Internet Speed (or lack of the same)

[Suncitygaltx]

RCCL says they'll improve internet speed next summer on one of their ships:

 

http://www.cruisecritic.com/news/news.cfm?ID=4885

 

Do you think if enough of us emailed Oceania about this, they'd take action? I'm not sure who to send the emails to, but it's sure frustrating to sit and wait (and feel those expensive minutes slipping away) when onboard most cruise ships.

 

Martha

[hondorner]

I don't know aqbout Marina, Regatta or Nautica, but according to the MTN representative (internet provider) aboard Riviera on her maiden voyage, Oceania has purchased the fastest internet paffckage available to any cruise line. MTN is the provider for over 80% of the cruise ships, including nearly all of the major cruise lines.

 

Several comments have already been made about the improved speed on Riviera. If Oceania has not yet contracted for the fastest package on their other ships, I'm sure they are watching Riviera closely, reading comments closely and will act accordingly. However, bear in mind that existing contracts often have to run their course before they can be changed.

 

Certainly, letting them know can't do any harm and can add to the data they're collecting. But, I can assure you, they read every comment on Cruise Critic (often read by the Chairman and CEO), and your message has already been received!

 

Regarding Royal Caribbean and O3B, this is apparently a new provider (in competition with MTN). Promising speeds 4 times faster through satellite technology is ambitious; it remains to be seen how effective it actually is, and I imagine that's why RCCI is introducing it to just one ship. If it works, and if there is enough band width for all satellite users to take advantage of it, and the price is not too high, it won't be long until others adopt it, as well. In the meantime, I imagine Oceania will be watching it just like everyone else.

 

O3B has not yet launched it's first satellite.

[Don P]

if only Riviera cruisers would begin to add their reviews to CruiseCritic. The maiden voyage was over a month ago and I believe there is only one cruise review officially posted. I do know there has been running commentary on the Oceania thread but nothing but the one review thus far. Can't fault FDR and others at Oceania about the slowness of the Internet service unless past cruisers on the Riviera start adding reviews.

 

I don't know aqbout Marina, Regatta or Nautica, but according to the MTN representative (internet provider) aboard Riviera on her maiden voyage, Oceania has purchased the fastest internet paffckage available to any cruise line. MTN is the provider for over 80% of the cruise ships, including nearly all of the major cruise lines.

 

Several comments have already been made about the improved speed on Riviera. If Oceania has not yet contracted for the fastest package on their other ships, I'm sure they are watching Riviera closely, reading comments closely and will act accordingly. However, bear in mind that existing contracts often have to run their course before they can be changed.

 

Certainly, letting them know can't do any harm and can add to the data they're collecting. But, I can assure you, they read every comment on Cruise Critic (often read by the Chairman and CEO), and your message has already been received!

[Paulchili]

Don,

What was your experience and impression about the internet speed on the Riviera (as compared to the other O ships)?

Paul

[Balloon Man]

Just off Marina mid June. Lovely ship but internet speed would have done justice to a senile snail. Regent Voyager was somewhat faster in April, yet I understand both use the same software and satellite system.

 

One alleged computer expert onboard Marina suggested the bandwidth was being deliberately throttled so users would need to buy additional minutes. Can anybody with greater knowledge of the subject than I have (which means nearly everybody) confirm this can be done?

[hondorner]

Just off Marina mid June. Lovely ship but internet speed would have done justice to a senile snail. Regent Voyager was somewhat faster in April, yet I understand both use the same software and satellite system.

 

One alleged computer expert onboard Marina suggested the bandwidth was being deliberately throttled so users would need to buy additional minutes. Can anybody with greater knowledge of the subject than I have (which means nearly everybody) confirm this can be done?

Of course it can be done; consider that you can buy different bandwidths for cable and DSL internet connections at different prices; also most satellite interrnet hookups limit the bandwidth you can use in some fashion.

 

Your question really comes to do whether Oceania is restricting bandwidth, and, if they are for what reason? I know for a fact that in the past, Oceania has NOT purchased the fastest packages. I had a comment on Marina's Maiden Voyage, for example, from Paul, the MTN representative on board: "If Oceania stepped up to a greater bandwidth, it would cost them $50,000 per month." If he was anywhere near accurate (I'm sure actual costs are private contract issues between the cruise line and the provider), that's a big chunk of change, and could as easily suggest why Oceania has not gone to a bigger package any more than I'm willing to up the next step in my DSL service.

 

But, his suggestion implies that Oceania deliberately chooses a lower package in order to force guests to use more minutes and thus, by implication, make more money for the cruise line. Frankly, I don't find this credible. Internet revenues are small change to a cruise line. Sure, the bean counters want to try to cover costs, but I seriously doubt they consider it a profit item of any serious merit.

 

Contrast that notion with what they willingly spend on bedding and linens, and their food budgets, and things like free soft drinks, and you'll probably come to the same conclusion -- Oceania is NOT one of the nickel-diming, money grubbing cruise lines that would deliberatel;y choke the bandwidth to force folks to use a few extra minutes.

[hondorner]

Don,

What was your experience and impression about the internet speed on the Riviera (as compared to the other O ships)?

Paul

Paul, during the voyage I reported in some detail including examples, but the short answer is that speed is faster on Riviera, as fast as anything I experienced on Regent Navigator or Voyager. I was reliably informed that Oceania HAD purchased the most bandwidth available (which translates into faster speeds).

 

However, I also found that speed was VERY much subject to the time of day; it's axiomatic that the more bandwidth that is being used, the slower the service. This is because digital transmissions are by packet, and the more packets being sent, the less room is availlable for each.

 

Think of rush hour traffic. Each car is a packet, and bandwidth is the number of lanes available. Add more lanes and you can accommodate more cars at a given speed; add more cars to any fixed number of lanes, and the traffic slows down. Fiber ooptic cables have an almost in finite number of lanes; satellite service is like a two lane road. Each satellite connection is like a road; there can be lots of roads coming from different places, but think of the satellite itself as like a round-about, with all those roads funneling into and out of it. Thus, the satellite itself can be a chokepoint at peak times.

 

I found service to be fastest around 6 AM and after Midnight (I didn't test it at those times on the same overnight; I actually need some sleep, sometimes :rolleyes:). At those times, the speed rivaled my home connection, which is on a fairly slow DSL line (as rural as we are, I'm lucky to have that; they don't know how to spell "cable TV" in our county ;)).

 

On the christening cruise, when service was complimentary, I used 1034 minutes in 10 days, accessing the internet like I do at home, reading and writing messages on Cruise Critic, uploading photos to DropShots, etc., abd reading all my email, all on my laptop, and my wife's email on her iPad2.

 

The following voyage, the maiden, when I was paying for my own minutes, I bought a 200 minute package for $150 (using onboard credit). I read and responded to my own email, read some of the threads on Cruise Critic, composed replies to CC in a Word Processor and cut and pasted them into CC, did the same for email responses, and used 20 minutes trying to download my wife's emails onto her iPad. I gave up on the iPad; it downloaded the subject lines but none of the email content in 20 minutes. It's possible I had the wrong settings.

 

But, in the end I had something like 37 minutes left to blow -- I went on CC and fooled around for 32 of them until dinner time, then shut down and wasted 5 of them.

 

I consider that to be entirely acceptable.

[PaulMCO]

Paul, during the voyage I reported in some detail including examples, but the short answer is that speed is faster on Riviera, as fast as anything I experienced on Regent Navigator or Voyager. I was reliably informed that Oceania HAD purchased the most bandwidth available (which translates into faster speeds).

 

However, I also found that speed was VERY much subject to the time of day; it's axiomatic that the more bandwidth that is being used, the slower the service. This is because digital transmissions are by packet, and the more packets being sent, the less room is availlable for each.

 

Think of rush hour traffic. Each car is a packet, and bandwidth is the number of lanes available. Add more lanes and you can accommodate more cars at a given speed; add more cars to any fixed number of lanes, and the traffic slows down. Fiber ooptic cables have an almost in finite number of lanes; satellite service is like a two lane road. Each satellite connection is like a road; there can be lots of roads coming from different places, but think of the satellite itself as like a round-about, with all those roads funneling into and out of it. Thus, the satellite itself can be a chokepoint at peak times.

 

I found service to be fastest around 6 AM and after Midnight (I didn't test it at those times on the same overnight; I actually need some sleep, sometimes :rolleyes:). At those times, the speed rivaled my home connection, which is on a fairly slow DSL line (as rural as we are, I'm lucky to have that; they don't know how to spell "cable TV" in our county ;)).

 

On the christening cruise, when service was complimentary, I used 1034 minutes in 10 days, accessing the internet like I do at home, reading and writing messages on Cruise Critic, uploading photos to DropShots, etc., abd reading all my email, all on my laptop, and my wife's email on her iPad2.

 

The following voyage, the maiden, when I was paying for my own minutes, I bought a 200 minute package for $150 (using onboard credit). I read and responded to my own email, read some of the threads on Cruise Critic, composed replies to CC in a Word Processor and cut and pasted them into CC, did the same for email responses, and used 20 minutes trying to download my wife's emails onto her iPad. I gave up on the iPad; it downloaded the subject lines but none of the email content in 20 minutes. It's possible I had the wrong settings.

 

But, in the end I had something like 37 minutes left to blow -- I went on CC and fooled around for 32 of them until dinner time, then shut down and wasted 5 of them.

 

I consider that to be entirely acceptable.

 

Nice analogy --

 

Add to that that Riviera/Marina are larger ships with more passengers and you have more traffic. Also the "public" internet shares bandwidth with the ships services data (yes the ship uses data for all of the transactions and services with Miami) and of course the Crew Internet system. Again more crew -- more data use.

[Earl Rosebery]

Recently back from Nautica from BCN to CPN.

 

Internet speed is slow. Somewhere around 1-2 mbps Typical home high speed is 5-10

 

The satellite excuse is phoney. Consider world cup TV from Poland or golf from China. You guessed it It comes by satellite. Same for all telephone calls.

 

That being said, the internet service was fast enough for us to hold a real time video call with our relatives in NYC via FaceTime. Skype would probably be as good.

 

To avoid paying for unnecessary time, do your reading and work offline. Ie if you read a newspaper, refresh the contents, then read it later. Same for e-mails.

 

Save your time intensive work for the free wifi hot spots available everywhere. i.e. many ports (look for the crew calling home), many cafes (buy a coffee and a croissant) We used 100 minutes on board in 2 weeks and called NYC on FaceTime about every 2-3 days.

[hondorner]

...The satellite excuse is phoney. Consider world cup TV from Poland or golf from China. You guessed it It comes by satellite. Same for all telephone calls...

Internet by satellite works differently than TV. TV sends one signal up per channel and back down again to receivers; internet sends millions of packets up and works in two directions. I believe phone calls are different satellites. It's not an "excuse", and it's not phoney.

[Kkamlani]

Internet by satellite works differently than TV. TV sends one signal up per channel and back down again to receivers; internet sends millions of packets up and works in two directions. I believe phone calls are different satellites. It's not an "excuse", and it's not phoney.

 

You are absolutey correct that internet at sea is very different than TV, land based internet and internet technology used on airplanes. That being said, by early next week we will have completed an Internet upgrade across the entire fleet. Based on guest feedback, we increased bandwidth by as much as 300% which will result in higher processing speeds. While I would not recommend streaming video at sea, our guests should see a material improvement on the Internet.

Kunal S. Kamlani

[Benita]

Nice analogy --

 

Add to that that Riviera/Marina are larger ships with more passengers and you have more traffic. Also the "public" internet shares bandwidth with the ships services data (yes the ship uses data for all of the transactions and services with Miami) and of course the Crew Internet system. Again more crew -- more data use.

 

I often sail the really large ships (Freedom Class on RCCL, with 3500 passengers) and the internet speed is usually excellent. Of course, that means sailing on an RCCL ship and I much rather give up the internet as I do on Oceania ships and stay with Oceania, but certainly, there has to be a happy medium. Reading the post just above mine from the president (I think) of Oceania, tells me there is.

[candbgirl]

I got off the Regatta last Monday and I really have NO complaints about the internet. The service was as good as some other ships I've sailed and better than some. I never had a problem signing in and accessing my email accounts. There were only couple of times that the Oceania @sea room was busy and even then I experienced no problems at all and I never heard anyone complain about the service.

[Mura]

I will be on Regatta in 6 weeks and look forward to better internet speed. But if I don't have it, I won't be exasperated. Yes, I've always wanted faster speed. But that isn't a priority with me. If I really must communicate with people, I'll go into an internet cafe. I have found faster service on NCL -- but the other aspects of NCL make me not want to return!

 

On the QE2 I didn't use internet at all since they didn't provide packages the way O does. By that I mean it was $.99 per minute no matter how many minutes you used. (I'm going back to 2003 and 2004 since that's the last time we sailed with Cunard.)

 

When I'm on board I limit my internet access. If I was on the internet as much as I am at home, I wouldn't have any time to visit the ports!

 

I bring my laptop with me not for the internet so much as for editing my photos and doing my trip diary.

 

Mura

[hondorner]

You are absolutey correct that internet at sea is very different than TV, land based internet and internet technology used on airplanes. That being said, by early next week we will have completed an Internet upgrade across the entire fleet. Based on guest feedback, we increased bandwidth by as much as 300% which will result in higher processing speeds. While I would not recommend streaming video at sea, our guests should see a material improvement on the Internet.

Kunal S. Kamlani

That's great news, Kunal!

 

Back in post number 2 on this thread, I said, "Certainly, letting them know can't do any harm and can add to the data they're collecting. But, I can assure you, they read every comment on Cruise Critic (often read by the Chairman and CEO), and your message has already been received!"

 

Now I have to add the President of Oceania to the list of those who read -- and respond! (I already know dozens of ships' staff, from Captains and General Managers to Food and Beverage Managers and others who read Cruise Critic to see how they're doing, plus many from headquarters, most travel agents and often the top brass here at Cruise Critic -- some day it would be fun to have a thread where they could all say "Hi" You would be amazed.).

[Wendy The Wanderer]

That's good news. Now if only they'd lower the package prices. Internet is so intrinsic to our lives now, it should be getting cheaper onboard, if not included.

[Paulchili]

Now I have to add the President of Oceania to the list of those who read -- and respond! (I already know dozens of ships' staff, from Captains and General Managers to Food and Beverage Managers and others who read Cruise Critic to see how they're doing, plus many from headquarters, most travel agents and often the top brass here at Cruise Critic -- some day it would be fun to have a thread where they could all say "Hi" You would be amazed.).

 

So then, all of us here on CC are "celebrities"? :D

Seriously though, Mr Kamlani, thank you for this piece of good news.

Internet is not THE reason we cruise on Oceania but in today's world it is a very important part of many peoples' world (including mine).

[Balloon Man]

Don: Mr. Kamlani's intervention hopefully makes my question to you irrelevant, but do your posts suggest that Oceania is paying (perhaps) $50,000 per month more for the service they use on Riviera than the one provided on Marina? I haven't experienced the service on Riviera but stand by my "senile snail" comment in respect of the speed of e-mail on Marina. Alan.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

It doesn't sound credible to me that Oceania would "throttle" bandwidth to force passengers to spend more money on minutes. But nor is it credible that fixing the bandwith problems (like they seem to have done on Riviera) would cost $50K a month.

 

I think that both Oceania and Regent should just start making internet freely-available. It almost is on Regent, considering that everybody gets it after 21 days onboard. I wonder what you Oceania folks would think about fares going up a tiny bit to cover this?

[JimandStan]

I wonder what you Oceania folks would think about fares going up a tiny bit to cover this?

 

I hate to be the voice of reason, but what they really need to do is to raise the price dramatically, so that people will think twice about using the internet unless they REALLY need it.

 

Then, those who are willing (or able) to pay for it will get reasonably prompt and reliable service.

 

At some point, the marketplace decrees that availability will catch up and prices will stabilize, but until then, if your concerns are not pressing enough to pay for it, PLEASE stay off of it.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

I hate to be the voice of reason, but what they really need to do is to raise the price dramatically, so that people will think twice about using the internet unless they REALLY need it.

 

Then, those who are willing (or able) to pay for it will get reasonably prompt and reliable service.

 

At some point, the marketplace decrees that availability will catch up and prices will stabilize, but until then, if your concerns are not pressing enough to pay for it, PLEASE stay off of it.

 

So you're saying that technology doesn't exist to give people fast, reliable internet service on cruise ships, eh? Okay, well maybe that's true.

 

But the days are past when the internet is only for emergencies--with people only checking their email occasionally to find out if there are crises at hom. Most of us, perhaps especially CCers and our ilk, spend large amounts of time online, and want to be connected whenever we like while we're on vacation.

[Benita]

I hate to be the voice of reason, but what they really need to do is to raise the price dramatically, so that people will think twice about using the internet unless they REALLY need it.

 

Then, those who are willing (or able) to pay for it will get reasonably prompt and reliable service.

 

At some point, the marketplace decrees that availability will catch up and prices will stabilize, but until then, if your concerns are not pressing enough to pay for it, PLEASE stay off of it.

 

Actually, you get fast, reliable internet service on other lines for a reasonable price. We sail Oceania because we like the itinerary and food, but asking for something as reasonable as a well priced internet package with a service that works is not above and beyond. I have to laugh, because we all had the same discussions a few years ago, substituting the word refrigerator for internet, and a similar discussion just a few posts ago, substituting the phrase lounge chairs on extended balconies for internet. Give us an inch and we want a mile - LOL. Internet access, in most of our humble opinions is still in the inch catagory, and from the response of the president of the company, something about which Oceania agrees.

[Don P]

There are many folks who have elderly parents at home or on occasion a relative in poor health. Recommending that Internet fees be raised to allow more bandwidth availability because then only those who could afford it would use it is a bit harsh. I'm not seeing the voice of reason here. They simply need to be competitive and have current technology capability. They shouldn't "give it away" nor should they gouge their customers. As has been suggested by others, go to bed a bit later or get up earlier and use it during the less congested hours.

 

 

I hate to be the voice of reason, but what they really need to do is to raise the price dramatically, so that people will think twice about using the internet unless they REALLY need it.

 

Then, those who are willing (or able) to pay for it will get reasonably prompt and reliable service.

 

At some point, the marketplace decrees that availability will catch up and prices will stabilize, but until then, if your concerns are not pressing enough to pay for it, PLEASE stay off of it.

[aZ4me]

I hate to be the voice of reason, but what they really need to do is to raise the price dramatically, so that people will think twice about using the internet unless they REALLY need it.

 

Then, those who are willing (or able) to pay for it will get reasonably prompt and reliable service.

 

At some point, the marketplace decrees that availability will catch up and prices will stabilize, but until then, if your concerns are not pressing enough to pay for it, PLEASE stay off of it.

 

J&S, I have thoroughly enjoyed reading your posts, but this is the first time I have to disagree with your sentiment.

 

I do not believe that asking for reasonable Internet rates is an unreasonable thing.

 

Since folks are already paying premium prices to connect while at sea, I think it's safe to think that they are already giving thought to how they use those high-priced minutes.

 

I do not mind paying for the luxury of having Internet access while on a cruise. I did mind paying for endless minutes of waiting, waiting, waiting for connections...knowing full well that the minutes I paid for were slipping away with nothing to show for them.

 

While on board Marina last year, I chose to use my minutes late at night, even setting the alarm clock so I could Skype those precious grandkids. Was it worth the money I spent? You betcha. Would I have preferred being able to spend some of those dollars in the gift shop on board or in ports? Of course. But, for me the choice was clear. Pay the price and keep in touch with those who matter the most to me.

 

Not sure that "those who are willing to pay" for even more expensive connections had any more important business than I had using the Internet. Just saying..... :)

[Benita]

I hate to be the voice of reason, but what they really need to do is to raise the price dramatically, so that people will think twice about using the internet unless they REALLY need it.

 

Then, those who are willing (or able) to pay for it will get reasonably prompt and reliable service.

 

At some point, the marketplace decrees that availability will catch up and prices will stabilize, but until then, if your concerns are not pressing enough to pay for it, PLEASE stay off of it.

 

It took me a moment, as the sarcasm was subtle, but I realize this post was a joke. Sorry for taking you seriously in my first reply.