RCCL pax prove their irresponsibility once again...

[dakrewser]

couldnt find anything re: the above--any other details available

 

From FoxyTerrier's post (http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=6077190&postcount=20) Lou...

[IDoLoveToCruise]

Suing is all too often just about getting something for nothing. Not about real truly "not my fault" issues. Quite possible new to cruising people are not aware that "leaving" means exactly that, the ship is leaving" at a stated time. However that does not negate their responsibility to be back in time. I believe as Williebill said some people just think they are so special the ship MUST wait for them to return. I shudder to think of the legal hassle if a passanger is injured in the dangerous transfer to a ship from a pilot boat. Seems all agree if you are making your own arrangments for an excursion at a port factor in that always present glitch in getting back on time. By the way the only "traffic jam" possible anywhere close to a pier on any Caribbean Island is caused by ships passangers. (cabs and busses bring them all back) So if 99.9 % were on the ship somebody please tell me more about this traffic jam.

[SDHALFAN]

I'm starting to feel sorry for Royal Caribbean. First the widowed bride starts doing the media rounds, now this. :rolleyes:

Like the song says---When will they ever learn? When will they ev-er learn?

 

Hi Ruth,

 

Re: "the widowed bride", there is a very interesting article in the April 2006 edition of Vanity Fair magazine ("The Honeymoon-Cruise Mystery) that provides some information we haven't heard before. The writer of the article also comes to a very interesting conclusion.

 

"When will they ever learn?", as in "Where have all the flowers gone?" I looove that song, but I have a feeling that you and I are "dating" ourselves (as in showing our age).:D

 

Have a sensational cruise.:)

 

Valerie

[SDHALFAN]

Suing is all too often just about getting something for nothing. Not about real truly "not my fault" issues. Quite possible new to cruising people are not aware that "leaving" means exactly that, the ship is leaving" at a stated time. However that does not negate their responsibility to be back in time. I believe as Williebill said some people just think they are so special the ship MUST wait for them to return. I shudder to think of the legal hassle if a passanger is injured in the dangerous transfer to a ship from a pilot boat. Seems all agree if you are making your own arrangments for an excursion at a port factor in that always present glitch in getting back on time. By the way the only "traffic jam" possible anywhere close to a pier on any Caribbean Island is caused by ships passangers. (cabs and busses bring them all back) So if 99.9 % were on the ship somebody please tell me more about this traffic jam.

 

 

Actually one time my husband and I, and a full busload of other HAL passengers, were an hour and a half late getting back to the ship due to a traffic jam on the Island of Margarita (just off the northern Venezuelan coast). It was a HAL shore excursion trip and our poor tour guide (who was sensational, by the way) was getting extremely nervous that we wouldn't be back in time. We all assured him that he shouldn't worry because they would hold the ship for us since the trip was purchased through HAL. The traffic jam was caused by a very long funeral procession - who could foresee something like that happening?

 

The moral of the story is that even though the HAL shore excursions may cost more than one could buy onshore at least one has the peace of mind that no matter how late one gets back the ship will be waiting, ready to welcome us back aboard.

 

Valerie:)

[Sunshine91]

I shudder to think of the legal hassle if a passanger is injured in the dangerous transfer to a ship from a pilot boat./quote]

 

 

My background is in benefits/safety/healthcare, so I wondered about this, too.

 

Anyone know what damages the suing folks are seeking? Just curious.

[SDHALFAN]

Okay,

 

I hate to "hog" the board but I do have one more story to share with you, and to this day I still shake my head and think "what was he thinking?"

 

One of my favorite ports on the Pacific shores of Mexico is very beautiful, and strange as it may sound one of the most beautiful sights is when sitting in the Crow's Nest watching us leave port. So, being fortunate enough to have had fantastic dinner companions I told them my little secret.

 

Fast forward and we have already cast off and are ready to head back north. There I am sitting, way above the pier, with one of my favorite dinner companions, enjoying the scenery, when we notice this man strolling down the pier towards the ship. I mean this man was just strolling, as though he had all the time in the world. Did he not notice that the ship had cast off and was about to leave the harbor? Ellie and I just looked at each other and then decided maybe he wasn't a passenger. HAH - he was and it finally dawned on him that the ship was leaving:confused: .

 

He was incredibly lucky that some Mexican fishermen took pity on him and got him in a small boat right away and brought him to the ship. I'm sure that the officers on deck knew what the problem was and the ship probably wasn't moving as fast as it normally would have been so the "idiot" was able to get aboard, no doubt by way of the Jacob's Ladder which can't be an easy way to board ship. I doubt that he will make that mistake again, and I certainly hope that he "tipped" those fisherman a hefty sum.

 

Valerie:D

[dakrewser]

Just a note - no cruise line I'm aware of will promise to "hold the ship" even if you're on a ship-sponsored shore excursion. What they will do is guarantee that they'll get you back aboard. If taking you to the next port is cheaper than holding the ship waiting, then they'll leave without you - but make arrangements for your travel, etc.

[infopaul]

Thanks FoxyTerrier for posting. As a matter of observation Dakrewser made a serious point that may be agrued legally. I don't think the "management on board the ship" should be fired and it would be foolish, as if admitting he/she did something wrong, but this guy/gal is up to their eyeballs in it. I think this is where I sit on the fence with this, what did they do and what they shouldn't have done.

 

The fact that a family member is an attorney is irrelevant. RCCL has already lost in a manner of speaking (more bad publicity). Depending on the determination of the attorney money might not be his only objective, he could feel he's been put upon by their ignoring him afterwards which bolsters his position of negligence. They already are paying because of RCCL's expenses for out of state attorney fees so again they are clear losers.

 

Even if it was settled for a nusiance value ($15K), it might lead to RCCL rewritting it's policy when someone is left behind. It could effectively change things industry wide about responcibilities if they were to lose in court. That may be the big picture. In the court system there is a lot of legal pressure for corporate accountability...Paul:)

 

In the alternative , if they offered 500 dollars off his next cruise it could be over quicker than it took me to write this.

[Grumpy1]

Suing is all too often just about getting something for nothing. Not about real truly "not my fault" issues. Quite possible new to cruising people are not aware that "leaving" means exactly that, the ship is leaving" at a stated time. However that does not negate their responsibility to be back in time. I believe as Williebill said some people just think they are so special the ship MUST wait for them to return. I shudder to think of the legal hassle if a passanger is injured in the dangerous transfer to a ship from a pilot boat. Seems all agree if you are making your own arrangments for an excursion at a port factor in that always present glitch in getting back on time. By the way the only "traffic jam" possible anywhere close to a pier on any Caribbean Island is caused by ships passangers. (cabs and busses bring them all back) So if 99.9 % were on the ship somebody please tell me more about this traffic jam.

Well... sometimes you have to wait for the herd of goats to get out of the road..

[SDHALFAN]

Just a note - no cruise line I'm aware of will promise to "hold the ship" even if you're on a ship-sponsored shore excursion. What they will do is guarantee that they'll get you back aboard. If taking you to the next port is cheaper than holding the ship waiting, then they'll leave without you - but make arrangements for your travel, etc.

 

 

I can only answer for HAL but there have been several times where we or other passengers were extremely late getting back from a HAL sponsored cruise excursion, and the ship most definitely stayed in port waiting for us.

 

I think that one would have to be very, very, very late getting back to the ship if the ship were to leave without you, promising to board you at the next port of call. First of all, as you mentioned, they would have to make arrangements for your travel. Then they would have to put you (and a busload of 30-40 other passengers) up in hotels for the night, provide you with, at a minimum, basic toiletries and change of clothes, and let's not forget breakfast, lunch and/or dinner). Now that scenario sounds to me like a lawsuit just waiting to happen. What if they didn't provide you with necessary life-saving medications - who packs all of those for a supposed 3-4 hour shore excursion?

 

You may want to check with the various cruiselines' regarding their shore excursion policies. However I cannot see any cruiseline willing to take the chance that a passenger, on one of their sponsored shore excursions which happened to be late back to the ship, may suffer a heart attack because they did not take along their medication (which needs to be taken every 12 or more hours) for a 3-4 hour shore excursion. I can see the attorneys lining up right now to take on that lawsuit. A "no brainer" there.

 

Valerie

[ryansmemom]

Even if it was settled for a nusiance value ($15K), it might lead to RCCL rewritting it's policy when someone is left behind. It could effectively change things industry wide about responcibilities if they were to lose in court. That may be the big picture. In the court system there is a lot of legal pressure for corporate accountability...Paul:)

 

.

 

 

The "magic number" is much higher than that these days, at least in Pennsylvania. It used to be that the amount nusiance suits settled for was $20K now it's $50K. At least that is the number for malpractice cases and I imagine the settlements are similar.

 

The good news is some states are now taking steps to discourage frivolous law suits. The courts are fining attorneys who file law suits who file law suits deemed to be frivolous and plantiffs are being assessed all costs for these suits including costs incurred by the defendants and the court. This has cut down on the number of these cases especially since the attorneys are risking being hit with hefty fines.

 

Linda

[Tricia724]

"....After returning from the cruise, Babcock wrote and called Royal Caribbean several times to try to talk with someone about how the situation was handled. Babcock said his complaints were repeatedly ignored, prompting him to seek legal recourse. "

 

I think this is the key to the lawsuit....he got fired up because no one would talk to him, so this is his way of getting attention.....or rather getting their attention. Probably won't go anywhere, but RCCL surely doesn't need any more press.

 

As far as leaving passengers behind: Two weeks ago we were docked in Costa Maya next to Carnival's Glory. Glory was scheduled to depart at 5:00 pm...and from my balcony window, I could see a large crowd gathering for sailaway. When I went into the bathroom to put on makeup at 5:15 she still hadn't sailed. Even in the bathroom I could hear lots of noise from the ship...hooting, hollering, catcalls. My other half came back to the cabin, and I asked him to see what was happening on the Carnival ship. He took his field glasses out and I could hear him laughing hysterically. He said the ship was getting ready to pull in their gangway, and two couples were coming down the pier waving their hands. The women were running, but the men were just strolling along. When the women got to the gangway, a security man put up his hand as if to say "no." One of the women threw both of her hands up in air, and the other woman dropped to her knees and clasped her hands together in mock prayer. "Let them on, let them on" cheered the crowd. Both of the women scurried on. Along came the men who weren't making any effort to hurry. A roar came up from the crowd..."Leave them, leave them." Well....of course, they didn't leave them, but as soon as their feet hit the ship, the gangway was pulled and the ship sailed. By this time it's after 5:30. I figure those were some lucky people.

[infopaul]

ryansmemom, sounds like you know something so I defer at this time.

 

The figure I quoted is a basic NYC "magic number" used even today for insurance claims.

 

Don't open Pandora's Box, frivolous suits tie up the calenders even more in NYC (attys play the numbers game).

 

I'm glad I live in "Happy Valley", Pa.

 

I think Babcock has merit (not being frivolous).

 

Yours truly,

Paul:)

[AAAAmerican]

Once we went to Hell and back... even sent the Post Cards from Hell..yes there is a Post Office in Hell, Grand Cayman...

 

I was doing business this time again and we visted a friend there in her residence in the AM coming from the Ship which was a RCL Ship...

 

Cutting to the chase..not not chase manhatten...*S*

 

We were back to catch the launch at the dock as always we were early so as if any discrpency occured we could adjust... (there should always be room for errors..) low and behold we caught they told us was the last launch back..? HUH ..and yes we were very early... What the devil was going on? And we had been to Hell that day again...

 

There were no signs on the dock or coming down there to catch the launches... Well the RCL Ship left early after a couple (2) more launches were coming in and hoisted up... I asked a crew member and he said everyone was aboard and they are getting underway so I thought it strange but guessed it was normal then... We watched us leave and went to our stateroom to shower and change...

 

At dinner ( we like the formal dining room best ) we saw the newly married couple on there honeymoon were not at dinner and figured they were doing a honeymoon routine.. yes in a few years it turnms into a honey do routine.,...

 

So we thought nothing about it... but the next night again they were not there.. WOW ok they are liking the honeymoon we hoped... but the next night in Key West, FL we came back to the ship and at dinner the couple was there and we just smiled..and they let it loose... the couple had gone on a RCL tour and were back prior to the sheduled time of departure and no launch..no Ship... they did find the agent on Grand Caymen finally and had to get to Miami then drove to Key West all without any Passport etc...

 

But instead of suining they said they were just going to have a rather unique memory of there honeymoon side trip...

 

My point is this .. With so much money flowing and revenues generated why not simple shedules, communication, sihgnage and SIMPLE INSTRUCTION for the staff.. Launches are run really poorly in most ports of call .. why not set themselves apart and have good launch services... just basic communication.. If they say a time of departure keep it..

 

 

Holland American is great on there watching out for passengers.. wish more lines were this way...

 

 

We have had to depart in a hurray a few times.

Yes inclimate weather can move in quickly.. EG: We were in Sydney and they had a storm coming in so we left in haste and missed Ports of Call .. but everyone was accounted for and aboard the ship..

 

 

 

The Cruise line did compensate us for the missed Ports of Call by not charging us the Port Tax.. (Watchout Some Cruise Lines ((Non-American)) do/have charged people for non-attended ports of call...

 

The point of the Story is Consumers need Protection against Problems.:eek: .. Law Suits only make the people involved in the suits satisfied.

 

All cruisers need protection. Cruise lines do need to be accountable for there actions, as the cruisers are.

 

Have a lot of you been to Hell and back?:eek:

[mim100]

so....looks like taking your passports along on an excursion is a good idea....I've read some posts on other threads with the majority of posters saying not to take your passport - only a copy....would a copy of the passport have helped those people in this case? probably not....

[sunflowerstarr]

I have never been on a cruise before, my first one is coming up in Nov but even I knew this way before booking that you are responsible for getting to the ship on time in ports or else you much pay at your own expense to get back to the ship. Unless of course it was a ship sponsored shore excursion whichwould be a different scenario. I read that article and thought what a bunch of idiots. lol

[AAAAmerican]

I doi think it does matter which Port of Call as well.. like in S. America or Africa...

 

We do usually take ours with us in a BellyBag or Money belt as they in even Pick Pocket areas EG: Naples, Italy etc... they are the most secure places against this...

 

Yes keep Copies of your Documents Passports C Cards numbers etc in a few places that are accessible in the event a problem occurs..

 

I think it would have helped the newly weds in expediting there transit time.. they mentioned that would have saved them a lot of agrivation...:eek:

[AAAAmerican]

*WARNING* And **WELCOME ABOARD* Your entering a life changing event time in November for which there may be no return....:rolleyes:

 

Yes Cruising still is the best method of travel on vacation I have ever done so far.. A great cost bsis too.. Availability of many variables and so many choices of destinations... price points help... (they are better to me than toast points)...:eek:

 

 

Yes Ship and Cruise Line sponsored excursions are nice in that respect as they have responsibility..

 

Where are you cruising to/from? which Ship? Did you start a Roll Call yet fopr this or is one started?:)

 

 

I have never been on a cruise before, my first one is coming up in Nov but even I knew this way before booking that you are responsible for getting to the ship on time in ports or else you much pay at your own expense to get back to the ship. Unless of course it was a ship sponsored shore excursion whichwould be a different scenario. I read that article and thought what a bunch of idiots. lol

[mama d]

Being left behind to figure out how to make it to the next port of call has always been the deciding factor in using the cruise's excursions.

I remember the time we took a snuba ex. in St. Johns (port - St. Thomas)while on the "Big Z" and got back about 15 minutes prior to the ship weighing anchor. On the boat coming back from St. Johns we were "clock watching" and worried but we knew we had booked through the cruise line just in case we were late getting back to the ship. We had to run down the dock to make it on board, luckily for me we did not have far to run!

 

I never even considered taking our paperwork off the ship with us, I was under the impression that leaving it onboard was "safer". :(

 

Guess that is what I get for being impressionable. ;)

 

May all your excurions deliver you back on time.

[dakrewser]

so....looks like taking your passports along on an excursion is a good idea....I've read some posts on other threads with the majority of posters saying not to take your passport - only a copy....would a copy of the passport have helped those people in this case? probably not....

 

It depends on where you are. Far as I know, you don't need a passport to get from Key West to Miami! :rolleyes:

 

But the folks who missed the boat we were on in Grenada (Spain) and who needed to get to the next stop, Gibraltar (UK), certainly needed them.

[aaerobear]

Actually no passports would be needed for going from Grenada to Gibralter as they are both part of the EU, but your point is well taken. After having been in the travel industry for more than 38 years, I can say with no hesitation that most people have no idea how many folks are left behind when planes/trains/ships leave.

 

One of the rules we always stressed to ourselves and others was that you should take a COPY of your passport (greencard etc.) with you when going out on your own. Most, if not all, authorities will accept this as proof of citizenship and will render whatever help they can.

 

We had a friend almost missed the ship in Turkey and the next port was in Greece (would have been a real test there) His roommate kept pacing the floor and saying "what are we gonna do? What are we gonna do". Well, I told him we were gonna go up on deck and wave goodby to Turkey like everyone else. When he gets back to the port they will help him get to Greece. I know that sounds cruel, but thats all one could do. (by the way he had made it back in the mean time)

 

Ed

[dakrewser]

Actually no passports would be needed for going from Grenada to Gibralter as they are both part of the EU, but your point is well taken. After having been in the travel industry for more than 38 years, I can say with no hesitation that most people have no idea how many folks are left behind when planes/trains/ships leave.

 

At the time, there were no "open borders". But the border between Spain & Gibraltar is still rather difficult to cross (unlike, say, Spain to France). The Spaniards will do whatever they can to "facilitate" the return of the rock. If that includes impeding US citizebns who need to cross, then so be it. Those pax who missed the sailing had to:

1) retireve their passports from the port agent

2) taxi to the border w/Gibraltar

3) walk across the border

4) catch another cab.

 

Alternatively, they could have flown to Madrid, changed planes to London and changed again for Gibraltar.

[trubey]

Although the two ports could both be in the EU, to travel by air, you must still show identification.

 

And I would assume that if you only have copies of your passport, etc., it would not hurt to have a little help from the port agent—and maybe a consulate or embassy.

 

susana.

[sunflowerstarr]

hello aaaamerican! my friend and i are sailing on the 11/30 southern caribbean cruise out of norfolk va on the maasdam. there is a roll call started(by someone else) but no one seems to come back to talk that or not too many people who have booked have decided to post there. any tips you have in mind would be fantastic! thanks :)

[AAAAmerican]

Hi SunFlowerStarr,

 

Hope youall had a great PI Day yesterday. 03.14 as it happens only once a year...

 

On your roll call sometimes people do not post nor know about it so it does take time to see, to post there, to talk with other people here and other boards... also ask your Agent/Agency if they know otherd going aboard then or even clients... give them the URL here and see that way too..

 

Norfolk, VA is a wonderful city, US NAVY... GO SEALS! and so much history there in the area.. make sure you go to the museum there it has some nice collections. One of my first cousins married his wife and had his reception inside.. this was the first time in its history that had been done.:)

 

The ferries in the harbor are great getting around too..

 

Jamestown, Willamsburg, YorkTown, VA BEach... shopping is a WOW factoring as well .. the Pottery Shed on US 60 is so very nice and very very incredible buying power for your dollars too....:eek: now who likes a bargain?

 

 

 

hello aaaamerican! my friend and i are sailing on the 11/30 southern caribbean cruise out of norfolk va on the maasdam. there is a roll call started(by someone else) but no one seems to come back to talk that or not too many people who have booked have decided to post there. any tips you have in mind would be fantastic! thanks :)