Question re Automatically Gratuities

[CathyCruises]

I am surprised after reading three pages of this thread that no one has mentioned that the reason they instututed the autotips in the first place was to keep people from stiffing the staff.

 

As far as I'm concerned, that's the end of the story. Draw your own conclusions.

[bplazo]

I am surprised after reading three pages of this thread that no one has mentioned that the reason they instututed the autotips in the first place was to keep people from stiffing the staff.

 

As far as I'm concerned, that's the end of the story. Draw your own conclusions.

 

Agreed. You are eating somewhere on this ship for all those days. Just cheap.

[lucywestie]

Well Im back after a night away and I see I stirred up quite a storm of comment. I did post yesterday about it deterioating into a brawl and maybe that was a bit much. But it certainly seems to have gone that far now with the word "cheap" being thrown around.

 

Anyway, somebody had posted about how they eat a lot of their meals in port. The cruises we are on [back to back] has alot of port days and our plan was to experience dining in alot of these places.

We had already planned to let the matrie'd know we wouldnt be eating in the mdr and our TA put us down for a table for 10 as we said we probably wont be eating there.

 

It just seems that when I read tipping posts there is always somebody trying to outdo the last poster, as in "oh..I always tip" closely followed by "ohhh..I always tip more".I understand its a very touchy subject in the US whereas in other parts of the world its just not such a big concern.

 

Yes, we will be eating in the buffet everyday, not because we want to load our plates up to overflowing proportions, but just because we didnt like the atmosphere in the mdr on our first cruise, it was to noisy and to crowded, but that is what we knew to expect when you are feeding approx 1000 people at a time. Different strokes for different folks.

 

Somebody had mentioned that cruiselines introduced automatic tipping to stop people "stiffing" the crew. Do you really think they sat in a boardroom and did that?? Cruiselines are a business. They are there to make money for their the share holders. If they can get away "stiffing" their own employees by making their customers pay their wages [lets be honest, this is what it is] then that is what they will do to increase their profits.

 

Either way, we are looking forward to our cruises. If I remove the auto tipping I will be informing my cabin steward of this fact but I will also advise them that I will not let it affect them and will tip accordingly.

 

As an afterthought, in a restaurant, you don't tip before you have your meal, you do it afterwards and tip according to the quality of the food and service. That is how it should be.

 

Anyway, this was a spirited discussion and I thank you for all your responses.

Pete

[PartyAllDaTyme]

I know the behind the scenes people need tipped and I am happy to do that if the "other service personnel" doesn't cover that.

 

Alternative Service*

Other Service Personnel $1.25

 

As was mentioned earlier, the "Other Service Personnel" $1.25 goes to the Chief Housekeeper, similar to the buck for "Dining Room Management." I had recalled from a discussion some months (years:o?) ago that this was for housekeeping, and at the time was led to believe that it went to laundry service. Apparently, though, this was at one time spelled out, and there was much resistance on the Cruise Critic boards to tipping someone who most cruisers never even saw. Thus, the more ambiguous change.

 

Per cruisestitch, the dining service tips cover waitstaff that work not just the MDR but the buffet-- not clear if they work other venues, but I don't recall seeing anything that says that workers in, say, Cova Cafe or the Mast Grill get any part of their tips. You have to select one dining option or another, whether you ever eat in the MDR or not. If we're concerned about the proper people receiving tips, your erstwhile waiter and assistant waiter will be serving you (in some fashion) for two meals, and that's assuming the staff you interact with in the buffet are the same ones you would have had for waitstaff-- if you choose Select dining, those tips get pooled, anyway, so best to think about it that way. Somehow, I doubt the maitre d' also doubles in the buffet, so there's $14 to someone who you have had no interaction with at all, and $91 to someone to freshen up the salad bar, bus your table and maybe offer to get you a refill on your beverage for two visits each for two people. The cabin steward who provides you with five nights of room service sees none of that.

 

Part of the problem with removing the autotip is that the buffet workers/waiters will get stiffed for what service they do provide. To be fair, maybe you could slip them a buck any time they actually do something for you, but how awkward would that be? I've never adjusted the autotip-- can you specify what does and does not go to who? If you can, possibly you could adjust downward the waiters' tips and remove the $1.00 management tip.

 

It's an imperfect system, but I'd rather overpay than underpay. Reminds me of the story (I'll try to clean it up) of the old time prospector who rode his burro into town and decided to treated himself to a night in a fancy hotel. He checked in, then went to the saloon for a night of drinking and card playing. He staggered back to his room at 2am and passed out on the bed. In the morning, when he went to check out, the front desk clerk presented him with a bill for $50. "What in tarnatian for?" he asked. "Sir, we charge $20 for the use of the bath, $20 for the laundry, and $10 for the services of the concierge." "But I didn't use none o' that!" "Those services were there available for your use. If you chose not to use them, that's your concern, but the charges stand." "Stay right there, young feller." The prospector went off and came back with a handwritten bill for the clerk. "You owe me $50 for 'romancing' my burro last night." "What-- I never-- with your burro-- I never 'romanced' your burro! That's outrageous!" "Well, she was tied up in front of the hotel all night, available for your use. If you chose not to use her, that's your concern.":D:eek::D

[cruisestitch]

" I doubt the maitre d' also doubles in the buffet, " They are there not as a server, but as a supervisor. They are there at breakfast and lunch, generally with walkie-talkie or cell phone in hand, monitoring the service.

 

Housekeeping is more than just your own stateroom. There are all the folks who keep the public restrooms spotless, the ones who vacuum the passageways, polish the handrails, wash the windows. They are all on the housekeeping staff, obviously, many of them practicing their English and hoping to be promoted to an assistant room steward, then to a steward, and ultimately to a butler.

 

Auto-tipping was, in fact, instituted for a variety of reasons, at least one of which was to keep the incidents of "stiffing the crew" down. Also, some travel agents urged for the auto-tip, and in fact, for the pre-paid tipping such as is required by the choice of Select Dining. Having their customers know, up front, what is the total cost of the cruise, and being able to pay for it ahead of time, meant fewer complaints later. Being able to have your charges put into your SeaPass account rather than worrying about carrying a lot of cash is, for most customers, the preferable option.

 

Went out with a large group of friends last week to dinner. A tip was automatically added to each person's dinner, per the restaurant's policy. This was, in essence, paying the tip before the service was received. Maybe think about the cruise line in the same way -- you are a group of 2000 plus people. Having the auto-tip in place ahead of the cruise lets you know what your bill will be. Paying it before you cruise is a way to go into the trip knowing that at least that detail is already taken care of, for those who like to do it that way.

[denby]

I have a concern about gratuities that I have never seen addressed on any board. On our first cruise we happily paid the automatic gratuities and might add that we have continued to do so on subsequent cruises. Our table mates were 3 other couples who were all seasoned cruisers. They made a big production of picking up envelopes for everyone and then the last evening another big production of giving these envelopes to our waiter and assistant waiter. We never knew whether they had prepaid their gratuities and were giving an extra tip to the wait staff or whether this was their total tip for the cruise. Either way, we felt badly for not coming prepared with envelope in hand. So my advice, if you are tipping or providing an extra tip, please do it discreetly.

[PartyAllDaTyme]

" I doubt the maitre d' also doubles in the buffet, " They are there not as a server, but as a supervisor. They are there at breakfast and lunch, generally with walkie-talkie or cell phone in hand, monitoring the service.

 

Housekeeping is more than just your own stateroom. There are all the folks who keep the public restrooms spotless, the ones who vacuum the passageways, polish the handrails, wash the windows. They are all on the housekeeping staff, obviously, many of them practicing their English and hoping to be promoted to an assistant room steward, then to a steward, and ultimately to a butler.

 

Thanks for your fast and knowledgeable response!:) I did not recall maitre d's working as a buffet supervisor, but it makes sense.

 

Regarding housekeeping, my source was from a post I found from dkjretired from April of this year--

 

Total is correct and I will tell you exactly what Alternative Service is. Since they came into exsistence, Celebrity has always had a seperate tip for what they call the Chief Housekeeper. A couple of years ago they changed the name of this tip to other Service Personnel probably because there were so many complaints both on board and on these boards. The complaints basically were that we never see the Chief Housekeeper so why should we tip him.

 

So my question would be if the other housekeeping personnel actually share in the $1.25, or does it go to the mighty and all-powerful Chief Housekeeper?

[cruisestitch]

The "chief housekeeper" part of the tips might be a carry-over from times past, or even based on what happens on other cruise lines. I have sailed on lines where the Chief Housekeeper for my section of staterooms was a visible presence, introducing him/herself, checking on staterooms during the cruise, someone who was around much as the Assistant MaitreD for your station is around in the dining room, not necessarily at your table, but nearby if needed. But on Celebrity, this supervisor doesn't show his/her face in the same way, and so the change in nomenclature for the tip allocation.

[dkjretired]

The "chief housekeeper" part of the tips might be a carry-over from times past, or even based on what happens on other cruise lines. I have sailed on lines where the Chief Housekeeper for my section of staterooms was a visible presence, introducing him/herself, checking on staterooms during the cruise, someone who was around much as the Assistant MaitreD for your station is around in the dining room, not necessarily at your table, but nearby if needed. But on Celebrity, this supervisor doesn't show his/her face in the same way, and so the change in nomenclature for the tip allocation.

 

It depends on the CH, I have met several on my cruises and yes it is a carryover. There were a lot of complaints that we should not be paying a tip to someone we rarely see and provides minimal service so they changed the name.

[u2cruiser]

u2cruiser, was this on Celebrity? It is very rare to have a cabin attendant hint for tips, and there aren't many female cabin attendants on this line. Just curious.

 

Hi cruisestich, yes it was on Equinox in May.

It was a little tricky really as her male assistant was great.

She also asked us to put her name on the questionnaire and to say she was excellent. (we didn't)

 

She complained a lot, saying she was tired with losing the hours on an Eastbound TA and didn't want to do the job for much longer as it was too hard. Not the best cabin steward we've had :(

[PS90]

I have a concern about gratuities that I have never seen addressed on any board. On our first cruise we happily paid the automatic gratuities and might add that we have continued to do so on subsequent cruises. Our table mates were 3 other couples who were all seasoned cruisers. They made a big production of picking up envelopes for everyone and then the last evening another big production of giving these envelopes to our waiter and assistant waiter. We never knew whether they had prepaid their gratuities and were giving an extra tip to the wait staff or whether this was their total tip for the cruise. Either way, we felt badly for not coming prepared with envelope in hand. So my advice, if you are tipping or providing an extra tip, please do it discreetly.

 

I absolutely agree. I think it is tacky/poor etiquette both to make a big display of giving tips onboard, as well as making big boasts on CC like "I always give every crewmember extra tips". Tipping for the sake of being generous is one thing, tipping for the sake of bragging to everyone else is a whole 'nother ballgame.

[Gonzo70]

As an afterthought, in a restaurant, you don't tip before you have your meal, you do it afterwards and tip according to the quality of the food and service. That is how it should be.

 

 

You are mistaking a traditional tip with a service charge. There are different types of gratuities. In restaurants (in U.S. and some other countries) it is customary to tip the server at the end of the meal as long as the service was decent, and to tip a higher amount for good to outstanding service. On cruise ships the daily gratuities are simply a service charge for the basic expected service (and should not be removed as this is the system Celebrity has for how the crew is paid). One is free to hand out cash towards the end of the cruise (or immediately after service is rendered if one prefers) to anybody who goes above and beyond and provides exemplary service. This is more the type of tip you are thinking about. Please realize this is quite different than the daily gratuities set up by Celebrity. The only time these should be removed are if you receive poor service, you inform a supervisor and the poor service continues.

[PS90]

Hi cruisestich, yes it was on Equinox in May.

It was a little tricky really as her male assistant was great.

She also asked us to put her name on the questionnaire and to say she was excellent. (we didn't)

 

She complained a lot, saying she was tired with losing the hours on an Eastbound TA and didn't want to do the job for much longer as it was too hard. Not the best cabin steward we've had :(

 

I've never had this happen, thankfully. But if it gets to the point in cruising that crew-members start to EXPECT tips in addition to the auto-tip then I, for one, will be finding a different type of vacation.

[u2cruiser]

I've never had this happen, thankfully. But if it gets to the point in cruising that crew-members start to EXPECT tips in addition to the auto-tip then I, for one, will be finding a different type of vacation.

 

It is unusual. That is why we wondered whether they knew we had prepaid.

[Project_gal]

Somehow, I doubt the maitre d' also doubles in the buffet, so there's $14 to someone who you have had no interaction with at all,

 

Oh, but they do! The Maitres d' of the MDR and speciality restaurants [and other staff from the speciality restaurants] do duty at breakfast and lunch in the buffet and other food venues around the ship - including the Elite breakfast wherever it is held. In fact, they often oversee more than one venue at these times - they have kindly carried my tray for me in the buffet or checked we are OK in the Aqua Spa cafe on many occasions.

 

Sue

[PartyAllDaTyme]

Oh, but they do! The Maitres d' of the MDR and speciality restaurants [and other staff from the speciality restaurants] do duty at breakfast and lunch in the buffet and other food venues around the ship - including the Elite breakfast wherever it is held. In fact, they often oversee more than one venue at these times - they have kindly carried my tray for me in the buffet or checked we are OK in the Aqua Spa cafe on many occasions.

 

Sue

 

Thanks, Sue-- cruisestitch set me right about that a while back. I was thinking more along the lines of a maitre d' lugging a fresh tray of breakfast sausages or mopping the floor. I wasn't thinking about supervisory roles.

[kruzgal]

It is unusual. That is why we wondered whether they knew we had prepaid.

 

Our last 2 cruises have been under the new auto tipping system and we have also wondered whether staff are aware we have paid since not one member of staff acknowledged that we had, or said a simple thank you. It has left a very bad feeling on the last night and we can't help but feel our money is just taken for granted. We also had a situation this year where the people on the next table made a point of handing over envelopes - had they removed the auto tips and given less or were they tipping extra? I just hate that awkwardness at the end of a nice holiday - it really spoils things. I think it is about time cruise lines had a major re-think regarding the way they pay their crew/ demand tips from passengers. As a family of four, watching our on board account go up by $44 every day for 2 weeks made us think about land based alternatives. Cruising in Europe is not cheap during the school summer holidays and there are alternatives, such as land based vacations, where I won't be left with such a bad feeling on the last night. Not what I want at the end of my holiday!

[u2cruiser]

Our last 2 cruises have been under the new auto tipping system and we have also wondered whether staff are aware we have paid since not one member of staff acknowledged that we had, or said a simple thank you. It has left a very bad feeling on the last night and we can't help but feel our money is just taken for granted. We also had a situation this year where the people on the next table made a point of handing over envelopes - had they removed the auto tips and given less or were they tipping extra? I just hate that awkwardness at the end of a nice holiday - it really spoils things. I think it is about time cruise lines had a major re-think regarding the way they pay their crew/ demand tips from passengers. As a family of four, watching our on board account go up by $44 every day for 2 weeks made us think about land based alternatives. Cruising in Europe is not cheap during the school summer holidays and there are alternatives, such as land based vacations, where I won't be left with such a bad feeling on the last night. Not what I want at the end of my holiday!

 

Hi kruzgal. I'm not sure you get a thank you when auto tips are on either, so it's just the same really. We never have.

We have to accept it is part of the cruise cost rather than an actual tip as we know them. For me, cruising is unique and though I enjoy land holidays, cruising is special.

 

I do agree that for a family, the gratuities really add up on a 2 week cruise. That's why I'd rather have the option of pre paying if possible. I just want to know that my steward and waiters know we've already paid.

 

I don't like the envelope business either. I find it really awkward and false.

P&O still operates the envelope system for the cabin steward and waiters, unless you're on Freedom dining, then an auto tip of £1.60 pp per day is charged to your account. Have you cruised with P&O? The gratuities are less, but the base price is generally higher than Celebrity.

 

It spoils my last day too in a way, because I always feel we should give more, even after auto tips.

[SusieV]

I actually like the envelopes, partly for the reasons that I like to know that the people I'm tipping actually get the money, and partly because I just don't like prepaying a tip. I understand that it's a service charge and I have never given less, even one time where the steward really deserved less.

 

I'm just more comfortable actually handing the money to the staff who have served me and telling them how much I appreciated their service. We remove the auto tips as soon as we get onboard so that there is no possibility of anyone thinking that the staff are to blame for anything.

 

And we spend lots of time in the casino anyway so we always have US cash to get rid of at the end of the trip! Envelopes just work better for us then the auto tips. We still get an envelope for the head housekeeper too, with instructions written on it to give it to our steward. Everyone still gets covered.

[Taxguy77]

The "auto-tip" is being more properly described as a "hotel charge" by cruiselines. It is NOT a 'tip' (to insure promptness), but another charge among the many. To properly price a cruise, add the cruise + port fees + taxes + per-diem 'your share of wages' and don't forget travel to and from ports. Only then can you compare a cruise to another vacation.

There are always people on board who EARN our tips, and we are happy help them financially.

[Blanco-Grande]

Please just leave the auto-grats in place (really more of a service charge than gratuities), then hand a little extra cash out to anybody at the end of the cruise you feel provided you with outstanding service. It does not matter if you will be eating in the main dining room or not, you will be eating somewhere I presume. The auto-grats ensure that all the hard working crew receive compensation (they earn only a minuscule salary and the auto-grats is how they are paid).

 

We were with you and the Centurions (still have the shirts) April 2008 Trans atlantic and crazy Hotel Dir Frabrezio We ate in muranos EVERY NIGHT

Thomas

[smeyer418]

Celebrity used to do the same thing as RCI, I dont even think they do it that way anymore on RCL, all cruise lines have changed to some different form in tipping. At least on Celebrity you have the option to remove them, other lines such as NCL you cannot.

 

 

you can adjust on NCL as well.

Then you have no respect for me...no water off my back...and i don't mind at all.

 

We always remove auto tips...We also don't eat in MDR. Our room steward brings us our dinner and we tip him (and his assistant) and from what I gather (only from reading these message boards) he gives some of that tip to the "general fund" for the backstage workers. I will ask steward next time if he can "keep" any/all of the tip I give him.

 

 

Our room steward provides normal "room" duties, plus is our head waiter and assistant waiter...I don't think it is right to tip those 2 catagories if they are not a service I use...he gets all 3 tips (and if he chooses to, or has to give some/all of that to the general fund that is his choice)

 

BTW crew was expected to tip out from the money they recieved in the past. for wait staff this was the head waiter/asst maitre d, dishwashers and line cooks for room staff it was the asst head housekeeper(not the one in charge) the laundry and supply rooms. With the dsc they now don't have to do that and in fact keep more. When you remove the dsc all they get in cash is put back into the pool(and in fact some of them put cash in anyway when you remove the tips even when you don't give them anything to prove that they weren't being singled out for poor service). very rarely do crew pocket cash tips when someone has removed them without putting them in the pool. The penalty for doing this is severe. The crew knows who pockets the tip and they won't be around long.

 

BTW TIP doesn't mean to assure promptness that is a urban legend...it is derived from a word that means bribe....

[Blanco-Grande]

Oh, but they do! The Maitres d' of the MDR and speciality restaurants [and other staff from the speciality restaurants] do duty at breakfast and lunch in the buffet and other food venues around the ship - including the Elite breakfast wherever it is held. In fact, they often oversee more than one venue at these times - they have kindly carried my tray for me in the buffet or checked we are OK in the Aqua Spa cafe on many occasions.

 

Sue

Usually the Murano staff do the Elite breakfast and they always have control of the Aqua Spa Cafe My cousin is a Maitre d in one of the Muranos

On Solstace class Murano Maitre d also has charge of the Gellato Ice Cream and the Bistro on 5

[smeyer418]

btw why tip the Maitre D or the head waiter? besides their other duties of coming to your table for special issues, they are responsible for the overal ambiance of your dining area, the assignment of the crew to stations and training of the staff. This means that if their is a problem they are the ones you should talk to in order to fix it. I had a problem on my last X cruise and I not only got to know the Maitre D well but the restaurant manager too. They bent over backwards to fix the problem and I actually enjoyed the experience.(when we went on the kitchen tour the manager called me by name and the people with us wondered who I was that the manage knew me)...

[Blanco-Grande]

I always opt OUT...I give my cabin guy around $100 plus for 2 people for 7 days,($50 first meet, then we see how he does by the 3rd day for the rest) his asst $25 and lots of $5 bills for wait staff in Blu, asst Maitre d in Blu $25 and lots of $2 bills (they are considered "lucky" by the crew) for room service etc...I order them from my credit union a month before