New Liverpool cruise terminal

[margo2011]

Hello, is anyone aware who is taking over the terminal from the council ? Rumour has it the cost has now increased to an unsustainable level and they are looking for a cruise line to take over the build and running of the terminal.

Fred is an obvious choice with its history of cruising from Liverpool but it currently only has the one ship visiting on a regular basis.

I was looking at the cruise schedule for 2024 and Viking seem to have three ships visiting on a regular basis or am I just hoping for a prestige line to take over ,no disrespect to Fred.

My family are all cruisers with many many under our belts but would love to cruise from our home port .People say it takes a day to get into the sun ,well I know that I would rather spend it on the ship than at the airport for hours or  hours spent travelling to Southampton.

Any ideas please answers on a post card.

 

regards

 

 

 

 

[tring]

On 9/8/2023 at 10:44 AM, margo2011 said:

Hello, is anyone aware who is taking over the terminal from the council ? Rumour has it the cost has now increased to an unsustainable level and they are looking for a cruise line to take over the build and running of the terminal.

Fred is an obvious choice with its history of cruising from Liverpool but it currently only has the one ship visiting on a regular basis.

I was looking at the cruise schedule for 2024 and Viking seem to have three ships visiting on a regular basis or am I just hoping for a prestige line to take over ,no disrespect to Fred.

My family are all cruisers with many many under our belts but would love to cruise from our home port .People say it takes a day to get into the sun ,well I know that I would rather spend it on the ship than at the airport for hours or  hours spent travelling to Southampton.

Any ideas please answers on a post card.

 

regards

 

 

 

 

 

Interesting, thanks.  We are currently in Canada, so not picking up local news.  Will follow after we return.

 

[twotravellersLondon]

No great signs on the horizon. It's nine month now since Liverpool decided to pull out of the project due to estimated costs escalating from £50 million to £88 million.

 

FOCLs are in deep debt and so far seems to have been unable to sell the Braemar which was put up for sale in November 2022. What does the future hold for FOCLs now that the first instalment of about £7,000,000 on the purchase of the old Amsterdam and Rotterdam from Holland America seems to be due. It's wait and see.

 

Bonheur, Fred's parent company in Norway could be interested and are currently looking at the Norwegian bond market... but it's wait and see on that eventuality.

 

"Fred" in our opinion often seems to charge more for cruises from Liverpool. We've just had a flyer advertising the "Fleet in Funchal. We have a 15 night cruise from Southampton on the Bolette or the Balmoral from £1,299pp for 15 days or... we can spend £200pp more for one less day cruising on the Bolette from Liverpool. Add the cost and time travelling from the South-East to and from Liverpool... it's a non starter.

 

FOCLs have a hard sell to almost double the number of passengers sailing on the Bolette from Liverpool compared to the numbers sailing on the Black Watch. That may well be a deterrent.

[westerdam]

16 hours ago, twotravellersLondon said:

 

No great signs on the horizon. It's nine month now since Liverpool decided to pull out of the project due to estimated costs escalating from £50 million to £88 million.

 

FOCLs are in deep debt and so far seems to have been unable to sell the Braemar which was put up for sale in November 2022. What does the future hold for FOCLs now that the first instalment of about £7,000,000 on the purchase of the old Amsterdam and Rotterdam from Holland America seems to be due. It's wait and see.

 

Bonheur, Fred's parent company in Norway could be interested and are currently looking at the Norwegian bond market... but it's wait and see on that eventuality.

 

"Fred" in our opinion often seems to charge more for cruises from Liverpool. We've just had a flyer advertising the "Fleet in Funchal. We have a 15 night cruise from Southampton on the Bolette or the Balmoral from £1,299pp for 15 days or... we can spend £200pp more for one less day cruising on the Bolette from Liverpool. Add the cost and time travelling from the South-East to and from Liverpool... it's a non starter.

 

FOCLs have a hard sell to almost double the number of passengers sailing on the Bolette from Liverpool compared to the numbers sailing on the Black Watch. That may well be a deterrent.

I am rather surprised that they did not charter out the Braemar to house all the Ukrainian refugees. Maybe by the time she would be done with that she could be brought back to regular service if the numbers warranted it or just sold for scrap at that point due to her advanced age.  

[twotravellersLondon]

4 hours ago, westerdam said:

I am rather surprised that they did not charter out the Braemar to house all the Ukrainian refugees. Maybe by the time she would be done with that she could be brought back to regular service if the numbers warranted it or just sold for scrap at that point due to her advanced age.  

 

It may well be that the Braemar just isn't fit to sail or to accommodate people. 

 

When a ship is mothballed, many of the key navigation, safety and other systems can go past their use-by-date and need to be re-certified In order to be approved by the marine authorities. This involves the UK authorities, the Bahamas where the Braemar is registered, and it's not a simple task. When the Balmoral was initially brought back into service, the operation took months and the company reported that the cost of putting the ship to sea again had a significant impact on the company finances.

 

The Braemar can't simply "be sold for scrap". Bonheur insist that when the Black Watch was sold a sales clause insisted that the new owners and all subsequent owners had to agree to the far more expensive "recycling" process. That seriously diminishes the value of the ship.

 

So it may well be that, without substantial investment, the Braemar is now a floating hulk... unfit to go to sea.

 

So with that in mind... it seems highly unlikely that FOCLs will have any spare cash to buy into a Liverpool Cruise-Terminal... but never say never as far as Bonheur is concerned.

 

 

[margo2011]

Thank  you for your thoughtful insight.We have heard an announcement is due shortly .Possibly could be MSC haven't tried them so can’t comment .

 

I personally would love Cunard to return to our city .Many people would love to cruise from Liverpool and I know people we have been fortunate to meet on cruises from around the world agree.

 

fingers crossed for an international cruise line sooner rather than later ,we are holding out on booking for 2024 in hope to hear something soon .

 

Thank you all .

 

 

 

 

[Eglesbrech]

2 hours ago, margo2011 said:

Thank  you for your thoughtful insight.We have heard an announcement is due shortly .Possibly could be MSC haven't tried them so can’t comment .

 

I personally would love Cunard to return to our city .Many people would love to cruise from Liverpool and I know people we have been fortunate to meet on cruises from around the world agree.

 

fingers crossed for an international cruise line sooner rather than later ,we are holding out on booking for 2024 in hope to hear something soon .

 

Thank you all .

 

 

 

 

I would love to cruise from Liverpool. Much easier than Southampton.

 

During the pandemic MSC embarked at a number of ports, for example Greenock so they have done it. Also in the winter they embark /disembark from 4 European ports for the same cruise (Southampton, Rotterdam, Hamburg and Le Harve). Consequently the staff, IT systems etc are very used to frequent change over days so it’s not impossible they could include Liverpool.

 

We only started cruising with MSC last year when Fred cancelled our cruise 3 days before it was due to sail due to a propeller issue. MSC was the only thing available for the date. Fred did us a favour as we have taken several MSC cruises since and have more booked. Love the Yacht Club experience.

 

I will be really interested to see what happens with this. Perhaps @tring can update us once back home (hope you are having a fun time in Canada).

[twotravellersLondon]

On 9/8/2023 at 10:44 AM, margo2011 said:

I just hoping for a prestige line to take over

 

18 hours ago, Eglesbrech said:

I would love to cruise from Liverpool. Much easier than Southampton.

 

During the pandemic MSC embarked at a number of ports, for example Greenock so they have done it. Also in the winter they embark /disembark from 4 European ports for the same cruise (Southampton, Rotterdam, Hamburg and Le Harve). Consequently the staff, IT systems etc are very used to frequent change over days so it’s not impossible they could include Liverpool.

 

We only started cruising with MSC last year when Fred cancelled our cruise 3 days before it was due to sail due to a propeller issue. MSC was the only thing available for the date. Fred did us a favour as we have taken several MSC cruises since and have more booked. Love the Yacht Club experience.

 

I will be really interested to see what happens with this. Perhaps @tring can update us once back home (hope you are having a fun time in Canada).

 

 

The latest news from Liverpool is that the entire idea of a new cruise terminal has been "put on ice." The main reason is escalating costs in the face pf the reality that the number of cruise passengers using Liverpool is still below pre-pandemic levels but there are significant environmental issues for many on the council as well. (Check out the latest on Liverpool Airport)

 

A decision on the new terminal is now expected sometime in 2024 but it may simply result in a partnership with private developers to improve the existing facilities and the city infrastructure... that's what's being discussed at the moment... sounds more and more like property development rather than a cruise-line's own terminal. So we really can't see a "prestige" cruise line taking over the terminal but time will tell.

 

Anyway the concept of a company like MSC spending tens of millions on a Liverpool base and using it as one of a number of embarkation ports for individual cruises has it's problems. Costa do this exceptionally well in parts of the Mediterranean where there are numerous ports with good links to the hinterland and passengers embark and disembark on a daily basis. The simply problem is that Liverpool is a bit off the beaten track and would require additional sea days.

 

Having lived in Aberdeen for years, we would have been so grateful for cruise lines stooping off there to pick up and drop off passengers... perhaps for a trip to the Fjords... but not a single cruise company (not even "Fred") showed any interest.

 

Perhaps if Liverpool was to attract far more cruise passengers... but chicken and egg.

 

 

Anyone interested in the Liverpool terminal might look for comments or reports featuring John Mawer, Head of Cruise and Operations at Cruise Liverpool. Such is the wonder of the internet these days!

[margo2011]

Thank you for your thoughts ,you never know with the new destinations next year from Liverpool airport this could help .We are destination in itself as shown by the increase in hotels ,which show room occupancy has never been higher .

 

thanks again 

[twotravellersLondon]

1 hour ago, margo2011 said:

Thank you for your thoughts ,you never know with the new destinations next year from Liverpool airport this could help .We are destination in itself as shown by the increase in hotels ,which show room occupancy has never been higher .

 

thanks again 

 

We've visited the city a number of times and have enjoyed our time there.

 

Perhaps the Local Authority has the vision that Liverpool and the surrounding region should be a resort attracting visiting cruise ships rather than just Liverpool being an embarkation and disembarkation port.

[Eglesbrech]

8 hours ago, twotravellersLondon said:

 

Having lived in Aberdeen for years, we would have been so grateful for cruise lines stooping off there to pick up and drop off passengers... perhaps for a trip to the Fjords... but not a single cruise company (not even "Fred") showed any interest.

As an aside Aberdeen is more popular now that they have the new port. A number of cruise ships scheduled.

[westerdam]

On 9/14/2023 at 1:01 AM, twotravellersLondon said:

 

It may well be that the Braemar just isn't fit to sail or to accommodate people. 

 

When a ship is mothballed, many of the key navigation, safety and other systems can go past their use-by-date and need to be re-certified In order to be approved by the marine authorities. This involves the UK authorities, the Bahamas where the Braemar is registered, and it's not a simple task. When the Balmoral was initially brought back into service, the operation took months and the company reported that the cost of putting the ship to sea again had a significant impact on the company finances.

 

The Braemar can't simply "be sold for scrap". Bonheur insist that when the Black Watch was sold a sales clause insisted that the new owners and all subsequent owners had to agree to the far more expensive "recycling" process. That seriously diminishes the value of the ship.

 

So it may well be that, without substantial investment, the Braemar is now a floating hulk... unfit to go to sea.

 

So with that in mind... it seems highly unlikely that FOCLs will have any spare cash to buy into a Liverpool Cruise-Terminal... but never say never as far as Bonheur is concerned.

 

 

I do not debate anything that you said.  I do recall even my own ship when I was in the US Navy and when it was brought back into service after being in the shipyards for drydock and repairs it took months afterwards to get everything back together and set right. 

 

Braemar has been a dead ship more or less for over a year. In cold iron status (as far as I know) I am sure it would be prohibitively expensive to bring her back to life and class. Even if it was just for non sailing purposes as an accommodation ship. 

 

As for her possible sale for scrapping/recycling I do remember the entire debacle a year or so ago with the Black Watch going off to Alang and the parent company of Fred fighting it. She still went none the less. Perhaps this time if it comes down to it they should just sell direct to an EU approved breaker like the ones in Turkey.  

 

So I do agree for now that she has become sadly nothing more than an expensive hulk.