Just came back from a barf fest on the Volendam

[cruiserman79]

cruiserman - I am glad your family is recovering. I have never had noro but two people in our group got noro on our last HAL cruise in March. Both of them said that they were sicker than they ever had been before (one of them required intravenous fluids because of severe dehydration) and that it was by far the worst they had ever felt. But, I am wondering if you actually had noro. Both of them also said that they were told that usually only one person in the cabin gets it - I don't know if that is true or not since I have absolutely no medical training at all. But, if it is true, perhaps your family had something other than noro - just a thought especially because of how sick the baby was.

 

Thanks for your concern, I really appreciate it.

 

I had never really thought about norovirus either, although I am just assuming that's what it is/was what we had at this point. I am waiting for results on a stool sample at this time. It is possible that it was something else, although it is most likely. I'll be sure to confirm this when I can.

 

Again, this is all on my own accord as no real effort was made to diagnose this on the ship. I don't know if that is even standard procedure, but again, are we doing the bare minimum CDC guideline or are we caring about passenger safety? Dehyrdation is a serious issue as both my kids couldn't hold down a glass of water. For me, I got very bad chills and probably the worst feeling was vomiting with nothing in your system.

 

Nothing was really life-threatening for normally healthy people, but it was very uncomforatble to say the least. And with young kids involved, very frightening and helpess when you are in the middle of the sea. As far as ease of transmission, apparently shaking hands can transmit the illness. I think in our case, it was mostly due to contact with contaminated surfaces. I.e., the vomit stained carpet, etc.

 

As others will tell you, this is not a cruise-ship only virus either. I reccomend anyone concerned to do a Google search for norovirus and research how that particular line has addressed these issues in the past and recently.

[cruiserman79]

We cruised on the Volendam from June 1 to June 4.....got on at Skagway, off at Vancouver.

 

We were aware of a virus outbreak about halfway through our cruise, but it appeared to be under control. At no time did I or any of my tour party see anyone who was in obvious distress. Of course, they may have been leaning over or on the pot; but all the same, it seemed like all was fine.

 

We were on the Verandah deck and did not notice any uncleanliness of any sort. Our room was spotless the entire time we were on ship. The public areas were very clean, as well.

 

One can look for, and find, anything one wants to find....including fault. It's unfortunate that the OP was the victim of the virus, but to hold HAL ultimately accountable is unfair, in my estimation. From everything I observed and experienced, the ship was very clean.

 

This was my first cruise, though, so my baseline for cleanliness was not established. I only know what I saw.....

 

Thanks for your observations.

 

I am pleased that you were satisfied with your experience. I am curious as to how you became aware of the outbreak, was it word of mouth? There was no announcement, until the afternoon of the last day during the last address by the captain. I was not located on the Verandah deck, and may have received the worst of it due to our location. I did actually visit the third level as well but I did not make it to where you would have been staying.

 

I never intended to go on a fault-finding mission as some here no doubt feel. I wonder why it is "unfair" to hold HAL accountable, however, even after going to great detail on what happened IMHO. As for a baseline of cleanliness, I can safely say that our staterooms were very much dirtier than any hotel I have ever stayed in. I have no idea what your baseline is, but thick dust, mildew and nicotine stained everything is not my idea of clean--all of which I have photos of. Even after all that, I likely wouldn't have complained if we hadn't have had so many other things go wrong--believe it or not.

 

I think it is very reasonable to hold HAL accountable and I would be negligent not to complain after all that we went through. They should be pleased to receive suggestions and feedback both good and bad to make necessary adjustments to satisfy their customers. Personally, I would be going above and beyond to make sure people are as safe and content as possible. Maybe I'm kind of funny that way.

[RuthC]

As of tonight, my older daughter is STILL ill with diahrea and occasional vomiting and we are getting very concerned.

If your daughter is still sick (as opposed to sick again), then you need to give serious consideration to exploring another diagnosis. Noro virus does not linger this long.

[sjdnv]

I totally agree,I was obsessive about washing hands not

touching walls and rails etc and still contracted Norwalk

you cant blame the op it happens and anyone that has

had Norwalk in the past can tell you just what a dreadful

experience it truly is. I was lucky that my husband was

ok, but it put a damper on the whole trip!!

[operafan]

 

It's time that HAL stood up and took the lead in STOPPING this NORO Virus once and for all, so that passengers can go on a cruise without worrying if they are going to catch the "NORO" if they touch and Elevator Button or pick it up from another passenger who is sick! I will never again spend $2,000 only to spend my cruise in "Sick Bay" aka "quarantined"!

 

That would be great if it were possible. Passengers generally bring it on the ship and spread it around. We just got off Westerdam and during embarkation were handed a letter stating that some of the crew had the flu. They didn't know what kind of flu, but it was the flu. They were quarantined. I'm glad I had my Lysol, antibacterial wipes and a hand sanitizer that also kills viruses. First thing I did was spray down the cabin, even the bathroom floor and we used an entire bottle of the hand sanitizer. We're lucky - We didn't get sick.

[all is good]

Cruiserman I applaud you for at least trying to inform other cruisers - I just wish there was something I could say to take away the ugly memory of this years vacation for you and your family. I dont blame you at all for wanting HAL to acknowledge how this was not handled properly, thats the least they could do. Just having gotten off my third cruise with HAL a few weeks ago, it was very obvious that customer service was not a priority anymore. I did not appreciate the sewer smell in our room and they did not seem to care. However, I found out I was lucky because the otherside of the ship had serious sewer and overflowing problems. It was also my first experience with norovirus on the ship, thank goodness we didnt have it but seeing the code red and talking to other parties where friends were quarantined to cabins is something you just cant explain to others that have always had wonderful, lovely trips. After my experience and hearing of yours I will be very careful to do a lot of research IF I book my 14th cruise. :(

[wander]

Robertmnch,

 

Every Nursing Home and every Elementary school in the US would LOVE to have you tell them how to put an end to the Noro Virus ONCE AND FOR ALL. Once you have accomplished this you could start on other types of flu, them maybe colds, etc.

 

Now I am very sorry your cruise was so impacted, and perhaps both HAL and YOu could have done more to try to prevent such problems. However, to say you expect any person or corporation to put an end to Noro Virus "once and for all" is NOT a reasonable expectation, in my opinion or any reasonable person's opinion.

[Jana White]

I TOTALLY agree with the last post. Thank you wander. You can pick up Noro Virus anywhere.

[robertmnch]

Robertmnch,

 

Every Nursing Home and every Elementary school in the US would LOVE to have you tell them how to put an end to the Noro Virus ONCE AND FOR ALL. Once you have accomplished this you could start on other types of flu, them maybe colds, etc.

 

Now I am very sorry your cruise was so impacted, and perhaps both HAL and YOu could have done more to try to prevent such problems. However, to say you expect any person or corporation to put an end to Noro Virus "once and for all" is NOT a reasonable expectation, in my opinion or any reasonable person's opinion.

 

How many cases of H1N1 (Swine Flu) have been reported around the world? How many cases of the "Noro Virus" have been reported around the world? There's going to be a H1N1 Vaccine available this December 2009! Money talks! How long did it take Dr. Jonas Salk to find a Vaccine for Polio! Let's get real about this Noro Virus so anyone who goes on a cruise can feel confident that they are going to have an enjoyable vacation experience and NOT go through HELL just because the cruise lines are accepting "Status Quo"!

[woody73]

 

Wow what a horrible thing to say to the OP. . .

 

It is shocking to blame the victim in this case.

 

 

I agree but am not surprised. If you say or imply something negative, however true, about HAL you will get it from someone. The OP can't breath for defending himself. All because he posted to inform the rest of us. I thank him kindly.

 

 

I agree. That was a totally uncalled for remark.

I agree. The OP has posted information that could be valuable to others.

 

I do not doubt the OP's experience and observations.

 

We were on the Volendam for the 70-days before the OP's cruise (from March 19 to May 27). We were onboard on May 20 when the captain announced Code Red. The ship was in Code Red for five days.

 

Being onboard for 70 days, we got to know some crew members and officers quite well. Shortly after the ship went into Code Red, we were told privately that the ship had to get out of Code Red -- and stay out of Code Red -- or risk getting shut down by the CDC for a thorough cleaning and inspection. The person said an "unscheduled drydock" would be a financial disaster for the ship.

 

Woody

[Tampa Girl]

Wow what a horrible thing to say to the OP.

 

I know when I got the noro virus just over 6 years ago it was no fault of mine. I know that it was food related - that I got contaminated salad from a cook who must not have washed his/her hands. How on earth could I have prevented that??? I was the only one in the family who had a salad, everyone else was fine. For the OP it may have been the same sort of thing - something that all family members ingested.

 

Noro has a fairly quick onset. If someone gets it partway through a cruise, they most definitely did not come on board with it. When I had noro, because of the severity, I pretty much knew what I had right away. I kept myself separate from the family and only used towels once etc. No one else got sick. I felt quite unwell for about 10 days after the initial illness. I am healthy and of an age to get well quickly. However, the elderly and infants this is a very, very serious illness.

 

Handwashing is the best line of defense, for everyone. Too bad the food service worker who made me ill didn't get the memo.

 

It is shocking to blame the victim in this case.

 

With all due sympathy for your experience, it would appear that you did not have a virus, but food poisoning, which is usually bacteria related. Norovirus does not last for ten days. Remember the salmonella outbreak from spinach??

[aaerobear]

probably NOT food poisoning, in a large environment such as a cruise ship or airplane, if it were food poisoning, there would have been many many more people getting very sick for a long time. Chances of someone being the only person to eat a particular item are little or none.

 

I do think the OP's child has something else though. Very few people that get Noro are sick for more than 48-72 hours.

 

As for H1N1 and vaccines, there is no copmparison. H1N1 can kill, Noro makes you ill for a couple days and goes away. No wonder there is more attention to it.

[Susie51]

OP, is your daughter still sick? This is the first time I have read this thread.

 

When my daughter was 18 months old, she became critically dehydrated and needed to be hospitalized. They had to put in an IV and opened it up as much as they could to save her life. In a 24 hour period I had been to emergency 4 times. They tried suppositories to stop the vomiting, finally they admitted her. The virus passed and she was better in a few days.

[mamaofami]

OP, is your daughter still sick? This is the first time I have read this thread.

 

When my daughter was 18 months old, she became critically dehydrated and needed to be hospitalized. They had to put in an IV and opened it up as much as they could to save her life. In a 24 hour period I had been to emergency 4 times. They tried suppositories to stop the vomiting, finally they admitted her. The virus passed and she was better in a few days.

 

Had the same experience with my daughter when she was 9 months old. It was a virus and very scary.

[RuthC]

OP, is your daughter still sick?

OP posted the other day that her daughter is "still" sick---as opposed to "sick again". It's hard to believe that it's noro if the girl is "still" sick, as noro doesn't last this long.

[woodworker&knitter]

How many of us have seen people come out of the toilet stall and only wet their hands, no soap. They now have touched the faucette and the door. Probably the slots, hand railings and everything in between.

I will be the one wearing long sleeves so I can pull them over my hands to push buttons, and open doors, on my 8/19 cruise to Alaska,and I will enjoy myself

[DesertDogs]

How is your DD doing? I hope she is better by now.

[cruiserman79]

OP, is your daughter still sick? This is the first time I have read this thread.

 

When my daughter was 18 months old, she became critically dehydrated and needed to be hospitalized. They had to put in an IV and opened it up as much as they could to save her life. In a 24 hour period I had been to emergency 4 times. They tried suppositories to stop the vomiting, finally they admitted her. The virus passed and she was better in a few days.

 

As of today, she seems to be symptom free. I suspect as well that it was just terrible luck and coincidence and not the same virus. That is very unfortunate what had happened to your little one, I can only imagine what a nightmare that must have been. It is such a helpless feeling to see them suffering and think that there is nothing you can do.

 

Thanks for sharing.

[cruiserman79]

I have been on 27 HAL cruises from 1987 to 2006. The "Virus" as it was called back in 1998 during the Alaska Cruise Season, the Princess ship docked next to us cancelled the following weeks cruise because of an outbreak of the FLU! I came off the old Niew Amsterdam and became sick as I left the ship. HAL's response, "Not Our Problem", you probably caught it in one of the Alaskan Ports of Call! Sorry HAL, but I did NOT leave the ship as I had recently been diagnosed with Type 2 Diabetes, and was being extremely cautious!

 

Passengers come to Alaska in our Summer when it is Winter in Australia and New Zealand, etc., and bring the FLU with them. Is this confused with the "Noro" Virus?

 

 

When I boarded the Oosterdam in February 2006, all of the Waiters in the Lido Restaurant were shaking hands with the passengers. Within 8 to 12 hours I had "Noro"! I went to see the doctor and it was handled as just another complaint!

 

 

I will NO longer sail on HAL for the way they treated me and Cruiserman and his family. HAL could have done better!

 

 

I just came back to California from a vacation to Nova Scotia and did the same trip last October. I had been on crowded planes, trains and shuttles, and nary a sign of Noro.

 

It's time that HAL stood up and took the lead in STOPPING this NORO Virus once and for all, so that passengers can go on a cruise without worrying if they are going to catch the "NORO" if they touch and Elevator Button or pick it up from another passenger who is sick! I will never again spend $2,000 only to spend my cruise in "Sick Bay" aka "quarantined"!

 

 

I filed claim after claim and never got a cent from HAL or TravelGuard!

 

Robert

 

I am very sorry to hear about your experience. It is truly infuriating to be made to feel like no one cares. Even if nothing can really be done about norovirus, it is important to be made as comfortable as possible. As everyone knows at this point, I felt that the medical staff were quite unsatisfactory in this regard on my cruise.

 

I really don't know what can be done to completely eradicate virus on board, however. What needs to happen is that the good kitchen and food area standards need be maintained throughout all areas of the ship, especially the staterooms. I sympathize with you in the thought that they just didn't give a damn, as I felt much the same way from beginning to end. Being quarantined is unfortunate, but a necessary precaution. I think that doing this early on, combined with having proper sanitation in the living areas would reduce the transmission of virus. Even if you go look at the CDC reports, nearly all of the focus is on food handling which is really only half the story since a simple handshake can spread this nasty as well.

[Boatdrill]

I know when I got the noro virus just over 6 years ago it was no fault of mine. I know that it was food related - that I got contaminated salad from a cook who must not have washed his/her hands.

 

Just curious how you learned the source of your illness.

Did the chef tell you ?

[Boatdrill]

It is sometimes easy to armchair quarterback after the game as others have suggested, but this was a vacation that a great deal of money was paid for. How is expecting a clean room unreasonable?

 

Wait a minute. Your room steward didn't clean your room daily ? What did the Hotel Director say about that ?? I hope you told him.

 

You mentioned that "kids" or "supervisors" came in to sanitize. Were those the only people who cleaned your room during the entire cruise ?

[sportsmum]

Not surprised at all- last June (HAL Veendam) we were in quarantine (we were not sick, it was 'preventative') and our cabin was to be completely cleaned and sterilized when we came out- 24 hours later.

 

Our sheets were not even changed. Yes, in that time period I ate in bed and spilled.

[Robin7]

As of today, she seems to be symptom free.

 

I am so glad she's doing better. I have had two kids hospitalized (both around a year old) with dehydration caused by rotovirus. Their illnesses were very scary! I am very happy your child is on the mend.

 

Robin

[Jeal]

cruiserman - I am so glad that your daughter is better. That was a long time for a child to be sick. I am glad it didn't turn out to be something more serious. It is always awful when your children are sick especially when you aren't sure what is wrong with them.

[mamaofami]

I too am really happy to hear your daughter is feeling better. That's very good news.