Train--London to Glasgow 02 Sep 23

[helovestrains]

We cruise out of Southampton 19 Aug - 02 Sep 23.  Upon disembarkation we have train tickets to Glasgow.   On the national rail site is states that there could be a travel disruption on the London to Glasgow portion and may not run.  The site says to check back closer to 02 Sep 23.  Any advice on what we should do?  Thanks.

[edinburgher]

1 hour ago, helovestrains said:

On the national rail site is states that there could be a travel disruption on the London to Glasgow portion and may not run.

Two new dates for rail strikes have been announced in recent days and Sept 2 is one of them with the London to Glasgow route (operated by Avanti) being one of those affected.

 

Avanti have suspended ticket sales on those two days in the meantime, but some strikes go ahead as announced and others can be called off.  Unfortunately there isn't any way to find out until an announcement is made and that could be closer to the travel date.Have you checked the Avanti website for any info?

 

I think your would need to to liaise with whichever organisation/business  you bought your tickets from to see what your options are, whether that be rescheduling travel for a different date, or requesting a refund and finding an alternative means of travel, such as long distance coach, not ideal I know.  There are also flights between Southampton and Glasgow with Loganair, and flights from London airports.

 

These train strikes have been ongoing for well over a year now making buying train tickets a bit of a lottery.

 

And I noticed your username.  Maybe think of changing it after this inconvenience?

Edited August 13, 2023 by edinburgher

[helovestrains]

In the past when strike action has been announced, is it more likely than not that it will happen?  The website does indicate that if a strike does happen we will receive a refund.  Not sure if we should buy airline tickets now or wait.

[fruitmachine]

I can provide some information on an analogous route - London to Edinburgh - where we and other family members have travelled that journey on strike days.

 

In our case the number of services was limited; probably hourly leaving London (and only between about 8am and 12 noon or 1pm) so far less than the usual ~30 trains a day.  But the rail company did such a good job of discouraging passengers, those that ran were much quieter that normal.

 

If you're holding off changing your travel plans, check this link on and immediately after the next strike date of 26 August to see what actually ran: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/gb-nr:GLC/from/gb-nr:EUS/2023-08-26/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

[Globaliser]

6 hours ago, helovestrains said:

In the past when strike action has been announced, is it more likely than not that it will happen?

 

I wouldn't put any money on the strike not going ahead. But that's not the full story.

 

The announced strike is by a union called the RMT. Recently, strikes by this union have seldom been enough to bring trains to a complete halt on important main lines like London <-> Glasgow and London <-> Edinburgh. I have an experience similar to fruitmachine's when I've been travelling London <--> Newcastle: the trains that ran were pleasantly quiet, even though I had to adjust my journey times to get onto a train that did run.

 

If a union called ASLEF strikes, then trains operated by the relevant companies do tend to come to a complete halt. Further strikes for 2 September could be announced any time up to 2 weeks before that date. So it's not yet possible to be fully confident about this - but if there is no ASLEF strike on 2 September, then I would personally be reasonably comfortable that I would be able to get to Glasgow at some time on that day.

[helovestrains]

8 hours ago, fruitmachine said:

I can provide some information on an analogous route - London to Edinburgh - where we and other family members have travelled that journey on strike days.

 

In our case the number of services was limited; probably hourly leaving London (and only between about 8am and 12 noon or 1pm) so far less than the usual ~30 trains a day.  But the rail company did such a good job of discouraging passengers, those that ran were much quieter that normal.

 

If you're holding off changing your travel plans, check this link on and immediately after the next strike date of 26 August to see what actually ran: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/detailed/gb-nr:GLC/from/gb-nr:EUS/2023-08-26/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

Thanks so much for your response.  We will check the link on/after the 26th.

[helovestrains]

2 hours ago, Globaliser said:

 

I wouldn't put any money on the strike not going ahead. But that's not the full story.

 

The announced strike is by a union called the RMT. Recently, strikes by this union have seldom been enough to bring trains to a complete halt on important main lines like London <-> Glasgow and London <-> Edinburgh. I have an experience similar to fruitmachine's when I've been travelling London <--> Newcastle: the trains that ran were pleasantly quiet, even though I had to adjust my journey times to get onto a train that did run.

 

If a union called ASLEF strikes, then trains operated by the relevant companies do tend to come to a complete halt. Further strikes for 2 September could be announced any time up to 2 weeks before that date. So it's not yet possible to be fully confident about this - but if there is no ASLEF strike on 2 September, then I would personally be reasonably comfortable that I would be able to get to Glasgow at some time on that day.

Hopefully ASLEF won't announce a strike and we will be able to keep our current travel plans.  We will wait until 26 Aug 23 and revisit the train situation.  Thank you for the information you provided.

[Globaliser]

15 hours ago, helovestrains said:

On the national rail site is states that there could be a travel disruption on the London to Glasgow portion and may not run.

 

One other thing that should be both an alert and some comfort: There could also be disruption between Southampton and London. I presume that you're planning to use South Western Railway for this, and its website also has a warning: "It is likely that we will operate a significantly reduced service on a limited number of lines, with trains only running between the hours of 0700 and 1900." So it isn't only the London to Glasgow part of your journey that could be affected.

 

However, the wording of that statement underlines how it is likely that you will be able to travel, just not necessarily as currently booked. It seems that Avanti West Coast is being more cautious about avoiding overcrowding on trains on which some passengers will be making very long journeys, hence taking all trains off sale until the strike timetable has been finalised. SWR doesn't have quite the same constraints, and many passengers would do no more than grumble a bit (at the unions, probably) if they have to stand for (say) the 1¼ hours between Southampton and London, which is probably the worst-case scenario for that bit of the journey.

[helovestrains]

We have pre-purchased tickets on SWR for SOU to LON at a specified time without reserved seating and then on Avanti for EUS to GLW at a specified time with reserved seating.  If the number of trains are reduced how would travel work.  Would we still be able to use our current tickets?  Am I just getting ahead of myself?  Thanks again.

[Cotswold Eagle]

28 minutes ago, helovestrains said:

We have pre-purchased tickets on SWR for SOU to LON at a specified time without reserved seating and then on Avanti for EUS to GLW at a specified time with reserved seating.  If the number of trains are reduced how would travel work.  Would we still be able to use our current tickets?  Am I just getting ahead of myself?  Thanks again.

I think you are describing Advance fares, valid only on a particular service. In that case, if the train doesn't run, the ticket can be used on another service, you can get a refund, or in some circumstances travel another day. See the FAQs on National Rail's Industrial Action Page.

[Globaliser]

27 minutes ago, helovestrains said:

If the number of trains are reduced how would travel work.  Would we still be able to use our current tickets?

 

There should be more specific advice by the day of travel.

 

What I recall on the strike day on which I travelled was basically along the lines of: If your booked train operates, you can/should take it. If your booked train doesn't operate, you can take any other train. Also, if you miss your onward booked train because of strike disruption on an earlier part of the journey, you can use your existing ticket to take any other train (and this is a standard provision anyway for a missed connection on a through ticket that's not your fault).

 

The train operating company that I was on also allowed you to make a standalone seat reservation on another train if you wished to have a reserved seat and you couldn't travel on your original train. But there were actually plenty of free seats anyway.

 

My vague impression was that on a strike day, anything goes so far as using tickets on other trains was concerned. But it's safer to know exactly what your TOC actually advises.

[helovestrains]

7 hours ago, Cotswold Eagle said:

I think you are describing Advance fares, valid only on a particular service. In that case, if the train doesn't run, the ticket can be used on another service, you can get a refund, or in some circumstances travel another day. See the FAQs on National Rail's Industrial Action Page.

Yes, I believe it is Advance fare.  Thank you so much for your response. 

[helovestrains]

7 hours ago, Globaliser said:

 

There should be more specific advice by the day of travel.

 

What I recall on the strike day on which I travelled was basically along the lines of: If your booked train operates, you can/should take it. If your booked train doesn't operate, you can take any other train. Also, if you miss your onward booked train because of strike disruption on an earlier part of the journey, you can use your existing ticket to take any other train (and this is a standard provision anyway for a missed connection on a through ticket that's not your fault).

 

The train operating company that I was on also allowed you to make a standalone seat reservation on another train if you wished to have a reserved seat and you couldn't travel on your original train. But there were actually plenty of free seats anyway.

 

My vague impression was that on a strike day, anything goes so far as using tickets on other trains was concerned. But it's safer to know exactly what your TOC actually advises.

Thank you.   I appreciate your comments. 

[Globaliser]

On 8/13/2023 at 12:36 PM, helovestrains said:

We cruise out of Southampton 19 Aug - 02 Sep 23.  Upon disembarkation we have train tickets to Glasgow.   On the national rail site is states that there could be a travel disruption on the London to Glasgow portion and may not run.  The site says to check back closer to 02 Sep 23.

 

FWIW, ASLEF has now announced a strike for Friday 1 September, and an overtime ban on Saturday 2 September. The affected TOCs will publish details of their plans later; but at a guess this will mean that on Saturday 2 September there will be disruption in the morning due to trains being out of position (Friday 1 September may see very few if any trains operated by the affected TOCs), and a reduced service on mainline routes because of a combination of RMT's strike and ASLEF's overtime ban. So my guess remains that there's a good chance that you'll get from Southampton to Glasgow at some stage that day.

[helovestrains]

11 hours ago, Globaliser said:

 

FWIW, ASLEF has now announced a strike for Friday 1 September, and an overtime ban on Saturday 2 September. The affected TOCs will publish details of their plans later; but at a guess this will mean that on Saturday 2 September there will be disruption in the morning due to trains being out of position (Friday 1 September may see very few if any trains operated by the affected TOCs), and a reduced service on mainline routes because of a combination of RMT's strike and ASLEF's overtime ban. So my guess remains that there's a good chance that you'll get from Southampton to Glasgow at some stage that day.

Thank you for the update.

[Globaliser]

You've probably seen that timetables for 2 September will be published tomorrow (25 August) by both SWR and Avanti. Unfortunately, it looks like Avanti has decided to run services only as far north as Preston (and occasionally Carlisle) and won't serve Glasgow that day. However, it looks like LNER will run to Edinburgh Waverley, from which you should be able to reach Glasgow Queen Street easily because those services are operated by ScotRail, which is not affected by the strike.

 

On 8/13/2023 at 2:02 PM, edinburgher said:

And I noticed your username.  Maybe think of changing it after this inconvenience?

 

Maybe it should be helovestrainsbutnotsomuchtraindrivers?

[Harters]

As I understand it, ASLEF (which represents train drivers) are on strike on 1/9 but have a ban on overtime working on 2/9. It is well known that the train operating companies have insufficient staff to work a full timetable without drivers working overtime so, in itself , that sounds like it will be disruptive on 2/9. The RMT (which represents other staff working on the trains, signalling staff, etc), are on strike in their very long running dispute on 2/9. Put the two together,  and it seems clear that not much, if anything, is going to be running on Avanti West Coast London/Glasgow, or LNER London/Edinburgh.  

[Globaliser]

2 hours ago, Harters said:

Put the two together,  and it seems clear that not much, if anything, is going to be running on Avanti West Coast London/Glasgow, or LNER London/Edinburgh.  

 

If you follow those links, which I included for the sake of detail that's as accurate as currently possible, the plan for 2 September (subject to National Rail confirmation) is that Avanti will not run to Glasgow, but LNER will run to Edinburgh.

 

That seemed to me to be important to the OP, who does still have a decent chance of getting to Glasgow by train that day, although unfortunately not on their booked route.

[helovestrains]

 

 

14 hours ago, Globaliser said:

 

If you follow those links, which I included for the sake of detail that's as accurate as currently possible, the plan for 2 September (subject to National Rail confirmation) is that Avanti will not run to Glasgow, but LNER will run to Edinburgh.

 

That seemed to me to be important to the OP, who does still have a decent chance of getting to Glasgow by train that day, although unfortunately not on their booked route.

Looks like we will have a couple more changes to contend with, but we will get from Southampton to Glasgow on the 02 September which is the goal.  Thanks for all the great info you have provided.

[Island2Dweller]

LNER will be running a service from London Kings Cross to Edinburgh on 2 September but it will be very limited - far fewer trains than usual.  This means the few trains that do run are likely to be full and standing.  If you do not have a reservation for one of those services you may well not be able to board.

Personally, I would not attempt it.  I would either change the date of travel or if you must travel that day, take a refund and fly.  Loganair fly from Southamton to Glasgow.  There are also services to Glasgow from Heathrow - which you can reach by coach from Southampton

[fruitmachine]

7 hours ago, Island2Dweller said:

LNER will be running a service from London Kings Cross to Edinburgh on 2 September but it will be very limited - far fewer trains than usual.  This means the few trains that do run are likely to be full and standing.  If you do not have a reservation for one of those services you may well not be able to board.

Personally, I would not attempt it.  I would either change the date of travel or if you must travel that day, take a refund and fly.  Loganair fly from Southamton to Glasgow.  There are also services to Glasgow from Heathrow - which you can reach by coach from Southampton

Personal and immediate family experience of LNER in exactly these circumstances is that everyone else heeded the dire warnings of overcrowding, and the trains were actually much quieter than average. 

 

Just checked the message my BIL sent at the time, and there were only 10 people in his carriage.