There is Something Very Wrong and I Don't Know What it Is........

[kazu]

Hello everyone: I'm back to my beloved Cruise Critic Message board. Haven't been on here since our last cruise last April 2012.

Now our reservation was confirmed onboard the Noordam October 31st out of Rome for the TA cruise. Firstly, we have never sailed on the Noordam before. Secondly, what rules have changed with regard to bringing wine onboard? I haven't been reading the posts but just saw something about this now.

Will have to start my research for Rome, etc. Not sure where to stay yet as we fly into Rome 5 days in advance. :D

 

go to the ports boards for the Med - lots of good ideas there.

 

There are some really nice spots in Carnavecchio (I probably spelled that wrong). It's away from the maddening crowds, with a canal and some hotels have water taxi access. it's about a 10 minute trip to the key tourist spots walking.

 

Loved it there.

[smokinmike]

Providing activity options may not be the same as a duty to "entertain" individual passengers. I get what you are saying Linda and Vern. It is nice to have distractions to some degree while cruising, but it still seems to me the main task is to provide transportation to specific destinations with some relative degree of comfort. But I might be missing something here because we always thought the ports visited were the primary focus of cruising.

 

Ports might be your reason for cruising but others may wish for a different experience. There are many levels of expectations associated with cruising and whatever one's own expectations are, they then become the most important - to oneself.

 

I like ports and I like sea days too - for what they BOTH offer. I expect a certain level of comfort and amenities in both instances.

 

. . . and speaking of HAL itineraries - how are those reduced times in ports working out for you?

[Linda&Vern]

I appreciate your thoughtful post. The comment "No cruise line is in the business to entertain us" is one that I must disagree with. This is their primary function. Why would HAL offer spa services, trivia, bingo, guest speakers, shore excursions, specialty restaurants etc.if not to entertain. Why would any pax pay thousands of dollars if they were not being entertained. This is indeed the business of any cruise line. Again thanks for your comments.

Thanks for your feedback. My fingers may not have been coordinated with my brain last night. I probably could have worded my comment: "HAL’s business is providing cruises to their guests … but they are in business to make profits for their shareholders." Hope that makes sense now.

[OlsSalt]

the main task is to provide transportation??? seriously??? I can take a land tour and do that in Europe. Yes, we do expect some relative comfort which HAl has provided in the past. I do expect nice meals and I do expect some service. I do expect a nice experience If I am crossing the ocean with no ports for 9 days, then yes, I do expect some nice meals and some activities. HAL's activities are minimal which suits us but I do expect the minimal.

 

I guess my expectations are unreasonable;)

 

Yes, seriously I do see a ship primarily as a transportation option to many locations, with some built in comforts while doing that moving from place to place depending upon the price level I want to pay. Shows how many different ways there are to view the choice to use a ship as a primary transportation mode.

 

I guess since I started cruising on passenger ships, all these extras now part of the cruise ship experience and assumed are essential is quite confounding. I can now see how I got off track about cruising versus sea travel just to get from place to place. I am learning a lot hearing how others see this travel choice that are quite different from my own.

 

Land transportation for similar type journeys can mean long waits in airports in unattractive remote locations far from town, traffic, driver fatigue, not covering travel distances when sleeping, hauling luggage, making hotel arrangements, packing and unpacking.

 

A sole location resort is more like a cruise ship, but without the novelty of different ports. So each has its own merits as well as limitations. All three are quite different when providing the basics.

[OlsSalt]

Ports might be your reason for cruising but others may wish for a different experience. There are many levels of expectations associated with cruising and whatever one's own expectations are, they then become the most important - to oneself.

 

I like ports and I like sea days too - for what they BOTH offer. I expect a certain level of comfort and amenities in both instances.

 

. . . and speaking of HAL itineraries - how are those reduced times in ports working out for you?

 

We have had several HAL cruises lately that have offered several days in one port and that we like a lot. Same thing on the one coming up so we haven't noticed reduced times in ports as a plus or a minus. It is what is is and disclosed up front. Who knows, with our upcoming limping Prinsendam cruise we may get more days in port than originally planned. :cool:

[RuthC]

Yes, seriously I do see a ship primarily as a transportation option to many locations,

Which is not news to those of us who read CC regularly. You have posted that many times.

A sole location resort is more like a cruise ship, but without the novelty of different ports.

A "sole location resort" is nothing like a cruise ship. It can't give you days at sea, the scenery never changes, and there is no being rocked to sleep. All of these are important parts of a cruise---at least to some of us.

[OlsSalt]

Which is not news to those of us who read CC regularly. You have posted that many times.

 

A "sole location resort" is nothing like a cruise ship. It can't give you days at sea, the scenery never changes, and there is no being rocked to sleep. All of these are important parts of a cruise---at least to some of us.

 

A sole land-based resort lets you pack and unpack once and you have the same room and get to know the same staff and depending upon location and remoteness would use the same dining facilities. So as stated originially they are more like a ship, but absent the actual sea features that you have rightly added.

[Lauranne]

Thanks for your feedback. My fingers may not have been coordinated with my brain last night. I probably could have worded my comment: "HAL’s business is providing cruises to their guests … but they are in business to make profits for their shareholders." Hope that makes sense now.

 

That makes perfect sense to me. Thank you for the clarification. :)

[buggins0402]

I'm so tired of being preached at and told how we should think. Evidently only one opinion counts with the prolific poster, and there is no point in arguing with it.

 

As to the others, I have enjoyed reading all sides and it is interesting to read of others' choices and priorities for a cruise. It sure would be a dull world if we all thought the same way and wanted the same things from our cruise. That would make us clones;) It's the differences that make us the people we are, and interesting to each other. Respecting others opinions and not demanding that only ours is the right one, is what - as Walt reminded us - this forum is all about.

 

As to "anger at HAL" - I remember reading that somewhere - I don't think there is anger, but more disappointment in our cruise line of choice, in some of the decisions they have made and the decline we've seen. But I venture to say that we likely all still prefer HAL, all things being equal.

 

Thank you for a nicely done post, it makes me feel more comfortable considering HAL.

 

Tell you the truth - this board needs one of those silly threads to get the loyalists disappointed about some recent changes to lighten up a bit. Like the tongue in cheek thread running on the Celebrity board about what ruined their cruise. Example - cruiser hates tenders and their cruise was ruined by the captain not beaching the ship.

[arewethereyet]

Thank you for a nicely done post, it makes me feel more comfortable considering HAL.

 

Tell you the truth - this board needs one of those silly threads to get the loyalists disappointed about some recent changes to lighten up a bit. Like the tongue in cheek thread running on the Celebrity board about what ruined their cruise. Example - cruiser hates tenders and their cruise was ruined by the captain not beaching the ship.

I've been reading some of that. They seem to have a well developed sense of humor over there. It would be nice to see some of that over here.

[Wakepatrol]

That's forbidden here:eek:

[smokinmike]

We have had several HAL cruises lately that have offered several days in one port and that we like a lot. Same thing on the one coming up so we haven't noticed reduced times in ports as a plus or a minus. It is what is is and disclosed up front. Who knows, with our upcoming limping Prinsendam cruise we may get more days in port than originally planned. :cool:

 

Nice deflection!

[world~citizen]

... But I venture to say that we likely all still prefer HAL, all things being equal.

 

Thoughtful post. I would say if not prefer, certainly look forward to another dam adventure. :)

[cbr663]

We are booked on HAL in December and are keeping our fingers crossed that this cruise will be so much better than our last. We are giving HAL one more chance, mainly because I very first cruise with them was on the Veendam and we loved it.

 

We have decided to make some changes to see whether these will change the experience. We have decided to partake more of the speciality restaurants, will be staying away from the MDR on formal night, and a few other changes in order to avoid a repeat of our last cruise experience. I don't want to go into too much detail as I don't wish to go into detail about our previous cruise.

 

We have also booked with Oceania for 2014 and are looking froward to it immensely. And yes, we will be comparing this cruise with HAL.

 

My point is that we are trying everything that we can to have a great experience with HAL. Our hope is that HAL is trying harder also.

[world~citizen]

We have also booked with Oceania for 2014 and are looking froward to it immensely. And yes, we will be comparing this cruise with HAL.

 

 

Look forward to the review. Of course the two lines are not strictly comparable.

[sail7seas]

If it is just sunshine some people want, then I can see the reasons to move on to land-based resorts in the same area.

 

These two differing expectations for cruise travel can pull a traditional line like HAL in two opposite directions asking it be both a daily entertainment emporium and a cruise travel destination operation. That may be too much to ask from a line like HAL with its older ships and still many travel-oriented passengers.

 

Interesting differences in expectations. How does the money get spent when passenger fares are asked to go in such two different directions?

 

 

But we like the sea.

Why should be suffled ashore and expected to stay at a land resort if that is not our choice. We've done plenty (dozens) of Caribbean resort stays and may again but for now we'd rather be at sea. :)

 

[world~citizen]

But we like the sea.

Why should be suffled ashore and expected to stay at a land resort if that is not our choice. We've done plenty (dozens) of Caribbean resort stays and may again but for now we'd rather be at sea. :)

 

 

I must say, one has to admire someone who has found their bliss. Looks like you guys have.

[OlsSalt]

But we like the sea.

Why should be suffled ashore and expected to stay at a land resort if that is not our choice. We've done plenty (dozens) of Caribbean resort stays and may again but for now we'd rather be at sea. :)

 

 

No one is shuffling you ashore. Good points are getting raised about the variety of expectations different people get from cruising.

[sail7seas]

No one is shuffling you ashore. Good points are getting raised about the variety of expectations different people get from cruising.

 

 

 

I'm curious......

 

If you don't mind my asking, have you sailed HAL very much?

Of course, no need to respond if you don't wish.

[innlady1]

Which is not news to those of us who read CC regularly. You have posted that many times.

 

A "sole location resort" is nothing like a cruise ship. It can't give you days at sea, the scenery never changes, and there is no being rocked to sleep. All of these are important parts of a cruise---at least to some of us.

 

Exactly, Ruth. For a moment, I thought I was "seeing things"... reading the post to which you replied! Guess ole salt sees the world through a different lens than many of us. :rolleyes:

[OlsSalt]

.....

 

I'm not sure if I am reading your post correctly but you seem to suggest there should be one trade off for another (itinerary vs. comfort). I disagree.

People don't just cruise to see ports - they dream of being pampered and taken care of. sorry to disillusion you but most people still think when they cruise they will be well treated (and expect it).

 

Thought I had added enough disclaimers in the original query, but the question was all over the place wasn't it -- I was thinking more about what HAL might have to face in the future - where to put its emphasis and money, particularly when it gets more expensive to run the smaller and older ships. ..... if they wanted to stay in the same price class as Celebrity and Princess, yet still keep their smaller, older ships. (Hopefully as long as they can but it appears most of the complaints registered here are on the smaller, older ships)

[sail7seas]

Thought I had added enough disclaimers in the original query, but the question was all over the place wasn't it -- I was thinking more about what HAL might have to face in the future - where to put its emphasis and money, particularly when it gets more expensive to run the smaller and older ships. ..... if they wanted to stay in the same price class as Celebrity and Princess, yet still keep their smaller, older ships. (Hopefully as long as they can but it appears most of the complaints registered here are on the smaller, older ships)

 

 

HAL has managed to figure it out for over 150 years. I suspect

they will continue to do so. :)

 

[kazu]

HAL has managed to figure it out for over 150 years. I suspect

they will continue to do so. :)

 

 

thank you. you said it better than I.

[innlady1]

Thought I had added enough disclaimers in the original query, but the question was all over the place wasn't it -- I was thinking more about what HAL might have to face in the future - where to put its emphasis and money, particularly when it gets more expensive to run the smaller and older ships. ..... if they wanted to stay in the same price class as Celebrity and Princess, yet still keep their smaller, older ships. (Hopefully as long as they can but it appears most of the complaints registered here are on the smaller, older ships)

 

 

Not from me...we love the older ships. As I know a lot of others here on CC do. I don't think your assessment is accurate re the smaller ships. :rolleyes:

[mamaofami]

I go out for a few hours to have dinner with friends and look what I come back to.

 

I also love the smaller older ships on Hal. I also love being out to sea. It beats a land vacation any day, and as Ruth said, where else can you be rocked to sleep. I want to have interesting ports and to be pampered, have good food, and good service. I want to be able to sail.