datolim

13 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Because nowhere in the article does it say that the crew, or even passengers, cannot be disembarked, if medically required.  It says "ships are idle" and "there are 80,000 crew onboard".  I, however, read the actual order from the CDC, which states (can't copy and paste, so I'll type it out):

 

"1.  Cruise ship operators shall not be allowed to disembark passengers and crew members at ports and stations, except as directed by the USCG, in consultation with HHS/CDC personnel, and, as appropriate, as coordinated with Federal, state and local authorities"

 

So, anyone on the ship that is in critical medical need can be disembarked if the USCG is satisfied with the cruise line's plans for ground transportation and hospitalization as per the MSIB issued a few days ago.

 

Just because MSN says it, doesn't make it true.  And, having read the article at least 4 times, I don't see "condemned to die" anywhere.  But maybe I need better glasses.

Hello Chief. How are you doing. You may remember me from my previous postings as SG007. 

I have re-incarnated myself as 'datolim' after taking a long break.

Wow this thread is on fire and it took me an hour from where I left off last night to read the balance of the postings here.

I assume you have notification of replies to get to this reply.

Now to get back to business.

I said 'In the mean time how many may die in the ships at sea'

You said "condemn" people to "die at sea", and 'Let's not get overly dramatic'.

So who is being dramatic and who use the would 'condemn'

You can read the article again and again, but it is not glasses you need but a mirror to look at yourself.

You said 'Because nowhere in the article does it say that the crew, or even passengers, cannot be disembarked'.

They don't have to say 'cannot be disembarked' specifically but the conditions the CDC make is such that 'they cannot be disembarked'.

The reality of this is that the 3 big US carriers, CCL, RCL and NCL would have given their proverbial right arm if they can do this.

Instead what is the state that the 3 US carriers find themselves in today.

They don't know what to do with themselves in this crises and what is their future.

Their share prices are at a fraction of what it was last year.

And the stock analyst would tell their stock price is 'priced' as those facing 'bankruptcy'. 

4 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Let's not get overly dramatic.  First off, this only applies to US waters, since the CDC has no jurisdiction anywhere else.

Reading the updated order from the CDC, it appears, to me at least, to be issued in order to stop sailings until the newly required action plans can be submitted and vetted.  The order can be changed or rescinded at any time by the CDC, as it states, and I believe with the acceptance of action plans, it will be.  When this will happen is uncertain, but may or may not last the full 100 days.  It is interesting to note that the order is specifically described as not a rule, but an emergency action, so I don't foresee that the required action plans, or most of its requirements, as being continued after the current health emergency is over.

 

Secondly, it does not "condemn" people to "die at sea", as it allows for disembarkation of passengers and crew "as approved by USCG".

 

If passengers are allowed to disembark then why does the article says this

Until then, the about 100 cruise ships in the Atlantic, Pacific or Gulf of Mexico must remain idle, either in port or wallowing at anchor, the CDC said. Those ships currently have nearly 80,000 crew aboard

Condemn people to die at sea is in the article

Cruise ships, with their confined environments, have been hit particularly hard by the coronavirus pandemic. The CDC notes that in recent weeks, crew members or passengers have developed either flu-like symptoms or tested positive for COVID-19 on at least 10 cruise ships.

On some of the vessels, passengers or crew members died either on the ship or after being moved ashore to hospitals.

4 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Let's not get overly dramatic.  First off, this only applies to US waters, since the CDC has no jurisdiction anywhere else.

Reading the updated order from the CDC, it appears, to me at least, to be issued in order to stop sailings until the newly required action plans can be submitted and vetted.  The order can be changed or rescinded at any time by the CDC, as it states, and I believe with the acceptance of action plans, it will be.  When this will happen is uncertain, but may or may not last the full 100 days.  It is interesting to note that the order is specifically described as not a rule, but an emergency action, so I don't foresee that the required action plans, or most of its requirements, as being continued after the current health emergency is over.

 

Secondly, it does not "condemn" people to "die at sea", as it allows for disembarkation of passengers and crew "as approved by USCG".

 

If you have read te

The CDC order states that cruise ships can't board passengers and return to their sailing schedules until one of three events takes place:

This looks like a very very serious matter.

100 days from Apr 14 means Jul 23.

In the mean time how many may die in the ships at sea if I read this news correctly.

Cannot be true!!!!!

https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/news/cdc-extends-no-sail-order-for-cruise-ships-as-industry-ravaged-by-the-coronavirus/ar-BB12pv5w?ocid=spartandhp

5 hours ago, Got Out There said:

Interesting to see if there will be consolidation ...... who will buy who?  Not many big players out there beyond the big four (carnival, Royal, NCL, MSC) ....

 

From a RCCL perspective, I recall years ago Carnival tried to buy them, but the Pritzker  family came in and saved the day..... later RCCL tried to buy Princess but Carnival out bid them.  Been sometime since any significant merger or buyout.   Interesting to see what happens going forward .

There are just too many unknown nowadays.

You mention the 'Pritzker' family. But these are during normal times. Nobody has seem what the cruise industry is like as it is today.

I remember  Star Cruises Chairman Dato Lim  bought NCL and then sold 50% to Leon Black of Apollo management. With hindsight I am sure Chairman Lim feels he should not have sold as the shares have multiplied by six times in value.

I would ask this question first before yours.

'If the cruise industry survive which is highly debateable, in future what will it look like'

Among the unknown are the following.

Are the cruise industry really going to adopt the 70 years old rule as almost all would have at least one 70 years old in their party.

After the companies have disgorge their crew and this virus thing is behind us, what are the countries that would accept their ships. Not counting what new regulations the US government would put through.

Would existing guests still want to cruise after seeing what it has gone through.

They sometimes giveaway free $5 for slot play on the last night. I remember cashing out $7 on one cruise. Check with the cage on the last night.

5 minutes ago, mugtech said:

You want free alcohol go to an art auction, take along a good book.

Seriously, would you or anyone else have the guts to do this.

This looks like the time share vacation property or the ship painting sales pitch.

Not a bad deal if you are the type that would sit through their ship painting sales pitch.

Just don't how many sessions you have to go through to get the two free drinks.

I would say in most first world countries like in Europe, Australia and Singapore there is protection for the consumer under the government law. It comes under the advertising law whereby what the total price the consumer pays must be the quoted price.

The dsc is deemed to be compulsory as you have to pay first and then try and claim the refund after the cruise.

There is no such law in the USA. If the USA consumer agency can out-lobby the Retail Association lobby in Washington then things would change. But imagine NCL advertising the $499 special and it now becomes $600+. What would NCL say about this.

From where I write it is no surprise that NCL pull Joy out of China. They had no knowledge of the China market yet went head first with Joy and a second ship to follow.

RCL had been working the ground for the last 5 years and had developed "guanshi" (relationship) with the government officials. In China you just cannot come in tomorrow and try and take away a slice of the market.

They could have work with their previous partner Genting HK or at least get advice from them. Genting would have told them many things including the very tempting casino market. Genting had 2 ships in China 5 years ago but pull out both ships after a little while because the locals cannot go on these ships. They need a visa from the central government to go on the ships which is only issued through some government run travel agencies. No such thing as direct sales to customers.

Genting pull out of the Shanghai last year after some further attempts and NCL should have done the same. But I suspect with Joy build purely for the China market they could not see their way out. Is it possible to convert Joy for the Western market with just $50M. Just about every thing have to be changed. From the very large items like the pool deck which I don't think they can do any thing to the very little inconsequential chop sticks which would now be fork and knife instead.

This is just more madness by Genting HK. You would have thought with the 2 Dream ships doing so badly they would stop to think. 2 200K tons casino ships under the Star Cruises brand will not float anywhere. Dream was suppose to tap into the Southern China gambling/cruising market and take a large slice off the Macau gambling market but it is not working out so good.

And now they want to put their casino ships around the world. RCL is pulling Ovation out of Tianjin, China and Genting wants to go into there. And Quantum is moving their homeport from Shanghai to Singapore for 6 months in a year.Their casino ships in East Asia was doing O.K. until recently and doing very badly now. But casino ships in the rest of the world is one pie in the sky. Why many countries would not even let them homeport their ships in their countries.

To solve the choice of channels question....RCI could reduce the cost of Voom even further, and let everyone stream whatever news source or television network appeals to them....:cool:

Really is that possible. Buy the Voom package and I can watch CNN. I will consider cruising more often on RCI then.

Wish there was a decent American news channel that didn't have strong leanings. It's boring to watch either of those with their partisan approach to 'news', instead of trying to be objective. I guess that's where RT got their model from (and then just doubled down).

 

Hence, normally watch another international news service instead.

I don't want to get into any more trouble with Bob.

But I just want to say I agree with you, especially for us aliens as they call us without any skin in this political matter.

I try not to mention my political leanings and I work in politics but I guess folks can tell opinions by what TV channel we watch especially as Fox and MSNBC appeal to opposite political viewpoints.

I completely agree with you. Never knew some name cannot be mentioned in the CC postings. Learn something new everyday.

Make sure she is holding it when it goes over. ;p

I just notice my last posting is deleted. So yes cannot mention the name T - - - -.

There are other stations besides Fox.

This question is for Bob.

There are so many deletions in this thread that I just don't know what can and cannot be posted.

I have gone back to read the posting guidelines and I am no wiser.

I did notice that when the name Trump appears the postings are deleted.

Just want to know what can be posted or even mentioned.

As far as RC and the cabin steward, the earlier the better. They generally have their cleaning cart outside by 6 am and waiting to pounce on any empty room so they don't have to rush their 1 pm dateline. But general accepted if you leave by 8 am it would be nice for them. 8.30 am is about the max.

We flew in on United flight UAL1. The flight itself was kind of meh, the length actually wasn't too bad, I was able to sleep for a solid 8 hours after the first meal and then watched movies for the rest. The meals were really mediocre, especially compared to our first international flight last October on Asiana. On United it felt like the seats were more narrow and the flight attendants seemed like they really didn't want to be there. It was a world apart from flying on Asiana last year.

 

 

 

Very nice, I can see why you sail the Mariner so often. We felt like we got an excellent deal on the two cruises and are really enjoying it so far. I can see us definitely coming back to Singapore for another cruise in the future. Maybe we'll see you on board sometime today or tomorrow.

Sure. Anytime and place that is convenient for us.

It could be a technical issue. Last month when I was on the ship the signal coming in from the US was bad, breaking up and difficult to watch. Signal from HK, London and Dubai was O.K. But RCL better spend some money now to fix this or they will lose more customers.

Please tell me that you`re joking!

No joke. No CNN on Mariner. BBC now.

I am on Mariner now. Was going to book next cruise. Turn on the TV and there is no CNN only BBC. How am I going to survive without my daily diet of 4 hours of CNN, 3 hours in the morning here and 1 hour in the evening. If I still don't get enough of Trump then I go to Fox news at home. RCL must bring back CNN or lose more customers.

I am on the 3N cruise on 5 Feb. RCL has cut the price of their following 7N cruise to the same price as the 3N cruise. The longer cruise just don't sell here. Tempted to book this also but it is too long a cruise for me and I am on the Mariner every month here.

We think the crew and service they provide are excellent.

I agree with Bob. It must be the way RCL pushes their crew. Basic pay $50 per month and bulk comes from gratuities. Room Attendant, Waiter and Bartender get average $1000 per month. Pot Cleaner, garage collectors and others get $500 per month. For reference see latest financial report by CEO.

No formal nights.