notamermaid

8 hours ago, Canal archive said:

Saints or beings that they thought were good to look over them

Going back all the way to the Celts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhenus_Pater

Rhenus bicornis of the Romans, a sculptured head: https://www.rheinische-geschichte.lvr.de/Epochen-und-Themen/Themen/der-rhein-im-denken-der-roemer/DE-2086/lido/5d63a243246c37.82044604

The two horns are said to represent the fact that the Rhine has two branches in the Netherlands.

notamermaid

12 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

Often the levels are close enough to the cusp that it can change from one day to the next!

 

Indeed. The abysmal year of 2018 seems to have brought in more awareness with companies that people prefer to be informed prior to sailing and from what I have gathered there have been more notifications and e-mails sent to passengers. Also, passengers are generally more aware of what may be in store. However, it is not a given that you will be informed or that the company can inform you. Say you leave on 10 August to a cruise starting in Amsterdam and all river levels are fine. You sail the Rhine and by the time you are on the Main river the weather is really dry and the level in the Danube drops. A hydrologist may have been able to tell you of the risk on 9 August but neither he nor the company can tell you for sure on 11 August that you cannot sail on 14 August. It really depends on what level the river is at when you leave on 10 August and then you can still not be certain either way. Likewise it is the same coming from Budapest and then finding the Rhine is too low. We have had passengers report that the captain announced in the morning that they would not be able to sail the Danube (at Pfelling) the same evening. Lots of scenarios...

13 hours ago, euro. said:

I had no idea the Danube would be more finicky!

It is not an exact science but usually both rivers are low in a similar time frame as we share weather patterns overall. However, the "cut-off point" for sailing or not sailing on the German Danube is often reached before the corresponding level on the German Rhine (in the Rhine Gorge that is). An important difference between the two rivers is that on the Rhine the shallow area just extends in length as the river level drops whereas on the Danube you get two shallow sections, first one in Germany and then one in Hungary around Budapest (scenarios further down from Hungary I am not familiar with, low water happens there as well though).

Major ways of avoiding both Rhine and Danube shallows: 1. Choose a route that does not include Pfelling (mentioned before and explained in the Danube thread).

2. Do not choose a "Grand European" itinerary.

3. Choose a route that does not include the Rhine Gorge (which you may prefer to keep in the itinerary because it is the most scenic part (tough luck!)).

4. Choose a 110m ship over a 135m ship. As a rule of thumb that gives you a tiny advantage of lower draft and could be the difference between sailing and not sailing.

Finally, my "disclaimer". I cannot and will not give figures of when ships cannot sail. That is a range of figures depending on each individual ship and its captain and may even vary going upstream or downstream. However, from past years' experiences and authorities commenting in the news I will give hints and tips about it when the rivers get low. Flooding is different so there are figures declared by authorities to be the maximum when ships are allowed to sail. Just before that level for a specific section of river is reached captains know a river traffic ban will be issued.

Another problem if you want to call it that is, by the way, the fact that as the river level drops on the Rhine, so do the landing stages and the available water for the ship hull at the embankments. You may have to dock away from the prime spots.

@euro. I am taking the liberty of using your question to put a bit more statistics in the Danube thread.

notamermaid

The Rhine as regards water levels is the "easier" of the two rivers to sail in August, but there can certainly be low water.

8 hours ago, euro. said:

Looking to cruise along the Rhine & Danube the 1st half of August

So let us have a look at the Danube. Track record of first half of the month in:

2018 - no sailing of 135m ships possible in the shallow parts of Germany, bad in Hungary as well.

2019 - not too bad, sailing restricted, Hungary was okay as far as I know.

2020 - bad start, fine from 5 August

2021 - perfect

2022 - see 2018

2023 - perfect

For further info on how to almost avoid this see here: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2984995-danube-water-levels-2024-and-similar-topics-plus-tips-and-info/page/2/

post #48 and #49.

notamermaid

Hello and welcome to Cruisecritic. I will start with this.

2 hours ago, euro. said:

Please advise any other threads I should look at for tips!

Last year's Rhine thread, perhaps start on page 10 and work your way forward: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2910181-rhine-water-levels-2023-and-similar-topics/page/10/

As you are also interested in the Danube, here is the thread, I have given you page 13 as a start: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2910185-danube-water-levels-2023-and-similar-topics-plus-tips-and-info/page/13/

Both give you an idea of the conversations we have had. For logistics of ship swaps the roll calls of last year, mainly the Viking Rhine Getaway and the Grand European, tell you how the ship swaps work and how people felt about it. The Viking roll calls are the most active. Many people prefer just to post there, not on the main river cruising board (i.e. this one you are on now reading this thread).

You are right about unpredictability but we can look at statistics that help a little to narrow it down and put into perspective. More on that in another post.

notamermaid

I must admit that I am in two minds about the updated infrastructure and the increase in the size of the ships. Well, they showed the Viking landing stage... But it is not just Viking. It used to be only 110m ships that were allowed on the river, then some years back they said 135m ships are okay, now most of them are the 135m maximum length. It is not that many more people per ship of course. So on the one hand I would say "what are they moaning about?", but on the other hand I can see where they are coming from, i.e. the passengers come in a bulk, have a guided tour, an ice-cream, and disappear. I do not fully agree with that assessment, though. It is a mixed thing. As a day tripper in Bernkastel-Kues I strolled along, had a quick lunch in a café and disappeared. And a pittance in parking fees. Almost any river cruise passenger leaves more money directly and indirectly in town. But I also do not fully agree with the mayor saying that people that have been on a river cruise very often become a repeat visitor on land (with more money they will leave in town). Again a mixed thing. Depending on the individual, the country of origin, the budget. I doubt a person from (insert US State of our choice) will tell ten friends how great Bernkastel-Kues is and five of them turn up at a café in Bernkastel-Kues a month later... Anyway, I hope they find the right balance, and do not turn the place into "Rüdesheim-on-the-Moselle". 😉

As for Traben-Trarbach: when I went I found it a bit quiet and so far I have not seen that many ships dock there. I understand the townspeople trying to keep a bit more of that "sophisticated" approach to tourism which is well becoming to this once famous wine centre, but a bit more should not do harm. But as always, just a bit more may turn into a lot more and better complain now than when it is "too late". I can understand the citizens looking at other places, we know Passau is struggling, and saying that they do not want this. Traben-Trarbach is too small for hordes.

By the way, on this topic. Beilstein. The village is quaint and popular and if a Viking river cruise ship docked there the passengers would more than double the head count in town. Beilstein only has 149 inhabitants but a landing stage for ships. The place is no hidden gem.

notamermaid

notamermaid

We have had warm and dry days, a bit untypical for April, that in summer would have a negative impact on the water levels. But it is still early spring. The figure at Pfelling gauge is 383cm and those figures have been stable so there is still enough water in the Danube basin for good levels in Germany. And rain is now sweeping over Bavaria.

notamermaid

6 hours ago, Microman123 said:

Any water level update 10 days later?

Seeing that we have had dry days here, this is a very valid question. I am being to see a slight problem that hopefully will not turn into a real problem. The level at Dresden shows a fast drop (20cm) which suggests that the authorities in the Czech Republic may be retaining water now. No way for me to find out, but the dry water has drained water out of the Elbe basin. The level is now 107cm. The weather has changed and rain is coming into Europe. A band of moderate to heavy rain is sweeping over southern Germany East-North East so today getting into the Czech Republic. Water for the Vltava and the Elbe and a good sign.

notamermaid

On 4/11/2024 at 5:15 PM, frangill said:

Trying to decide if we should book a river cruise from Prague to Budapest in Mid August.  Looking for advise and predictions of waterlevels as well as the cruise company with the best backup plans and service please?

 

Water levels are very difficult to predict for the Danube, I mean not even in detail. In August flooding is rare and low water can certainly happen, it is a wide range. My advice is to have a look at the itineraries starting and ending in Vilshofen. They avoid the bottleneck between Straubing and Vilshofen where low water is most likely to happen.

notamermaid

On 4/13/2024 at 1:20 PM, pontac said:

 

Maybe because they're not rivers? They're holding ponds, the windmills pump water up to one, then pump up to a higher one before pumping up again, out of the polder and into the river.

You mean Kinderdijk is not on a river but at a canal or rather low lying ground that fills with ground water if the windmills did not do the pumping? Thanks, had not checked actually. It is quite fascinating how much land the Dutch have taken from the ocean/floodplains and cultivated it. With a bit of help from German forests and mountains I may add. The Netherlands still import much stone from Germany today.

notamermaid

2 minutes ago, RDVIK2016 said:

Roß seems to be in quite regular use in southern Germany and Austria.

Ah, yes. You are right. Another aspect of different uses of words in parts of the German-speaking realm. Quite some years ago a popular television series made use of that when in the story a Bavarian guy moved to the island of Rügen. Hardly gets any more extreme than that.

I have never seen more than six horses drawing a cart/wagon/carriage. Eight or ten is a lot to handle. May be used in Royal processions and such but I have never noticed it.

Beautiful day yesterday, was great fun working as all people apart from one woman were happy and even jovial. Busy tourism weekend. Fortunately only needed to do one day (although I have been finishing a few things off in the background today). Anyway, I hope you can now all enjoy the floral delights of spring. Helped my elderly relative planting a type of roses (we call them that in German sometimes) today that is called Alcea, apparently they are the family Malveae in English.

notamermaid

The water levels continue to be good. After dry and warm days the weather is now changing and the rain next week should bring the level at Kaub over 250cm again, staying any under levels that could indicate flooding in the near future. 208cm is the long-term mean so you can look forward to continued very pleasant sailing on "my" river.

So let us have look at the islands in the river again this year. Tons of them about and one section of it has actually been dubbed the "Inselrhein", that is between Mainz and Bingen, as there are so many islands close together. Many are uninhabited (by humans), some are designated nature reserves or have another protected status, a few are peninsulas due to interference by humans, others are inhabited and one is a separate administrative entity, i.e. a proper village.

One very interesting one historically is up there in Switzerland. No need for a moat or artificial way of creating a recluse - just use the mighty Rhine. Rheinau with its former monastery: https://www.myswitzerland.com/en/destinations/rheinau-abbey-island/

While this a distance from Basel and other places in Switzerland are more popular, with good reason, for extensions, I have long thought that it would be nice if a company could put a bigger focus on the upper reaches of the Rhine beyond Basel. The nearby Rhine Falls are not massive compared to others in the world but the scenery is nevertheless stunning. It is a different aspect of the Rhine that is worth seeing to "complete" the picture of this river in Europe I find.

notamermaid

I just have to go to Ghent after seeing these photos! That castle is even better than I remember from other photos. Looks similar to the model one I used to play with (together with my male cousin). I very much enjoyed Bruges so it would be nice to compare the two.

notamermaid

Forecast not looking too good, you are right. But as you say you have been to the area before.

If you happen to check out the wine list, please post some info if the offers are regional, i.e. wine growing regions in Germany or France. Would love to know if they include the rarer Belgian wines.

Have a great time.

notamermaid

17 hours ago, RDVIK2016 said:

Where the horses are used for plowing they can be called an Ackergaul, right?

Yes, correct. 😊

Roß is the neutral older word, very much favoured in literature and a typical phrase is "Roß und Reiter". We enjoy alliterations as well. "Schimmel", yeah, weird one. The other meaning in German is mould. So "white horse" in the bathroom is most likely a mistranslation if you ever see it. 😉

The Haflinger are beautiful I find.

notamermaid

More and more river cruise ships are sailing the Moselle. What has been a small hindrance so far has been the old infrastructure. The towns need more or stronger landing stages. Traben-Trarbach will have one updated so that then 135m ships can dock on both sides of the river. The mayor is happy, some townspeople are not. There is a Bürgerinitiative, a citizens' interest group, campaigning against it. They prefer it "quiet" as it is now. Townspeople in Bernkastel-Kues are also sceptical about the modernized landing stage area. But there the main reason for the investment is the connection to electricity supplied from on land. This will eliminate noise at night but some people seem to think it will attract more ships. Again, their mayor is fine with it. It is a constant debate how much money river cruise tourists spend in a place and whether it is worth putting up with more of them, not just on the Moselle. Here is the German article on the topic: https://www.swr.de/swraktuell/rheinland-pfalz/trier/buergerinitiative-in-traben-trarbach-fuerchtet-massentourismus-wegen-mosel-fluss-kreuzfahrten-100.html

notamermaid

It does look good from the air, doesn't it? Apparently the bastion bits are recreated according to the original and the architect was not Vauban, but it is still impressive. As the Meuse was a frontier there exist several fortified places in the area.

Much further upstream and almost a century later a water-related place came into existence. Quite a different use of it in these gardens: http://www.annevoie.be/en/

I see one online German website calling the palace between Namur and Dinant the Belgian Versailles. May be a bit of a tall order... Not sure that the place needs to be compared to anything else it just looks good to me. As I have noted in a past year, you could sail to Dinant on a small ship but it is of course not far from Namur so easy to do as an excursion.

notamermaid

15 hours ago, RDVIK2016 said:

Some of the horses are just magnificent looking animals.

Thank you for the link. Had not heard of this tradition there. By the way, for the language nerd. We call the heavy horses pulling the beer wagons also Brauereigäule. Word to be used in limited circumstances! "Gaul" is mostly a not so nice word for a horse, but basically okay with the Brauerei in front.

@Canal archive I love the shire horses, your equivalent to those breeds here. Give me a shire horse to look at over any posh Viennese Hofreitschule one any day. Once took a ride in a carriage through York with a half breed I think it is called. Anyway, one of those strong ones but not heavily built for breweries. It was a lovely experience. We do not see many carriages or heavy horses where I live.

notamermaid

From Namur ,Huy and Liége river cruise ships have those two main options of diverting into the Albert Canal or staying on the Meuse and sailing into the Netherlands. Sailing via Maastricht and Venlo you can head to Nijmegen via the Maas-Waal Canal (see post above) or - again - stay on the Meuse. That is what Uniworld appear to do. The company offers this intriguing, somewhat unusual itinerary: https://www.uniworld.com/uk/river-cruise/central-europe/rhine/holland-and-belgium-at-tulip-time/2024-brussels-to-amsterdam

Brussels to Amsterdam would be a normal route but this one after a more standard sail through the Albert Canal arrives in Maastricht and the following day stops in Cuijk! This is the port from which you can take a tour to Nuenen where the painter Vincent van Gogh lived. Here is some info:https://www.vangoghbrabant.com/en/home/nuenen/exhibitions/vincents-life-in-nuenen

The afternoon takes the ship to Heusden a place I only know in connection with a shipyard. What a fascinating small town, I mean, look at this: https://www.visitbrabant.com/en/locations/248755060/the-fortified-town-of-heusden

The next stop is the more conventional Kinderdijk excursion. Nice of Uniworld to combine something new with the familiar stops.

notamermaid

It's as flat as a pancake down there at Kinderdijk. An odd kind of place, so different from my river up here. I spotted the grey and blue earthenware pots in one photo. They could be Dutch but they look more like the Kannenbäckerland pottery from the Westerwald near Koblenz in Germany. Interesting.

notamermaid

2 hours ago, Peribit1 said:

Any suggestions or concerns that I should consider (other than the hot weather)?

Hmmm, I cannot really think of anything. The busy weekend of Rhine in Flames is at Oberwesel on 14 September and the big one at Koblenz is earlier than your time frame. Public holidays I am not aware of - those may impact on shopping and other activities. But do check dates yourself: https://www.feiertagskalender.ch/index.php?geo=0&jahr=2024&hl=en

You may bump into a wine festival which generally is a plus but could alter a schedule in a port.

River levels tend to be okay, but no way of planning that.

Crowds are there and rafting of river cruise ships will happen. But that is not confined to August.

Has anyone any thoughts?

notamermaid

Sorry to read about the fall. Hope you recover quickly.

notamermaid

Good question. I have no direct answer but the Tagus is apparently not an easy river to make navigable. At least not in Spain. Geography. Historically and logistically speaking, river cruising follows commercial shipping, i.e. only a river that has been used and made relatively safe and efficiently to use by transport is then used for transport of humans and then used for transport of humans for leisure. If the Spanish did not consider it commercially viable or necessary for transport they just did not do it. In Portugal it is a little different and there appear to be short leisure boat trips in the Lisbon area. Again, leisure follows commercial transport. I am not convinced that in Portugal it would make sense to introduce river cruising now but perhaps a company is still looking into it. Unless the authorities categorically prohibit large ships anyway. On the Danube beyond Kelheim for example you can use motorboats, the river is navigable for some length and suitable for that, but the authorities do not allow it. In Portugal by the way the river only has a length of 145km.

CroisiEurope for example introduced river cruising to the Loire, a notoriously shallow river not suitable for large transport that had never seen a river cruise ship ever before the Loire Princess was put on the water in 2015. Some rivers just do not work and that particular river cruise ship was specifically built for that river, it looks different from any other ship.

Canal archive mentions dams, so those, if not built with a lock, block a river for traffic of course.

I suspect there may be something with the authorities as the river is not registered officially as a waterway. Here is a page where you can download maps. You can see that the Tagus is not marked: https://unece.org/where-navigate-network-inland-waterways-europe-and-its-parameters

notamermaid

A look at marinetraffic.com reveals river cruise ships sailing the Meuse. At midnight local time 11 April these are the Avalon Tranquility II coming back from Namur, the Viking Kvasir sailing towards Maastricht and the SE Manon on the return leg to Düsseldorf. This Dutch flag ship sails for SE Tours, a German company. And there is the Switzerland docked in Mook. The German "Reise Riese Prestige" is currently in the Maas-Waal Canal headed for Maastricht. So there is more than the occasional bit of river cruise traffic on the Meuse. Very few ships go as far upstream as Namur though. Itineraries often also do not stay on the Meuse for long if the next port is Antwerp. Then river cruise ships go through the Albert Canal from Liége.

Another ship will also be on the Meuse in summer. Saga returns to the river to see the highly popular concerts of André Rieu in Maastricht. The ship leased by the company from Lüftner Cruises, the Amadeus Elegant, will take passengers along the Meuse to and from the concerts on three dates. This is the long Dutch and Belgian waterways itinerary: https://travel.saga.co.uk/cruises/river/where-we-go/dutch-and-belgian-river-cruises/the-andre-rieu-hometown-experience.aspx?availability=2&boardbasis=AI

notamermaid

Forecast for river levels still looks good for at least a week so let us have a look at a ship.

On 4/7/2024 at 2:00 PM, notamermaid said:

Another river cruise ship is ready to be photographed in spring sunlight, the MS Gentleman.

We talked about the ship more than a year ago when the proud company announced it and now it is ready to sail. The big difference with the MS Gentleman is that she has not been built by the Vahali shipyards and she does not belong to a "normal" river cruise company or fit into an existing fleet of an owner or lease company like Scylla in Switzerland. The company is actually an operator of commercial transport ships. This is their first venture into river cruising (setting up a separate company for that). In spring and summer the MS Gentleman will sail for 1A Vista Reisen. It appears from the website of that river cruise operator that she will sail after the christening which will be in May. It is not clear when exactly and where it will take place. Heusden on the Meuse is the home of Teamco shipyards that last year built a river cruise ship for Amadeus Flusskreuzfahrten, the Riva. The company delivers about one river cruise ship per year, but appears to have been busier with river cruise ships in the past. Another charter this summer is done by Thurgau Travel in Switzerland. That river cruise operator offers the "Southern runs", i.e. starting and/or ending in Basel.

I am looking forward to seeing this ship on "my" river. I kind of think it does look a bit "male" in the interior design. Will be doing even more ship spotting to try and see this brain child of Arjan Van Loon and his children in May/June.

notamermaid

2 hours ago, RDVIK2016 said:

All this does not explain why the Danube is measured from the mouth and the Rhine from the "source" (sort of), but that is the way it is.

Yup, I have no clue why they did this.

Which reminds me, fun fact for those travelling on the long journey on the Danube, Canal, Main and Rhine. The Danube is now 134km shorter than in the 19th century (man-made alterations) and the Rhine has a miscalculated short kilometre: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Kurzer_Kilometer.jpg

The plus sign before the number 530 denotes the 500m mark.

notamermaid