Without Valor- a Mini Review

[Indytraveler83]

Getting off the Valor now from a 5 day trip to Costa Maya and Cozumel.  This is our 8th cruise and mimics our first that occured on the Elation out of New Orleans almost exactly 8 years ago.

 

Typically I do a detailed "Winter Escape" review detailing every day of our cruise.  I'm typically as balanced as possible and give both positives and negatives.  

 

That will not happen here.  I have no desire to revisit this cruise in detail.  Normally I enjoy our cruises so much I get labeled a "Cheerleader," so please understand I'm being honest when I say this was a terrible experience that will alter how we cruise in the future.

 

I'm going to cover "the good, the bad and the ugly" and try to be as fair as I can.  I'll answer any questions as best I can as well, and leave my advice at the end.

[Indytraveler83]

The good:

 

Most service staff (dining not included): the bar staff on this ship was phenomenal, room stewards were friendly and full of smiles, and Guest Services (which we rarely have needed on past cruises) responded admirably to extensive issues with our room (I'll detail this in the "Ugly" section).  Guest services aggressive response likely saved our relationship with Carnival, so I am grateful they have a team that is well trained.  

 

Ship cleanliness: Visually the ship looks much better than expected, and cleaning was constantly occuring.  

 

Cozumel: our visits to Mr. Sanchos are a tradition that never disappoints.  I know Cozumel is one of the most touristy ports that offers very little in unique experiences.  That's ok, we needed at least one reliably good thing.

 

That's it.  That's all I got for this section.

[Indytraveler83]

The good:

 

Most service staff (dining not included): the bar staff on this ship was phenomenal, room stewards were friendly and full of smiles, and Guest Services (which we rarely have needed on past cruises) responded admirably to extensive issues with our room (I'll detail this in the "Ugly" section).  Guest services aggressive response likely saved our relationship with Carnival, so I am grateful they have a team that is well trained.  

 

Ship cleanliness: Visually the ship looks much better than expected, and cleaning was constantly occuring.  

 

Cozumel: our visits to Mr. Sanchos are a tradition that never disappoints.  I know Cozumel is one of the most touristy ports that offers very little in unique experiences.  That's ok, we needed at least one reliably good thing.

 

That's it.  That's all I got for this section.

[Indytraveler83]

The bad:

 

Let's start with the dining room staff.  Some were friendly, attentive and remembered our names.  That was likely about 50% of them.  The rest were standoffish, made no effort to remember names, and disappeared frequently.  Coffee refills at breakfast, water refills and simple requests (like cream for coffee or ketchup at dinner) were infrequently responded to.  Even the better wait staff forgot orders, mixed them up and made mistakes we aren't accustomed to.  While we are used to the occasional mistake, they were so numerous that dining took 2+ hours and felt like a fight to get the simplest of meals completed.

 

The ship design: This was our first time on a Conquest class vessel.  It will be our last.  All of the ship's outer decks are focused inward toward pools.  The stadium seating on lido is weird, and the only way to see the ocean is to visit deck 10 or higher, where the wind is an issue.  We badly missed the aft decks on most of the other ships.  The interior isn't any better.  It feels spacious at first, but when full of passengers, most venues crowd easily.  It was strange to see so many open, wasted spaces that should have been utilized better.

 

The entertainment: We knew we would take a step down from our recent Horizon entertainment experiences.  We didn't know how far of a step it would be.  The violin string trio were the only group we liked (taste is subjective, I know), but they were only scheduled during dinner, making it nearly impossible to see them.  There were only musicians playing in the atrium and the casino (where the seating is very limited) and only sometimes.  We were forced to try and rely on the "old" Carnival entertainment, such as the comedy club and the Playlist shows, which we have grown tired of.  We were bored.  Most nights we were in the room by 9 PM.

 

All of that said, I'm reasonable, and this is much of what we expected on an older ship on a 5 day cruise.  Had it ended here, the cruise would have been exactly what we expected it to be.  However...

[Indytraveler83]

The Ugly:

 

Let's start with the food.  It was BAD.  We ordered much of the same food on the Horizon and the experiences couldn't have been any different.  Chocolate melting cake was solid and overcooked.  Much of breakfast tasted like it has been frozen and then microwaved back to life.  Many of our dishes had clearly been overcooked.  Steak temperatures were random, and "medium rare" came out anywhere between rare and well done.  Now this would have been part of the "bad" if it weren't for the fried chicken.  Most of our table ordered the Southern Fried Chicken one night, and it came out with large black burns (clearly from heat lamps) all over it.  The skin was no longer crispy, and the meat itself was blackening from the burns.  When we tried to politely reject this food, the dining staff looked at us like we were crazy, and audibly complained about food waste as they removed the dishes. 

 

Our room: The shower started off bad.  Heat was difficult to find on a dial that spun freely.  By our second day, hot water disappeared entirely, and it took two days for it to be repaired.  In the middle of this, our toilet also stopped working, leaving us without working plumbing in our room for more than 24 hours.  We first tried to get our room steward to call maintenance, but for whatever reason this failed.  Angry, we went to Guest Services who showed far more concern.  It still took multiple return trips to get any sort of hot water again, but they did provide onboard credit, wine and checked in with us constantly.  This room still isn't quite right, and maintenance doesn't seem to care.  But at least guest services did.

 

Ship maintenance: while the appearance of the ship is good, things are broken everywhere.  Half of the gym equipment is down, lights are out everywhere, toilets, sinks and other fixtures aren't working.  All of the maintenance work we saw being done was cosmetic, and no efforts seem to be made to fix functional items.  

 

The Hub App: while it has been the hero of our last few cruises, it was the villain here.  I'm not sure if the ship's poor wifi is mostly to blame, but the app switched days, times and agendas on a regular basis.  One morning we woke up, and the app said it was 11:58 PM.  This prevented us from checking into breakfast.  To make matters worse, while this was a clear ship wide issue, the dining staff must have been left in the dark, arguing with each passenger to check in on the app.  It was a flat out mess.

 

And finally:

 

Our fellow passengers.  I've never been on a cruise with so many verbal altercations, yelling, arguing, shoving and lack of basic kindness.  One member of our party is elderly and clearly has mobility issues (but is walking), and people would literally shove past him into the elevator, making him wait for the next one.  My husband and I are a same sex couple, and by the second day we didn't dare so much as touch each other on the shoulder, afraid of the glares and angry looks we got from many of our fellow passengers who seemed eager to start a fight (we aren't ever a heavy PDA couple, but typically try to hold hands or dance together on cruises).  No one here was on vacation.  They all acted like they had brought the people they hated the most into a nightclub for 5 nights and were just hunting for trouble.

 

And finally, my overall reaction to this cruise:

[Indytraveler83]

I've heard "A bad cruise is better than a normal day on land."  No.  It isn't.  On land I have reliably hot water, safe food and friendly coworkers.  I hate that I paid for this, and hate even more that I used 4 vacation days.  I would have rather been at my desk, sipping coffee and talking to clients.  

 

I feel like Carnival has quietly split their experience into two tiers.  There are the Vista class ships and newer, which seem to get unique entertainment, the best staff and all of it is kept up to compete with RCL, MSC and the rest of the cruise industry.  The older ships exist in purgatory, still relying on the "Funship 2.0" formula that was developed since before we started cruising.  This experience is getting long in the tooth and Carnival seems to be doing it's best to milk every dollar from this ships without investing a dime.  

 

After we cruise on the Spirit to Alaska, here are my rules for all future cruises:

 

1) I will never sail on anything older than the Vista.  Nostalgia is a powerful beast, and the Farkus ships are a fond memory.  No need to further tarnish those memories.

 

2) Never, ever sailing for 5 days or less.  This wasn't even a "party" crowd, but was some entirely different animal, people who just didn't even want to be here.

 

3) Never sailing out of New Orleans again.  We have always bristled at the other passengers coming from here, but it's so much worse now.  I know this is a highly personal opinion that will get some flak.  But we aren't comfortable, and we simply won't vacation that way.  

 

If you have questions, let me know. If you were on this cruise, I'm interested to see if you had a similar experience as we did.  

[Indytraveler83]

A few things I forgot:

 

Our room was 7203.  It's a forward facing room with a window.  The concept was interesting, and I wouldn't avoid this idea in the future.  However, you do feel A LOT of motion, so keep that in mind.  I would also avoid this particular room, as I doubt they will make much of an effort to fix the issues further.

 

It's 9 am and debarkation is very slow.  We thankfully aren't ina hurry, but I feel sorry for those who needed off the ship quickly.  

[chesfarm]

I went on the Valor Jan 5-9, 2023, and I can second the fact that the food was awful. I ended up just eating from the deli, and making sure I only ate packaged foods for breakfast, like cereal and yoghurt. I went to brunch the first sea day and the steakhouse, and never went back after that.

 

I hope my next cruise is better. October on the Glory and January on the Magic. After that, I believe I will be changing lines. 😞

[Megan_Strick]

1 hour ago, Indytraveler83 said:

The Ugly:

 

Let's start with the food.  It was BAD.  We ordered much of the same food on the Horizon and the experiences couldn't have been any different.  Chocolate melting cake was solid and overcooked.  Much of breakfast tasted like it has been frozen and then microwaved back to life.  Many of our dishes had clearly been overcooked.  Steak temperatures were random, and "medium rare" came out anywhere between rare and well done.  Now this would have been part of the "bad" if it weren't for the fried chicken.  Most of our table ordered the Southern Fried Chicken one night, and it came out with large black burns (clearly from heat lamps) all over it.  The skin was no longer crispy, and the meat itself was blackening from the burns.  When we tried to politely reject this food, the dining staff looked at us like we were crazy, and audibly complained about food waste as they removed the dishes. 

 

Our room: The shower started off bad.  Heat was difficult to find on a dial that spun freely.  By our second day, hot water disappeared entirely, and it took two days for it to be repaired.  In the middle of this, our toilet also stopped working, leaving us without working plumbing in our room for more than 24 hours.  We first tried to get our room steward to call maintenance, but for whatever reason this failed.  Angry, we went to Guest Services who showed far more concern.  It still took multiple return trips to get any sort of hot water again, but they did provide onboard credit, wine and checked in with us constantly.  This room still isn't quite right, and maintenance doesn't seem to care.  But at least guest services did.

 

Ship maintenance: while the appearance of the ship is good, things are broken everywhere.  Half of the gym equipment is down, lights are out everywhere, toilets, sinks and other fixtures aren't working.  All of the maintenance work we saw being done was cosmetic, and no efforts seem to be made to fix functional items.  

 

The Hub App: while it has been the hero of our last few cruises, it was the villain here.  I'm not sure if the ship's poor wifi is mostly to blame, but the app switched days, times and agendas on a regular basis.  One morning we woke up, and the app said it was 11:58 PM.  This prevented us from checking into breakfast.  To make matters worse, while this was a clear ship wide issue, the dining staff must have been left in the dark, arguing with each passenger to check in on the app.  It was a flat out mess.

 

And finally:

 

Our fellow passengers.  I've never been on a cruise with so many verbal altercations, yelling, arguing, shoving and lack of basic kindness.  One member of our party is elderly and clearly has mobility issues (but is walking), and people would literally shove past him into the elevator, making him wait for the next one.  My husband and I are a same sex couple, and by the second day we didn't dare so much as touch each other on the shoulder, afraid of the glares and angry looks we got from many of our fellow passengers who seemed eager to start a fight (we aren't ever a heavy PDA couple, but typically try to hold hands or dance together on cruises).  No one here was on vacation.  They all acted like they had brought the people they hated the most into a nightclub for 5 nights and were just hunting for trouble.

 

And finally, my overall reaction to this cruise:

I'm truly curious. What did you do with no toilet for 24 hours?? Where did you "go" and go?

Edited January 19, 2023 by Megan_Strick

[Megan_Strick]

1 hour ago, Indytraveler83 said:

A few things I forgot:

 

Our room was 7203.  It's a forward facing room with a window.  The concept was interesting, and I wouldn't avoid this idea in the future.  However, you do feel A LOT of motion, so keep that in mind.  I would also avoid this particular room, as I doubt they will make much of an effort to fix the issues further.

 

It's 9 am and debarkation is very slow.  We thankfully aren't ina hurry, but I feel sorry for those who needed off the ship quickly.  

VERY off topic? Is that a Brittany in your picture? We have one too!

[pe4all]

Sorry you had such a bad experience. We have sailed on Valor (long ago) and other Conquest-type ships, (more recently) and enjoyed the stadium seating.  There is no excuse for bad behavior by passengers, or for the break-down issues of your room, or the gym equipment, or the bad food, or terrible dining room service.  2 hours for a meal is crazy.   As for entertainment - yes, the same playlist shows "get old" after a while.  And as you said, everything is subjective.  Hopefully your Spirit cruise will be better - we head out on Spirit next week!

[Riles34]

1 hour ago, Indytraveler83 said:

After we cruise on the Spirit to Alaska, here are my rules for all future cruises:

 

1) I will never sail on anything older than the Vista.  Nostalgia is a powerful beast, and the Farkus ships are a fond memory.  No need to further tarnish those memories.

 

2) Never, ever sailing for 5 days or less.  This wasn't even a "party" crowd, but was some entirely different animal, people who just didn't even want to be here.

 

3) Never sailing out of New Orleans again.  We have always bristled at the other passengers coming from here, but it's so much worse now.  I know this is a highly personal opinion that will get some flak.  But we aren't comfortable, and we simply won't vacation that way.  

 

If you have questions, let me know. If you were on this cruise, I'm interested to see if you had a similar experience as we did.  

I don't disagree with your three requirements! Shorter sailings are more affordable and you can get the immature/rude passengers. I find Miami to be a good port with good people.

[pirate4me2]

I agree about the Conquest class ships, they are definetly not my favorites. We do have the Valor booked, as well as the Sunshine (has that same closed in feeling), but we usually try and avoid them because of the "claustrophobic" feeling. 

I hope your next cruise is better. 

[Indytraveler83]

18 minutes ago, Megan_Strick said:

I'm truly curious. What did you do with no toilet for 24 hours?? Where did you "go" and go?

Thankfully we were cruising with family, so we could use their rooms.  Still felt weird asking to use someone else's bathroom.

[Indytraveler83]

2 minutes ago, Riles34 said:

I don't disagree with your three requirements! Shorter sailings are more affordable and you can get the immature/rude passengers. I find Miami to be a good port with good people.

I absolutely agree with Miami departures.  I just hate the airport.  Some cruising friends said they fly to a nearby airport and just drive the rest of the way 

[Indytraveler83]

8 minutes ago, MoistTowelette said:

Thanks for your detailed report. I think you were spot on with your experiences and it is why I am not bullish on the cruise industry over the next few years. Carnival indicated on its last earning call that it is focusing marketing to new cruisers, which is what they will need to survive because I think the returning customers, especially those that have experienced cruising both pre and post COVID, are no longer going to find the value and service worth it and look to land-based options. Fares, on-board prices, even the online store all has pricing that is 30-100% higher compared to my last cruise, all with a reduction to customer service and items that were once included with cruise fare. Those employees that do want to work are burning out quicker from the impacts of less staffing.

 

One cruise company has recently said is their biggest competitor is not other cruise lines but land-based vacations. They are not wrong at all. There is only so much discretionary income and as markets tighten back up, so will wallets. Not the best time for cruise lines to think they should be jacking up prices because they think they are undervalued.

 

The thing that frustrates me the most is that our experiences on the Horizon were totally different.  The SAME FOOD was so much better, and the overall cruise was amazing. Our Horizon cruises were an amazing value and we would step back onboard in a heartbeat.

[Indytraveler83]

9 minutes ago, pe4all said:

Sorry you had such a bad experience. We have sailed on Valor (long ago) and other Conquest-type ships, (more recently) and enjoyed the stadium seating.  There is no excuse for bad behavior by passengers, or for the break-down issues of your room, or the gym equipment, or the bad food, or terrible dining room service.  2 hours for a meal is crazy.   As for entertainment - yes, the same playlist shows "get old" after a while.  And as you said, everything is subjective.  Hopefully your Spirit cruise will be better - we head out on Spirit next week!

 

You'll have to let me know what you think of the Spirit.  I'm seriously reconsidering our Spirit cruise.  We got it at an epic price that we will never get again, but I also can't do another shipboard experience like this. 

[Indytraveler83]

31 minutes ago, chesfarm said:

I went on the Valor Jan 5-9, 2023, and I can second the fact that the food was awful. I ended up just eating from the deli, and making sure I only ate packaged foods for breakfast, like cereal and yoghurt. I went to brunch the first sea day and the steakhouse, and never went back after that.

 

I hope my next cruise is better. October on the Glory and January on the Magic. After that, I believe I will be changing lines. 😞

 

If it were me, I'd change to something newer. I doubt the Glory is going to be much different . Vista class and newer ships honestly feel like a different cruise line.  I didn't notice the stark difference until now.  

[Indytraveler83]

23 minutes ago, Megan_Strick said:

VERY off topic? Is that a Brittany in your picture? We have one too!

 

He actually is a dachshund/Chihuahua mix, but his markings are stereotypical Brittany markings, so everyone thinks he is (even the vet at first).  He's 8 years old but stuck looking forever like a Brittany puppy!

[Megan_Strick]

Just now, Indytraveler83 said:

 

He actually is a dachshund/Chihuahua mix, but his markings are stereotypical Brittany markings, so everyone thinks he is (even the vet at first).  He's 8 years old but stuck looking forever like a Brittany puppy!

Oh wow! Still a cutie

[Indytraveler83]

2 minutes ago, Megan_Strick said:

Oh wow! Still a cutie

Thank you.  His "sister" is a mini dachshund and at 7 pounds she usually gets all the attention, lol!

[Indytraveler83]

3 minutes ago, Megan_Strick said:

Oh wow! Still a cutie

Thank you.  His "sister" is a mini dachshund and at 7 pounds she usually gets all the attention, lol!

[ARcruisin2]

52 minutes ago, Indytraveler83 said:

 

You'll have to let me know what you think of the Spirit.  I'm seriously reconsidering our Spirit cruise.  We got it at an epic price that we will never get again, but I also can't do another shipboard experience like this. 

I hear your concerns... and I bet it's already stressing you.

I'd switch it if I could...even if it costs more, because it seems you've found the point where "an epic price" is no longer a great "value for your money".

[CruiseMGM]

48 minutes ago, Indytraveler83 said:

 

You'll have to let me know what you think of the Spirit.  I'm seriously reconsidering our Spirit cruise.  We got it at an epic price that we will never get again, but I also can't do another shipboard experience like this. 

 

Hi, I'm so sorry you had such a rough time on the Valor! Really sounds dreadful. We're mainly HAL cruisers but went on 2 Carnival cruises last year (Panorama to Mexico with family inc. kids and Sprit r/t Alaska from Seattle just the 2 of us for a cheap and quick anniversary adventure). Just our experience, we'd do the Panorama again if family wanted to go, but it wasn't really our cup o' tea......big ship, overbooked, lots of kids, etc. Buffet was scary. Still, fun with the family, and the kids had a ball! But the Spirit? We really weren't expecting much ..............and we had a WONDERFUL time. The food wasn't outstanding but it was tasty and mostly well prepared, our balcony cabin was great, staffing was good and the ship was lovely. We went to the Steakhouse twice and really enjoyed that, hit up the sushi restaurant the first night and pretty much had the place to ourselves, very good. We pretty much did our own thing and didn't mingle a lot, so had no issues with other passengers.

 

I just want to say that we really hope your next cruise is a good one, and that you enjoy the Spirit if you decide to partake of that sailing! Best wishes and safe travels!

[pe4all]

2 hours ago, Indytraveler83 said:

 

You'll have to let me know what you think of the Spirit.  I'm seriously reconsidering our Spirit cruise.  We got it at an epic price that we will never get again, but I also can't do another shipboard experience like this. 

An Alaska voyage is totally different.  We did CCL to Alaska on Miracle (Spirit class ship also) at the end of August one year, and it was an unforgettable cruise.  You will find less kids onboard, and probably an "older" demographic.  Don't let your Valor experience scare you off.  Less partying, people concentrating on the naturalist, scenery and excursions. If going out of Seattle try to get in a day or 2 early - lots to see.  Our fav excursions were small boat into Tracy Arm and helicopter to glacier where we did real dogsled.  Expensive, but worth every penny.