Fire on Carnival Triumph. No engines, running on emergency generators.

[shof515]

By the time the Triumph was hooked up to be towed it was Tuesday. 250 nautical miles at 5 mph would be a 50 hour tow. Wouldn't that put the time of arrival at noonish Thursday. Sounds entirely right to me. Why would people think it was today?

 

in one of the uscg press releases, they said that with weather and the currents they could try to dock late evening today. However, if its gets dark out then will have to hold off till the morning since they need the daylight for safety reasons

[davids68girl]

Fox News just ran a story that I just laughed through bc of the inaccuracies. No big media outlet seems to want to stick to the facts of the situation because, well, sensationalism sells.

[PrincessKate]

Wow. So many Pro Life Lessons to be learned from this situation and this thread.

 

I'm really concerned about the number of people who are still insisting that there has to be a way to transfer passengers onto another ship. I've been on a rig tender in the Gulf of Mexico (I was scuba diving), and the waves and current are no joke. Only the most steady and physically fit of people should even consider doing something at water level. Being on a life boat even for a short time would be miserable. Transferring off the ship is NOT an option.

 

Another concern for me is that a four-day booze cruise to Cancun/Cozumel should be anyone's idea of a "trip of a lifetime", or that this is an appropriate trip for young children. Given the rock-bottom prices Carnival charges, the only way a trip like this makes economic sense is to cram as many people as possible on board. Of course there's no extra food or another generator. If you're living life so close to the edge that you're 24 hours away from disaster if you don't have diapers, formula, medication, etc., you probably shouldn't leave yourself completely at the mercy of someone else. That's always a bad idea.

 

Finally, while I have every reason to agree that Mobile, Alabama makes the most sense from a logistical standpoint, the fact that 900 people don't have passports completely ruled out any Mexican ports. It is a terrible idea to travel outside of the US without a passport.

 

I know that Carnival makes it seem like this is a cheap, carefree way to travel, and that people hear what they want to hear, but all seasoned travelers know that "stuff happens". This is not a catastrophe, and everyone will be on dry land in 24 hours, but no one should board a cruise ship with some of the unrealistic expectations that I've seen expressed here.

 

Yes, this is my first post, but I've read the entire thread. I'm also a very experienced traveler. The kind of cruise we're talking about here should only be taken with relatively low expectations.

[MrPete]

Here comes the interview on CNN intro'd with "sewage sloshing around the hallways". Wow... If and when the truth comes out, I'm gonna hold CNN accountable for the truth or lack there of and then go back to turning off my TV for another few months.

 

Edit: Father reported "sewage was coming up from the showers" and the daughters had to sleep in the hallways. :eek:

 

... lol and then the interview/segment is suddenly cut off by a commercial. I didn't hear the women confirm what the announcer said about sewage sloshing in the halls unless I missed it. Moar CNN hype and damage control?! Long live Noam Chomsky.

__________

"Never argue with a fool. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience"

I just watched an interview on Fox with a Dr. Leigh Vinocur (sp), an LAU asst Prof and ER physician and natl spokesperson for the American. Legs of emergency physicians, and clearly she is speaking based on the rumors we have all heard, including open bars, Norovirus, ecoli, and why they didn't offload the other people with those sick that were offloaded.

[sjn911]

I am sorry if this is a repeat..we are all posting so fast.

 

It does seem on poor taste to be at the head of a corporation at a Professional basketball game on a potential of so many problems still unresolved situation like this...

 

Miss the good old Trailblazers..a total aside...

 

 

http://blog.al.com/live/2013/02/carnival_cruise_ceo_spotted_tu.html

[declansdad]

Here is an interesting read, along with some good photos:

 

"Boss of Carnival cruise ship adds insult to misery by going to basketball game as 4,000 suffer aboard 'stinking stricken ship' with urine-soaked carpets and sewage in cabins".

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2277914/Carnival-Triumph-CEO-Micky-Arison-takes-basketball-game-thousands-suffer.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

 

____________________________________

 

EDIT: Don't know if this is fact or fiction ....

 

.

 

What would people expect him to do, sail out and board the ship. Stupid story.

[Naomi John]

This! Again, I'm sorry but there's no way people are popping a squat in public areas and letting others watch them do their business.

 

Ever been to Mardi Gras in New Orleans?:eek:

 

No new news I see, all speculation. Hope we get the calm facts soon. Not bothering with the major news.

[dm33]

If they transferred one passenger, they should have been able to transfer all passengers. Carnival is just being cheap.

 

They should have cancelled another cruise, sent the empty ship and transferred everyone. Or cram everyone into the same ship and get everyone back to port ASAP. Anything is better than the reports coming from the ship.

[LSUcajunmom]

there is roughly 1 crewmember for every three passengers on this vessel. Having been on a number of these cruises i cannot imagine that the crew is not working nearly around the clock doing everything they can to keep conditions as sanitary as they can under the circumstances. They are usually obsessed with 'clean'.

 

That said, there have probably been some nasty messes to clean up and a lot of red bio-hazard bags to collect and remove from the hallways. Not a pretty sight, but i am sure the crew is working very hard to keep things as sanitary and comfortable as they can.

 

We shall see in a few hours what things were really like, as opposed to that portrayed by vivid imaginations on cruise critic and cnn.

 

I would bet there were many real humanitarian heroes among both the crew and passengers. We shall see soon.

 

like, like, like!!

[kylenyc]

I just watched an interview on Fox with a Dr. Leigh Vinocur (sp), an LAU asst Prof and ER physician and natl spokesperson for the American. Legs of emergency physicians, and clearly she is speaking based on the rumors we have all heard, including open bars, Norovirus, ecoli, and why they didn't offload the other people with those sick that were offloaded.

Yeah, the Fox interview didn't shed much light or have any direct quotes or interview with family who've heard from passengers other than to repeat what the CG commander said about it being risky to offload passengers at sea. One of the two women on CNN did however say she heard from her husband and daughters who reported sewage backing out of the shower and the poor girls were forced to sleep in the halls because of the smell and a daughter crying and wanting to go home. Poor things. :(

__________

"Never argue with a fool. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience"

[ducklite]

What would people expect him to do, sail out and board the ship. Stupid story.

 

If nothing else it's just bad form.

 

Similar to Condeleeza Rice shopping for $600 dollar shoes while New Orleans was flooding during Katrina. It wasn't her "job" to run FEMA, but the appearance of indifference by the fourth in line for the Presidency to the horrific plight of her fellow citizens during a wide-spread natural disaster was a very negative public image to portray.

[Rasvar]

Here is an interesting read, along with some good photos:

 

"Boss of Carnival cruise ship adds insult to misery by going to basketball game as 4,000 suffer aboard 'stinking stricken ship' with urine-soaked carpets and sewage in cabins".

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2277914/Carnival-Triumph-CEO-Micky-Arison-takes-basketball-game-thousands-suffer.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

 

____________________________________

 

EDIT: Don't know if this is fact or fiction ....

 

.

 

Yeah, he owns the team. Not really unusual for the owner of a basketball team to go to a basketball game. I don't mind ripping him for doing a poor job of making sure the ships are in good shape but this is just silly.

[Boatdrill]

Finally, while I have every reason to agree that Mobile, Alabama makes the most sense from a logistical standpoint, the fact that 900 people don't have passports completely ruled out any Mexican ports. It is a terrible idea to travel outside of the US without a passport.

 

 

Agreed, passports are best, and those who cruise on a passport card are taking a risk.

 

BUT, it's safe to say that if the Coast Guard thought it best for the Triumph to sit down in Progreso for safety reasons, it would have happened.

 

And while Mexico would have been preferred because of location, Progreso doesn't have the infrastructure to handle 3,000 pax disembarking, nor does CCL have the numerous shore side staff in place on site that's required to assist and run such an operation. The pier is miles off shore, and if one large tour bus holds 40 people, how many busses and hours would it take to get everyone transferred ? How many aircraft to fly them out ? Who gets the first flight ? The second ? What a nightmare.

[ducklite]

If they transferred one passenger, they should have been able to transfer all passengers. Carnival is just being cheap.

 

I agree to an extent--I believe there were other options, Carnival didn't want to spend the money on them. I will however defer to the USCG official who said it was too dangerous.

 

They should have cancelled another cruise, sent the empty ship and transferred everyone. Or cram everyone into the same ship and get everyone back to port ASAP. Anything is better than the reports coming from the ship.

 

That would have been a gross violation of maritime law. There wouldn't have been enough life boats and would have created an even more unsafe situation for even more people.

[juiceman]

If they transferred one passenger, they should have been able to transfer all passengers. Carnival is just being cheap.

 

They should have cancelled another cruise, sent the empty ship and transferred everyone. Or cram everyone into the same ship and get everyone back to port ASAP. Anything is better than the reports coming from the ship.

 

Right, that sounds like a good idea, let's inconvience another few thousand people who booked a cruise on another ship. Sorry, it doesn't happen like that. Or, even better let's put one ship at over-capacity, putting the ship over its limit & potentially putting two groups of passengers at risk.

 

Also, if they did that, where would the Triumph's passengers sleep?

[Aquahound]

Care to provide a link that states this? I'm not a fan of transferring cruise passengers from one ship to the other on the open ocean but I truly doubt this is correct.

 

Yes. It's called the Jones act...or PVSA. The scenario was I responding to was suggesting a foreign flagged ship (Carnival Magic) leave a U.S. port, transfer the passengers, then go directly to another U.S. port. By law, that is illegal.

[seavoyager6]

I am STILL HERE!

 

87 tomorrow, survived London Blitz, (East End Dockland ) V1's ( "Doodlebugs") and V2's. Worked in office by day, nursed in hospitals, Air raid shelters by night and manned ambulances carrying wounded service men at weekends. Later drove 3 ton trucks in Womens Royal Air Force, then was a military wife for over 30 years.

 

Will be on Cunard QE in three weeks time, 2014 is still a matter for thought, the spirit is willing but confess body is feeling its age.

 

I am sorry for the passengers on Triumph, sure there are quite a few not behaving well.

 

What caused the problem? I do not think we will ever get the true story, just that the spin doctor tells us, but: -

 

"If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, looks and behaves like a duck , then it is 99% likely to be a duck."

 

Hey Jimsgirl

 

 

Happy B Day

 

See you aboard the magnificent Queen Elizabeth on March 12.

[Emilija]

Ive dealt with hysteria in mass casualty situations

First I would make sure whoever I am traveling with is safe than I would be assisting the elderly or others with limited mobility issues to safety.

Any one injured I would be helping them as well. Thats who I am.

 

 

Well said, good plan!

 

It's unfortunate that some would fight to death (of others) to use the wrong muster station.

 

If only things could be done in an orderly fashion under a stressful situation.

 

Emi

[Aquahound]

Does the ship have to sink for a foreign flagged ship to transfer passengers?

 

 

Come on, Pete. Of course not. The scenario suggested by waldo was to have another cruise ship deny it's passengers and sail out to transfer these people....not a ship already on scene. If the situation is that dire, bad enough to cause the U.S. to give a pass on the law, then there would be other, more suitable choices. If a transfer of 3000+ people to another boat was necessary, CCL would have to contract high capacity, U.S. flagged ferries. Not only would the transfer be much more safe and efficient, but it would also comply with U.S. law.

[ruskatab]

I just saw a commercial for a solar cell phone charger. I bet when the ship gets within range alot of the passengers phones will be dead. I am getting one of these!

[declansdad]

If nothing else it's just bad form.

 

Similar to Condeleeza Rice shopping for $600 dollar shoes while New Orleans was flooding during Katrina. It wasn't her "job" to run FEMA, but the appearance of indifference by the fourth in line for the Presidency to the horrific plight of her fellow citizens during a wide-spread natural disaster was a very negative public image to portray.

 

 

Oh I get that but I still think it is foolish. In this case, isn't he one of the owners of the Heat? Typically owners attend the games.

[WYB!]

But if you would follow the rules and go to your assigned muster station, then EVERYONE would be safe. Don't be the jerk on the Titanic. Just do what you're told. You are NOT the expert in an emergency situation on a cruise ship. The Captain and the crew are. Follow directions and do as you're told. If one person gets out of line, then others follow suite, and then now you have chaos when you need calm and order endangering everyone else on board.

 

I would have agreed with what you wrote, except the Costa Concordia happened.

[PrincessKate]

Agreed, passports are best, and those who cruise on a passport card are taking a risk.

 

BUT, it's safe to say that if the Coast Guard thought it best for the Triumph to sit down in Progreso for safety reasons, it would have happened.

 

And while Mexico would have been preferred because of location, Progreso doesn't have the infrastructure to handle 3,000 pax disembarking, nor does CCL have the numerous shore side staff in place on site that's required to assist and run such an operation. The pier is miles off shore, and if one large tour bus holds 40 people, how many busses and hours would it take to get everyone transferred ? How many aircraft to fly them out ? Who gets the first flight ? The second ? What a nightmare.

 

I agree that if safety were an issue, of course - any port in a storm. But if lack of passports played a role in the planning, as a passport holder, I'd be angry. I'd rather be off the ship in Progreso. At that point, I wouldn't need the cruise line to help me - being independent is always my objective.

[ducklite]

Oh I get that but I still think it is foolish. In this case, isn't he one of the owners of the Heat? Typically owners attend the games.

 

If anyone missed him the speculation would have been that he was hard at work managing the Triumph crisis. I can't see anyone faulting him for missing the game under the circumstances, but they can sure fault him for being there.

[MrPete]

I would have agreed with what you wrote, except the Costa Concordia happened.

 

Exactly. Everyone went to the closest lifeboat. People making their way to THEIR muster station found their lifeboat gone!