Why are Aussies being overcharged for cruises?

[EGG]

I'll just throw this out because it might relieve some anxiety, but it is hearsay. Maybe you can confirm this on another board by asking the question differently. The question I would ask is "Has anyone from Australia or the U.K. been denied boarding because they used a U.S. travel agent? -

 

We did a cruise on Island Princess in May of 2009. We became good friends with a couple from the U.K. The husband was interested in booking another cruise and they were at first told they would not be able to book with their U.S. travel agent but then they were told that if they already had a U.S. based agent they could continue using them. So I am wondering when you get to the check in desk with a long line of people how the agent at the desk is going to know whether this is a rebooking with the same agent or a first booking with an agent. Of course there is also a difference between U.K. and Australia.

 

If I booked with the U.S. travel agent

- I would fill out my online document well ahead of time.

- I would purchase travel insurance that would cover you if you were denied boarding for some reason. (I'm not sure they sell insurance for this). But the insurance would cover you if the U.S. travel agent went under.

[Murrumba]

:mad:

Thank you so much JannandJohn and Murrumba for your advice.

The TA is in the city and it's quite a long way from where we live...and then there is no guarantee that we will see him :rolleyes:

He will not answer emails nor telephone calls....he plays his voicemail at the end of each day, according to my Oh's Daughter....but he never gets back to us.

I will let you know when we hear from him.

Like I said, he was supposed to be changing our names 2 weeks ago...and it till hasn't been done. :(

There are things I would like to check on RCI's website but we can't access it as they require our names....in the correct order.

Thankyou once again :)

 

I would try and report him if he refuses to see you and let him know that iswhat you re going to do (Current Affair sort of thing always works). I do not think that if you have a booking with a TA that you can see your paperwork on RCI website. From memory I think that this is reserved for people who book directly with the cruise company.

Can anyone clarify this; I am sure that I used to read this when I was assessing ours on a very reqular basis.

[Murrumba]

that's what I thought!;)

 

your sig looks like 3 b2b's (but diff. ships)...good cruising..especially the New England one.

 

Yes, we have 3 cruises. Start off in New York and then overnight in New Orelans, 7 day cruise, then 5 days in New Orleans after the first cruise - we are staying in the french quarter. Then off to Boston for an overnight before the 14 day Canada/new england one, then overnight Long Island New York and 7 day to Bahamas/Florida.

 

Have you done the canada/New england?

 

We were in New England/Canada the same time last year, but in a coach and then a car. Did not get to go to Nova Scotia though, but drove around the Gaspe Pensinsular (near Quebec).

[Hlitner]

I heard a rumor that several cruise line executives were once forced to eat some vegemite and have never recoved from the experience. As a result they decided that the Aussies must pay pay pay and keep paying.

 

Hank

[jannandjohn]

I'll just throw this out because it might relieve some anxiety, but it is hearsay. Maybe you can confirm this on another board by asking the question differently. The question I would ask is "Has anyone from Australia or the U.K. been denied boarding because they used a U.S. travel agent? -

.

no, it's hearsay...don't scare her .

how would that relieve her anxiety?:eek:

people from here use US agents all the time.

[jannandjohn]

Have you done the canada/New england?

.

yes on NCL Jewel..in sept'05..same penthouse 10500,as our trip in 10 days (E/W MED 21 days) ..

In '05 we got it for the price of an inside cabin(and our friends same next door cabin 10502),

our friends in Hawaii who we met here on CC before the cruise, coincidentally had the owners suite 2 cabins away!!

 

the 4 penthouses across the front of the ship were released to Australia for just 24 hrs at that price, and we got the 2

because my friendly online cruise agent emailed me and asked if we wanted them

(had to answer on the spot, for my friend too) but who wouldn't at that price!!

the other 2 penthouse cabins were snapped up by Canberrans , a husband wife in one, and their 2 kids in the other..

the kids had the butler run ragged with pizza and dvd orders:p

 

here's some pics of the cabins and the N/E cruise

click the photo

 

[shazz_1958]

 

As I mentioned earlier, the tipped crew have union contracts that are designed to protect them in case the ship is in a situation where expected tips do not happen for some reason.

This normally includes accidents, dry docks, and cruises with high numbers of Aussies, Kiwis, or Brits.

Most tipped crew on ships are officially paid an average of US$1 per day. Anything they hope to earn above that comes from tips.

In case those tips are not forthcoming, their contract with the cruise line stipulates that they will receive a guaranteed minimum salary for the month - the difference being covered by the cruise line. Unfortunately this minimum guarantee salary is only about 60% of what the crew would normally earn if tips were forthcoming.

quote]

I am not an experienced cruiser or forum poster..but this did bother me greatly to think that an average wage was $1 a day ( unless I am miss reading the post)

I had to google to check..here is a wage quote from International Cruise Services for the lowest paying food/berverage position I could find.

Cruise Ship Buffet Steward/Stewardess

 

Serving meals and beverage, cleans tables. No experience required although some experience is preferable. Strong possibilities for promotion to Bar Steward, Junior Waiter, Assistant Waiter and Waiter.

 

Salary region: $1,200 – $1,600 US per month (Approx: £600 - £800 per month) depending on gratuities and cruise line.

 

I can see it does say depending on gratuities, and even though the wages are by no means brilliant, it is certainly more than $1 a day.

 

If I have read your post wrong BruceMuzz please accept my apology now, and can you please refrain from being rude to me. As I said it really bothered me thinking that $1 aday could be happening..Cheers

[shazz_1958]

just as a footnote from the same site

THE ABOVE SALARIES ARE AVERAGE SALARIES. IN ADDITION YOUR FOOD AND ACCOMMODATION IS INCLUDED AND YOUR SALARY IS NORMALLY TAX FREE IF YOUR CONTRACT IS FOR SIX MONTHS AND OVER. THESE CONTRACTS ARE RENEWABLE.

[A&G]

....My point in adding this post is to ask the aussies who have booked direct with the US if they would be kind enough to report back with how they went embarking - whether they were disallowed......

 

We have booked every cruise through a TA based in the USA and there has never been any sugestion or question or concern at port of embarkation.

 

If your US TA keeps accepting the booking just do it. The cruise line obtains your passport numbers at time of booking. You no doubt complete the on line check in well in advance with address, nationality and again passport numbers so if the cruise line were going to deny you boarding I am sure they would let you know before you arrived at the port of embarkation.

[jannandjohn]

I heard a rumor that several cruise line executives were once forced to eat some vegemite and have never recoved from the experience. As a result they decided that the Aussies must pay pay pay and keep paying.

Hank

is it because they were so dumb, that they didn't spread it the way it should be spread??..just a scrape is all it takes.:p:p:p

[A&G]

........

 

By the way, it's not my country. I live in Europe and unfortunately carry an American Passport.......

 

Yes, BruceMuzz, I am another "undesirable".

 

If you live in Eurpoe you will be aware that most American tourists will not pay to use a public toilet (customary in most of Europe). I've heard them say "I am American and we don't pay to use public toilets at home". What about the little old lady who sits there all day and cleans for probably far less than US$1.00/day.

 

The Australians I know observe the customs of the country inwhich they are a guest. The above is just one example of many Americans expecting and demanding everything to be the same as at home, wherever they may be in the world. However, like you, I am probably only talking about the undesirables. Luckily we have been fortunate to meet or gravitate towards only nice Amercians.

 

By the way, I like the tipping system and I wish it would catch on in Australia. I think people who provide a service work harder to please when part of their wage comes from the employer and part from the customer. Unfortuately Australia is a long way away from such a system.

 

What I have learnt from this thread is that, to avoid any concerns, I will now tip my room attendant up front at the first meet and greet. I will charge the usual ships suggested gratuities to my account and I will continue to tip for extra services any employee cheerfully and graciously provides to me throughout the cruise.

 

Alan

[BruceMuzz]

 

As I mentioned earlier, the tipped crew have union contracts that are designed to protect them in case the ship is in a situation where expected tips do not happen for some reason.

This normally includes accidents, dry docks, and cruises with high numbers of Aussies, Kiwis, or Brits.

Most tipped crew on ships are officially paid an average of US$1 per day. Anything they hope to earn above that comes from tips.

In case those tips are not forthcoming, their contract with the cruise line stipulates that they will receive a guaranteed minimum salary for the month - the difference being covered by the cruise line. Unfortunately this minimum guarantee salary is only about 60% of what the crew would normally earn if tips were forthcoming.

quote]

I am not an experienced cruiser or forum poster..but this did bother me greatly to think that an average wage was $1 a day ( unless I am miss reading the post)

I had to google to check..here is a wage quote from International Cruise Services for the lowest paying food/berverage position I could find.

Cruise Ship Buffet Steward/Stewardess

 

Serving meals and beverage, cleans tables. No experience required although some experience is preferable. Strong possibilities for promotion to Bar Steward, Junior Waiter, Assistant Waiter and Waiter.

 

Salary region: $1,200 – $1,600 US per month (Approx: £600 - £800 per month) depending on gratuities and cruise line.

 

I can see it does say depending on gratuities, and even though the wages are by no means brilliant, it is certainly more than $1 a day.

 

If I have read your post wrong BruceMuzz please accept my apology now, and can you please refrain from being rude to me. As I said it really bothered me thinking that $1 aday could be happening..Cheers

 

shazz,

You read my post correctly. The OFFICIAL Union Contracts for all tipped crew have a salary of around US1$ per day. Some are as low as 70 cents per day; others as high as $1.25 per day. This depends on which union is negotiating the contract, and which cruise line they are negotiating with. That is how much the cruise line actually PAYS the tipped employees. The remainder comes from tips they receive from passengers.

 

This $1 per day is critical for tax purposes. Different countries have different regulations when it comes to taxing gratuities. Some do; most do not. If the tips were legally classified as salary, many of the crew would be forced to pay a substantial amount in taxes and would then demand higher salaries. That translates to higher cruise fares for you.

 

If you read my posts completely, I also pointed out that all the Union Contracts have a Minimum Guarantee Clause that forces the cruise line to guarantee a minimum earnings in case the expected tips are not forthcoming for some reason. This minimum guarantee is not very much (about 50% - 60% of what the crew would normally make with tips), but it is a form of insurance for the crew. If the ship breaks down, has a dry dock, or has a high number of passengers who refuse to tip, the minimum guarantee salary clause kicks in and the cruise line must make up for the tip losses - up to the amount of the minimum guaranteed salary.

 

About 80% of a ship's crew are in the "tipped employee" category and so are part of this program. On a large ship, that can mean around 1,000 crew in the tipping pool.

As you can imagine, the cruise line is not too happy about shelling out what can amount to quite a bit of extra money in salary when passengers refuse to tip.

And the tipped crew are not too happy about working as long and hard as ever, but receiving only 50 - 60% of their normal monthly earnings.

 

This is all calculated on a monthly basis - which is very important for our conversation. If it happens that the ship has a 2 week dry dock (with no tips), or two cruises where a large number of passengers refuse to tip, the tipped staff may still make their guaranteed MONTHLY salary without any need for the cruise line to make up any difference.

 

This is very detrimental to crew morale and creates many hard feelings against whoever they feel is responsible for their lack of earnings.

 

The salary amounts you have quoted are about average numbers for the official earnings of the $1 per day PLUS TIPS as I have detailed above.

 

Hope this helps.

[shazz_1958]

Thank you BruceMuzz for the more detailed description of the wages. From a purely selfish point of view I will now be a 'happy little cruiser', I would have been absoultely mortified going on my cruise thinking that that the crew only get $1 a day. The tax free quote that I posted certainly makes more sense now as well.

I must add though, as a aussie girl, and most of my friends being australian, we do tend to have the WHEN IN ROME......... attitude, so it does surprise me what you said about Australians in earlier posts, I sincerely hope that your future encounters with my fellow australians will prove to you that WE AINT ALL HALF BAD:D

[jocap]

Brucemuzz- I have followed this thread with interest, and I thank you for your honesty.

From a UK point of view, it's not so much the having to pay for the crew's wages, as the lack of information about this at the time of purchase. This is a big shock to people unused to a tipping culture, who have paid an already large amount, to be then told that gratuities will be added. Many times I've met this with 1st timers, who laugh in my face- no, their TA said it was £1200 all in, so why are they trying to squeeze another $140 on top? And so they don't pay, thinking they're being conned.

If companies would advertise this fact in the newspapers which make ridiculous claims, much of this problem wouldn't arise.

Perhaps new wording is needed in Aus., NZ and UK & Ireland, so that people know the facts from the beginning.

Jo.

[Mal2105]

Having worked in travel as a wholesaler of international products in Australia I can assure you it is common and wide practice for principals and wholesalers (not the TAs) to load currency margins heavily into the AUD selling price. The cruise lines appear to have taken this to a new level however - I guess it helps them fund their intl sales offices and marketing etc - supply and demand etc etc ...

I now book everything on line and through the most "direct to the source" (ie cut out the middle men) where possible. It is regrettable for retail TAs that this trend will continue to jeopardize their businesses but such is the nature of trading these days and why deny yourself the best price

 

Tip - if you have a friend or relative in the US and can use their address as a contact point you will have no trouble booking cruises direct

[bunburyseagull]

Having worked in travel as a wholesaler of international products in Australia I can assure you it is common and wide practice for principals and wholesalers (not the TAs) to load currency margins heavily into the AUD selling price. The cruise lines appear to have taken this to a new level however - I guess it helps them fund their intl sales offices and marketing etc - supply and demand etc etc ...

I now book everything on line and through the most "direct to the source" (ie cut out the middle men) where possible. It is regrettable for retail TAs that this trend will continue to jeopardize their businesses but such is the nature of trading these days and why deny yourself the best price

 

Tip - if you have a friend or relative in the US and can use their address as a contact point you will have no trouble booking cruises direct

 

 

 

Hi Mal, What if you don't have a relative or friend in the U.S, and the travel agent just gives you a random address, would you have any problems when boarding? That's what the U.S agent I have booked with has done, I am getting a bit nervous about boarding now>

[Mal2105]

Hi Mal, What if you don't have a relative or friend in the U.S, and the travel agent just gives you a random address, would you have any problems when boarding? That's what the U.S agent I have booked with has done, I am getting a bit nervous about boarding now>

 

mmm - i guess as long as you recv the cruise docs you are ready to go - cant see them denying boarding on a "change of address" basis

[Murrumba]

mmm - i guess as long as you recv the cruise docs you are ready to go - cant see them denying boarding on a "change of address" basis

 

 

 

PLEASE REFER BELOW TO CORRESPONDENCE (EMAIL) FROM RCL TO MY ENQUIRY ABOUT THEIR INFLATED PRICES AND MY RESPONSE TO THEM FOLLOWS THIS EMAIL. I THINK THIS IS SELF EXPLANATORY. VERY DISAPPOINTING AND I FOR ONE WILL HAVE TO THINK VERY LONG AND HARD ABOUT USING RCL AGAIN OR REFERRING ANY OTHER PERSON TO RCL CRUISES.

 

From: "customerservices.au@rcclapac.com" <customerservices.au@rcclapac.com>

Sent: Mon, 15 March, 2010 11:00:35 AM

 

Good morning

 

Thank you for your email regarding the pricing of cruises booked in

Australia as compared to those booked through an overseas travel agent.

 

Royal Caribbean Cruises Australia prices and sells all of its cruises in

Australian Dollars. The Australian dollar cost is determined prior to our

brochures being produced, which may be as much as two years prior to

sailing. Wwhere the underlying cost of an item comprising an element of the

cruise costs (such as gratuities which are paid in US dollars) is not in

Australian dollars the exchange rate prevailing at the time of going to

print is used to calculate the Australian dollar cost. By doing this Guests

are not affected by any currency fluctuations as they are aware of the

Australian dollar cost of their cruise at the time of booking.

 

It should be noted, that bookings made by Australian residents with an

overseas based travel agency, whether on-line or via a high street

location, are not covered by Australian consumer laws and the associated

protection of the Travel Compensation Fund - which protects consumers

against travel agency liquidation or insolvency.

 

Please be advised that if you book at a rate that is not applicable to an

Australian resident, you may be asked to pay the difference at the pier

during embarkation and in some cases be denied boarding.

 

This policy has been established in consultation with our retail travel

agent partners in Australia, USA and Europe, in an effort to ensure the

best possible consumer service is provided to all Royal Caribbean Cruises

Limited guests.

 

We hope this answers you concerns.

 

 

Sincere regards

 

 

Trish Sleigh

 

 

Customer Relations

Royal Caribbean Cruises (Australia) Pty Ltd.

email: customerservices.au@rcclapac.com

fax: 61 2 8065 3564

 

 

Hello,

 

I would appreciate this email being brought to the attention of a Manager of RCL.

 

Thank you for your reply. I am absolutely astonished at this response to my enquiry. The conversion is totally unfair. There has been some talk on cruise critic that USA companies decided to charge Australians this extra as they do not pay their tips. I always pay and always pay about twice as much in cash again.

 

I have had two cruises with your company and thoroughly enjoyed them, and encouraged other Australians and even brought some of my friends from the USA (Madawaska) to come to Australia and cruise to New Zealand with us.

 

My partner and I after receiving your email need to advise you that unless you change your policy that we will not be going on anymore RCL cruises and will use other countries who allow us to book for the same fare that people in the US can use. I understand we cannot use Military, Resident or Teacher discounts (as this was for the US people, which is still unfair). I will be putting your reply on Cruise critic for other Australians to see and they can make their own decision. I am very disappointed, but now understand that when we were looking for cruises in the US this year, your prices were prohibitive and we booked 2 cruises with NCL and one with Carnival as their prices were about half the price that you were going to charge us in Australian dollars.

 

I did wish you well in the Australian market and encouraged other people to use you. Unfortunately I cannot support you at this time with your policy.

[Tanderra]

if you are going in 4 weeks, you may have to make the long trip.

and just demand to be heard..

Your tickets have to be the same as your passport, and if he doesn't change the names soon, it may be too late.

 

why is it according to your oh's daughter??

why don't you ring?

 

Hi jannandjohn...and Murrumba :)

We really must go to see him (the TA). Upon inquiring we are now told that everyone has to make an appointment to see one of their staff :eek:

This is awkward at the moment as we have so many appointments...medical tests etc. It would have been nice if we could have made a day of it and went to see him when it suits us. So if we don't hear anything this week we will have to make an appointment and hope that it doesn't fall on one of my medical test days. As you know it can sometimes take a while for appointments so I take it when I can.

As for it being according to my OH's daughter...she has never been on a cruise and has only travelled as far as the UK once, flying...and Bali a number of times, all booked online.

Now she is going on a cruise and decided to book everything through this TA, she said they have been marvellous (she has since encountered a few problems with them herself :eek:). My OH decided to go her way :confused:....simply because she is his daughter. He says he has now learned his lesson.

Murrumba, when we 'phoned RCI in Sydney they said we could check everthing on RC's site....but our names were incorrect and unil they were changed we couldn't access it.

Thankyou for posting the email and your reply :)

[Tanderra]

Hi again jannand john :)....we have 'phoned so many times and got his voicemail. He has NEVER answered any of our calls. Just one or two earlier emails.

[jannandjohn]

We really must go to see him (the TA).

 

This is awkward at the moment as we have so many appointments...medical tests etc.

 

. So if we don't hear anything this week we will have to make an appointment and hope that it doesn't fall on one of my medical test days. As you know it can sometimes take a while for appointments so I take it when I can.

 

but our names were incorrect and unil they were changed we couldn't access it.

Your time is really going fast..you may have to put something else off, or you won't be going anywhere...if your names are wrong.

 

ps..got a bad feeling about this

[aussiek88]

i havent read all of the thread but seeing that Princess is doing away with the auto tips on the Sun and Dawn mid 2011 do you people think that the other cruise lines will follow suit

[jannandjohn]

i havent read all of the thread but seeing that Princess is doing away with the auto tips on the Sun and Dawn mid 2011 do you people think that the other cruise lines will follow suit

that doesn't mean no tips though...

[Murrumba]

Hi again jannand john :)....we have 'phoned so many times and got his voicemail. He has NEVER answered any of our calls. Just one or two earlier emails.

 

I wondered how you got on yesterday and today?? I wondered if you put the name incorrectly into the Cruise company website would that find you and you could at least check out somethings there? Hope things are going better.

 

Jannand John - thank you for posting those photographs - I loved going through them. Brought back so many memories from being in Canada and New England Maine last year. It really is a beautiful place in the world and I found the people so nice too. Looking forward to coming going there again. Loved your cabin - wow!!! I usually travel inside and only twice, one many years ago had a really small porthole near sea level on a Cunard ship and recently to Alaska had a window. We do have one balcony in our set of 3 cruises this year, so that will be wonderful. :p:p

[Australian family]

Aussies don't tip.

They insist in doing things "their way" - even when they are NOT in their country.

 

The cruise lines have agreements with the tipped crew to cover shortages in tips when passengers don't tip.

 

Charging higher fares to Aussies is a great way to recoup that extra expense for the cruise lines.

 

 

That is a poor response, do you know that for a fact that us Aussies don't tip. You are very wrong and shouldn't make those statements about Aussies. This board is not about hitting out at other countries.