An interesting article about more folks getting turned away at the Canadian Boarder

[bepsf]

It was your post about this that alerted Cruise Critic to the problem! A news article about it has been published now, and some of the questions are answered.

 

http://cruisecritic.com/news/news.cfm?ID=1954

 

Thanks so much for being on the ball (as usual!)

 

Jana

 

PS I'll contact you when my daughter and I do our long weekend in The City, hopefully later this spring... We're still on for coffee together, right?

 

Jana--

You're most welcome!

:)

I've seen this happen to other HAL passengers in the past couple years that they've not been allowed off the ship in Victoria - I've never bothered to try to leave the ship in Victoria since the ship is usually so late in the afternoon/evening - probably just as well since I too have a DUI arrest (charges dropped). Also heard of folks not being allowed to go from Airport to Ship in Vancouver for a DUI on their record - thereby causing the cancellation of their entire cruise.

Yes, we're still good for lunch/coffee - you still have my e-mail and phone number, right?

[Jana]

Jana--

 

You're most welcome!

:)

 

Yes, we're still good for lunch/coffee - you still have my e-mail and phone number, right?

 

nope. I don't. Send them again to me at jana at nbc17travel dot com

[number1cruiser]

I was wondering if anyone can tell me how to get a copy of any record on

yourself to see what was on there?

 

Thanks

Number1cruiser

[bepsf]

I was wondering if anyone can tell me how to get a copy of any record on yourself to see what was on there?

 

Thanks

Number1cruiser

 

A former boss of mine said once to an employee who was fired for lying about their legal record:

"If you don't remember being hauled to jail in handcuffs and fingerprinted...?"

[Jana]

Being hauled off to jail is one thing, but look at the guy who got community service for shoplifting and was still nailed. My daughter had a ...shall we say... driving discretion (not a DUI) when she was 19. She kind of tried to evade the cops when they were after her to give her a speeding ticket. She was ultimately given many, many hours of community service. Does that mean a conviction? We don't know!

 

The lady (Lucy Perrillo) at that Border Crossing service in Canada told me to get the court documents from the "satisfaction" of the judgement, in other words, from the date the community service was satisfied. That would go to a jail term or fines or anything else, but not from the date of the conviction. I think my daughter had like four months to do the community service.

 

The court documents will show what's on the record.

 

This is scary! My daughter is a professional 31 year old now. that was almost 12 years ago and when I think about it, I still get p*ssed off. What it did to my insurance rates was tragic!

 

Jana

[Schplinky]

I'm really surprised that this isn't getting more publicity. I took a look at the requirements for "rehabilitation", and not only is the paperwork a nightmare, but it costs at least $200 and could go up to $1000. And there is NO rebate if your paperwork is not approved!!:eek:

 

In addition, you must go to one of their US consolates, of which there are only 5 or 6 I believe.

 

Probably the biggest one that most will not be aware of is a DUI conviction. It doesn't matter how old it is, if they find out you will not be admitted to Canada.

 

Cheers,

 

There are actually thirteen consulates in the US. They are in DC, Atlanta, Boston, Buffalo, Chicago, Dallas, Detroit, LA, Miami, Minneapolis, NYC, San Francisco and Seattle.

 

Hey, I'm all for allowing Americans with records into Canada if the US would allow Canadians into the US who are similarly convicted but the fact is, you won't, although I do think that DUI is taken more seriously here. No way a politician could become our top guy if he had a DUI. You also now require passports for even day-trips (I know, everyone's a terrorist until you prove they are not) and I suspect that this has crippled tourist towns on both sides of the border. Given the current state of government in Canada, this new enforcement of these rules is most likely because the Canadian government is doing what the White House has told it to do. I wouldn't suspect a lot of independent thinking with this government.

[tomc]

A former boss of mine said once to an employee who was fired for lying about their legal record:

 

"If you don't remember being hauled to jail in handcuffs and fingerprinted...?"

 

...then you sure did when you sobered up in the morning!

[vickiw0318]

I had a friend who was trying to be "rehabilitated". He found out that not all the Canadian consulates can be of assistance with this issue. That's why there are only five listed on the website. The one in Dallas, for example, will refer you to one of the listed ones.

[seasideny]

Hi TomC:

In response to:

"Whatever were you doing with a phonebook and paystubs in your car that an agent would (a) find them, (b) be interested in them and, © the big one: want to see your tax returns?"

I was called into the interview area and they asked to look in my purse. I always carry my personal phonebook to a visiting city since I haven't memorized my friends phone numbers and this was in the days before we had cell phones to store them in. I had my paystub in my wallet (which he also looked through) because I went to the bank to deposit the cheque before heading to the border and this was in the days before directdeposit.

The big question as to why he wanted to see my tax return was a mystery to me except that he must have wanted to harrass me - like I said - for no apparent reason. Maybe he wanted to be sure I was a tax paying citizen of Canada and not trying to be illegally employed in the US? -- It was in the middle of a work week? Or he was in a bad mood!!:eek:

Your guess is as good as mine. I don't think I looked suspicious and I was with my then 4 year old son. All I know is if I want the freedom to travel I go along with their whims and comply.:rolleyes:

[Chivalrygirl]

Why are so many immigration people in North America so very rude? For example, while in transit in Vancouver from the Statendam on returning to the ship from our day out we had to go once more through US immigration to allow us re-entry back into the US. Three lots of fingerprints in 10 days, OK thats the law I am fine by that. However there is no need to be so rude and arrogant. No lines, no people two men just sat there doing nothing when we went up to them, apparently we were the 2nd to last ppl on board to go through the procedure. I can appreciate there is more stress for them when clearing long queues of people! My husband went first, the gentleman immigration officer did not even look at my husband he just instructed him to REMOVE HIS GLASSES and look at the camera, my husband was NOT WEARING GLASSES.

[Ephraim]

Why are so many immigration people in North America so very rude? For example, while in transit in Vancouver from the Statendam on returning to the ship from our day out we had to go once more through US immigration to allow us re-entry back into the US. Three lots of fingerprints in 10 days, OK thats the law I am fine by that. However there is no need to be so rude and arrogant. No lines, no people two men just sat there doing nothing when we went up to them, apparently we were the 2nd to last ppl on board to go through the procedure. I can appreciate there is more stress for them when clearing long queues of people! My husband went first, the gentleman immigration officer did not even look at my husband he just instructed him to REMOVE HIS GLASSES and look at the camera, my husband was NOT WEARING GLASSES.

 

 

Want to really have a laugh? Read the US CBP’s Pledge to Travelers. I was talking to some US government employees in a border town and they said that they don't go into Canada as much anymore because they hate going through US Customs... and they are American citizens who work for the US government!

 

Let's be serious, how many people are really going to make a complaint? Being Canadian, I assure you that if I find a Canadian border guard to be rude, I actually have walked in and spoken to the supervisor (I've done it twice). But really, no visitor to another country is about to challenge the man who controls his entry. I'm sure that they are coping with a lot of stress and I try to be forgiving (though sometimes you wonder about the weird questions that they ask.) I therefore try to have all my paperwork in order, my tickets in my hand and clear answers for them. I do my best to make their job less stressful when it comes to dealing with me.

[tomc]

seasideny --

 

Thanks for the explanation. I thought maybe you were carrying a full-size phone book and had a box full of paystubs. Not that either of them matters a bit; you can't do much damage with that combination.

[Ephraim]

Now I finally remember where I saw it....

 

I guess the number of complaints about border guards is increasing. On the main page of the US embassy website (for Canada) under the "Entering the US" section you see:

 

Comments & Complaints

Do you have a comment or complaint about Customs & Border Protection or Preflight Clearance at Canada-U.S. border crossings? Check here for how to resolve it.

 

Obviously, you don't add something like that to the website if everything is working well.

 

And there is plenty of information including:

 

23 February 07

New border measures will in fact make travel easier: Byliner by Secretary of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff.

"Today, leaders from Canada, Mexico and the United States are convening in Ottawa to discuss the progress being made under the Security and Prosperity Partnership, our joint effort to boost security across North America, increase trade and travel, protect critical infrastructure, and develop common protocols to ensure co-ordinated and effective emergency response."

I wonder how they are going to increase travel. Looks to me like all of this nonsense is just hindering it.

 

And if you are looking for information on the Security and Prosperity Partnership of North American, it is at http://canada.usembassy.gov/content/content.asp?section=can_usa&subsection1=borderissues&document=spp Not really much about prosperity, but it's a name that makes it sound so nice. It's mostly about US security and access to oil.

[dot73]

I don't understand that two good neighbours (Canada and U.S.) who share the longest border in the world cannot get together and place some kind of a uniform customs policy in place. It is ridiculous not to allow tourists into a country because they have a DUI or a pot possession record. I can understand about not letting in murderers, child molesters or suspected terrorists. Surely the computer can show whether a conviction is a serious one or not or whether someone is wanted by police on either side of the border. Both Canada and the U.S. rely on each other's tourism. I know the Greater Toronto tourism has been hurt a lot because of the problems at the border (coming and going). I am sure that Florida, who benefits from Canadian tourism) has also been hurt by this. As for bad customs treatment, I have experience it on both sides. Recently, both customs agents (male) in L.A. and Toronto, demanded to know why I travel alone. Yiikes, what's next, "why aren't you married?". We all want to have safe borders and keep bad people out, but this is all getting a bit ridiculous.

[peterv]

I found this story quite amusing, having heard from some people who travel to the US about the rude and demeaning treatment from US Customs and Immigration people. I think it is great that some US citizens are on the receiving end of this treatment as well just so they can see how it feels to be on the other side once in a while.

 

I just do not understand why everyone can not get along, while it is probably a boring job looking at passports for 8 hours a day and having 99.999999% of the people go through without a problem can get frustrating, but why the need to be unpleasant?

 

This sounds like the idiotic zero-tolerance policies, the book says X, so we do X, check brains at door.

 

Have a Nice Day :)

 

Cheers,

Peter

[Schplinky]

I agree about the need for them to be polite. In fairness, I find the US customs people to be more polite than ours here. I think the theory is that being blunt puts the person being interviewed at a disadvantage but I think the only people truly caught out by this are the innocent. Those planning to do bad things are sort of prepared for all this.

[Chivalrygirl]

Recently, both customs agents (male) in L.A. and Toronto, demanded to know why I travel alone. Yiikes, what's next, "why aren't you married?". We all want to have safe borders and keep bad people out, but this is all getting a bit ridiculous.

 

Hey Dot, don't worry I love to travel alone :D It means I have escaped from married bliss for a bit :D In one week I am off to cross the Tasman all alone :D Do this frequently as I go over to visit an old friend, no one down here takes the slightest bit of notice, I find your experiences just mind blowing, I really thought those days were left behind over 40 years ago, just shows eh!

I found this story quite amusing, having heard from some people who travel to the US about the rude and demeaning treatment from US Customs and Immigration people. I think it is great that some US citizens are on the receiving end of this treatment as well just so they can see how it feels to be on the other side once in a while.

 

Hey Peter I suppose I feel the same way as you a bit, for a long time I have put off going into the US, just can't hack the aggro. However, cruising won the day last year as I decided just a little entry to the US would get me to Vancouver and onto the Statendam :D and the horror of all horrors LAX turned out to be a breeze by comparison to other times. Have to say however once you are safely inside the US the people generally make up for the aggro at the border, they are all so welcoming.

 

This sounds like the idiotic zero-tolerance policies, the book says X, so we do X, check brains at door.

 

Very clever what a good line.

You two have a good day also. Thank god its the weekend again, we are getting such beautiful sunny warm days down here, long may it last :D

Cheers

Val

[Schplinky]

I have experience it on both sides. Recently, both customs agents (male) in L.A. and Toronto, demanded to know why I travel alone. Yiikes, what's next, "why aren't you married?". We all want to have safe borders and keep bad people out, but this is all getting a bit ridiculous.

 

 

My partner and I are always asked "what is your relationship to one another?" Besides saying that I've just kidnapped him and am taking him home, I'm not sure exactly what the wrong answer is?

[Chivalrygirl]

Ha ha that reminds me of a funny story. I am a self-employed accountant and have for many years acted for a man 17 years my junior. The bank manager on more than one occasion enquired as to my relationship to my client. Getting totally "p" off I finally replied that he was my "toy boy", he never asked that question again :D My client thought it hilarious, so no repercussions there. Perhaps next time you might just try "sex maniacs" or some such :)

[bepsf]

Perhaps next time you might just try "sex maniacs" or some such :)

 

...actually, that would be a very bad idea - as US immigration also prohibit Canadians w/ HIV and other infectious diseases from entering the US, so this could involve alot more angst than anyone really needs.

[bepsf]

 

Surely with the way of the world at the moment you would have the same standards in the States?

 

Cathy

 

In the new land of "Guilty before proven Innocent" and "Foreigners wouldn't be so Bad if they were American"?

Not likely...

:cool:

[Chivalrygirl]

...actually, that would be a very bad idea - as US immigration also prohibit Canadians w/ HIV and other infectious diseases from entering the US, so this could involve alot more angst than anyone really needs.

 

Yeah I forget, no humour to be entertained at the border :D Please bring back the simple life :mad:

[tomc]

I came into the States thru Montreal with a ton of cruiseship people and was asked just why I had a pair of binoculars. I said it was because I was returning from a cruise. Then he asked why, if I had been on a cruise, did I have only one carryon bag. I didn't want to go thru my practice of traveling light, so I told him I left everything else at my brother's house.

[RuthC]

Recently, both customs agents (male) in L.A. and Toronto, demanded to know why I travel alone.

Were I to be asked that question I don't have a clue what I would say. How does one respond to that? Just stand there drop-jaw, I suppose. :confused:

[tomc]

...demanded to know why I travel alone.

 

Possible answers:

 

(a) I had a fight with my imaginary friend and he left me.

(b) I'm "bi-" and my partners married each other.

© Huh?? Where'd everybody else go??

(d) =sniff= They all =sniff= passed away on the trip =sniff=

(e) I'm returning from my spouse's execution

(f) I'm a orphan an' havnt eaten for three days, please sir

(g) When it's your ## business, I'll let you know