Cruise lines: time to provide unlimited FREE WIFI

[paulandfran]

I'll try to explain how emergencies work. Let's say you go on a 10 day cruise and on day 2, your Dad, LuckySr has some bad luck and is run over by someone speeding on their way to work and is in the hospital in critical condition and expected to only last a few more days. Some people would interupt their vacation and fly to be at their dying Father's bedside rather than finishing their vacation.

 

Back on topic: I agree with those who say there are better ways to reach you in case of an emergency than email. Also if it was unlimited it would slow everything down too much due to the increased usage. I believe the pricing is set to maximize profitability while trying to keep it from being sooooooooooo slow no one bothers with it. It's a balancing act.

 

Wouldn't a phone call get to you quicker in an emergency?

 

Yes, see bolded part of my post above. The first part of my post was answering MrLuckyToo's question.

[boogs]

I cruise to get away, not stay connected. The last thing I want to do on my vacation is do the same things I can do sitting at my computer at home.

[mikewrit]

I dragged the laptop along on our first cruise (NCL to Alaska five years ago) to download photos from the digital camera (which came with a very low capacity SD card). I was happy to find wifi available on the ship, dismayed at the high cost and low speed. Now I have a couple of 8-gig chips for the camera but take the laptop to keep in touch. Next time I think I'll take it again and use it in ports with free wifi or whenever I'm close enough to land to pick up Boingo -- which is a good deal faster and cheaper than NCL wifi or internet cafe charges. So NCL will lose that bit of cash flow.

[mikran]

The poll numbers are looking intruiging - growing support and more fence-sitters than I expected - although it is a very small sample size and a limited question. I also find it interesting that nobody has raised the age aspect yet, so let me jump in with that if I may:

 

Cruise lines are looking for ways to attract 'generation next' - you know, the younger set that always seem to be connected and have smartphones almost glued to the palms of their hands - like our children, nieces/nephews and grandchildren.

 

As the cruising boomers start to dwindle, those are the future cruisers and the key to the bottom lines of the cruise lines. They are growing up in an era of immediacy, simply expect information when, how and where they want it, and they will not want to pay through the nose for it either.

 

Are you cruise lines listening?...

[paul929207]

The poll numbers are looking intruiging - growing support and more fence-sitters than I expected - although it is a very small sample size and a limited question. I also find it interesting that nobody has raised the age aspect yet, so let me jump in with that if I may:

 

Cruise lines are looking for ways to attract 'generation next' - you know, the younger set that always seem to be connected and have smartphones almost glued to the palms of their hands - like our children, nieces/nephews and grandchildren.

 

As the cruising boomers start to dwindle, those are the future cruisers and the key to the bottom lines of the cruise lines. They are growing up in an era of immediacy, simply expect information when, how and where they want it, and they will not want to pay through the nose for it either.

 

Are you cruise lines listening?...

You make a good point about age.

 

As time goes along and there will likely be growing demand for connectivity, both cell and internet, there will likely be advances that will bring down the cost. At a minimum these savings will probably be passed along to the passengers. The costs may go down enough to allow the cruise lines to include them for free.

[paulandfran]

I cruise to get away, not stay connected. The last thing I want to do on my vacation is do the same things I can do sitting at my computer at home.

 

I see both sides of it. Personally I prefer to leave my computer home too but sometimes when you run your own business there will be projects that despite your best efforts conflict with a scheduled vacation. I have found myself needing to stay in touch in order to not miss closing a deal I've been working on. But when you have a job (like my hubby) you can often hand things off to others in your office and it's nice to not think about work on vacation. But I think unlimited is not a great idea at this point because they don't have the bandwidth to keep up with exponential increase in demand that would inevitably occur.

[BruceMuzz]

The Cruise Industry has spent many millions of dollars and a great deal of time and energy to understand how the American Public really thinks and behaves.

 

When NCL introduced their Freestyle Cruising concept with many restaurants, they had problems with controlling demand for their smaller venues. When they introduced a cover charge to discourage the "tire kickers", they were really on to something. Increasing the cover charge by just 50 cents per person could discourage a very predictable percentage of diners. Decreasing the cover charge by 50 cents could increase their patronage by a very predictable percentage of diners.

 

It is difficult to fathom that a single dollar could influence a decision by a couple to purchase an entire dinnner in a nice restaurant - or not. It's even more difficult to believe that such a small amount of money could influence the decisions of many hundreds of couples on a cruise. But that's the way it works.

 

Internet on ships is a difficult concept. Set up costs are enormous. The ship's constant movement requires a very sophisticated (expensive) satellite tracking antenna, and a back-up antenna (expensive) for the frequent technical problems encountered. Current commercial marine satellite technology is not very sophisticated. High traffic demand drives up prices. Bandwidth is not very good. As a result, connections are very slow.

 

So when you have a narrow bandwidth, how do you keep connection speed as high as possible?

Easy. You reduce the number of users. The fewer people connected, the faster the connection.

 

The Internet Cafe on most ships barely makes enough revenue to classify it as a revenue department. So why do we even bother to charge people for the service?

To control the number of people connected, and thereby keep some control over connection speed.

 

If Internet was free on a cruise ship, you would have many hundreds or possibly thousands of passengers (and crew) trying to get online at any given time. The narrow bandwidth would be overwhelmed, and the system would crash and be useless to all.

 

Note: The same bandwidth used for internet service also services all company related emails and telephone calls, credit card authorizations, background music systems, movie channels, satellite telephone calls, ATMs, currency exchange, cell phone roaming, crew telephone calls, and crew internet cafe. If the system crashes, the ship cannot be cleared for arrival in port, your credit cards will be declined, the ATM will not give you any money, movies on your stateroom TV will stop, no background music, you cannot exchange currency, we cannot call head office to get repairs or order food. The ship essentially stops.

 

So how do we ensure connection speed is optimized and that none of these problems arise?

 

We limit the number of people conected at any given time by putting a "cover charge" on the usage.

The internet rate charged to passengers is low enough to make essential emails affordable, but limits surfing and file downloads that would slow the system too much. If too many people started logging on, the price would have to be increased.

The rate charged to the crew is low enough to make it affordable, but high enough to limit the numbers. If too many crew start using the internet, the price goes up.

Satellite calls are pricey, but acceptable for important calls. At the current rate, not too many calls are made, so the price does not change.

 

How does a passenger deal with this?

You can simply pay the price if internet is that important to you, and still suffer with slow conections. Logging on at off hours will get generally get you a much faster connection.

 

Use internet Cafes in port. They are everywhere, and most have quite fast connections. Any crewmember can tell you where the best ones are. In some ports the WIFI coverage from local internet cafes will reach the outside decks of the ship. The crew can tell you which ones they are - and the best places on the ship to take advantage of this.

 

Or you can take a 7 day break from the internet and enjoy your cruise.

[BruceMuzz]

The OP obviously does not work for a cruise line.

Satellite services are not owned nor provided by cruise lines. They outsource the service via contract to a company that leases the satellite services from yet another company.

All the companies involved have invested quite a bit of money into this venture, and their shareholders expect some sort of financial return on their investments.

 

To get some idea of the costs involved, please read on:

 

First go ask NASA what they will charge you to build and launch 24 geosynchronous satellites into low earth orbit, and maintain them every day of the year for you. Once you have recovered from sticker shock, move to the next step.

 

Then find a contractor to build a multi-Million dollar earth satellite station to communicate with these satellites. This is the same type of earth station that major internet providers use. They have many millions of subscribers to help pay for the station, and the much bigger (and far more expensive) bandwidth. You will have only a few thousand subscribers at any given time to pay for the station and a smaller bandwidth. You will need to hire several dozen Satellite engineers to run the station for you, after you build it.

 

Then you need to provide satellite domes for every cruise ship receiving the satellite signals. The cruise lines will not pay for these.

Each ship requires a minimum of 2 domes. They cost $250,000 each.

There are around 300 cruise ships sailing world wide. How many are you willing to equip - at a cost of $500,000 per ship - with the domes to communicate with your satellites?

 

Due to ship's constantly moving, the servo motors in these satellite domes break down quite often. You must hire several dozen more engineers and have them standing by to fly to any corner of the earth on a moments notice to service the broken domes. They fly First/Business Class. You pay for the flights.

 

Unless your name is Bill Gates, you probably had to borrow the hundreds of millions of dollars required to start this business. The interest payments alone must be enormous.

Then you may want to try to make a profit on the many millions you have invested in this venture.

Your investors will be asking about their dividends.

 

Part of the deal you make with the cruise lines is that they get free internet and telephone for all cruise line business. This is going to eat up about 40% of your bandwidth.

Another part of the deal with many cruise lines is that their top 500 or so cabins get free internet connection packages. This eats up about 50% of your potential revenues.

And the final part of the deal is that the cruise line gets about 60% of any revenue you are able to generate.

 

How much would YOU charge per minute for your internet satellite services?

[mikewrit]

Excellent, Muzz. Well worth the reading. Thanks.

[snydermann]

Wow BruceMuzz, excellent post, thank you.

 

I had no idea.

[Keith1010]

I just wanted to add that there is a finite of capacity with the satellites. Back in the 1980's and early 1990's the cost for making international calls was extremely high and one of the reasons was very limited bandwidth because a good deal of the capacity was provided via satellite. In fact, back then, the access to many countries was satellite only. What drove down the costs was not only the expansion of undersea fiber cables but the necessary electronics to provide large volumes of capacity. This signficiantly reduced the cost for international calls and also improved quality.

 

Unfortunately, this is not an option for cruise ship communications thus the internet costs and the telephone costs remain high because supply is limited and the costs to provide those services are high. This is also why the speed of the internet is not what we are used to with DSL at home.

 

Keith

[mikran]

Thanks for your lengthy, detailed post BruceMuzz.

 

While your technical account sounds daunting on the surface, with all due respect, there are other ways this can be achieved to make the numbers work -- the cost is a drop in the ocean when compared to the billions that the cruise lines spend just putting ships in the water, let alone operating them.

 

There is too much talk about finite this and limited that which is rooted in similar thinking I suppose. But then it wasn't that long ago that people balked at the idea of mobile phones, the automobile, flight, and the light bulb. I find it more exciting to live in possibility.

 

All that aside, I did give the old-school cruiseline strategists a bit of a break -- you'll recall that my original post focused more on cruise lines offering free WIFI on board while ships are in port.

 

You're absolutely correct that I do not work for the cruise industry -- yet? Maybe they need some fresh thinking...

 

As a minor footnote response to your statement about market research - there are many cruisers out there who are not American, myself included. Perhaps they need to broaden their research a tad.

 

Happy sailings! :)

[Keith1010]

Thanks for your lengthy, detailed post BruceMuzz.

 

All that aside, I did give the old-school cruiseline strategists a bit of a break -- you'll recall that my original post focused more on cruise lines offering free WIFI on board while ships are in port.

 

Happy sailings! :)

 

I also have the benefit as having been a senior executive of a large telecommunications company.

 

When the ship is in port it is no different for the ship. Their communications are still via satellite. They can't just hook up into the local telecommunications system.

 

There really is limited satellite capacity and that is why internet rates are indeed high along with the communications on a ships telephone.

 

Hopefully, in time technology will continue to advance but that is the way it is right now.

 

Keith

[paul929207]

Princess used to give free internet to the Platinum and Elite Captain's Circle members. They found there was a huge increase in usage. It part because some people abused it by give or selling their ID to others. Princess switched to giving an internet credit of $75, $100 or $200 depending on the length of the cruise. This gets people 150, 250 or 500 minutes. For most people I talk to that is plenty for a cruise.

[euro cruiser]

The Cruise Industry has spent many millions of dollars and a great deal of time and energy to understand how the American Public really thinks and behaves.

Market research is notoriously bad at quantifying the upside of a new idea, primarily because comsumers are generally unable to predict their own behaviour in an unknown circumstance. As a marketing professional, I can tell you that much of the money we spend on research, and on advertising, is wasted. The problem is that we don't know exactly which dollars are the wasted ones, and which ones aren't, until after the fact.

 

The OP obviously does not work for a cruise line...First go ask NASA what they will charge you to build and launch 24 geosynchronous satellites into low earth orbit, and maintain them every day of the year for you...Unless your name is Bill Gates, you probably had to borrow the hundreds of millions of dollars required to start this business.

 

While these posts are interesting, although not really responsive to the OP's suggestion of in-port access, I find the tone of the posts most fascinating. Maybe I'm misreading it, but why the anger/sarcasm/condescension? Why be so put off by an idea, the possibility of something new, even if the implementation isn't clear?

[pmacher61]

If you return to this thread, I would like you to know that I really appreciate the time and insight you devote to these boards. I'm sure I speak for many others. IMHO the above accusation of ill mannered sarcasm, etc by the OP is unwarranted. Don't change your writing style which I, for one, find amusing as well as extremely informative. I'm willing to abide some minor doses of sarcasm in the bargain.

 

I'm prompted to publish this thank you now because I just finished plowing through a thread on why Aussies pay more for a cruise, a thread (now dormant) in which you participated at unusual length. You were continuously and unfairly insulted because a few ccers seemed incapable of comprehending the plain meaning of your words. Some people are stupid, some are just ignorant or appear to be careless readers, and some are downright meanspirited - but you probably know that better than I do. You demonstrated admirable restraint. I guess that's something one develops in your line of work.

[mikran]

Happy Friday fellow cruise enthusiasts!

 

Well, this thread has offered up some very interesting exchanges. And look at the poll numbers - almost half of respondents agree, and over 40% are indifferent, which could mean yay or nay. Cruise lines - are you listening? :-)

 

@BruceMuzz - for the record, I appreciate your perspective and take them in stride, so thanks again.

 

@euro cruiser - appreciate a fellow marketer's viewpoint - thanks for your insights as well.

 

@pmacher61 - nice of you to add your gratitude message for BruceMuzz... calling people names, however, is inconsistent with the spirit of your message to him (and this thread) :rolleyes:

 

@ everyone else participating - thank you for sharing your thoughts - keep em comin!

 

Happy Sailings all!

[smeyer418]

Happy Friday fellow cruise enthusiasts!

 

Well, this thread has offered up some very interesting exchanges. And look at the poll numbers - almost half of respondents agree, and over 40% are indifferent, which could mean yay or nay. Cruise lines - are you listening? :-)

 

@BruceMuzz - for the record, I appreciate your perspective and take them in stride, so thanks again.

 

@euro cruiser - appreciate a fellow marketer's viewpoint - thanks for your insights as well.

 

@pmacher61 - nice of you to add your gratitude message for BruceMuzz... calling people names, however, is inconsistent with the spirit of your message to him (and this thread) :rolleyes:

 

@ everyone else participating - thank you for sharing your thoughts - keep em comin!

 

Happy Sailings all!

 

the sample is small and not scientific. Cruise lines know that people who HAVE to stay in touch either will pay for it or their company reimburses(that is why a lot of high hotels still charge).

As long as its a profit center, they will charge for it or include it in the fare by charging more. Personally I don't want to pay for someone else's internet.

 

I have used my net book at cruise terminals and can sometimes find a hot spot that will allow me to surf the web-with a password. Almost everywhere I went you can find an internet cafe. Some of which were as cheap as $1 per hour. While satellites have become less expensive to use and have bigger "pipes" than they once did, its still not cheap for the cruise lines.

 

BTW GPS is a good example. It once cost many thousands of dollars to get a really good GPS for your car. Now you can get a great one for under $200. I have satellite radio in my car too. I bring my GPS for driving overseas or rent one for a few dollars a day. Its a different world with a GPS while driving. Will it be in every car probably some day....