delivered two years before the first Vista class ship was delivered (at the time, HAL was still receiving Rotterdam class ships). Costa also took delivery of its first Atlantica class ship that same year (also derived from the same design).

[idlenote]

If you are doing a cruise longer than seven days the Spirit ships really shine. If you want somewhere quiet, doesn't matter whether inside or outside you can always find it.

 

I think a lot of the crowded feeling on many of the other ships is for two reasons:

 

1) Every time they "update" them, they put the Guys garbage shack and the blue iguana burrito bar right in front of the forward entrance doors to the lido buffet creating a huge choke point. After you've fought your way through there a time or two you know the ship is crowded and nothing will convince you otherwise. Heaven help us if there ever was a major problem and they needed to move a lot of people quickly through that area.

 

2) The photo department and their perpetual logjam. Doesn't matter whether they are inside on Deck 3 or 5 or merely impeding the flow off the gangway, they slow everything to a crawl and, once again, contribute to the feeling of being crowded. You know, I can almost see the photographers taking pictures as the lifeboats are being loaded.

 

Just took a cruise on a Conquest class ship for the first time in a while and really enjoyed it, and will be bringing another one back to Galveston in a couple of weeks. Going to be really nice having those two ships so close. Just feel sorry for the folks in New Orleans when they see the Triumph.

Edited February 18, 2016 by idlenote
spelling

[k2excursion]

If you are doing a cruise longer than seven days the Spirit ships really shine. If you want somewhere quiet, doesn't matter whether inside or outside you can always find it.

 

I think a lot of the crowded feeling on many of the other ships is for two reasons:

 

1) Every time they "update" them, they put the Guys garbage shack and the blue iguana burrito bar right in front of the forward entrance doors to the lido buffet creating a huge choke point. After you've fought your way through there a time or two you know the ship is crowded and nothing will convince you otherwise. Heaven help us if there ever was a major problem and they needed to move a lot of people quickly through that area.

 

2) The photo department and their perpetual logjam. Doesn't matter whether they are inside on Deck 3 or 5 or merely impeding the flow off the gangway, they slow everything to a crawl and, once again, contribute to the feeling of being crowded. You know, I can almost see the photographers taking pictures as the lifeboats are being loaded.

 

Just took a cruise on a Conquest class ship for the first time in a while and really enjoyed it, and will be bringing another one back to Galveston in a couple of weeks. Going to be really nice having those two ships so close. Just feel sorry for the folks in New Orleans when they see the Triumph.

 

I think you hit the nail on the head perfectly about why they seem so crowded. It explains why some people will say that the ship never really felt crowded, while someone else on the same sailing will say it was so horribly crowded. I personally don't like Spirit class ships, but they are great for people who are really bothered by localized crowded spots on ships. I have gotten good at avoiding those spots when they are crowded, so I never have come away from Dream class ships feeling like it was crowded, even when they had every available bed filled. Dream has plenty of ways to avoid those spots, while the older ships (Holiday class) don't have as many ways to avoid them, which is why I felt more crowded on the older, small ships.

 

I also personally prefer the Conquest/Dream/Triumph layout of venues, with that nighttime venues all laid out one right after the other on the same deck. It does bring more life to the vibe of the ship, which is what I like. Spirit class scatters their venues all over the place, making the atmosphere more dull, and many people never find where some of the venues are. I don't view this or the way Conquest/Dream/Triumph does it as a design flaw, just simply as a difference in preference. Some people want it lively with everything close by (downside is that it can get crowded in spots), while some people want it less lively & less crowded. Everyone can choose accordingly.

 

I love your comment about them taking our pictures as we board the lifeboats. I can totally see that happening.

[Je Souhaite]

We were on the Fantasy's last sailing out of Charleston and it was our first cruise ever. Never once did we feel like it was "crowded". That made the trip more enjoyable.

 

The Fantasy class was an extension of the Holiday class, with with a stretch of the ship gave it an atrium. It also gave it an extended lido deck. And just more room.

 

And then went the opposite when then came out with the three Destiny class ships, where suddenly, the lido deck was one huge bottleneck.

 

The pendulum swung back once again when they came out with their best class, the Spirit ships, and then swung it back again, trying to cram as many people onto a ship as humanly possible, even kicking off entertainment in favor or more passenger cabins. And while they had that cram stick out, took the Destiny and crammed even more people onto it, taking away more public space, and called it Sunshine.

 

You really appreciate when you go on twice a size vessel on a competing brand, and find about the same amount of people, just with more space to spread around.

[jimbo5544]

The design was conceived for Holland America as the Vista class in the late 1990's while Holland was still receiving deliveries of their Rotterdam class ships (last one to be delivered in 2000). The first Vista class ship was slated for delivery in 2002.

 

Carnival was looking at a new class of ship that would have some of the amenities found on their Destiny/Triumph design (like balconies) but that would be small enough to fit through the Panama Canal and with a higher max speed that would give it more flexibility. This would allow Carnival to move ships from the east to west coast easily and tap into markets like Alaska.

 

However, the first Spirit class ship was delivered two years before the first Vista class ship was delivered (at the time, HAL was still receiving Rotterdam class ships). Costa also took delivery of its first Atlantica class ship that same year (also derived from the same design).

 

 

Interesting, thanks.

[tkportersat]

This just proves different perspectives....Didn't like Conquest, loved Triumph. Never had issues with Guys or Blue Iguana's location, got through fine and because of them avoided the buffet altogether.

 

I will agree with you on the photos. Frustrating to look for photos in the crowd, getting past the stations where set up on 5 or at the stairs and getting off the ship. Wish they could figure out how to make this work better.

 

If you are doing a cruise longer than seven days the Spirit ships really shine. If you want somewhere quiet, doesn't matter whether inside or outside you can always find it.

 

I think a lot of the crowded feeling on many of the other ships is for two reasons:

 

1) Every time they "update" them, they put the Guys garbage shack and the blue iguana burrito bar right in front of the forward entrance doors to the lido buffet creating a huge choke point. After you've fought your way through there a time or two you know the ship is crowded and nothing will convince you otherwise. Heaven help us if there ever was a major problem and they needed to move a lot of people quickly through that area.

 

2) The photo department and their perpetual logjam. Doesn't matter whether they are inside on Deck 3 or 5 or merely impeding the flow off the gangway, they slow everything to a crawl and, once again, contribute to the feeling of being crowded. You know, I can almost see the photographers taking pictures as the lifeboats are being loaded.

 

Just took a cruise on a Conquest class ship for the first time in a while and really enjoyed it, and will be bringing another one back to Galveston in a couple of weeks. Going to be really nice having those two ships so close. Just feel sorry for the folks in New Orleans when they see the Triumph.

[NPCIN]

As we all see on this cruise board time and time again...everyone has a different opinion and experience (even sailing on the same cruise) on the particular ship. I think just speaking only in reference to the crowds...it's all a mater of "timing". You could go eat the buffet and it be crowded and then come back 1/2 hour later and be not nearly as bad.

 

After my first sailing on the Dream I swore I'd never sail on her again as the crowds were by far the worst I've even seen on a ship. Nightmare trying to find a chair anywhere on the deck. On one sea day, I finally laid my towel down on the deck on the back of the ship to lay down and get some sun. Buffets were just as bad for breakfast and lunch walking around and sometimes standing with your food waiting for someone to get up so you could sit down to eat.

 

I did book another cruise on the Dream due to the cost and ports of call. There was about 150 less people on it that time, but it didn't feel as crowded as the first time by a long shot. However, I intentionally ate breakfast and dinner about an hour later than when I normally would trying to avoid the peak times and it worked. Deck chair wasn't a problem on that cruise.

 

Seems like I have the best luck of not feeling as crowded on the Spirit class ships.