Maleth confirms end of P&O partnership

[Interestedcruisefan]

6 hours ago, doog442 said:

 

Strange .They advertise 34" for their 787 dreamliners. Every long haul I've done with them has been 34 which has been much better than Virgin or BA economy, the Virgin Caribbean fleet being absolutely diabolical.  

 

"Most of our long-haul flights are on high-spec TUI 787 Dreamliners, so you’ll have at least 34 inches of legroom – that’s more than most planes. "

 

https://www.tui.co.uk/discover/top-tips-for-long-haul-flights

 

Have things changed?

When I went dreamliner to Montego Bay last month from Birmingham and back the legroom didn't seem good tbh

 

I'm only 5ft11

[Cumbrian1]

15 hours ago, EmilyJay said:

The only thing not stated which I did ask was can we bring a cabin case + a backpack/ handbag for under the seat. If anyone knows this I'll be very grateful, usually I only take a backpack however, I have a few books to pack as extras for this flight which I don't want to carry in my bag.

We travelled back Barbados - Manchester with Maleth on Friday 10th Nov, after the Transatlantic Cruise on Arvia. Bearing in mind there was no restrictions at Southhampton, and the hold cases were bonded from Arvia, both my wife and I took a 10kg cabin bag and 'personal' luggage into the Aircraft.

 

My wife took a cloth handbag that measures 45 x 45 cm when flat ( see pic below).

 

I had a man bag that carried, a 10" tablet, 7" kindle, smartphone, wallet, specs case, passports, charging leads and plugs and ghic.

 

 

I also caused quite a stir by, in 30°C heat and 90% humidity, wearing my waterproof coat with gloves hat and rolled up sweater stuffed in the pockets whilst transiting the airport. Took it off as soon as through Security and it went with my cabin bag in the overhead locker on the plane.

Glad I did as it was 1°C at Manchester.

 

Bear in mind that it may be different if you are flying both ways as you will be checking in at the UK Airport and may be subject to different scrutiny. Bear in mind also that your 'liquids'allowance is now 100ml.

[Interestedcruisefan]

1 minute ago, Cumbrian1 said:

We travelled back Barbados - Manchester with Maleth on Friday 10th Nov, after the Transatlantic Cruise on Arvia. Bearing in mind there was no restrictions at Southhampton, and the hold cases were bonded from Arvia, both my wife and I took a 10kg cabin bag and 'personal' luggage into the Aircraft.

 

My wife took a cloth handbag that measures 45 x 45 cm when flat ( see pic below).

 

I had a man bag that carried, a 10" tablet, 7" kindle, smartphone, wallet, specs case, passports, charging leads and plugs and ghic.

 

 

I also caused quite a stir by, in 30°C heat and 90% humidity, wearing my waterproof coat with gloves hat and rolled up sweater stuffed in the pockets whilst transiting the airport. Took it off as soon as through Security and it went with my cabin bag in the overhead locker on the plane.

Glad I did as it was 1°C at Manchester.

 

Bear in mind that it may be different if you are flying both ways as you will be checking in at the UK Airport and may be subject to different scrutiny. Bear in mind also that your 'liquids'allowance is now 100ml.

How was the flight experience itself?

[Cumbrian1]

13 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

How was the flight experience itself?

 

The flight itself, not as bad as predicted!🫢

 

See post #656 page 27

[Interestedcruisefan]

21 minutes ago, Cumbrian1 said:

 

The flight itself, not as bad as predicted!🫢

 

See post #656 page 27

Sorry hadn't realised that was your post I'd seen already

 

Yep all seems ok and the food pics look good for plane food. Will take a couple of good books and some entertainment. Probably do vat return again on the way as well!! Lol

 

And I had only booked standard seats so no complaints from me

 

 

[snaefell]

22 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Sorry hadn't realised that was your post I'd seen already

 

Yep all seems ok and the food pics look good for plane food. Will take a couple of good books and some entertainment. Probably do vat return again on the way as well!! Lol

 

And I had only booked standard seats so no complaints from me

 

 

The cynic in me thinks your positive report isn't half going to disappoint some posters!😂😂

[Interestedcruisefan]

4 minutes ago, snaefell said:

The cynic in me thinks your positive report isn't half going to disappoint some posters!😂😂

Tbf it can't help premium economy guests

 

But as I said the food and drink options seem good. Staff have got good reviews.

 

Thats half the battle won for the rest of us!

 

Ps that reminds me from our return flights to Montego Bay with Tui recently

 

Don't air stewards and stewardesses work so so hard??

 

Pretty much non stop for 10 hrs ish. Maybe a very short break in the middle 

 

They don't get tips but if anyone on your holidays works harder than them I would be amazed. 

 

They must walk miles and miles each flight dealing  with every sort of the question and problem you can imagine

 

All the time trying to smile and be pleasant etc

 

Hats off to cabin crew!!

 

From me

Edited November 15, 2023 by Interestedcruisefan

[snaefell]

12 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Tbf it can't help premium economy guests

 

But as I said the food and drink options seem good. Staff have got good reviews.

 

Thats half the battle won for the rest of us!

 

Ps that reminds me from our return flights to Montego Bay with Tui recently

 

Don't air stewards and stewardesses work so so hard??

 

Pretty much non stop for 10 hrs ish. Maybe a very short break in the middle 

 

They don't get tips but if anyone on your holidays works harder than them I would be amazed. 

 

They must walk miles and miles each flight dealing  with every sort of the question and problem you can imagine

 

All the time trying to smile and be pleasant etc

 

Hats off to cabin crew!!

 

From me

Certainly agree there,glad your flight turned out to be a pleasant experience after all the speculation!

[carlanthony24]

1 hour ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Tbf it can't help premium economy guests

 

But as I said the food and drink options seem good. Staff have got good reviews.

 

Thats half the battle won for the rest of us!

 

Ps that reminds me from our return flights to Montego Bay with Tui recently

 

Don't air stewards and stewardesses work so so hard??

 

Pretty much non stop for 10 hrs ish. Maybe a very short break in the middle 

 

They don't get tips but if anyone on your holidays works harder than them I would be amazed. 

 

They must walk miles and miles each flight dealing  with every sort of the question and problem you can imagine

 

All the time trying to smile and be pleasant etc

 

Hats off to cabin crew!!

 

From me

Not easy at times. Especially dealing with medical emergencies and people like to abuse you because you can’t serve them. Depending on flight you could be doing nothing.

 

A Larnaca for example you could do two drink services and do a gift shop but don’t sell much, are very boring flights especially if it’s a night flight. Remember my first official flight to Grenoble last winter flight of the season. Two passengers on the way out full flight ok the way back and it was chaos.

[Interestedcruisefan]

1 hour ago, snaefell said:

Certainly agree there,glad your flight turned out to be a pleasant experience after all the speculation!

Not my flight. It's somebody else's on Maleth that was ok.

 

We don't fly on Maleth til February.

 

My recent flight was non cruise related for a fabulous family holiday in Jamaica.

 

With Tui flights. 

[carlanthony24]

Inside knowledge from someone on another site. TUI dropping Vardero and Puerto Vallarta next year from MAN. Wonder what routes they will put the 787 on now. Maybe use them for P&O.

[cheshire]

Well It was almost inevitable it would happen sooner or later but Fridays Maleth Manchester flight was delayed almost 12 hours.    The 09:30 finally departed at 21:01.   Initially a replacement aircraft was going to come from Gatwick.  This was put back three times before Maleth finally positioned a replacement aircraft in from France around 7pm.  The replacement aircraft actually had 50 fewer seats than that scheduled to operate so I hope they all got on.  
 

let’s hope it’s a one off and lessons will be learned should their be a recurrence this winter.    Passengers will arrive in Bridgetown 02:00 local time.  Passengers leaving Barbados aren’t expected to leave before 03:30.   That’s a long day for everybody. 

 

passengers on Aer Lingus meanwhile have been stuck for two days in Barbados after one of their aircraft had an issue.  

[Interestedcruisefan]

What lessons can be learnt exactly?

 

This kind of thing happens all the time with all airlines doesn't it?

 

Planes have issues that cause another plane to be needed on occasion?

[cheshire]

3 hours ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

What lessons can be learnt exactly?

 

This kind of thing happens all the time with all airlines doesn't it?

 

Planes have issues that cause another plane to be needed on occasion?

Well the back up plan of using the Gatwick aircraft failed as its scheduled to fly on a Saturday do not enough time.  
 

the aircraft they substituted had 50 fewer seats.  That won’t work in January or over Christmas I’m sure.  
 

the aircraft had been in Manchester for four days sitting there going nowhere.  Its well known aircraft need to be used.  Perhaps the preparations for the Barbados flight should have started earlier to identify the issue affecting the aircraft.  
 

what maintenance agreements are in place at Manchester.   I could go on but I think you have the idea.  I was briefly involved in running an airline once.  The fist days of winter always found out a few issues.   Costly ones too

[Megabear2]

There is a worldwide shortage of aircraft due to delays in deliveries.  On several occasions last year there were very long delays for P&O passengers, these being TUI flights. I believe one Christmas flight from Manchester had a 12 hour delay last year so delays of this length have occurred.  One Glasgow flight failed to arrive in Barbados on the Friday at the same time and the passengers were returned overnight to the ship.  Unfortunately it happens.  Maleth are going to unfortunately be a little more open to a long delay if an aircraft goes technical, purely down to them having less aircraft to call upon at short notice.  However they did thankfully source the aircraft and passengers did make it to Barbados.  The real gamble on all these flights whatever operator is the Saturday flights getting into the Caribbean in reasonable time as the ship's schedule will be impacted.  A couple of years back Britannia waited a day extra in Barbados for late aircraft arrivals which led to the loss of the first port of call.  To their credit P&O laid on excursions, and gave everyone some OBC by way of compensation.  

 

Travelling a long distance to join a ship is a risk and passengers need to accept that.

[zap99]

59 minutes ago, cheshire said:

Well the back up plan of using the Gatwick aircraft failed as its scheduled to fly on a Saturday do not enough time.  
 

the aircraft they substituted had 50 fewer seats.  That won’t work in January or over Christmas I’m sure.  
 

the aircraft had been in Manchester for four days sitting there going nowhere.  Its well known aircraft need to be used.  Perhaps the preparations for the Barbados flight should have started earlier to identify the issue affecting the aircraft.  
 

what maintenance agreements are in place at Manchester.   I could go on but I think you have the idea.  I was briefly involved in running an airline once.  The fist days of winter always found out a few issues.   Costly ones too

They could gave got one from Air Lingus.  Oh !  You mentioned them as well.🤣

[cheshire]

1 hour ago, Megabear2 said:

There is a worldwide shortage of aircraft due to delays in deliveries.  On several occasions last year there were very long delays for P&O passengers, these being TUI flights. I believe one Christmas flight from Manchester had a 12 hour delay last year so delays of this length have occurred.  One Glasgow flight failed to arrive in Barbados on the Friday at the same time and the passengers were returned overnight to the ship.  Unfortunately it happens.  Maleth are going to unfortunately be a little more open to a long delay if an aircraft goes technical, purely down to them having less aircraft to call upon at short notice.  However they did thankfully source the aircraft and passengers did make it to Barbados.  The real gamble on all these flights whatever operator is the Saturday flights getting into the Caribbean in reasonable time as the ship's schedule will be impacted.  A couple of years back Britannia waited a day extra in Barbados for late aircraft arrivals which led to the loss of the first port of call.  To their credit P&O laid on excursions, and gave everyone some OBC by way of compensation.  

 

Travelling a long distance to join a ship is a risk and passengers need to accept that.

The Tui issues last year were due to the fact that because of covid planned maintenance of the aircraft had been delayed.  When they they went to Abu Dhabi and Singapore for major maintenance ahead of the busy long haul flying season several issues were identified on a number of aircraft that meant they were delayed in maintenance.  This had a cumulative impact on flight schedules pre Christmas that they finally got back in track with.  
 

Tui have reduced the number of uk airports too on Barbados in an attempt to give more resilience in the event of issues. 

[cheshire]

10 minutes ago, zap99 said:

They could gave got one from Air Lingus.  Oh !  You mentioned them as well.🤣

Not sure of your point there.  But Again Only one in the A330 on the uk register which is why the aircraft was stuck in Barbados.    Virgin and BA have more frequent services and a larger long haul fleet to offer more reliability but their flights cost more.  You decide.  

Edited December 2, 2023 by cheshire

[zap99]

14 minutes ago, cheshire said:

Not sure of your point there.  But Again Only one in the A330 on the uk register which is why the aircraft was stuck in Barbados.    Virgin and BA have more frequent services and a larger long haul fleet to offer more reliability but their flights cost more.  You decide.  

Just making the point that Aircraft/ships/coaches etc break. Not many airlines have spares..just in case.

[cheshire]

8 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Just making the point that Aircraft/ships/coaches etc break. Not many airlines have spares..just in case.

Very much aware of that.   Tui actually had a 787 at Manchester for 14 hours sitting waiting as a back up. the point is the choice of Maleth as an operator had a certain degree of risk.  This has been shown 

[Denarius]

5 hours ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

What lessons can be learnt exactly?

 

This kind of thing happens all the time with all airlines doesn't it?

 

Planes have issues that cause another plane to be needed on occasion?

It does. I recently flew from Manchester to Amsterdam and back on scheduled flights with a reputable national carrier. The outward flight was excellent and the plane had good sized seats and plenty of legroom. Not so the return flight. We were advised that a chartered aircraft was being used and that all wheeled cabin cases should be stored in the hold at no extra charge as storage in the cabin was extremely limited; a harbinger of things to come. The plane, owned by an airline I had never heard of before and whose name I have since forgotten, was the worst I have ever encountered in over 50 years of flying. The seats were so narrow that I felt cramped, and I am only 5 foot 5 inches and weigh about 9 stone 9 pounds. And my knees were only about 3 or 4 inches from the back of the seat in front of me. So if this can happen on a scheduled flight, what hope for charters?

Edited December 2, 2023 by Denarius

[Megabear2]

23 minutes ago, cheshire said:

The Tui issues last year were due to the fact that because of covid planned maintenance of the aircraft had been delayed.  When they they went to Abu Dhabi and Singapore for major maintenance ahead of the busy long haul flying season several issues were identified on a number of aircraft that meant they were delayed in maintenance.  This had a cumulative impact on flight schedules pre Christmas that they finally got back in track with.  
 

Tui have reduced the number of uk airports too on Barbados in an attempt to give more resilience in the event of issues. 

Thank you for the information.  As one of the people affected by TUI flight problems over the past few years (and also the broken entertainment system) I was simply pointing out that no matter which airline technical issues happen.  These P&O charters very rarely leave on time regardless of which airline although last year's flights truly were a nightmare regardless of which airport was the source.  

 

As has been mentioned throughout this thread both Virgin and BA had no aircraft to offer to P&O this year for charters.  In your reply to Zap you mentioned higher cost and choice.  Are you advocating that P&O stop the charters and get passengers to add on flights?

 

Interestingly going forward to 2025/26 Cunard are moving Queen Elizabeth to a winter Caribbean season.  There will presumably therefore be more pressure on air services to that reason to meet the demand and it will be interesting to see what arrangements are being put in place for these cruises.  Meantime we have Princess considering chartering to fly people to their Mediterranean based ships due to the difficulties they are having getting their guests to thr region.

 

It is going to be an interesting time with fly cruises, particularly if the new aircraft deliveries don't start rolling through.

[terrierjohn]

53 minutes ago, cheshire said:

Very much aware of that.   Tui actually had a 787 at Manchester for 14 hours sitting waiting as a back up. the point is the choice of Maleth as an operator had a certain degree of risk.  This has been shown 

It had far less risk than having no operator at all, resulting in major operating losses in this seasons Caribbean fly cruise programme.

[cheshire]

2 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

It had far less risk than having no operator at all, resulting in major operating losses in this seasons Caribbean fly cruise programme.

The late changes to flights indicate poor planning from p&O management.  Arvia was ordered in 2018 with its Caribbean programme in mind.  It’s pretty easy to calculate the number of aircraft seats required to fill the cabins onboard with slight variances being made up with ad hoc scheduled flights.    The fact Maleth were selected only a few months ago indicates a degree of poor planning.   Tui haven’t increased their long haul fleet so they have had known capacity.   I could go on but this is nothing new in tour operation.  Hopefully it’s a one off 
 

[Megabear2]

4 minutes ago, cheshire said:

The late changes to flights indicate poor planning from p&O management.  Arvia was ordered in 2018 with its Caribbean programme in mind.  It’s pretty easy to calculate the number of aircraft seats required to fill the cabins onboard with slight variances being made up with ad hoc scheduled flights.    The fact Maleth were selected only a few months ago indicates a degree of poor planning.   Tui haven’t increased their long haul fleet so they have had known capacity.   I could go on but this is nothing new in tour operation.  Hopefully it’s a one off 
 

The contract with Thomas Cook was in place. Don't forget they went out of business in September 2019. The pandemic came along then so no cruises  so very hard to plan in fairness.