Crown & Anchor Program Revisions - join the merged discussions here

[sealord]

Serious question, not meaning to inflame:

 

how would grandfathering in the Diamonds help anything, if the true problem is overcrowding?

 

Yes, it would make Diamonds happier, but would not solve the problem. If the concierge is overwhelmed with ticket requests, etc., due to volume of people allowed to make requests, grandfathering does not alleviate that problem.

 

There were many options that would have reduced the "number" of people they were having to 'handle', and it was a problem of their own making. First, a divorce is in order. Take the C&A benefit away from the Celebrity folks and vice versa. The programs were apples and oranges, and any Celebrity Elite who didn't switch to RCCL C&A when given reciprocal benefits, just didn't understand the program. Restrict C&A (whatever) status to only the cruisers who earn that status ... not everyone at the same address. Those steps alone would dramatically reduce the crowding issue. And the overflow lounges work well. Let the 'suites' have the CL, and require C&A to use the overflow venues ... no big deal. The cost of a few drinks is nothing compared to losing a large percentage of your customer base. And it occurs to me that there are probably "other" special people who some how get the little white "CL keycard" ... get control of that program.:rolleyes:

[PSCruiser]

There were many options that would have reduced the "number" of people they were having to 'handle', and it was a problem of their own making. First, a divorce is in order. Take the C&A benefit away from the Celebrity folks and vice versa. The programs were apples and oranges, and any Celebrity Elite who didn't switch to RCCL C&A when given reciprocal benefits, just didn't understand the program. Restrict C&A (whatever) status to only the cruisers who earn that status ... not everyone at the same address. Those steps alone would dramatically reduce the crowding issue. And the overflow lounges work well. Let the 'suites' have the CL, and require C&A to use the overflow venues ... no big deal. The cost of a few drinks is nothing compared to losing a large percentage of your customer base. And it occurs to me that there are probably "other" special people who some how get the little white "CL keycard" ... get control of that program.:rolleyes:

 

Best, and most logical, solution I've seen so far. If RC had adopted this approach, the crowding situation would be under control, and this thread wouldn't exist - such a shame.

[rascalious]

There were many options that would have reduced the "number" of people they were having to 'handle', and it was a problem of their own making. First, a divorce is in order. Take the C&A benefit away from the Celebrity folks and vice versa. The programs were apples and oranges, and any Celebrity Elite who didn't switch to RCCL C&A when given reciprocal benefits, just didn't understand the program. Restrict C&A (whatever) status to only the cruisers who earn that status ... not everyone at the same address. Those steps alone would dramatically reduce the crowding issue. And the overflow lounges work well. Let the 'suites' have the CL, and require C&A to use the overflow venues ... no big deal. The cost of a few drinks is nothing compared to losing a large percentage of your customer base. And it occurs to me that there are probably "other" special people who some how get the little white "CL keycard" ... get control of that program.:rolleyes:

I completely agree. This option should have been excercised and trialed before they rushed to disenfranchise many loyal Diamond members.

[Oville]

Take the C&A benefit away from the Celebrity folks and vice versa.:rolleyes:

 

How many people do you think cruise RCCL as Diamond because they were Elite on Celebrity? My guess is the reverse it true.

[tomnmary2]

Shareholder benefit is still there, just can't be combined with future cruise booking. No reason to do future cruise bookings as the shareholder benefit is better at certain levels. It does seem as though Royal is "shooting itself in the foot" by eliminating those who are currently Diamond from the CL. We also anticipated some changes and were able to become Diamond+ recently. We have friends, though who are a few cruises from that and are quite disappointed. Too bad Royal couldn't have figured a way to "grandfather" in the current Diamonds.

[Oville]

Shareholder benefit is still there, just can't be combined with future cruise booking. No reason to do future cruise bookings as the shareholder benefit is better at certain levels.

 

 

But the shareholder isn't there if you use a balcony discount.

[mojitodiva]

I see another business genius here. First of all it is not about just an expense, and when did RC ever say it was? ( They will still be giving Free Drinks on the ships that will carry about 40% of the fleets pax with in the next 18 months). I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, though. A company like RC or any other looks at revenues, and how they can generate them, while controlling it's expenses.

Let's see if the 100 Ds buy 2 drinks each instead at an ave of 6.50 that is $1300 in revenue generated per day. For 7 days it is about $9200, with the same $882 cost. Take $9200 net x 10 ships for 52 weeks. Over 4.5MIL, not a bad increase in revenue.

 

I've read about a lot of pax saying they will go elsewhere but most have made other excuses why they can't cancel just yet. Actually very few have cancelled. Let's say 20% actually cancel, and I think I am over estimating it. That's 20 cabins, using your 100 D person analogy, no matter what type. RC will fill those cabins, or come fairly close to it, and probably generate more revenue again, with on board purchases , excursions etc.

 

Most new pax or some 2 or 3 timers, or even more, aren't worrying about the free drinks it may take them 5 or 10 yrs to get. They are there for the other things RC has to offer, which is more appealing to a younger pax now, and even families, which is what RC, Carnival, NCL are opting for.

No company intentionally tries to p_ss off its customers. Business plans have to constantly change with the industry and competition.

 

All of a sudden we have all these "Loyal" pax turning on RC because of a few free drinks, and now also coming up with other things to complain about as well. If the only reason someone kept cruising with RC was the perks, but thought everything else was crap, and was unhappy with RC, as seems to be some sentiments now, then who is the fool here. There's also no loyalty either if you can be swayed that easily. Was there no other reason to sail with RC? There was never a guarantee the C/A programs wouldn't change. No one promised anything. Companies change their loyalty programs all the time. Maybe people need to stop being so naive.

 

RC will come out of this just fine. Btw, the stock closed over $10 today, and has been over $9 for a cpl of weeks now. I doubt that any one buying feels RC is going to fall on their face here.

 

I am one who has always been for, if you ain't happy, don't give em your dough. I am sure there may be another line for you somewhere, and thats ok, you won't be missed.

 

 

Excellent Excellent Excellent post!!! :D:cool::cool::D

[Oville]

Excellent Excellent Excellent post!!! :D:cool::cool::D

 

Are you D+?

[sealord]

How many people do you think cruise RCCL as Diamond because they were Elite on Celebrity? My guess is the reverse it true.

 

Celebrity has no Concierge Lounge, their coupon book was so good we used none of them, and the other Elite benefits I found to be not worth talking about. Elite members who came to RCCL got the "parties", the "brunches", the wine tastings, and the Concierge Lounge. As I said, and I have experienced both, the programs are "apples and oranges". And there are people "here" who have said that they made "that" switch ... and enjoyed the Concierge Lounge all the time they were becoming C&A Diamond Plus.:cool:

[Benita]

Us too, us too...please! We have Junior Suites booked on Radiance and Navigator. We are --->this<--- close to D+. Ooh, there's an idea. I really hope that Royal Caribbean will reconsider the exclusion and total disregard of their Diamond members. If they don't correct this in the near future, maybe they should consider letting Junior Suites have access to concierge instead? :D

What a wonderful surprise that would be! I'm sure it would result in more positive feedback than all the negatives they have been providing lately. Wishful thinking is still allowed![/QT

 

Then they would start charging a lot more for the junior suites. The JS is not that much smaller then the GS, but much, much less money. The JS is a fair amount larger than the balcony and often not a lot more money. If they started giving JS concierge privileges, they will sell out really fast at the present prices and then the prices will shoot up. IMHO, the JS is one of the best kept secrets on the RCL ships. You might not get the concierge, but you get a really nice cabin at a still affordable rate.

[Coralc]

How many people do you think cruise RCCL as Diamond because they were Elite on Celebrity? My guess is the reverse it true.

 

Actually there are a lot...especially those Elite Celebrity members that decide to bring the children, or adult children and and/or grandchildren along on a cruise. Royal Caribbean is a much more popular choice for families. We have met quite a few in most of the concierge lounges.

 

I think the suggestion of splitting the programs again is a very good one. We haven't really seen anything that would lure us to Celebrity. :)

[DHADEN]

....Ok, "Stockholder";

How do you think the stock is going to go anywhere but down (AGAIN) when the ships are sailiing with 150 cabins empty (at an average of $1500 per cabin per week - why don't you do the math)!!!

 

Take a look at these numbers and tell us all again what a GREAT DECISION RCI IS MAKING:

 

Average cost of a drink given in the CL = about 63cents.

Figure 100 Diamond Members having a couple of drinks per night

(that's a very high number compared to what we've actually seen on our last 5 cruises), but that comes to $126 per night.

On a 7-night cruise that would be a whopping $882 in savings by KICKING OUT THE DIAMONDS (whoop-Di-doo)

 

Here's the other side (the actual real life)

When ONLY ONE Diamond Member family decides to cancel their $2,500 (average price)balcony cabin and give the money to Princess, HAL, Carnival, etc.

$2,500 lost in bookings

$ $300 (average) in lost On Board Sales

$ 200 in lost Casino Revenue (a very conservative estimate)

$ 200 in lost Excursions

$xx,xxx in lost Future Bookings and GOD ONLY KNOWS how many other people they told to go elsewhere!!:confused:

)From what we're seeeing here, it will be a lot more than ONE per cruise that will be cancelling.)

 

Why don't you add those numbers up and kiss your stock value goodbye.

 

My fellow CC poster, Curley;

There are so many things wrong with your response, I don't even know where to begin.

 

I see another business genius here.

 

How about your snide beginning. Why did you feel it neccessary to be insulting?

 

First of all it is not about just an expense, and when did RC ever say it was? ( They will still be giving Free Drinks on the ships that will carry about 40% of the fleets pax with in the next 18 months).

 

Granted, maybe I'm not the "buseness genuis" you are, but,

What the ..... are you talking about??????

 

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, though. A company like RC or any other looks at revenues, and how they can generate them, while controlling it's expenses.

 

Your first mistake is in thinking that "Controlling Expenses" is going to help you "Generate Revenues" if you P_ss off your customers to do it.

Let's see:

In todays economy should we

A) Do something to get customers to BOOK MORE CRUISES

B) Do something that will make our best customers CANCEL THEIR CURRENTLY BOOKED CRUISES.

Should we

A) Create an atmosphere so people will go out and tell others they should book with RCI

B) P-ss of our best customers so they will go out and tell all their friends and family to STAY AWAY FROM RCI

I suppose you would pick "B" in both cases - common sense would pick "A"

 

Let's see if the 100 Ds buy 2 drinks each instead at an ave of 6.50 that is $1300 in revenue generated per day. For 7 days it is about $9200, with the same $882 cost. Take $9200 net x 10 ships for 52 weeks. Over 4.5MIL, not a bad increase in revenue.

 

I remember in sales training they taught us to inflate any stat-numbers to make them look larger than reality..... But you just make people not believe anything you say. If people are not getting the free drinks why in the world do you think "that means they will just go out and buy them".

The whole point is that they WON'T BE THERE TO GENERATE ANYTHING. Why can't you comprehend the obvious??

 

I've read about a lot of pax saying they will go elsewhere ....blah blah blah blah.....RC will fill those cabins, or come fairly close to it, and probably generate more revenue again, with on board purchases , excursions etc.

 

OH REALLY!! Then tell me why our cruise this July (the busiest time of the year) is close to final payment and STILL HAS OVER 150 CABINS AVAILABLE. (at an average price of $1500 per cabin..... Well you do the math and tell me about "Increasing / Generating Revenue)

 

Most new pax or some 2 or 3 timers, or even more, aren't worrying about the free drinks it may take them 5 or 10 yrs to get. They are there for the other things RC has to offer, which is more appealing to a younger pax now, and even families, which is what RC, Carnival, NCL are opting for.

 

Yeah, but Carnival is offering it at about 60% of the price that RCI is wanting; and without the discounts/OBC that RCI has taken away!

 

No company intentionally tries to p_ss off its customers. Business plans have to constantly change with the industry and competition.

 

This is ONE statement you made that is correct. Not intentionally, but even the highest executives make some MAJOR mistakes in their decisions.

 

All of a sudden we have all these "Loyal" pax turning on RC because of a few free drinks, and now also coming up with other things to complain about as well. If the only reason someone kept cruising with RC was the perks, but thought everything else was crap, and was unhappy with RC, as seems to be some sentiments now, then who is the fool here. There's also no loyalty either if you can be swayed that easily. Was there no other reason to sail with RC? There was never a guarantee the C/A programs wouldn't change. No one promised anything.

 

OK, there was so much "CRAP" (as you put it) in this paragraph, I wasn't going to nitpick; but your last statement was too much.

The whole OUTRAGE from the Diamond members is because RCI DID PROMISE, "sail with us 10 times (spend about $20-30 THOUSAND) and you will get to enjoy the Concierge Lounge". Again, Why can't you comprehend the obvious??

 

RC will come out of this just fine. Btw, the stock closed over $10 today, and has been over $9 for a cpl of weeks now. I doubt that any one buying feels RC is going to fall on their face here.

 

This is the most idiotic and insulting of all....... If you're the Business Genius, then look at the history....... Last year the stock was $35-$40!!! RCI also promised "Buy 100 shares and we'll give you OBC for every cruise you book." I waited and bought it at $23!! (A real bargain huh???) And now they have taken that promise away too!! How the heck can you say $10 is any good????

[Oville]

Actually there are a lot...especially those Elite Celebrity members that decide to bring the children, or adult children and and/or grandchildren along on a cruise. Royal Caribbean is a much more popular choice for families. We have met quite a few in most of the concierge lounges.

 

I think your suggestion is a very good one. We haven't really seen anything that would lure us to Celebrity. :)

 

I'm a D+ who has started to cruise Celebrity, and yes, as a result of Royal I am Elite. Funny thing, on the Celebrity cruises we've taken there have been, OH MY, no concierge lounge. We've enjoyed Celebrity's two parties for return customers, but guys, we all can cruise and be happy without the CL.

 

Having said that, I totally think the Diamond members have been "Royal"ly screwed.!!!!!

[Oville]

My fellow CC poster, Curley;

There are so many things wrong with your response, I don't even know where to begin.

 

 

 

How about your snide beginning. Why did you feel it neccessary to be insulting?

 

 

 

Granted, maybe I'm not the "buseness genuis" you are, but,

What the ..... are you talking about??????

 

 

 

Your first mistake is in thinking that "Controlling Expenses" is going to help you "Generate Revenues" if you P_ss off your customers to do it.

Let's see:

In todays economy should we

A) Do something to get customers to BOOK MORE CRUISES

B) Do something that will make our best customers CANCEL THEIR CURRENTLY BOOKED CRUISES.

Should we

A) Create an atmosphere so people will go out and tell others they should book with RCI

B) P-ss of our best customers so they will go out and tell all their friends and family to STAY AWAY FROM RCI

 

I suppose you would pick "B" in both cases - common sense would pick "A"

 

 

 

 

I remember in sales training they taught us to inflate any stat-numbers to make them look larger than reality..... But you just make people not believe anything you say. If people are not getting the free drinks why in the world do you think "that means they will just go out and buy them".

The whole point is that they WON'T BE THERE TO GENERATE ANYTHING. Why can't you comprehend the obvious??

 

 

 

OH REALLY!! Then tell me why our cruise this July (the busiest time of the year) is close to final payment and STILL HAS OVER 150 CABINS AVAILABLE. (at an average price of $1500 per cabin..... Well you do the math and tell me about "Increasing / Generating Revenue)

 

 

 

Yeah, but Carnival is offering it at about 60% of the price that RCI is wanting; and without the discounts/OBC that RCI has taken away!

 

 

 

This is ONE statement you made that is correct. Not intentionally, but even the highest executives make some MAJOR mistakes in their decisions.

 

 

 

OK, there was so much "CRAP" (as you put it) in this paragraph, I wasn't going to nitpick; but your last statement was too much.

The whole OUTRAGE from the Diamond members is because RCI DID PROMISE, "sail with us 10 times (spend about $20-30 THOUSAND) and you will get to enjoy the Concierge Lounge". Again, Why can't you comprehend the obvious??

 

 

 

This is the most idiotic and insulting of all....... If you're the Business Genius, then look at the history....... Last year the stock was $35-$40!!! RCI also promised "Buy 100 shares and we'll give you OBC for every cruise you book." I waited and bought it at $23!! (A real bargain huh???) And now they have taken that promise away too!! How the heck can you say $10 is any good????

 

Dizzying, the reason Royal has given for the change is overcrowding, no mention of the economy.

[mojitodiva]

Are you D+?

 

 

 

No I'm a D.

 

 

 

(Diamond that is not Bra Size) :eek::eek:

 

 

 

:p

[beachbuddy]

I can't believe you all are still Crying!!! Grow up, change lines if you want to, but let us get back to real RCL issues PLEASE!!!!

 

Excuse me but these are RCL issues on this thread and you have a choice to either come here and read them or to not come here and read them. If it bothers you so much, perhaps you should not come here.

[Oville]

No I'm a D.

 

 

 

(Diamond that is not Bra Size) :eek:

 

 

 

:p

 

;);):D:p, but how far are you from the next cup size?

[Ladylouwho]

And MANY of us think it is an EXCELLENT decision and will lobby for it to be kept as it is! If you don't like it either get over it or move on to Carnival! :D

 

Yeah, Rah, Zis Boom Bah. Cheerleading anyone?

 

I don't like it and I am doing what I want to do. I don't have to "get over" anything. I don't have to "move" anywhere. I call my own shots.

 

Hey go do your "lobbying" with RCI if you can tear yourself away from the entertainment of this thread.

[Ladylouwho]

A cruise line loyalty program can not be compared to a hotel chain's. It's a whole different animal.

 

Yeah and the one that Royal Caribbean had was the best in the business and worked SO WELL that their biggest complaint seems to be that they have TOO MANY Diamond Members. Well, they don't have to worry, their "brilliant" decision to kick the loyal Diamond in the head should solve that "problem", LOL!!!!!!!!!

[Ladylouwho]

Us too, us too...please! We have Junior Suites booked on Radiance and Navigator. We are --->this<--- close to D+. Ooh, there's an idea. I really hope that Royal Caribbean will reconsider the exclusion and total disregard of their Diamond members. If they don't correct this in the near future, maybe they should consider letting Junior Suites have access to concierge instead? :D

What a wonderful surprise that would be! I'm sure it would result in more positive feedback than all the negatives they have been providing lately. Wishful thinking is still allowed!

 

Hey Patti, That is what we are hoping as well. We are a little further back in our Diamond status than you and Bill. This whole thing STINKS!

 

Hope you guys are doing well. Enjoy your cruises!

 

Colleen

[sealord]

I'm a D+ who has started to cruise Celebrity, and yes, as a result of Royal I am Elite. Funny thing, on the Celebrity cruises we've taken there have been, OH MY, no concierge lounge. We've enjoyed Celebrity's two parties for return customers, but guys, we all can cruise and be happy without the CL.

 

Having said that, I totally think the Diamond members have been "Royal"ly screwed.!!!!!

 

"...but guys, we all can cruise and be happy without the CL."

 

scuzzzmmeee! You are D+ and "we can all cruise and be happy without the CL." OK ... no problem, you can transfer your D+ status, which did not exist when I signed up for the C&A Society, to me, and take my now worthless Diamond status in exchange ... and then ... we will all cruise and be happy! The fact that you know we have been "Royal"ly screwed does not make me feel warm and fuzzy. It should be obvious that moving the goal posts is not as big an issue to those people who are already in the 'stands' beyond the new goal posts. "We are aboard ... pull up the gang plank!" In January 2002, or before, they didn't 'promise' the Concierge Lounge to "Diamond Plus" passengers ... they promised it to "Diamond" passengers. I'm still looking for all those folks who understand, "Bait and Switch".:cool:

[Ladylouwho]

Dizzying, the reason Royal has given for the change is overcrowding, no mention of the economy.

 

Absolutely true. That is the REASON they gave us. But unfortunately they are not being honest There is Plenty of room in overflow lounges between the hours of 5-8:30pm. Another reason RCI blew it in their handling of the situation.

 

Kick your loyal, long time customers in the head and then LIE about the reason.

[Ladylouwho]

There were many options that would have reduced the "number" of people they were having to 'handle', and it was a problem of their own making. First, a divorce is in order. Take the C&A benefit away from the Celebrity folks and vice versa. The programs were apples and oranges, and any Celebrity Elite who didn't switch to RCCL C&A when given reciprocal benefits, just didn't understand the program. Restrict C&A (whatever) status to only the cruisers who earn that status ... not everyone at the same address. Those steps alone would dramatically reduce the crowding issue. And the overflow lounges work well. Let the 'suites' have the CL, and require C&A to use the overflow venues ... no big deal. The cost of a few drinks is nothing compared to losing a large percentage of your customer base. And it occurs to me that there are probably "other" special people who some how get the little white "CL keycard" ... get control of that program.:rolleyes:

 

Great post. Please e-mail your ideas to C&A at RCI, if you haven't already.

 

Colleen

[Oville]

"...but guys, we all can cruise and be happy without the CL."

 

scuzzzmmeee! You are D+ and "we can all cruise and be happy without the CL." OK ... no problem, you can transfer your D+ status, which did not exist when I signed up for the C&A Society, to me, and take my now worthless Diamond status in exchange ... and then ... we will all cruise and be happy! The fact that you know we have been "Royal"ly screwed does not make me feel warm and fuzzy. It should be obvious that moving the goal posts is not as big an issue to those people who are already in the 'stands' beyond the new goal posts. "We are aboard ... pull up the gang plank!" In January 2002, or before, they didn't 'promise' the Concierge Lounge to "Diamond Plus" passengers ... they promised it to "Diamond" passengers. I'm still looking for all those folks who understand, "Bait and Switch".:cool:

 

Too bad, because I really do feel badly for those who have been Royally Screwed(Ha,ha, a new class, not RC but RS) and I'd been equally pis*ed about if I were in your position.

 

And, sorry, but we can cruise and be happy and not to beholden to the CL and the loud crowd that has become this perk.

 

Oh by the way, we took our first cruise in Nov. '06 so we have clearly been soooooooooooooooooo Loyal to Royal but can see beyond this one cruise line and have had a really good times on others.

[Oville]

Absolutely true. That is the REASON they gave us. But unfortunately they are not being honest There is Plenty of room in overflow lounges between the hours of 5-8:30pm. Another reason RCI blew it in their handling of the situation.

 

Kick your loyal, long time customers in the head and then LIE about the reason.

 

Guess you haven't cruised on those long cruises that attract long time RCCL cruisers. There is nothing pleasant about the CLs or the overflow lounges.

 

Good grief, now I'm having to explain myself. Diamond members have indeed been screwed!!!!