Treveling with a Foster Child

[LasseKjus]

We're only four weeks away from our family's Christmas Cruise and I'm getting nervous about our plans. This isn't the first time we've cruised, but it is the first time with a foster child. Here's our specific situation and why I'm nervous.

 

Our foster child is 17 years old and currently doesn't have an ID, she was placed with us in September, something we had been trying to do for her for nearly a year. We started the process of adding her to the cabin and getting all the paperwork in order. We've been trying on the ID process for months. Her birth certificate doesn't match her social security number, so she can't get an ID. Birth parents finally agreed to amend her birth certificate to change her name and that paperwork has been processed. The original birth certificate had first name as Anne, but SS had it as Anna. She's gone by Anna forever and we got the BC changed to Anna, but getting the BC so she can get the ID seems to be a problem and the state doesn't seem to be in a hurry to do so on our behalf.

 

Second concern is boarding the ship. I talked to HAL representatives and they told me what they thought we'd need and I should contact the state department. The state department is saying that we only need the placement orders and don't need a judge's orders. The parents won't give approval (they already don't like that she's not with them) but I'm worried about needing a judge's orders and being denied boarding at the terminal and it's probably too late to get a judge's orders. All of this may be moot by Christmas and she'd have to go to respite for a week, which I'd absolutely hate because we'd lose just about any progress we've gained with her.

 

So my concerns are getting her the ID in time, since the state hasn't been in a hurry to get her birth certificate so we can get the ID. The change has been made more than a month ago and they've been dragging their feet to get the certificate.

 

My other concern is not having a judge's order at this point.

 

We've cruised with kids that aren't ours plenty of times. This is our 19th cruise and six of those have been with kids we've brought along that aren't ours. Only once were we asked for all the special paperwork needed when taking on a child that isn't your own. Once however, when we weren't traveling with another child we were given trouble at the terminal upon check in. My oldest daughter was assigned to her grandparents room and we all checked in together. They were giving us trouble because we didn't have any notarized authorized paperwork saying she could travel with them. We were standing right next to her, also boarding the ship, just in a different room. That took a half hour to sort out and it was our own kid. If that happens, we're going to have to leave her behind. Course, if we don't get the ID, we can't get her there in the first place.

 

Any help/advice would be helpful in this situation. We're also planning on going on a cruise in March, which would be just days prior to her 18th birthday, but we'll have all the paperwork needed by then if this one goes off without a hitch.

 

Thanks!

[jaguarstyper]

If its just days before her 18th birthday, why not just wait until after her 18th birthday and avoid many of the issues. She still will need to procure some form of ID to leave the country and come back. It sounds to me like you have way too many ducks out of the row. I'd suggest getting it all sorted before even thinking about traveling.

[LasseKjus]

jaguarstyper Your response wasn't helpful. You only responded to the March cruise, which we'll have everything sorted out by then. And then, you didn't give a helpful response. We aren't waiting because we didn't schedule when Easter, and subsequently, Spring Break was going to be this year. My biggest concern is the cruise in less than a month and my concern is that, despite what the state and the state department tells me, I'm going to be denied boarding for some reason. I wasn't looking for the "don't bother with doing it because there are too many hassles for this person you promised to be part of your family at a time when they probably need a family--that they don't really have--the most" response.

[sail7seas]

This is a very complicated matter and the only real advise that is accurate and truthful is if she does not have proper ID, there is NO chance she will be permitted on the ship.

 

I wouldn't begin to guess how you obtain that ID but were if me and with as little knowledge as I have on the subject, I would start by contacting my Congressman and/or Senator. Their offices are extremely competent and knowledgeable in these issues.

 

I hope it works out quickly and well and you all get to enjoy a great cruise but do not plan to fight it out at the dock. That will not work. Just about every cruise, the ship leaves without someone aboard who had hoped to board but they did not have the proper traveling documents.

 

[pms4104]

Even if you are able to get proper ID ... I would be concerned about actual permission from the courts to take your foster child out of the country. If anything were to happen ...

[Hawaiidan]

Your generous and kind offer and understant the impact on everyone including your family and the child at being denied boarding. Could be rather traumatic for all. With 30 days to go your chances of getting approval are, in my honest opinion, very remote.

I would non have extended myself and made promises untill I had everything necessary..BEFORE I made a move or said a word.

 

With many other vacation options not needing these documents, I would think seriously of another form of recreation at this time.

 

This has tradgedy written all over it and big red flags waving with spotlights on them.

 

The cruise line will proably refund you given the situation.

[LasseKjus]

The ID piece I'm aware of and is my first biggest hurdle, which looking back on has been a two month process trying to get a copy of the corrected birth certificate. If I can't get an ID for her, she can't get on the plane. No questions and she has to go to respite care.

 

sail7seas, that's what I'm worried about, fighting it out at the terminal. Assuming we can get her ID in a timely matter (which if we get her BC this week, we should be able to), I've contacted the cruise line, her caseworker and the state department, neither of which say a judges' order is necessary, just her placement orders. But you know how some people can be at their jobs. They might demand a court order, even though I have an e-mail from the state department and the state saying otherwise. I doubt it will be a problem. I've rarely been asked for documentation for the other friends of my daughter's we've brought along, but if this is the one time, it could ruin the whole holiday for everyone.

[jaguarstyper]

Well I'm sorry my response didn't help you. But, as Sail7seas points out, without proper documentation, you will not be cruising. That, is a fact. Its probably not what you want to hear, therefore your writing it off as not being helpful. It doesn't really matter what you have promised this person. The harsh reality is going to overrule any of those promises. It would have been better if you had it all sorted out before promises were made.

[maxandmolly]

Even if you are able to get proper ID ... I would be concerned about actual permission from the courts to take your foster child out of the country. If anything were to happen ...

 

As a former child welfare case manager-how on earth could a case manager tell you can take a child out of the country, against her parent's wishesno less, without a court order?!? We couldn't even send ours out of state without a court order. I don't care what they're telling you, whatever happens with tge ID, INSIST on a court order if you think you can pull off the rest of it to get on the plane.

[peaches from georgia]

Do you have 'cancel for any reason' travel insurance for this cruise? Because of all the ID issues which may or may not be solved in time and because of the importance of getting your life with this child off to a good start without any further trauma for her, I would consider cancelling and going on a family land vacation this special Christmas. Sending her to respite care if the ID doesn't come through sounds like worst possible scenario for her. And if you did get her on the plane but she couldn't board the ship, what do you do then?

 

As you say, problems should be solved by March when you all can cruise together.

[LasseKjus]

The fact of the matter is that the case worker encouraged our bringing her from the beginning and said it wouldn't be an issue (not referencing the ID part however). The cruise line said check with the state department. The state department said all we needed was placement orders, which we have. Her caseworker said all we needed was placement orders which we have. The ID thing should have been simpler, but it's not and that's not the crux of my concern. I realize if we don't have the ID, she's not going, but that should be the easy part. The thing I'm concerned with is now not having a judge's order, which WE WERE TOLD BY MULTIPLE ENTITIES that we didn't need one. We had plenty of time to get one, but now I'm in a little bit of travel panic/anxiety mode over not having one and getting one is going to be tough at this point, and not something her case worker is going to to since she told us we didn't need it.

[sail7seas]

The ID piece I'm aware of and is my first biggest hurdle, which looking back on has been a two month process trying to get a copy of the corrected birth certificate. If I can't get an ID for her, she can't get on the plane. No questions and she has to go to respite care.

 

sail7seas, that's what I'm worried about, fighting it out at the terminal. Assuming we can get her ID in a timely matter (which if we get her BC this week, we should be able to), I've contacted the cruise line, her caseworker and the state department, neither of which say a judges' order is necessary, just her placement orders. But you know how some people can be at their jobs. They might demand a court order, even though I have an e-mail from the state department and the state saying otherwise. I doubt it will be a problem. I've rarely been asked for documentation for the other friends of my daughter's we've brought along, but if this is the one time, it could ruin the whole holiday for everyone.

 

 

 

 

That is exactly what you should be concerned about.

It is the person standing at the computer with whom you have to transact all boarding 'business' who ultimately can and will deny boarding. They do everything they can to assist including accepting faxes of certain papers from some sources but in the end, either you are able to supply what documents they require or not.

 

You absolutely should be focusing on finding a way to get a court authorization to remove Anna from the country. If you can accomplish that, it would be good. Try speaking with your Senator or Congressman's Office. They are our representatives to our Government. Ask for their help IMO

[lvz2cruz]

We have done foster care and respite care through a private agency and there are many loopholes but we have taken kids out of state several times.

We only had verbal permission from the case worker which kind of worried me so I would send an email verifying hotel address and itinerary as well as phone numbers so we had something on paper showing they knew where we were taking kids.

For any officials that asked we had the release authorizing emergency care for a minor.

I know though to cruise even divorced parents need notarized approval from spouse before taking a minor aboard, so you need more than ID to prove you have permission to have this child in your custody. Your case worker or social worker should be able to provide this.

I would find out from HAL now what is needed to bring her. I would actually call a few times to make sure the responses are the same.

As far as the parents not wanting her to go, they lost the right to make that call. Too often birth parents are allowed too many goofs and last chances before losing custody.

Hope this works for you, but hey, we've done respite care and we love these kids too.:)

[pms4104]

You might want to review the comments in this now-archived thread ... http://boards.cruisecritic.com/archive/index.php/t-1208698.html

[alwaysfrantic]

Do you have the birth certificate? If she is under 18 no photo is is required to fly. If its a closed loop cruise from a US port then the BC may be sufficient

[maxandmolly]

We have done foster care and respite care through a private agency and there are many loopholes but we have taken kids out of state several times.

We only had verbal permission from the case worker which kind of worried me so I would send an email verifying hotel address and itinerary as well as phone numbers so we had something on paper showing they knew where we were taking kids.

For any officials that asked we had the release authorizing emergency care for a minor.

I know though to cruise even divorced parents need notarized approval from spouse before taking a minor aboard, so you need more than ID to prove you have permission to have this child in your custody. Your case worker or social worker should be able to provide this.

I would find out from HAL now what is needed to bring her. I would actually call a few times to make sure the responses are the same.

As far as the parents not wanting her to go, they lost the right to make that call. Too often birth parents are allowed too many goofs and last chances before losing custody.

Hope this works for you, but hey, we've done respite care and we love these kids too.:)

Just because parents have lost custody does mean their parental rights have been terminated. They still have a say in what happens to their children. Thus the concern for, and in my state, need for, a specific court order.

[pms4104]

Do you have the birth certificate? If she is under 18 no photo is is required to fly. If its a closed loop cruise from a US port then the BC may be sufficient

Actually, the age for which no photo ID is required may be 16 not 18

[Tampa Girl]

OP - why are you posing this question to a Cruise Critic board? You should be immediately contacting an attorney who is familiar with dependency cases. As an attorney who practiced in juvenile court, I would suggest that you immediately hire an attorney to obtain a stipulated (by the State caseworker) to quickly obtain the necessary order. It should not require a hearing but, if so, an expedited hearing might be able to be obtained. However, I tend to agree with the caseworker that you have a placement order, and depending on the parameters of that order, it may well be sufficient.

 

Good luck!

[LasseKjus]

TampaGirl.... Posting this message to a cruise critic board just to get responses. This isn't the only avenue of processing we've done to get this to work.

 

pms4101... I thought the same. But for the cruise ship boarding, a 16-17 year old needs a photo ID, not just the BC.

 

alwaysfrantic ... I have a birth certificate, but not the corrected birth certificate.

 

Got it re-iterated today from the case worker and the state department that I only need the placement order and a notarized letter from the state agency saying she can go on this trip and not a court order. Still working on the ID piece.

[LADYLAYLA]

I hope you can get this worked out and your cruise goes off without a hitch!

[alwaysfrantic]

Actually, the age for which no photo ID is required may be 16 not 18

 

The age for TSA flight ID is definitely 18. She can fly as a 16 year old without an ID.

 

Is the cruise booked in the name that is on the birth certificate? The problem is Anne v Anna? Do the placement orders match the name on birth certificate you have?

[Tampa Girl]

The thing I'm concerned with is now not having a judge's order, which WE WERE TOLD BY MULTIPLE ENTITIES that we didn't need one. We had plenty of time to get one, but now I'm in a little bit of travel panic/anxiety mode over not having one and getting one is going to be tough at this point, and not something her case worker is going to to since she told us we didn't need it.

 

 

I apologize if you thought that I was criticizing you for posting your problem on this board. I was merely trying to reassure you that a travel order could be quickly obtained but was probably not even necessary. it appears that your concerns are being resolved, so have a great trip!

[LasseKjus]

Tampagirl ... I didn't take offense to your comments, just was responding to them. The caps were for emphasis, not yelling. I had it re-iterated from the state department and from the state agency yesterday that all we need is a notarized form from the state agency and we are OK. Re-iterated that we don't need a judge's order (therefore won't be getting one). Called passport services and they can get a passport expedited for us if we need it once we have the form from the state services department. Things are looking better, but like I said, I'm worried about the one cruise ship worker who will over-reach. I am going to touch base with HAL one more time to verify all of this, but they initially didn't give me much of a response other than call the state department and the passport services division.

[Tampa Girl]

LasseKjus - All 's well that tends well. In closing, all I can say is: This is one fortunate foster child! Hope you have a delightful cruise.

[ellbelle]

Happy to read that this sounds like it will come together afterall!

 

I hope you will keep us posted on your progress and report how your foster daughter enjoyed the cruise which I assume will be her first cruise.... LUCKY girl!