Should Celebrity Ban Smoking on its Ships for Safety?

[greeneg]

It is probably more the duration rather than the amount although both are probably significant in one way or the other. The problem is that there doesn't appear to be an absolute number which applies to all people: the true level of risk probably varies from person to person. The trouble is that no one knows where the line is; when you find out that you have crossed it, it's probably too late.

 

I hear the argument about individual freedom a lot in these discussions ( this is a pretty commonly posted topic) and how we all need to get along. Usually this is used on the smoking side of the discussion as some sort of justification for people smoking on the ship. I concede that the vast majority of smokers are reasonably courteous and considerate about it, but if the non-smokers have their Anti-Tobacco Police Squad, well, there are some fairly obnoxious smokers who create problems also.

 

I support the individual "freedom" of smokers to do themselves grievous bodily harm, but I do object strenuously to them doing the same to me while they placate their addiction.

 

Legal, yes it is ( for now at least), but as the percentage of smokers decreases ( which it does every year due to people quitting or reaping the seeds of what they have sown), there almost certainly will come a time when restrictions will be increasing imposed on smokers to the benifit of the non-smoker. My point is that as your numbers shrink, you will need to get along with me more than I will need to accomodate you.

 

I would like to be very clear that my comments are not directed at any one individual but are simply an expression of how I feel and how I view the situation.

 

And, if anyone cares, I smoked heavily for 30+ years before I quit 14years ago, so I do have an appreciation for how intense is the pleasure of nicotine and how difficult and demanding a master it can be.

 

Bottom line, though, is still that it is bad for you, bad for me, and bad for everyone else.

[on board]

I am most certainly not trying to say that second hand smoke isn't dangerous, nor that it can cause cancer. We were talking in a very specific scenario, though. I simply don't believe that somebody who was outside on a balcony and happened to breath in a whiff or two of smoke from a cigarette dozens of feet away for a few minutes a day over the course of a week or two is going to contract cancer as a result. I would be willing to bet that the scientists who conducted those studies would back me up on that! Yes, second-hand smoke can be harmful, but a more concentrated, prolonged exposure than I was discussing here would be required to do any real damage.

 

Trust me, if you are outdoors on a cruise ship and you are worried about contracting cancer, you are probably about 100 times more likely to get it from exposure to the SUN than from cigarettes! Should they shade the entire ship so that people aren't subjected to the (similarly proven to be carcinogenic) rays of the sun?

 

The sun is an act of God!:cool: Smoking is at will and your choice!:cool: The two that you tried so hard to compare there is not a comparison what so ever! :p

[on board]

I'm sorry to disagree here, but here it goes. Just the smell of smoke does not cause cancer. Being confined for long periods of time, in a smoke filled environment probably doesn't help your lungs.

 

That being said, everybody is just overly sensitive to the topic and want to force their beliefs on everybody else. We are losing enough of our freedoms already. Please let this one go for the freedom's sake. Smoking is legal and the smell of a cigarette in the open air doesn't cause cancer, even though second hand smoke does.

 

Yes you are right the SMELL of a cancer stick does not cause cancer but it does smell horrible! Not only can you smell it when you walk into a room where people have been smoking it is like a bad pesty bug, it folows you everywhere you go, on your clothes, hair, whatever you may have on! The only way to get the smell off is to shower and wash everything that has been exposed to the smoke! PLease look at a person's fingers that is a smoker! :eek: Also, smoke and smoking ages people so much faster! Again, that is your choice to do that to your body, we non-smokers should have the same right! :p

[Drew B]

The sun is an act of God!:cool: Smoking is at will and your choice!:cool: The two that you tried so hard to compare there is not a comparison what so ever! :p

 

I'm not sure exactly what your point is, here. If I'm not mistaken, God also created tobacco. And cancer, for that matter.

[sasset]

Yes. For safety, smoking on cruise ships should be banned. The October Report of The Bermuda Government Department of Maritime Administration Marine Accident Investigation Branch has concluded that the cause of the Star Princess fire was likely a cigarette. You can find the report here:

 

http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources/Star%20Princess.pdf

 

I doubt Celebrity will ban it, since it would likely cause a drop in revenue.

 

Regards

[BobBeaSea]

Improperly discarded cigarette/cigar butts are a hazard. Anyone caught throwing them off the ship should be put off at the next port. Having said that, the 3 main causes of fire on a cruise ship are accidents in the galleys, laundry rooms and engine rooms. Ship fires caused by butts are rare and require a good amount of (bad) luck. If the fire was caused by a butt, there is little doubt it came from above as the report says the occupants had extinguished their last cigarette 3 hours before the fire, in an ashtray.

 

I don't think it will be anytime soon mass market cruise lines totally ban smoking but some of them have definitely made changes to provide a more non-smoker friendly environment.

[bububr]

While there is really no damage caused from second hand watching or tasting. The visual sight of food along with the smells can lead to addiction.

 

The simple fact that we live in a country where many are not just deemed overwieght, but obese....including young children...should be enough to lay off the smokers a bit so some of us can take time to look in the mirror.

 

Being overweight causes a tremendous amount of deaths and health problems each years...heart disease, high blood pressure, diabetes, and so on and so on. While LONG term exposure to second hand smoke can cause permanent problems...I see the risks of high cholesteral causing heart failure, and others problems to be much more of a risk than developing cancer on a cruise ship after being exposed to cigarette smoke.

 

As someone else said, the ocurrances of fires caused by cigarettes is very rare. First all fabrics and furniture are flamed proofed, along with the carpets, and other furnishings. Cigarette paper also is self extinguishing for the most part.

 

After we finish banning smoke and food, lets then move onto alcohol, as we know it damages the liver and kidneys, not to mention causing ulcers in the stomach and intestinal linings, and the emotional factors also....then comes gambling.....and the addictive illness of it that causes monetary loss and relationship problems, mental stress...etc...

 

 

So at this point why would we even bother to take a cruise?

 

I guess I do it to eat myself into a heart attack, drink myself into liver damage, have a smoke after dinner to damage my lungs, then gamble my mortgage payment away at BINGO :D .

 

Ahhhhhhh.....life is good.

 

Dave:eek:

[Drew B]

So at this point why would we even bother to take a cruise?

 

 

Well, there's always romance/sex. But then again, if we're banning anything potentially life-threatening, I guess that's got to go as well...

[on board]

While there is really no damage caused from second hand watching or tasting. The visual sight of food along with the smells can lead to addiction.

 

The simple fact that we live in a country where many are not just deemed overwieght, but obese....including young children...should be enough to lay off the smokers a bit so some of us can take time to look in the mirror.

 

Being overweight causes a tremendous amount of deaths and health problems each years...heart disease, high blood pressure, diabetes, and so on and so on. While LONG term exposure to second hand smoke can cause permanent problems...I see the risks of high cholesteral causing heart failure, and others problems to be much more of a risk than developing cancer on a cruise ship after being exposed to cigarette smoke.

 

As someone else said, the ocurrances of fires caused by cigarettes is very rare. First all fabrics and furniture are flamed proofed, along with the carpets, and other furnishings. Cigarette paper also is self extinguishing for the most part.

 

After we finish banning smoke and food, lets then move onto alcohol, as we know it damages the liver and kidneys, not to mention causing ulcers in the stomach and intestinal linings, and the emotional factors also....then comes gambling.....and the addictive illness of it that causes monetary loss and relationship problems, mental stress...etc...

 

 

So at this point why would we even bother to take a cruise?

 

I guess I do it to eat myself into a heart attack, drink myself into liver damage, have a smoke after dinner to damage my lungs, then gamble my mortgage payment away at BINGO :D .

 

Ahhhhhhh.....life is good.

 

Dave:eek:

 

Food is not like the second hand smoke! Second hand smoke is just that, and most of the time it is people who do not wish to poison their body with it! Smoking is a choice that you make :cool: when one eats it is their choice to over eat and make themselves obese! The last itme I checked I did not gain weight from watching, smelling or looking at food! :D

[on board]

quote=Drew B]Well, there's always romance/sex. But then again, if we're banning anything potentially life-threatening, I guess that's got to go as well...

 

It is not so much as the life threatening aspect as it is smokers smoking their cancer sticks at no regards toward non smokers! Romance and sex is a choice we make and if one chooses to have sex or romance at their Will and dies from it they will probably die happy and not from infected lungs and cancer! :p

[on board]

I'm not sure exactly what your point is, here. If I'm not mistaken, God also created tobacco. And cancer, for that matter.

 

LMAO:D You are kidding right? :confused: Again I am belly rolling over this one!:p

[greeneg]

While there is really no damage caused from second hand watching or tasting. The visual sight of food along with the smells can lead to addiction.

 

The simple fact that we live in a country where many are not just deemed overwieght, but obese....including young children...should be enough to lay off the smokers a bit so some of us can take time to look in the mirror.

 

Being overweight causes a tremendous amount of deaths and health problems each years...heart disease, high blood pressure, diabetes, and so on and so on. While LONG term exposure to second hand smoke can cause permanent problems...I see the risks of high cholesteral causing heart failure, and others problems to be much more of a risk than developing cancer on a cruise ship after being exposed to cigarette smoke.

 

As someone else said, the ocurrances of fires caused by cigarettes is very rare. First all fabrics and furniture are flamed proofed, along with the carpets, and other furnishings. Cigarette paper also is self extinguishing for the most part.

 

After we finish banning smoke and food, lets then move onto alcohol, as we know it damages the liver and kidneys, not to mention causing ulcers in the stomach and intestinal linings, and the emotional factors also....then comes gambling.....and the addictive illness of it that causes monetary loss and relationship problems, mental stress...etc...

 

 

So at this point why would we even bother to take a cruise?

 

I guess I do it to eat myself into a heart attack, drink myself into liver damage, have a smoke after dinner to damage my lungs, then gamble my mortgage payment away at BINGO :D .

 

Ahhhhhhh.....life is good.

 

Dave:eek:

 

Silly Post. The issue is not what you do to yourself, but what effects your actions have on others.

 

Personally, I don't care if someone smokes themselves into an early grave; what I do care about is being exposed to their high risk behavior and placed at risk because of their actions.

 

If you drink and drive, talk on a cell phone while operating a motor vehicle, or read the paper/ get dressed/fix your hair on the way to work in traffic, you are a public danger. To the extent that you are a public danger, your freedom to do as you please should be restricted.

[jessemon]

To quote someone in a previous post "This is silly".

The whole thread has gotten silly. One of my post included.

 

Does anyone remember the OP's heading for this thread.

"Should Celebrity Ban Smoking In It's Ships For Safety"

It said nothing about should smoking be allowed on a ship due to any other reason.

"Just for safety".

 

I looked at the whole last page and only one...count them one person referred to the "OP's" post.

 

I am making a mental note to never ever again to get involved in a thread that even get's anywhere near the word smoke...

 

This thread is so far of point it is truely silly.

[on board]

All the goody-goodys out there ready to ban anything they don't like that others do. If you don't like smoke sail Oceania. If you don't like drinkers. that's too bad. Even the Morman owner Marriott hotels have bars everywhere. Let each of us live our own lives and you take your complaints elsewhere. We are cruising to do what we like in interesting new places. We don't need home grown Talibans looking for rules to enforce.

 

Well that is easy for you to say what you did! Are you a smoker? If so making your statement is not being fair to both sides! Sure a smoker does not want smoking banned! Why? Because they are addicted to the cancer sticks! :confused: Should smokers care about the feelings of non smokers? Hell yes because the second hand smoke is harmful to all and everyone around them! Should people who are not over weight or obese care about someone that is and over eats, fills their plate to full? No, because they are not hurting anyone sitting around them! :cool: Do I care if someone is drinking or drinking to much, unless it is a loved one, or the drunk is vomiting around me or being abusive, or down right out a pain in my A$$ I could careless! The only thing I care about is my health and saftey on this issue. :p I don't consider myself a goody goody so to say but just concerned for the well fare of my loved ones and myself! ;)

[on board]

Actually, I think it's to allow guests to do what they want to do on the veranda, whatever that may be. Some people may dislike the aroma of coffee, but it would be wrong for them to expect their neighbors to refrain from drinking coffee onboard, right?

 

But... Coffee has never been an issue plus coffee does not cause cancer, make you to stink, eyes to burn, and breathing problems! :p ;)

[m steve]

It is no different than people smoking outside of a building and for that matter since the ship is moving the smoke disipates more quickly upward and outward. Outdoor smoke doesn't make your clothes smell. I am not a smoker but my friend is and is considerate of those around her when she smokes. It seems that non-smokers are the less considerate of others. I don't like smoke in the house or the cabin and she is considerate and goes outside. We were recently in a port when a Costa ship was in at the same time. At an open window restaurant everyone that was there from that cruise smoked but with fans and breezes it really wasn't a problem.

[on board]

It is no different than people smoking outside of a building and for that matter since the ship is moving the smoke disipates more quickly upward and outward. Outdoor smoke doesn't make your clothes smell. I am not a smoker but my friend is and is considerate of those around her when she smokes. It seems that non-smokers are the less considerate of others. I don't like smoke in the house or the cabin and she is considerate and goes outside. We were recently in a port when a Costa ship was in at the same time. At an open window restaurant everyone that was there from that cruise smoked but with fans and breezes it really wasn't a problem.

 

I beg to differ!:rolleyes: If you are around someone that is smoking in or out doors not only do they stink:eek: but maker everyone else stink! Especially their hair and clothes! Yes if it is a windy day and you are not in the down draft of the smoke it is highly doubtful you will smell of smoke. Before I married my DH I dated a smoker 1 time and that was 1 time to many! I told him if he was not willing to quit smoking he could move on down the road! :D That he did than goodness! I kissed him one time and it about made me vomit! I actually stunk after he left and my parents and family all was very upset. I actually had to shower and wash everything I wore that evening! We love going to different bars but cannot stay long because we get a headache and our eyes start burning so bad that they water. That is very sad! After spending a couple of hours in a bar enjoying Dinner my DH has to take allergy meds. to clear his throat and sinus. And to think smokers continue to say second hand smoke is not harmful!:cool:

[Drew B]

But... Coffee has never been an issue plus coffee does not cause cancer, make you to stink, eyes to burn, and breathing problems! :p ;)

 

Okay, let me ask this question directly. Do you feel that a person who is at no other point in his/her life exposed to anything carcinogenic is at substantial risk for contracting cancer based SOLELY on contact with diffuse cigarette smoke on a cruise ship balcony for several minutes a day for several weeks a year? If so, we'll have to agree to disagree, because I have no idea how to argue that point. I simply know in my gut that it takes a lot more than that to cause cancer.

 

If you DON'T believe that the limited, diffuse balcony exposure is a realistic cancer risk, then what you're really talking about is annoyance. My point is that there are a number of perfectly reasonable things that people can do on their balconies from having conversations to drinking coffee that could annoy their neighbors. I don't think that behaviors should be eliminated because they might be slightly annoying to some. I would rather that people work things out like grown-ups and reach a compromise that isn't too tough on either of them.

[morriscats]

Ok, have tried to stay out of this because no amount of talking is going to change anyones mind. Is smoking on your balcony going to give me cancer? Probably not. And I used to agree that is was just an annoyance but 4 years ago I got sick which led to asthma and pneumonia twice in a 3 month period. Now smoke affects me very negatively. Makes my throat tighten up which leads to an asthma flare-up. Is this the only thing that causes this? No. And I try to avoid anything that makes this happen. Our last trip we had the FV corner stateroom on Infinity and our neighbors smoked a lot on their balcony. It affected me! Had to use my inhalers. So what is the answer. Do I stay home so "smokers can have their rights too?" I can't ask that polluting car to stop. I can't ask the company's that spew pollution into the air to stop. Can I ask you?? At least around me and my family??

[Lookeylew]

I just came off a 14 cruise on the Celebrity Summit to Hawaii. I booked a concierge class cabin with veranda, which we couldn't use because we had two chain smokers in the cabin next to us. Not only that, but we had to put a towel down on the floor by our cabin door to block the smoke that kept coming into our cabin from next door. I spoke with the customer service on the ship when they happen to call our cabin to ask how we were enjoying the cruise. We were told that we were one of many people complaining about cigarette smoke. You can't smoke a pipe in your cabin or on the veranda, but cigarettes are okay! Sounds crazy to me. We will not be cruising on any ships anymore unless they are non smoking in the cabins. Oceania does not allow smoking in cabins and that's the cruise line will be trying next!

[Drew B]

Ok, have tried to stay out of this because no amount of talking is going to change anyones mind. Is smoking on your balcony going to give me cancer? Probably not. And I used to agree that is was just an annoyance but 4 years ago I got sick which led to asthma and pneumonia twice in a 3 month period. Now smoke affects me very negatively. Makes my throat tighten up which leads to an asthma flare-up. Is this the only thing that causes this? No. And I try to avoid anything that makes this happen. Our last trip we had the FV corner stateroom on Infinity and our neighbors smoked a lot on their balcony. It affected me! Had to use my inhalers. So what is the answer. Do I stay home so "smokers can have their rights too?" I can't ask that polluting car to stop. I can't ask the company's that spew pollution into the air to stop. Can I ask you?? At least around me and my family??

 

Well, if I was in the cabin next to yours and you told me about your problems with smoke, I would have ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM with not smoking while you were out on your balcony. It wouldn't bother me at all. Heck, even without the asthma problem, I'd probably refrain from smoking on the balcony around anybody who asked me nicely. I would assume that there would be times that my neighbor wasn't on their balcony while I was, and I could smoke then. Otherwise, I could go to the public decks to smoke. I've cruised in cabins without balconies, and I've had no problem with leaving my cabin when I want to smoke. I think the issue is in asking NICELY.

 

I don't know if my response is typical or not, but I'm pretty sure that none of the smokers have it as their GOAL to upset the non-smokers. However, if the non-smokers are rude, dismissive or judgemental towards the smokers, it only makes sense that the smokers are going to be less willing to make accomodations...

[m steve]

I've worked in and visited many buildings where smokers congregate outside the entrance and have never had to change my clothes due to smoking odor. Yes, If I go into a smoking permitted bar and stay for a while I will remove my clothes. The ideal situation is to smoke in a clothing optional bar and check my clothes before entering and I won't have that problem! As for banning smoking on board as a safety hazzard, there are many other things that are more lethal. How about the soot from the smokestacks that land on your balcony.

For those so allergic to cigarette smoke I suggest either Oceania or taking the fist couple of cabins on the deck so there won't be smoke moving in your direction, only the bouncing of the ship. I don't believe that anyone on a cruise chain smokes all the time on their balcony to annoy you nor can the smoke enter your cabin from their balcony if your door is closed.

[TWELVEOHONE]

While there is really no damage caused from second hand watching or tasting. The visual sight of food along with the smells can lead to addiction.

 

The simple fact that we live in a country where many are not just deemed overwieght, but obese....including young children...should be enough to lay off the smokers a bit so some of us can take time to look in the mirror.

 

Being overweight causes a tremendous amount of deaths and health problems each years...heart disease, high blood pressure, diabetes, and so on and so on. While LONG term exposure to second hand smoke can cause permanent problems...I see the risks of high cholesteral causing heart failure, and others problems to be much more of a risk than developing cancer on a cruise ship after being exposed to cigarette smoke.

 

As someone else said, the ocurrances of fires caused by cigarettes is very rare. First all fabrics and furniture are flamed proofed, along with the carpets, and other furnishings. Cigarette paper also is self extinguishing for the most part.

 

After we finish banning smoke and food, lets then move onto alcohol, as we know it damages the liver and kidneys, not to mention causing ulcers in the stomach and intestinal linings, and the emotional factors also....then comes gambling.....and the addictive illness of it that causes monetary loss and relationship problems, mental stress...etc...

 

 

So at this point why would we even bother to take a cruise?

 

I guess I do it to eat myself into a heart attack, drink myself into liver damage, have a smoke after dinner to damage my lungs, then gamble my mortgage payment away at BINGO :D .

 

Ahhhhhhh.....life is good.

 

Dave:eek:

 

 

Over eating and getting a heat attack etc. are choices each person makes but ONLY effect them. They are in a sense they may be committing sucide.

Smokers are not only harming themselves but others with second hand smoke

[on board]

Okay, let me ask this question directly. Do you feel that a person who is at no other point in his/her life exposed to anything carcinogenic is at substantial risk for contracting cancer based SOLELY on contact with diffuse cigarette smoke on a cruise ship balcony for several minutes a day for several weeks a year? If so, we'll have to agree to disagree, because I have no idea how to argue that point. I simply know in my gut that it takes a lot more than that to cause cancer.

 

If you DON'T believe that the limited, diffuse balcony exposure is a realistic cancer risk, then what you're really talking about is annoyance. My point is that there are a number of perfectly reasonable things that people can do on their balconies from having conversations to drinking coffee that could annoy their neighbors. I don't think that behaviors should be eliminated because they might be slightly annoying to some. I would rather that people work things out like grown-ups and reach a compromise that isn't too tough on either of them.

 

It is just not about the cancer, if you are down wind of someone smoking outside on the balcony you are the one that is going to get the brunt of the smoke! :rolleyes: Therefore in that case not only is it annoying as you put it but also a health issue. The burning of the eyes and throat, making the sinus act up and causing severe headaches. Then on top of all of that being exposed to second hand smoke, it does not make any difference how much or how long or often. According to the American Cancer Society it states that "Second hand smoke is the same as smoking a cancer stick". When someone can come up with exactly how much smoke, how many cancer sticks, and how long one has to be exposed, I am sure that will make no difference to whom ever smokes as they everyone that I have come across who smokes always has an excuse as to second hand smoke is nothing! :eek: Now I will hit on the annoying part of it, all of the above symptoms are health issues, the annoying issues are but are not limited to: the smell it leaves on clothes, hair, and anything and everything a person as on them! Then to top all off is when a person is talking to another who is smoking their horrible breath, honestly it smells as if they just had a bowl of cancer sticks for Dinner! Gum, mouthwash or what ever does not cover up the oder. For the life of me I have no clue why someone would continue to smoke with all the health issues that have been proven, the smell, the staining of the teeth and fingers, the rapid aging it makes one go through, and finally the cost! :rolleyes: Am I missing something? I know I am not! ;)

[on board]

Well, if I was in the cabin next to yours and you told me about your problems with smoke, I would have ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM with not smoking while you were out on your balcony. It wouldn't bother me at all. Heck, even without the asthma problem, I'd probably refrain from smoking on the balcony around anybody who asked me nicely. I would assume that there would be times that my neighbor wasn't on their balcony while I was, and I could smoke then. Otherwise, I could go to the public decks to smoke. I've cruised in cabins without balconies, and I've had no problem with leaving my cabin when I want to smoke. I think the issue is in asking NICELY.

 

I don't know if my response is typical or not, but I'm pretty sure that none of the smokers have it as their GOAL to upset the non-smokers. However, if the non-smokers are rude, dismissive or judgemental towards the smokers, it only makes sense that the smokers are going to be less willing to make accomodations...

 

Actually your response is not typical! You appear to be conscious of others which a lot if not most smokers are not! From what I have read here and experienced in some places all the smokers care about is getting their fix for that moment! If this is truly you and how you are, you are one of the few! :p