How will NCL Court Traditional Cruisers to Return to NCL?

[negc]

A recent article in a travel trade publication predicted that the new CEO of NCL, Kevin Sheehan, will " work to bring black ink to NCL's balance sheet and to expand its marketing to court traditional cruisers for a return to the Freestyle fold." Does this mean an end to those NCL commercials which seemed to indicate that "traditional cruisers" were obnoxious and irritating characters to be avoided at all costs by cruising on NCL were you weren't in danger of encountering them at your dinner table?;)

What do you think that NCL can do to convince traditional cruisers to come back to NCL or should they even try?:confused:

 

Keep in mind that Kevin Sheehan is described as a "numbers guy" which doesn't necessarily translate into a "cruise guy".

[Arwenmark]

The Freestyle pendulum has swung WAY TO FAR the wrong way, and I doubt that NCL can ever swing it back even to center, or near center for that matter. NCL in no way vaguely resembles traditional cruising. It is what it is and you can either appreciate it for that or go with someone who still has a little bit of grip on traditional cruising.

 

I cruise NCL because I like the price and the dining options but it comes with a high personal price for me. I think of NCL as lowest common denominator cruising.

 

I honestly don't think they can do anything to bring back traditional cruisers other than start a new line with completely different rules.

[michigan tim]

It seems to me that NCL's niche or forte is FreeStyle and that branding/image has taken a stronghold. I see other mainstream lines working toward that direction rather toward traditional cruising. I don't know why NCL would want to do an about face.

[Dukegirl5577]

I don't know if they can "bring back" traditional cruisers, however, I do think some people are traditional cruisers only because they don't know any better and if given an opportunity to experience Freestyle they would like it a lot.

 

Specifically, I'm talking about my own generation. Assigned dining times and being assigned to sit with random strangers are the biggest complaints I've heard from people in the 20-40-something age group. So I think that NCL can probably make some good headway there.

 

But not just younger cruisers. I know a lot of people in my parents' age group (65+) that much prefer open seating, as well.

 

So I think it just comes down to mindset. You either prefer traditional dining or you don't. And only you know whether it would work for you.

[newmexicoNita]

A recent article in a travel trade publication predicted that the new CEO of NCL, Kevin Sheehan, will " work to bring black ink to NCL's balance sheet and to expand its marketing to court traditional cruisers for a return to the Freestyle fold." Does this mean an end to those NCL commercials which seemed to indicate that "traditional cruisers" were obnoxious and irritating characters to be avoided at all costs by cruising on NCL were you weren't in danger of encountering them at your dinner table?;)

What do you think that NCL can do to convince traditional cruisers to come back to NCL or should they even try?:confused:

 

Keep in mind that Kevin Sheehan is described as a "numbers guy" which doesn't necessarily translate into a "cruise guy".

i don't see why they should even try. What one person likes another will not and every mass marketed line except Carnival has now gone to some form of freestyle. Why is this? obviously people have requested it.

 

Nita

[smeyer418]

the newer ships...the thing that NCL likes to talk about the youngest fleet are NOT set up for traditional eating. They aren't set up for two seatings. Any one who wants to can now eat pretty much at a set time with the same people at the same station...that is what he is probably talking about...

 

one warning however is when you try to be everything for everyone you generally wind out disappointing everyone.

[watchdiva]

Here's my thoughts: We've cruised traditional (suites on HAL) and we returned to NCL and freestyle. The suite perks are much better on NCL, the butler service rocks and in NO WAY would I consider NCL to be the lowest common denominator cruising based upon our experiences in the past 20+ years of sailing the line.

 

Maybe our experiences are different because we do sail in suites but we've sailed NCL for 20+ years and have never had a bad cruise.

[Dukegirl5577]

What one person likes another will not and every mass marketed line except Carnival has now gone to some form of freestyle.

 

Exactly. The cruise lines wouldn't be following this model unless their passengers wanted it.

 

I'm sorry for those passengers who prefer TD and don't want it to go away and I sincerely hope that some lines will continue to offer it. That being said, after my cruise on Carnival I know that I much prefer Freestyle, so that's where I will vote with my dollars.

 

Choice is good. Some people want TD. Others want flexibility. So I'm glad that there are options out there for everyone. Imagine how boring life would be if we were all stuck with the same things?

[sottovoce]

The Freestyle pendulum has swung WAY TO FAR the wrong way, and I doubt that NCL can ever swing it back even to center, or near center for that matter. NCL in no way vaguely resembles traditional cruising. It is what it is and you can either appreciate it for that or go with someone who still has a little bit of grip on traditional cruising.

 

I cruise NCL because I like the price and the dining options but it comes with a high personal price for me. I think of NCL as lowest common denominator cruising.

 

I honestly don't think they can do anything to bring back traditional cruisers other than start a new line with completely different rules.

Anyone who feels like this should just stick to the traditional lines and leave us alone. The "wrong" way? Are you kidding? Michigan Tim has it right. Cruise lines are moving toward freestyle with all deliberate speed, because the traditional nonsense is simply out-of-date and out-of-fashion. Self-described "upscale" lines like Azamara and Oceania are freestyle, and even the stuffy "traditional" ones like HAL and Princess are offering features suspiciously resembling freestyle, like open seating in one floor of the main dining room (although, with dining rooms consisting of tables for six and eight, it just isn't the same).

 

Here's one vote for NCL staying as far away from so-called "traditional" cruising as possible. NCL has clearly headed toward the "right" way, and would make a big mistake in trying to turn back.

[NoPiratesPlease]

Kevin Sheehan is a bean-counter who doesn't understand that taking $150 worth of beans in liquor away from a Garden Villa cruiser who has paid $x0,000 beans will convince that Garden Villa cruiser to take his/her $x0,000 worth of beans elsewhere. This is simply one example of how he is "GM"ing NCL.

 

You can't keep your GV, CV and OS cruisers by cutting benefits and raising prices. Mr. Sheehan doesn't understand that. He doesn't understand that we "get it" and aren't being fooled. He doesn't understand you don't kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. This is why after over 20 cruises, always in higher-end cabins, we are leaving NCL and giving our beans to somebody else.

 

He treats his casino high-rollers better than he treats his Courtyard class guests--the players get their drinks paid for in the casino, but Courtyard-class guests spend far more on his ships.

 

Penny-wise, pound-foolish. This goose has been cooked enough times and is laying no more golden eggs for Mr. Sheehan.

[newmexicoNita]

Exactly. The cruise lines wouldn't be following this model unless their passengers wanted it.

 

I'm sorry for those passengers who prefer TD and don't want it to go away and I sincerely hope that some lines will continue to offer it. That being said, after my cruise on Carnival I know that I much prefer Freestyle, so that's where I will vote with my dollars.

 

Choice is good. Some people want TD. Others want flexibility. So I'm glad that there are options out there for everyone. Imagine how boring life would be if we were all stuck with the same things?

 

too many people just can't accept change and that is a problem, thier problem as I see it but that is just me. Life changes, each year things change. I can remember when I told my hubby, who wanted a computer and a remote control for our TV, I would go along with the remote, but why in the heck did he think we would even need a computer?

 

Nita

[noreddye]

DH and I enjoy the Freestyle concept and that is why we cruise with NCL. However, Mr. Sheehan should concentrate on how they are going to get people to cruise in today's financial crisis.

 

I agree NoPiratesPlease, Mr. Sheehan should stop nickel and diming passengers that have paid $1000's for a suite and they are not comped free sodas, water or a free meal at a specialty restaurant.

 

Offer better deals and discounts to your Latitudes members.

[terrymtex01]

Kevin Sheehan is a bean-counter who doesn't understand that taking $150 worth of beans in liquor away from a Garden Villa cruiser who has paid $x0,000 beans will convince that Garden Villa cruiser to take his/her $x0,000 worth of beans elsewhere. This is simply one example of how he is "GM"ing NCL.

 

You can't keep your GV, CV and OS cruisers by cutting benefits and raising prices. Mr. Sheehan doesn't understand that. He doesn't understand that we "get it" and aren't being fooled. He doesn't understand you don't kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. This is why after over 20 cruises, always in higher-end cabins, we are leaving NCL and giving our beans to somebody else.

 

He treats his casino high-rollers better than he treats his Courtyard class guests--the players get their drinks paid for in the casino, but Courtyard-class guests spend far more on his ships.

 

Penny-wise, pound-foolish. This goose has been cooked enough times and is laying no more golden eggs for Mr. Sheehan.

 

I have to say I agree with you on everything except the casino and it's high rollers. The only way your posting would be correct would be if those high rollers were actually in those suites to begin with. We have seen many of the high rollers spend anywhere from $7,000.00 to $10,000.00 a night in the casino. I don't mean we have heard of this.. we have actually seen it many times. On the Sun we became friends with a guy who was playing nothing but the $25.00 to $100.00 slots and he was in the casino more than we were, and that is saying a lot. On one cruise on the Star we spoke with two different guys that cruise who each were spending over $10,000.00 a night in the casino.

 

As far as the original question, I don't think he should go after those traditional cruises. Seems foolish to me. If people sail NCL and they don't like the way NCL does business or treats their pax, etc etc, then let them go. Ther are many who love NCL's Freestyle concept and would never cruise with anyone else. That is not to say NCL could not use improvement. I think any business can always use some imporvement some where. But to me, they need to get their landbased customer service groups in check before they try to change anything on the ships. Not to hurt any of their feelings, but I have never seen a company so bad in their customer service where each rep will give you a completely different answer from the next.

 

I don't understand the article saying all of that anyway. Wasn't there just an article like in Nov that said NCL was one of the few cruiselines last year that was in the black? And in the black quite a bit? Maybe the article the OP was writting about was speaking specifically about NCL's POA or something.

 

NCL if you do read these boards and you read this posting... don't bother courting the traditional cruisers to NCL. Focus on keeping the cruisers you have already and you will be fine. You wil always get new people to try NCL and they will stay just like the rest of us.

[newmexicoNita]

I have to say I agree with you on everything except the casino and it's high rollers. The only way your posting would be correct would be if those high rollers were actually in those suites to begin with. We have seen many of the high rollers spend anywhere from $7,000.00 to $10,000.00 a night in the casino. I don't mean we have heard of this.. we have actually seen it many times.

 

As far as the original question, I don't think he should go after those traditional cruises. Seems foolish to me. If people sail NCL and they don't like the way NCL does business or treats their pax, etc etc, then let them go. Ther are many who love NCL's Freestyle concept and would never cruise with anyone else. That is not to say NCL could not use improvement. I think any business can always use some imporvement some where. But to me, they need to get their landbased customer service groups in check before they try to change anything on the ships. Not to hurt any of their feelings, but I have never seen a company so bad in their customer service where each rep will give you a completely different answer from the next.

 

I don't understand the article saying all of that anyway. Wasn't there just an article like in Nov that said NCL was one of the few cruiselines last year that was in the black? And in the black quite a bit? Maybe the article the OP was writting about was speaking specifically about NCL's POA or something.

 

Terry, I think you are about right. They were in the black, at least the third quarter.

 

Nita

[Dukegirl5577]

II have never seen a company so bad in their customer service where each rep will give you a completely different answer from the next.

 

EXACTLY. I find that half the time, the phone reps don't seem to have a clue what's going on, which is why I've started booking with a TA rather than directly with NCL, even though I don't truly need a TA. But since NCL's customer service is so screwy, I'd rather let a TA deal with it, not me!

[NoPiratesPlease]

DH and I enjoy the Freestyle concept and that is why we cruise with NCL. However, Mr. Sheehan should concentrate on how they are going to get people to cruise in today's financial crisis.

 

I agree NoPiratesPlease, Mr. Sheehan should stop nickel and diming passengers that have paid $1000's for a suite and they are not comped free sodas, water or a free meal at a specialty restaurant.

 

Offer better deals and discounts to your Latitudes members.

 

Great minds think alike!

 

To me, Freestyle simply means no early or late seating dining. Nothing more. For the CV level passengers, neither Freestyle nor Latitudes gets you much. All we get for PLATINUM is one "free" dinner in a specialty restaurant--when it should be free to us every night.

 

We won't even go to Tappanyake at all. Why bother? Here in NJ we know a place that with one chef can cook twice as good a hibachi meal as two can and in half the time the two take--and for about the same price per person as the add-on fee!

 

Oh...and the Jewel class Garden Villas are smaller than the Dawn class. Plus the Pearl and Gem GVs are even smaller than the Jewel and Jade's--plus you get a noisy DOS hot tub over your outdoor dining table. This is why we will NEVER take a GV on the Pearl again, or on the Gem...EVER!

 

Gives you less and less, but charges more and more. We must look like idiots to Kevin Sheehan.

[NoPiratesPlease]

I have to say I agree with you on everything except the casino and it's high rollers. The only way your posting would be correct would be if those high rollers were actually in those suites to begin with. We have seen many of the high rollers spend anywhere from $7,000.00 to $10,000.00 a night in the casino. I don't mean we have heard of this.. we have actually seen it many times. On the Sun we became friends with a guy who was playing nothing but the $25.00 to $100.00 slots and he was in the casino more than we were, and that is saying a lot. On one cruise on the Star we spoke with two different guys that cruise who each were spending over $10,000.00 a night in the casino.

 

I've seen very, very few like that...do you know what a GV costs for 2 weeks? When it was the hidden bargain, when the Star and Dawn were new, you could put 6 people in there for 2 weeks for less than $5k/person--a great deal for what you got! But it's not like that now..........If I was going to drop $7000-$10k per night in a casino, I'd be sure to go to Las Vegas where the games are more varied and the odds are better. I like Black Jack and 3-card poker but I'm not dropping big money like that! (nor do I see the point--but I'm not a high-stakes gambler).

[smeyer418]

and you will lose loyalist when you ended the NCL cruise credit card. Now it doesn't matter if I go to another cruise line(which I don't want to do)

[newmexicoNita]

EXACTLY. I find that half the time, the phone reps don't seem to have a clue what's going on, which is why I've started booking with a TA rather than directly with NCL, even though I don't truly need a TA. But since NCL's customer service is so screwy, I'd rather let a TA deal with it, not me!

 

thanks we will take the business anyway we can get it...LOL

[dznymom]

I suppose if they want to stop insulting the average robotic traditional cruiser ;) in their commercials, I can live with that, but DON'T MESS WITH MY FREESTYLE!

 

Nita, when I cruised the Carnival Legend in October, even they were testing a form of freestyle in the upper level of the main dining room. I don't know how it worked since we were with first timers and the group decided to go traditional :o I think all of the lines know Freestyle is better; they just don't know how to implement it on their built for tradional ships.

[newmexicoNita]

I suppose if they want to stop insulting the average robotic traditional cruiser ;) in their commercials, I can live with that, but DON'T MESS WITH MY FREESTYLE!

 

Nita, when I cruised the Carnival Legend in October, even they were testing a form of freestyle in the upper level of the main dining room. I don't know how it worked since we were with first timers and the group decided to go traditional :o I think all of the lines know Freestyle is better; they just don't know how to implement it on their built for tradional ships.

gee, I learn something every day, I knew RCI and Co were giving it a shot. I had expected Carnival to follow but didn't know they had. You are right, the ships not built for flex dining will not be able to make it work as well as NCL has.

 

Nita

[uppitycats]

I don't think NCL should bother with TD dining. Perhaps there wouldn't be so much negativity if they'd advertise freestyle a little better, without making fun of the traditionalists.

 

I've cruised both ways, and won't ever do the traditional dining again. While I might not always cruise NCL, I'll always choose to do the flexible dining, whatever other cruiselines might call it.

 

I do think there are things that NCL could improve. But then, I think there are things that Princess and Carnival -- the two other cruise lines I've been on -- could improve, too. But getting rid of freestyle, or trying to cater to TD, isn't one of them!

[sottovoce]

All we get for PLATINUM is one "free" dinner in a specialty restaurant--when it should be free to us every night.

I don't think it should be. You paid for a suite and you got it. What else do you want? Free airfare? Free bingo? Free wine and booze? Get serious. Sounds really selfish to me. Try Celebrity. See what they give you.

[hawaiilvr]

Here's what I don't understand. Just because a ship is "freestyle," a person can still go to dinner at the same time every night, if they wish. they can even eat with the same people every night, if they wish. It might take a minimal amount of coordination.

 

I have only cruised on NCL - once on a traditional cruise, the other two (and one next month) have been freestyle. On our first cruise, we were at a table for six, and the other two couples were best friends. My wife and I tried to interject ourselves into conversations, but they wouldn't give us the time of day. We dreaded going to dinner each evening.

 

To woo traditional cruisers back, they need to show some pictures/commercials of diners in formal wear - there are a few on every cruise in a selected dining room - sitting around a table just looking at each other as they have nothing to talk about, all ordering the staff around like they are superior with their little white envelopes in hand on the last night of the cruise. Okay, just kidding.

[newmexicoNita]

I don't think it should be. You paid for a suite and you got it. What else do you want? Free airfare? Free bingo? Free wine and booze? Get serious. Sounds really selfish to me. Try Celebrity. See what they give you.

I agree, no, why should they be given free specialty dining nightly? I have seen how the other frequent guests programs work, none do much more than NCL and the frequent guest parties on NCL, though not perfect are much better than on Celebrity of Princess. The only problem I have with the latitude program is we get credit for the number of cruises only, not the number of days sailed or the type of cabin we have. For me, this works fine, I do understand why some wish it worked more like Celebrity...

 

One more thing that I always find interesting, the phrase, nickel and diming us. I saw a referance to this on another thread today, comparing NCL with that line and saying NCL nickel and dimes everyone. I asked for an example but never got a response...The poster did make other comments, but no explanation to what nickel and diming meant..

Nita