Spirit of Adventure: riding out the storm ?

[FannyLiz]

1 minute ago, Windsurfboy said:

Any goodwill payment  should be extended to the crew

Hear hear to that ! They seem to have gone above and beyond to have cooked meals, served them, dealt with injuries and vomit, kept everything running and all when no doubt  many of them felt awful themselves.

[Glad Bailey]

SOD- Captain has just given us an update,and we should

be docking in Portsmouth about 21.00 this evening

 

We are in the English Chanel and sea conditions are smooth.

As part of his update the Captain read out a letter from Saga CEO

 Nigel Banks,a copy of which will be sent to our cabins later.

Apologies were given and the rationale for crossing the Bay during

the storm were explained (basically that La Coruna,Lisbon etc we’re not

available)

Some passengers were accepting,others not.

Nigel also said we shall receive another letter once home with offer

of compensation

[JMMKUK]

3 hours ago, FannyLiz said:

I do hope they provide transport into Bilbao and don’t let them think that Santurtzi is “ it”.  

Only times I've known them not to is when taxi drivers etc won't allow it.

When we were in Bergen on Pearl 2 passengers from other ships tried to use our free shuttle busses. Children & teens were a bit obvious though.

[nosapphire]

It seems that one area where Saga may be making problems for themselves is lack of information given out at the time.

I remember when I was a commuter, and quite frequently the train would shudder to a halt and we would sit there.. and sit there....

If there was no communication, tempers started to rise.

If the driver came on the tannoy to tell us, then we all grumbled to each other ("typical" was a very - er - typical word used).
Even if the driver said something like, "Sorry, I have a red light, It have no idea why, I am trying to find out" it immediately defused the situation.

While a halted train is nothing like a ship in a storm, the same principle applies - keep people updated and the majority will understand.

 

(The best train reason for a sudden stop I heard from the driver was,

"There are two swans on the track. They probably think we are still on strike. I got out to shoo them off and they stood up and hissed at me. I am back in the cab waiting for assistance from the RSPCA".)

**

 

 

 

 

[Dermotsgirl]

More news from ‘elsewhere’

 

An apology statement from the Saga CEO has been read out by the captain, passengers have also been advised that they will be contacted individually later in the week. 
 

The person reporting this has been a particularly clear voice throughout the incident, so I thought it was worth mentioning that she says that 7 people will be taken to hospital this evening when SOD docks. She also says that 150 passengers needed medical attention for falls etc, that’s about 15% of the passengers. 
 

I also have to wonder how many got some bumps and bruises that didn’t need medical attention 

[JoJo1947]

19 hours ago, Whiteduck1 said:

Firstly sympathys to all aboard. Can't imagine how awful and scary it was for you. 

Just asking and if I'm being silly just say.. Why are you still having food in and being told to stay in the cabins in what now looks like fairly normal stormy weather during the winter months. Is it because the restaurant is still being used as a field hospital? ... 

Being cynical I wonder if they want to keep the passengers in their cabins and apart so that they don't start asking very difficult questions..... If I was the Captain I would start looking forward to my new job with Saga, probably involving toilet duck..... 

Safety given the age and disability of guests. Silly remark re the Captain cleaning toilets. The team have done their best in exceptional circumstances and I congratulate them and the wonderful crew working through this. Seasickness hits them too

[FannyLiz]

26 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

 

I also have to wonder how many got some bumps and bruises that didn’t need medical attention 

I wonder how many crew were injured ? Hard to avoid getting burnt as a chef or kitchen worker, falling when carrying heavy trays, even getting trapped when heavy doors swing back on you when you haven’t got a free hand. Goodness knows how many bumped heads in the engine room.

 

( I speak as someone who was thrown into a Christmas tree, chipped a chunk out of my leg on its stand and then, on the rebound, got thrown into a plate glass window, not quite head first. There didn’t seem anyone about to be sympathetic so I went back to our cabin to have a lie down. I’d only gone out to find some food)

 

[twotravellersLondon]

 

A lot of these comments seem to be very sound. But...

 

1 hour ago, Dermotsgirl said:

the decision making process ended up putting the ship in the middle of the weather

 

However having watched the scenario, it would seem that the weather was worse in every direction around the ship and that the ship maneuvered in such a way as to mitigate the worst effects. While some passengers have posted about the conditions... it would seem that less than a hundred miles in any direction the sea and wind conditions would have been significantly worse. 

 

There's an awful lot to consider without the full details needs the skills and knowledge to make sense of what's happened.

 

Having (20 years ago) crossed the North Atlantic in a small ship with no stabilisers in a cabin immediately behind the bridge on the top deck... we were less than satisfied with the Captain's response when we literally bumped into him as we were being tossed about by the entrance to our cabin and the bridge... when he shrugged his shoulders and said... "Well it is the North Atlantic!"

 

So we have immense sympathy with the passengers and crew.

[Windsurfboy]

On 11/2/2023 at 5:03 PM, Windsurfboy said:

If SoD keeps going may hit 9 meter waves. Could drop La Corona and spend day in port further south, Cadiz say and let waves die down

 

There was the alternative of staying well South untill it died off. Once they had commited to go north they ended up with no good alternatives. 

 

Note  SoD was just out of Canaries South of Gibraltar at the time.  

[david05]

Whatever the in and outs of the decision making, you can expect that, whilst the Captain is ultimately responsible, the decision to proceed would have been agreed with HQ. Feel very sorry for the passengers and crew but it was a very difficult call to make. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. 

[rslrhu]

It is a difficult decision to make, of course, but the priority is the safety of the passengers, crew and ship.  It was known that La Coruna was shut on Friday morning when the ship was still off Lisbon.  Was there really no option to turn back south, hugely inconvenient, but safer?  I hope the reason for not doing this will be explained by the CEO, as he has done for the Lisbon and Porto options.  If it's true that the strikes in Portugal were not until today, he needs to further clarify this as well though.  He needs to be fully transparent about all the options and reasons they were discarded, otherwise there will always be a suspicion that this was at least partially a business decision.

[seasickphil]

2 hours ago, FannyLiz said:

falling when carrying heavy trays

 

I think they would use a trolly to transport food and drinks to the cabins, carrying trays in those conditions would be extremely difficult.

[Harry Peterson]

Once you understand the financial position of the Saga group of companies, you start to view decisions like this in a different light. And you can imagine a scenario in which a captain might take a particular view, but be overruled by someone further up the management chain. I’m not for a minute suggesting the ship was put at risk, but decisions made for the wrong reasons were the underlying cause of the Titanic disaster.

 

Saga once had an impeccable record for absolute trustworthiness. However, for large numbers of Saga life members earlier this year they proved themselves anything but trustworthy by unilaterally cancelling the legal right of all those life members (who paid a hefty advance sum) to receive the Saga magazine every month. No excuses, no reasons (other than financial), no backing down by the CEO (who has a fascinating track record before Saga)  - just tough luck. We don’t care.

 

Maybe that’s the sort of thinking from the top that’s behind this. 

[Dermotsgirl]

On 11/2/2023 at 5:03 PM, Windsurfboy said:

If SoD keeps going may hit 9 meter waves. Could drop La Corona and spend day in port further south, Cadiz say and let waves die down

Your post from Thursday, is a perfect illustration of what I was thinking about.

 

These days, we have access to weather models and forecasts where ever we are, and that includes onboard the ship.

 

No doubt there were passengers on SOD following the forecasts - indeed, I've seen one comment from someone saying that he was getting more scared the further north they went, as he could see what they were heading into.

 

When you posted your message on Thursday, SOD still had several  options available.  They may not have been desirable to Saga, as most of the options would involve being late back into Portsmouth, but the options were there. But, by making the decision to keep going north, the options got fewer and fewer until the only option was to ride out the storm at sea.

 

If I was on board, I think I'd be feeling that, so far, the full truth is not known. When I got home, I'd be writing to Saga, asking lots of questions.  I think the full truth would matter more to me than any good will gesture.

 

(PS, good call from you on Thursday)

[Windsurfboy]

2 hours ago, david05 said:

. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. 

 

Note the date on my initial post, this was not hindsight. 

[david05]

5 minutes ago, Windsurfboy said:

 

Note the date on my initial post, this was not hindsight. 

My apologies if you thought my comment was directed at you. It was a general comment that it is always easier to say what should be done after the event.

[Windsurfboy]

There is a whole science of decision making, contingency analysis  and gaming, to try , note try, and ensure you don't end up in the position where it'sonly  a choice between least worse. Which is why it's always nice if the captain is ex navy, as they spend as much timing being trained in forward thinking as in seamanship.

[Method81]

6 hours ago, twotravellersLondon said:

However having watched the scenario, it would seem that the weather was worse in every direction around the ship and that the ship maneuvered in such a way as to mitigate the worst effects. While some passengers have posted about the conditions... it would seem that less than a hundred miles in any direction the sea and wind conditions would have been significantly worse. 

SOD went right into the heart of the storm building up to a sustained 12.8m swell, the storm eventually passed over them. They couldn’t have been in a worse position for sea conditions.

[JMMKUK]

Good to see on CruiseMapper that SoD is now safe in Portsmouth.

Hope everyone on board can sleep easy tonight after the trauma of the last 5 or 6 days.

[FannyLiz]

7 minutes ago, JMMKUK said:

Good to see on CruiseMapper that SoD is now safe in Portsmouth.

Hope everyone on board can sleep easy tonight after the trauma of the last 5 or 6 days.

I guess the crew will be too busy clearing up to sleep well

 

A couple of newspaper reports I have seen are reporrting:

:  

“The incident happened when ship's propulsion safety system activated at 12.30pm and turned the ship - resulting in the injuries to around 100 of the 1,000 passengers on board” 

 

as the cause of the injuries, when the ship was hove to near A Corunā.

[Windsurfboy]

Wellcome home

[Dermotsgirl]

1 hour ago, FannyLiz said:

I guess the crew will be too busy clearing up to sleep well

 

A couple of newspaper reports I have seen are reporrting:

:  

“The incident happened when ship's propulsion safety system activated at 12.30pm and turned the ship - resulting in the injuries to around 100 of the 1,000 passengers on board” 

 

as the cause of the injuries, when the ship was hove to near A Corunā.

People onboard are saying the news report is not accurate - they say injuries happened both before and after the ‘hove to’ and not as a result of it

 

The report I saw also said that they were keeping ahead of the storm, and if they turned round to go back, they’d be sailing towards the storm. Whereas we know that they were always sailing towards the storm.

 

i hope this is just poor reporting, and not what Saga’s press release says! 

 

 

[twotravellersLondon]

9 hours ago, Method81 said:

SOD went right into the heart of the storm building up to a sustained 12.8m swell, the storm eventually passed over them. They couldn’t have been in a worse position for sea conditions.

 

The evidence seems to shows otherwise... have a look at post 142 which contains this screen-shot.

 

The most severe winds and waves are orange, red and brown. The less severe wind and waves are green and blue. 

 

The green window is about 300 miles wide. One hundred miles in any direction would have been worse.

 

 

What do you base your post on?

Edited November 7, 2023 by twotravellersLondon

[Zeg]

So the SOD lived up to its name!

 

A speedy recovery to the injured and a satisfactory resolution from Saga. 

[rslrhu]

2 hours ago, twotravellersLondon said:

 

The evidence seems to shows otherwise... have a look at post 142 which contains this screen-shot.

 

The most severe winds and waves are orange, red and brown. The less severe wind and waves are green and blue. 

 

The green window is about 300 miles wide. One hundred miles in any direction would have been worse.

 

 

What do you base your post on?

This screenshot was from Sunday when the worst of the wind had passed but the swell was still significant.  I wish I'd taken a screenshot from Saturday because that showed an altogether different story - I was tracking it out of concern for my Mum and couldn't believe that they were pushing on.  The swell chart was at the top of the scale on Windy.com, as it had been forecast to be.  As I said, more clarification needed as to why it wasn't possible to turn back south when they first knew there was no other options north on Friday.