Is auto tipping hurting service????

[tnt091605]

Let me first say that I have posted several times telling people that I do not agree with them removing the auto tips. Now let me eat my words. We just got off the Carnival Liberty last week. We had anytime dinning. There was 6 total. 3 couples all though we only all ate together 3 nights. The service on 5 or the 7 nights was just horrible. We could not even get our water glasses refilled. We would ask and they would never return. We thought maybe this was because of the anytime seating. As people are showing up at different times and it does not flow the same. But on 2 of the nights it was just like eating in the regular dinning room. So it was not the anytime dinning that was the problem. We are not picky people and roll with the flow. They just did not care if your glasses were empty or you needed anything. My wife ordered coffee each night with desert. 2 or the nights she did not get any. When they brought the desert she again asked for coffee. They never returned. We went to the pursers desk and removed the tips from the dinning room only. Took cash back to the dinning room and gave very large tips to the people that took care of us. We also tipped the hostesses and their supervisor. We really liked the anytime seating and hope that it gets worked out. We are willing to wait longer and be understanding to some extent with the service to keep this feature. But they need to at least make an effort.

[tedjazz]

I think that title is already safe in the hands of someone else. If you want you can be the "Second Most Hated Poster":D.

 

Well Ok then, I'll take the Silver Metal in this event, but I'll keep going for the Gold. ;)

[carcarzoom]

Yes, I believe that the automatic tipping affects the service that we receive---it's basic human nature. If I know that my "pay" is directly affected by the service I provide I will go out of my way to make sure my service is high quality. Occasionally we come across people who would provide the same level of service regardless of money but as a general rule------you bet----people do more if they have an opportunity to earn more--period. Automatic tipping removes incentive and is definitely affecting the quality of service aboard ships-----cruising since 1987.

[travelntreats]

Will this stop me from cruising CCL, absolutely not. Next cruise we will be Platinum and looking forward to a better time.

 

And you think that because you are going to be "platinum" (congrats BTW), this is going to increase you odds of better service ???

[tedjazz]

Yes, I believe that the automatic tipping affects the service that we receive---it's basic human nature. If I know that my "pay" is directly affected by the service I provide I will go out of my way to make sure my service is high quality. Occasionally we come across people who would provide the same level of service regardless of money but as a general rule------you bet----people do more if they have an opportunity to earn more--period. Automatic tipping removes incentive and is definitely affecting the quality of service aboard ships-----cruising since 1987.

 

Very Good Points, you're right about human nature and incentives to work hard. Let's face it, that is what Tipping is all about...reward for Good or Exceptional service after it has been received. Just showing up doesn't qualify as Good or Exceptional Service. Some folks will tell you it does, but they are wrong.

[travelntreats]

You know.....people can argue the tipping point till the end and really, it is a matter of personal choice... some like it added in advance (BTW, do you pre pay when you go out to dinner too ?) and some prefer to provide it based on the service they receive (BTW....does that sound old school theory the way it used to be on cruises and still is when dining out ?).

 

Basically it is a service fee and not a gratuity any longer in my eyes...so in essence, we are paying for the earned "wages" rather than the cruiseline building it into the cruise fare.

 

When "tipping" was treated by what it's "definition" is, from years gone by in the cruise industry, we paid higher fares than we do now......but how much of that rate difference was really going to the staff I wonder ???Perhaps not much of those higher fare differences compared to lower rates now was being paid to the staff, and back then, the staff realized that their pay scale needed to be supplemented and the only method was via "tips" which they figured out were not going to be as great for poor service vs. higher tips for excellent service rendered ?

 

I am not condoning those to remove tips or leave them in place..... it is again a personal matter and I know what works for me and what makes my decision of how to handle good or bad service.

[LounVal]

Well, one thing I have noticed from everyone's remarks is that CCL seems to be the company that comes up that most when discussing poor DR service.

It probably is due to CCL having the staff service more tables than they once did.

The pool is pretty split on auto-tipping but any discussion on tipping, whether on land or sea, lends itself to a wide array of opinions.

I like the auto-tip because it is one less thing for me to think about,and when I'm on vacation that's what I like. I can, like everyone says, give a little extra cash and/or a remark on a comment card to or about anyone that I choose.

I have learned that you can take the auto tip back. I do not think most people know that and that is probably a good thing,especial for those who lose big in the casino. I don't think I would ever remove it,even though I know you can. Overall, the staff works hard and the auto-tip seems the least I can do. And, I always do the least I can do :p.

[LHP]

I believe a change in service is from the changes that CARNIVAL has made overloading their wait and cabin staff.

 

Of course, this is just my personal opinion. But just the changes that have been made, in say the last 10 years.....I have seen the work requirements increase GREATLY for the waiters and cabin stewards.

 

I have had the privilege of getting to know many of these fine men and women. Yes, they are doing a job. And yes, they are human beings...so they want to be paid as well as possible for doing that job....

 

but they do this job because (many times) in their country...this is not just considered a job....it is considered a profession. They go to college for hotel and restaurant management. They are still working under a system where you really have to pay your dues to become upper management.

 

Now of course this does not apply to ALL the countries presented but in many of these countries...this is true.

 

And we have to remember, if auto tipping is the reason the "quality" has gone down....WHY? These auto tips can be removed and everyone (especially the staff) know this!!! Not only can the tips be removed, but you have to give a REASON...so these specific staff people are held accountable when a tip is removed....and THEY know this.

 

WE here in the US need to remember that just because hotel/restaurant jobs are not the perhaps the "most respected" in our society....that this is not the case around the world. Some countries take great pride in their service industries.

 

My niece started working for McDonalds when she was 15 year old to earn money to buy her class ring. She is now 40 years old...and OWNS 33 McDonalds!!! So yes, there is something that can be achieved by "working at McDonalds"!!

[iancal]

Like others, I think that quality of service has declined because of cruise line management reducing staff and stretching duties. Add this to the drop in some exchange rates, including USD, and many of the on board staff are making less than they did two years ago and working harder. We always tip, others do not. I cannot help but think that auto tipping is a way by the cruise lines to ensure part of the 'wage bill' is covered off by customers.

[Chigirlcruzin]

There will be disagreement with this, as the more generous will say give more, and the cheapstakes will say give less.

 

 

So, if somebody doesn't tip above the auto-tip to at least the level you laid out, they're a cheapskate? I'm hoping I'm misinterpreting. I've tipped over and above for excellent service, I've left the autotip in place for adequate service. I did a B2B in the fall. I had an excellent room steward for both legs, so I tipped him extra ($25 each leg). For the first leg, my dining room server wasn't very good. He was very friendly and he tried hard, but he never asked our names, forgot dishes, didn't bring the entire table's courses at the same time, and mixed up dishes. He did not get an extra tip, but I did leave the autotip in place. The next leg, I had the best server I've ever had! She got an extra tip ($40 for a 5 day cruise). I do not consider myself a cheapskate for not giving waiter 1 an extra tip. And, as Kurban pointed out, the autotip IS the tip. It's not a minimum.

[Chigirlcruzin]

The last time I remember giving tips on the last night was in 2001, didn't go on a cruise in 2002. In 2003 it was auto tips.........

 

 

I cruised Sept 02, and it was autotips then.

[dan40]

I read these 'complaints' about auto-tipping hurting service. What I'm really reading is people complaining because there is now a system that makes it difficult or obvious when they stiff the help.

In the days before [and the cause of] auto-tipping, often more THAN HALF of all passengers DID NOT tip, ANYBODY, ANYTHING!!!!!

I find that many/most of the truly CHEAP do not want to be known as such, so auto-tipping works. The crews get a better percentage of passengers tipping, so the crew is happier. Adding tips to the cruise price just begets a different complaint.

Since the advent of AT, I have had the best service I've ever had on any cruiseline. And I have had service nearly as bad as the worst I ever experienced, long before AT came to be.

Not everybody is predisposed to be a waiter, I would be an unbelievably bad one, and its possible that the pool of truly good waiters is being deeply tapped. For instance, today there are more ships with "CARNIVAL" in their name than there were TOTAL cruiseships when I started cruising. And EACH of today's ships serves 4 times more pax then the old small ships did.

Even if in the old days only half the servers were really good and if that percentage remains the same today, it means there are THOUSANDS of servers that aren't really good. That's got nothing to do with AT, that's the need to staff hundreds of giant ships.

 

The true complaint that many above stated is the lower staffing levels, and that is not a reflection of AT.

 

Dan

[tef43]

The argument that auto-tipping somehow affects service quality is spurious at best, since the staff is well-aware that the passenger may adjust the gratuity.

 

I agree completely with Dan that the loudest complainers are those who are now forced to draw attention to themselves at the Purser's desk in order to remove the charge from their S&S accounts.

 

I submit that replacing the auto-tipping with something akin to NCL's "Mandatory service charge" would do more to "hurt service."

[tedjazz]

The argument that auto-tipping somehow affects service quality is spurious at best, since the staff is well-aware that the passenger may adjust the gratuity.

 

I agree completely with Dan that the loudest complainers are those who are now forced to draw attention to themselves at the Purser's desk in order to remove the charge from their S&S accounts.

 

I submit that replacing the auto-tipping with something akin to NCL's "Mandatory service charge" would do more to "hurt service."

 

Here's a solution...maybe when passengers go to the pursers desk to remove their tips, the pursuer could make an announcement over the ships public address system..." Mr./Mrs **** from Cabin *** has JUST removed their tips" and then they would be really looked down upon by the crew and passengers, you know... everyone call them Cheapos and Deadbeats, likewise when more tips are added, the purser could announce that Mr./Mrs. **** from Cabin *** has JUST added $$$ to their tips, that way they could feed their larger than average EGO. You know make it like a contest, who can be the cheapest and who can most generous. Award the coveted "Ship on a Stick" to the winners. Sound Good? :)

[LHP]

So, if somebody doesn't tip above the auto-tip to at least the level you laid out, they're a cheapskate? I'm hoping I'm misinterpreting. I've tipped over and above for excellent service, I've left the autotip in place for adequate service. I did a B2B in the fall. I had an excellent room steward for both legs, so I tipped him extra ($25 each leg). For the first leg, my dining room server wasn't very good. He was very friendly and he tried hard, but he never asked our names, forgot dishes, didn't bring the entire table's courses at the same time, and mixed up dishes. He did not get an extra tip, but I did leave the autotip in place. The next leg, I had the best server I've ever had! She got an extra tip ($40 for a 5 day cruise). I do not consider myself a cheapskate for not giving waiter 1 an extra tip. And, as Kurban pointed out, the autotip IS the tip. It's not a minimum.

 

You are correct. You are NOT a cheapstake if you leave the auto tip in place and do not tip any extra.

 

There have been times I have tipped extra...there are times I have not.

I have always left the auto-tip in place because I simply consider it the cost of cruising.

 

Kurban is correct....the autotip IS the tip. It is not a minimum.

[CruisnMom007]

I usually stay away from this topic as it seems to be a very sensitive subject matter to some on the boards. I have to tell you, we just got home from Elation this week. In the past I have always tipped IN PERSON. I have always felt that is how tipping should be as we don't tip ahead in a restaurant. Anyhow, this time, we left the tips on our S & S cards. The service was horrilbe!:eek: I know I was not the only one who noticed the decline in "service". We are not new cruisers so we know within reason, what to expect. In the dining room, the ladies at our table were treated secondly, that was a first! In the previous cruises, the women were always asked for thier orders first, served first, etc. We had to ask for water to be refilled. Our orders were all mixed up and given to the wrong people (that happened at every meal!). We barely saw the waiter at all. Maitre D...never saw him! I heard his voice once over the PA. We were not seated, we had to find our table and seat ourselves. On one day, I unrolled my napkin from my silverware only to find my napkin WAS USED AND DIRTY! I about died! It was very very odd. I thought maybe it was just our table and experience, but we heard throughout the ship others saying the same things. Our cabin was not "clean". It was very dusty on a daily basis. We had to ask for ice every single day. The only thing that was done was our beds were made every day. If I wanted a clean room, I had to do it myself.

 

On the flip side, the Purser who handled my special needs was OUTSTANDING and the CD was great! The entertainment staff was fun and actually mingled with us after hours. I loved that! The Walk for a Cure was awesome!

 

So, most of us seemed to think its due to the workers not having to "work" to earn your tips so they don't try as hard to please you. I know for sure that from now on, I will be tipping in person and I will no longer leave them on my card. I don't ever leave anyone out who deserves the tips. Even the omlette guy! Oh and for the employees like the Purser, the other staff that showed outstanding customer service.... besides great comments on the card, we sent them a cake for Valentines Day, we had the bar tender deliver a drink of choice to them on their breaks. They deserved it and you can really see how appreciative they were.

 

Again, this is a very personal choice for some cruisers. Some like the convenience of the pre-paid gratuities. I just miss the quality of service we used to get:(. I hope it gets better!!!!

[LHP]

I usually stay away from this topic as it seems to be a very sensitive subject matter to some on the boards. I have to tell you, we just got home from Elation this week. In the past I have always tipped IN PERSON. I have always felt that is how tipping should be as we don't tip ahead in a restaurant. Anyhow, this time, we left the tips on our S & S cards. The service was horrilbe!:eek: I know I was not the only one who noticed the decline in "service". We are not new cruisers so we know within reason, what to expect. In the dining room, the ladies at our table were treated secondly, that was a first! In the previous cruises, the women were always asked for thier orders first, served first, etc. We had to ask for water to be refilled. Our orders were all mixed up and given to the wrong people (that happened at every meal!). We barely saw the waiter at all. Maitre D...never saw him! I heard his voice once over the PA. We were not seated, we had to find our table and seat ourselves. On one day, I unrolled my napkin from my silverware only to find my napkin WAS USED AND DIRTY! I about died! It was very very odd. I thought maybe it was just our table and experience, but we heard throughout the ship others saying the same things. Our cabin was not "clean". It was very dusty on a daily basis. We had to ask for ice every single day. The only thing that was done was our beds were made every day. If I wanted a clean room, I had to do it myself.

 

On the flip side, the Purser who handled my special needs was OUTSTANDING and the CD was great! The entertainment staff was fun and actually mingled with us after hours. I loved that! The Walk for a Cure was awesome!

 

So, most of us seemed to think its due to the workers not having to "work" to earn your tips so they don't try as hard to please you. I know for sure that from now on, I will be tipping in person and I will no longer leave them on my card. I don't ever leave anyone out who deserves the tips. Even the omlette guy! Oh and for the employees like the Purser, the other staff that showed outstanding customer service.... besides great comments on the card, we sent them a cake for Valentines Day, we had the bar tender deliver a drink of choice to them on their breaks. They deserved it and you can really see how appreciative they were.

 

Again, this is a very personal choice for some cruisers. Some like the convenience of the pre-paid gratuities. I just miss the quality of service we used to get:(. I hope it gets better!!!!

 

 

Sorry you had an off cruise, but I don't believe we should make blanket statements about tipping based on one cruise as being the cause.

 

We have 30 Carnival cruises just in the past 10 years . We have cruised many times before the auto tip and many times after the auto tip and the only change in service we have seen is the additional responsibilities that Corp has put on these folks.

[Tbay-eh]

I have always left my auto tips in place and then will tip above and beyond when warranted, however, I think this should not be seen as a tip as it is manditory unless you choose to remove them, NOOOOTTT. The auto tip should be considered a service fee and part of the cruise price and paid by all and not removable. I admit I have had bad service in an area but not all. We have NEVER had a bad steward and I will gave him extra. Our diningroom waiter was leaving at the next port and you could tell he was anxious to go and the service was less than good so he got nothing extra, this happened a couple of times. Never saw the Maitre d so he got bugger all, as usual - only ever saw him on the second to last night. The 24 hour pizza guy was awesome - made me wild mushroom, feta cheese, purple onion and black olive pizza to die for and he got a tip every time he made it for me. The Lido staff were a lot of the same people in the diningroom at supper and lunch- and I always figure they deserve so much more, again I will often leave money on the table when they clear. A tip is exactly that - a reward for excellent service. I do not mind and never will mind paying a prepaid service fee but do not call it a tip, a tip is a choice.

[Chigirlcruzin]

A tip is exactly that - a reward for excellent service. I do not mind and never will mind paying a prepaid service fee but do not call it a tip, a tip is a choice.

 

You do have a choice. You can remove or reduce the auto-tip.

 

And I disagree that the tip is a reward for excellent service. I feel that the tip is the "pay" for doing that service, and it goes up or down depending on how good or bad the service is. The reward for excellent service is a larger tip.

[CruisnMom007]

Sorry you had an off cruise, but I don't believe we should make blanket statements about tipping based on one cruise as being the cause.

 

We have 30 Carnival cruises just in the past 10 years . We have cruised many times before the auto tip and many times after the auto tip and the only change in service we have seen is the additional responsibilities that Corp has put on these folks.

 

I am sorry, I am not trying to making a blanket statement...I know we don't have as many cruises in our folio as some, we do have more than a few, and we are working on more! LOL However, I have been on THIS ship before, only a year or so ago and it was night and day service in the dining room and cabin service. Who knows what is happening...maybe your right it is corportate to blame and that is not good at all! I don't go "looking" for the bad service to make a note, you just notice the difference when your past cruise on that particular ship was so different. Again, this was not just our experience on board. It was mentioned by quite a few others as well. I know this was the first 3 dayer for Elation. Maybe that was it?? I don't know how that could be though.

Again like I said, It doesn't stop me from cruising with Carnival. I think what some posters have said on here is that there seems to be a difference in service with this particular "tipping" policy I am begining to wonder if there may be some truth to it.

 

I can honestly say that we personally NEVER EVER stiff when it comes to tipping. My DH is known for being a very generous tipper, sometimes way more than what is expected!! lol

 

 

I don't consider our cruise as being a bad one or "off" per say, we really had a great Valentines Day Cruise and met some of our fellow Cruise Critic members on board! I left very happy. I am a stay home Mom, I am used to tending to myself and to cleaning 24/7 anyhow! lol (that was meant to be funny not serious). Plus I won the "guess the carat weight" contest in the jewelry shop yesterday! :D

[tedjazz]

CrusnMom007,

DW and I did the Elation two months ago and agree with you that the Service was awful. It was by far the worst of the 14 cruises we have been on. I too hope it gets better.

[Tbay-eh]

You do have a choice. You can remove or reduce the auto-tip.

 

And I disagree that the tip is a reward for excellent service. I feel that the tip is the "pay" for doing that service, and it goes up or down depending on how good or bad the service is. The reward for excellent service is a larger tip.

 

I think you and I will never agree on what a tip is and that is fine. I think a tip is a reward for good service and you think a larger tip is a reward, I was a waitress and got paid a salary (not much) for doing a service but my tip was a bonus and I made sure that I did extra for it. I can honestly say that I have left a restaurant and not left a tip ( not very often - and only once that I can actually think of) but the service was poor and totally appalling. I have not and will not remove the autotip even if I experience bad service because there are a lot of people involved not just one or two.

[Chigirlcruzin]

I think you and I will never agree on what a tip is and that is fine. I think a tip is a reward for good service and you think a larger tip is a reward, I was a waitress and got paid a salary (not much) for doing a service but my tip was a bonus and I made sure that I did extra for it. I can honestly say that I have left a restaurant and not left a tip ( not very often - and only once that I can actually think of) but the service was poor and totally appalling. I have not and will not remove the autotip even if I experience bad service because there are a lot of people involved not just one or two.

 

Yes, I agree to disagree;). Seriously, tipping is a personal thing, and there's no one correct answer. These threads can go on all day, but they are really pointless because so much depends on how you were raised, regionality, personal beliefs, etc. What's stated here is never going to change anybody's mind.

[Kurbanfan]

A tip is exactly that - a reward for excellent service. I do not mind and never will mind paying a prepaid service fee but do not call it a tip, a tip is a choice.

 

Ditto!

[Florida Gator]

It's O.K. to admit that Carnival DOES have some employees that doesn't live up to expectations. Our cruise a couple of weeks ago on the Glory (lot's of mention of the Glory in these posts...) was a perfect example.

 

Our room steward was great, did his job and (as a bonus) had a great personality. In addition to his regular tip, I also gave him an additional tip the last day. He earned it and helped make our cruise great.

 

On the opposite side, our head waiter was awful. He stood around, would not fill tea or water glasses even after being asked to and had the personality of a stick. I know some think that everything is always the cruisers fault and the staff can never do wrong but sometimes you just get a bad one. It is no ones fault (unless Carnival does not address the situation).

 

I had a similar problem as a previous poster in that after I reported the problem, no one ever followed up the last two nights to see if problem was resolved. The assistant waiter was great and we were sure to let everyone know that, in person and on comment card.

 

We have every right to expect great service and adjust compensation accordingly. Carnival agrees with you and allows you to adjust your tip UNLESS YOU PREPAY YOUR TIPS! We always prepay tips so, when service is bad, we have no recourse. I will not pre-pay tips again. I will just let Carnival add to sail and sign, leaving me options, if I choose to use them.