Shame on HAL

[josie724]

They were not together, the first one in the MDR, after I wish him a good vacation in the Bahamas during dry dock, said it won't be a vacation since they will be working for no salaries during these two weeks.

 

The other one, a cabin steward said there would be 700 workers on board that they have to take care of, without being paid and mentionned that only HAL is doing this, now I know its not very professional from them to talk to customers about their problems but it might comes from frustration or to gain a bigger tip I don't know...so this comes from two different people, from two different services I have no doubt that there is some truth to that and I think it is a sad situation.

 

Sorry if I disturb a few cheerleaders.

 

Yes you are right and we're all wrong, none of the information here could be true, only what you were told is fact. :rolleyes:

 

Oh well....

 

RAH RAH SIS BOOM BAH GO TEAM GO :p

[jtl513]

Sorry if I disturb a few cheerleaders.

I guess you aren't aware that Copper10-8 is a HAL Security Officer, and knows whereof he speaks. You were either being conned by the stewards who told you this, or you misunderstood what they meant when they said they wouldn't be getting the Hotel Service Charge money. :p

[serendipity1499]

Just disembark from Prinsendam (TATL from Civitavecchia) heard from 2 different steward that during the drydock in the Bahamas that they have to work for free during these two weeks.

 

There will be 700 workers that will stay on board and they will have to take care of them for room and board only...that is close to slavery.:mad:

 

Shame on you for spreading a rumor without checking the facts! :mad:

Crew members belong to a union & their contract is spelled out very clearly..When no Psgrs are on board HAL has to pay them their base salary which is in the contract... Each position on the ship is paid according to the industry rates..

Suggest you read up on crew contracts, which are posted on-line..You also might want to read the following article by Joyce Gleeson-Adamidis who was a cruise ship staff member as well as the wife of a Celebrity Captain..

http://www.cruisecritic.com/articles.cfm?ID=261

Many in the crew love to talk to gullible Psgrs who often spread these little untruths, without checking them out..Of course the crew knows these rumors will generate an increase in tips..I addition to their room, board & medical, the following site will give you an idea about crew salaries: http://www.cruiseshipjob.net/joblistings/

Betty

[josie724]

I guess you aren't aware that Copper10-8 is a HAL Security Officer, and knows whereof he speaks. You were either being conned by the stewards who told you this, or you misunderstood when they meant they wouldn't be getting the Hotel Service Charge money. :p

 

Thank you John for pointing that out, I wanted to but I wasn't 100% certain if John (Cooper) worked for HAL or another line.

[kazu]

They were not together, the first one in the MDR, after I wish him a good vacation in the Bahamas during dry dock, said it won't be a vacation since they will be working for no salaries during these two weeks.

 

The other one, a cabin steward said there would be 700 workers on board that they have to take care of, without being paid and mentionned that only HAL is doing this, now I know its not very professional from them to talk to customers about their problems but it might comes from frustration or to gain a bigger tip I don't know...so this comes from two different people, from two different services I have no doubt that there is some truth to that and I think it is a sad situation.

 

Sorry if I disturb a few cheerleaders.

 

You're not upsetting any cheerleaders - many of us tip as we love their service and feel for them.

HOWEVER, what Copper John says makes perfect sense - have you ever looked at DBA's blog? there are lots of pics of crew members having fun. Yes, they work hard but they also have fun.

They are not slaves - better look at home if you are worried and how some resorts pay their university students;)

In any case, Copper John is on the ships - he knows this stuff and I also talked to a crew member who would be back on the Prinsendam for her dry dock. He was looking forward to it (not the work necessarily) but he really liked what was going to happen with the ship (crossing my fingers he was right). He made no complaints to me about pay and there were plenty of opportunities.

[vicocala]

I would find it very offensive if I had crew members hitting me up for tips. I would report it to the hotman. It's bad enough that the lines are sticking their hands out without the crew doing it too.

 

I also think some are being a bit harsh with the OP, they are just reporting what was told them. Why would they have an ulterior motive?

[Tampa Girl]

I would find it very offensive if I had crew members hitting me up for tips. I would report it to the hotman. It's bad enough that the lines are sticking their hands out without the crew doing it too.

 

I also think some are being a bit harsh with the OP, they are just reporting what was told them. Why would they have an ulterior motive?

 

 

No one is accusing OP of lying. We accept that she was told as she reported. We are just pointing out that it is unwise to accept something at face value and then make accusations if one doesn't have all the info.

[vicocala]

No one is accusing OP of lying. We accept that she was told as she reported. We are just pointing out that it is unwise to accept something at face value and then make accusations if one doesn't have all the info.

 

Not to argue at all, but how do you know when you don't have all the info? The OP's later comments were defensive after some of the things said.

[innlady1]

Well, all I know is that I would trust what Copper John says...his word can be "taken to the bank". He's been on the board a very long time...when he and his "child bride" sailed as a passenger (they still do when he's not working).

Two or three years ago (maybe more...the way time flies) he became a Security Officer for HAL...in fact he was the SO on our Maasdam cruise in January.

Bottom line: He knows what he is talking about.

[vicocala]

But, you and I know that. The OP????

 

Anyways I am done.

[Tampa Girl]

Not to argue at all, but how do you know when you don't have all the info? The OP's later comments were defensive after some of the things said.

 

 

I think that common sense should tell a person that until they have researched the allegations, that one doesn't have all the info. In my field (law), we would classify such statements as were made by the staff as "self serving" and inadmissible. However, the problem in this case was that accusations were being made against the cruise line without investigating whether the statements were actually true. It appears that there may have been some confusion between "salary" and "tips", with the stewards meaning tips and the OP thinking they were being paid nothing. This is why repeating what someone has told you without checking it out can be dangerous. And, of course, we are all guilty of this.

[KirkNC]

I'm sure they simply meant they would not be getting any tips during that time. How quickly things get taken out of context:rolleyes: Thanks for clarifying, Copper.

 

Yes thanks for the clarification.

[PeaceLoveCruise]

I would find it very offensive if I had crew members hitting me up for tips. I would report it to the hotman. It's bad enough that the lines are sticking their hands out without the crew doing it too.

 

I also think some are being a bit harsh with the OP, they are just reporting what was told them. Why would they have an ulterior motive?

 

I have to agree. I felt a little like people were ganging up on OP.

 

I appreciate honest posts and I appreciate clarifying posts. I don't appreciate snarky or mean posts.

[serendipity1499]

Not to argue at all, but how do you know when you don't have all the info? The OP's later comments were defensive after some of the things said.

 

Hey Vic..The OP's title of her tread is:

"SHAME ON HAL"..And her last words of her post were .."That is close to slavery" with a :mad: sign..IMO that is slanderous!!

It the OP had started a thread stating she had heard that the crew is not paid their salary during dry dock, & expressed her dismay about it, perhaps some of us would not have our hackles up & post angry answers!

IMO it's slanderous & unconscionable to post something like this without checking out facts..

I wonder how they would feel if they hired a worker & someone posted something which is meant to be inflammatory like this on a public forum such as Face book without checking out the facts..

Betty

[richwmn]

I deal with tipped employees from the customer side quite a bit, and some of them work harder on their "sob story" than they do on their job.

 

I am not saying that all of the stories are false. Just that some people try to use them to increase their tips by making the customer feel bad.

 

Usually when management finds out they are doing this, they find themselves without a job.

[ASIWISH]

I would be more tempted to believe that one crew member "might" have told that lie.... but, two two crew members on two seperate occasions? No way...

 

I'm all for giving the benefit of the doubt, but not on this one....

 

I think sometimes we hear what we want to hear... The slave comment was WAY out of line, even for this cheerleader!

[santa fe]

I would be more tempted to believe that one crew member "might" have told that lie.... but, two two crew members on two seperate occasions? No way...

 

I'm all for giving the benefit of the doubt, but not on this one....

 

I think sometimes we hear what we want to hear... The slave comment was WAY out of line, even for this cheerleader!

 

It's after the second comment that I figure that there might be some truth to the story.

 

I am a HAL fan, I "did not hear what I want to hear" it was very clear, and I maintain that working without pay (if that is the case) equal to slavery.

[ASIWISH]

It's after the second comment that I figure that there might be some truth to the story.

 

I am a HAL fan, I "did not hear what I want to hear" it was very clear, and I maintain that working without pay (if that is the case) equal to slavery.

 

I just don't understand why you keep throwing around the slavery term, even now that you know it's not true...

 

This might be a good time to throw in a "thanks for clearing up the misunderstanding, John. I stand corrected."

 

I am not intending to beat up on the OP, just trying to clear up some obviosuly flawed information.

[kazu]

It's after the second comment that I figure that there might be some truth to the story.

 

I am a HAL fan, I "did not hear what I want to hear" it was very clear, and I maintain that working without pay (if that is the case) equal to slavery.

 

No arguments from me, but I don't think it is true. The facts were before you. Worried about slavery?? go take a look at what some of the resorts pay University students - by the time they deduct their room and board - they make little money - they truly do rely on tips.

 

And that's here in North America - not some contract signed in a far off country:eek:

 

I don't dispute what you heard (btw did you tip more after hearing the sad story?) but I do believe Copper John and the facts that are accessible easily on websites.

 

I was on this ship and did speak to crew who would be gone and back in time for the drydock - I heard no complaints.

 

In any case, we can agree to disagree - smooth seas

[ASIWISH]

In any case, we can agree to disagree - smooth seas

Better said... I wish I chose your words, Kazu.

 

Sorry, santa fe.

 

I just hate to hear the "slavery" comments about cruise ship employees. It couldn't be further from the truth, and takes away from the very serious issue of slavery that occurs today around the world.

[santa fe]

Better said... I wish I chose your words, Kazu.

 

Sorry, santa fe.

 

I just hate to hear the "slavery" comments about cruise ship employees. It couldn't be further from the truth, and takes away from the very serious issue of slavery that occurs today around the world.

 

I agree with you that slavery is a very serious issue and I should have chosen another word to describe what I consider an abusive behaviour, sorry about that.

 

@ Kazu, the comments were made after I had given them an envelope...and I did not re-opened them...

[jtl513]

... what I consider an abusive behaviour, ..

It does not matter what you think it is - if they felt "abused" by the system they would not come back once their first contract was over.

[innlady1]

I just don't understand why you keep throwing around the slavery term, even now that you know it's not true...

 

This might be a good time to throw in a "thanks for clearing up the misunderstanding, John. I stand corrected."

 

I am not intending to beat up on the OP, just trying to clear up some obviosuly flawed information.

 

Good post, Kevin. All the way around.

[sunviking90]

Isn't it also possible that both of these crew members were experiencing their first drydock and had misinterpreted info from other crew. They may have been told they don't get paid - meaning tips.

[innlady1]

It would be no more inappropriate than a reply from DBA was - he simply gave some facts - and the fact that some might try to get more tips is nothing new in the world and is not limited to cruise ships.

 

I appreciated his reply but that's just me;)

 

So do I.