Did you have AC issues on Zuiderdam?

[scdreamer]

Your experience matches precisely that of dinner companions on our November 2012 partial Canal transit on Zuiderdam (as well as matching numerous other postings here). Fortunately, we were in a lesser cabin and our a/c amidships was fine. I believe you are completely correct in thinking that HAL's plan to deal with what appears to be an intractable a/c problem is to leverage the "each individual passenger" approach and play out "Service Desk kabuki" following the script that they are shocked, shocked that someone is having a problem, say the engineers are working on it, then time goes by, then offer a fan, then stall as long as possible, and then after numerous complaints and several sleepless nights, offer-up a sleeping cabin. That was the script we witnessed last year, and that appears to be the script behind numerous postings I've read since then. Perhaps Zuiderdam just needs to be moved to the Alaska run. Or maybe its heat doesn't work either.

 

You are correct - at least that was pretty much our experience on Veendam two months ago. Except we were not given another cabin, just a fan.

 

The weather on the New England/Canada trip was quite cold and rainy, but our OV cabin was hot and stuffy the entire cruise. So one shouldn't assume the problem would not exist on an Alaskan itinerary.

[Hflors]

We were passengers on the October 18th cruise to the Panama Canal abroad the Zuiderdam. We did not have air conditioning in our aft-facing cabin for the entire trip. In fact, according to the front desk supervisor, all the aft facing cabins on deck 6, 7 & 8 had air conditioning issues. In reading the forums I’ve noticed this seems to be a recurring problem. Holland America’s response to the problem was pathetic while on board and non-existent since we’ve been home.

 

They pretty much brushed it off while on board saying the engineers were working on it, then after several days, stating that it was as good as it gets. I don’t believe cruising the Caribbean without AC (with a cabin temperature ranging from 84-89 degrees) is acceptable considering the prices we paid for the privilege to cruise on their ship.

 

I believe Holland America is taking advantage of the fact that each individual passenger thinks it’s a unique problem and that the passenger was just unlucky enough to choose a cabin with an AC problem. The majority of us don’t wish to spend our vacation arguing and complaining at the front desk over something that is beyond their control and trust that we are dealing with a reputable company. If in fact they are aware of an ongoing problem it is inexcusable that Holland America continue to ruin our vacations. Our expectation is that we are dealing with a reputable company who will provide us with the luxury vacation we paid for, not camping in the tropics!

 

My point: I’d like to know your specific experiences. We were in cabin 7145 for the October 18, 2013 Panama Canal cruise. Please share your information. Maybe if we gather enough specific information we can at the very least make future cruisers aware of areas to avoid on the ship. And maybe Holland America will pay attention that as cruisers and Cruise Critic members there is a forum through which they will be held accountable.

 

Maybe the word is out about the aft facing cabins. We are booked on the Dec 9th cruise and there are still aft facing cabins available even at this late date!

[iancal]

Don't forget the other nonsense excuse that the front desk uses....people are leaving their balcony doors open. It is all down to your inconsiderate fellow cruisers...ie not HAL's fault.

 

At least they have not got round to blaming this on the Ozzies yet!

Edited November 19, 2013 by iancal

[chrispb]

Looks like HAL should recruit new plumbers and engineers:cool: Or retrain existing staff.

[OlsSalt]

Looks like HAL should recruit new plumbers and engineers:cool: Or retrain existing staff.

 

Better yet make passengers sign statements they will use toilets and balcony doors properly, or else.

Edited November 19, 2013 by OlsSalt

[startwin]

Better yet make passengers sign statements they will use toilets and balcony doors properly, or else.

 

Yay!! You've hit on the total fix for the Zuiderdam.... hope Seattle is reading this and they can institute it in time for my next cruise. No more problems on the Zuiderdam! Thank you.:rolleyes:

[MermaidWatcher]

Maybe the word is out about the aft facing cabins. We are booked on the Dec 9th cruise and there are still aft facing cabins available even at this late date!

 

:mad: Sadly, I think they have found a way to fill these unsold cabins :mad:. While in line to disembark on Nov 18, we were in line next to a couple who were in one of the aft non AC cabins. When I inquired if they were offered fair compensation, they told a truly astounding twist to the story. They had booked a typical balcony, when shortly before the Nov 8 sailing day, they were offered a free upgrade to an aft balcony, which they of course took, believing that they had been rewarded for being multiple cruise HAL customers. Turns out they were played for the suckers, moved into what should have been one of numerous out of service cabins, so HAL could resell their lower priced balcony. How is that for real slap in the face customer relations ?

We have only sailed HAL twice, and although we thoroughly enjoyed both, I don't believe HAL will see us again. I will not spend my money with a company that repeatedly and knowingly puts their customers in not only a defective product, but in a situation that could very easily turn into a dangerous medical situation for them, considering the age of many passengers.

[OlsSalt]

:mad: …..

We have only sailed HAL twice, and although we thoroughly enjoyed both, I don't believe HAL will see us again. I will not spend my money with a company that repeatedly and knowingly puts their customers in not only a defective product, but in a situation that could very easily turn into a dangerous medical situation for them, considering the age of many passengers.

 

What were the recorded interior cabin temperatures in those A/C defective cabins? Thanks for the tip on possible upgrades maybe being downgrades. Or the fodder for those last minute online discount offers one keeps seeing. Do you know if any of the aft-cabin passengers were happy or did not notice any problems?

[stlouistravelers]

Better yet make passengers sign statements they will use toilets and balcony doors properly, or else.

 

This is facinating. My questions would be:

1. What if the passengers refuse to sign the statement. I use the toilet by depositing waste and then flushing.

2. Balcony doors, for some an open door is the proper use.

 

Then it begs the question, what is the "or else" and how will that impact business. If someone is concerned about the balcony then simply install a monitor on the door. When it is open then the vents shut down so the rest of the system works normally. As for the toilets, what can you say.

[OlsSalt]

This is facinating. My questions would be:

1. What if the passengers refuse to sign the statement. I use the toilet by depositing waste and then flushing.

2. Balcony doors, for some an open door is the proper use.

 

Then it begs the question, what is the "or else" and how will that impact business. If someone is concerned about the balcony then simply install a monitor on the door. When it is open then the vents shut down so the rest of the system works normally. As for the toilets, what can you say.

 

Signs on the door and the commode already indicate their proper use; it is not left to a passenger to decide privately how to use or abuse either. Passengers need perhaps more vivid or fuller explanation how their contrary private choices can affect other people on the ship. I assume the passenger violating this sort of agreement would be put off the ship. That should be made clear up front.

 

How will asking passengers to be responsible for a minimum level of personal conduct while on board affect business? Read how well it affects business if they do not, and degrade the experience for everyone else who is subject to inconveniences they created.

 

Agree, if balcony door closure is critical to the functioning of other cabin's A/V systems, then some sort of automatic door closure would help if passengers still choose to ignore the polite warning sign by the door (and often under a curtain) already in place.

 

How to prevent people putting things down the toilet know to clog the systems for others on the same line, since they too are ignoring the polite signs already in place on the commode itself? I think placement of a pictorial sign of what should not go down the toilet above the toilet would be more helpful than putting it on the inside of the lid which is where I think the more detailed list of prohibited items now exists.

 

The increasing prevalence of non-English speaking passengers who may not read or notice these signs needs to be considered too. All of this discussion is predicated on the supposition there are interconnected systems where one cabin's misuse can affect others on the same system. Which apparently are not even next to each other for HACV systems. But I suppose the plumbing systems are in a straight line.

Edited November 20, 2013 by OlsSalt

[startwin]

The assertion that air conditioning and plumbing problems on the Zuiderdam are the passengers fault is so tiresome. People have reported their experience - including me - and I can attest emphatically that the plumbing issue was not this passenger's fault. I can't speak to the a/c as I really didn't have much of a problem there, but I opened and closed my balcony door quite frequently.:rolleyes:

[OlsSalt]

The assertion that air conditioning and plumbing problems on the Zuiderdam are the passengers fault is so tiresome. People have reported their experience - including me - and I can attest emphatically that the plumbing issue was not this passenger's fault. I can't speak to the a/c as I really didn't have much of a problem there, but I opened and closed my balcony door quite frequently.:rolleyes:

 

If it is true, it should never be tiresome to keep reminding people to not force open their balcony doors, and not put anything that is prohibited down the toilets.

 

You never know who along your line may have caused a plumbing back up that affected your cabin, so how can you be sure it was not a "passengers" fault.

 

All ships get these reports which makes one suspect indeed these could very well be people problems too, which do need more attention that is for sure.

 

Just read in International Travel News (pp26/27 Dec 2013) about the Volendam having not only "constant electrical and plumbing problems, with toilets either not working or overflowing", but losing all power between Java and Singapore where the ship drifted in the wrong direction for 1 1/2 hours. -- Volendam now on the critical list with "no electricity, no flushing toilets, and no air-conditioning in that equatorial heat"/ (November 24-Dec 10. 2012)

 

Take her out and shoot her.

[djhsolara]

We were on this same cruise as the OP and you can read about our issues on the thread that I wrote. I said it on there, but I still love HAL but find no reason to ever return to Zuiderdam...ever!! The AC is not the only issue with this ship.

 

 

Sent from my iPad

[MermaidWatcher]

What were the recorded interior cabin temperatures in those A/C defective cabins? Thanks for the tip on possible upgrades maybe being downgrades. Or the fodder for those last minute online discount offers one keeps seeing. Do you know if any of the aft-cabin passengers were happy or did not notice any problems?

 

I spoke to at least 5 or 6 aft cabin occupants at random my time dining tables plus the couple at disembarkation, staying on varying decks, and none of them ever mentioned anything about any crew members coming in to verify room temperature. It was not the the AC was producing inadequately cooled air, it was putting out no air at all. What I garnered from these conversations was that it was the same age old, ongoing problem of no AC in any aft facing rooms on decks 6, 7, and 8. If this is not the case, I hope someone with first hand experience in this area of the ship will correct me, as my postings are not intended to be the source of a runaway rumor mill, but a heads up to future passengers who have paid substantial rates for these cabins.

Just as a reference as to what the cabin temps might have been, the daily weather temp was 88 to 91 degrees and typically 79% relative humidity.

[Cindy]

The assertion that air conditioning and plumbing problems on the Zuiderdam are the passengers fault is so tiresome. People have reported their experience - including me - and I can attest emphatically that the plumbing issue was not this passenger's fault. I can't speak to the a/c as I really didn't have much of a problem there, but I opened and closed my balcony door quite frequently.:rolleyes:

 

I have been reading about pervasive and persistent plumbing and A/C problems on the Zuiderdam for almost two years now. I was actually booked on the Zuiderdam for my 25th anniversary last year, and we jumped ship because of the reports.

Three things surprise me (although I suppose they shouldn't)...the first is some people's insistence in blaming the problem on the passengers, the second is the apparent willingness of some to accept these conditions as "the price of doing business" on a cruise ship in the Caribbean or the tropics, and the third is that HAL hasn't addressed the problem in any meaningful way.

As far as I'm concerned, the passenger blame game and the "what do you expect in the tropics?" excuses are a load of dung. I've been on 18 cruises on four different cruise lines - most of them in a tropical climate. I've never had any noticeable or lasting problem with the plumbing or air conditioning. I wouldn't go on a ship thinking if I was without A/C in the Caribbean it would be OK, and I also wouldn't find it acceptable to have a toilet that either didn't flush or was so delayed as to suck my insides out when I decided to risk taking care of business. Perhaps I could solve that problem by squatting like I'm in a Port-a-Potty instead of on a cruise ship! I think it's deplorable that people are spending thousands of dollars and finding themselves without air conditioning or a flushing toilet for a couple weeks. Yes, mechanical things break, but for HAL to continue selling cabins with known problems week after week is pathetic customer service and shows little regard for guests' comfort or vacations.

Edited November 20, 2013 by Cindy

[Wakepatrol]

I have been reading about pervasive and persistent plumbing and A/C problems on the Zuiderdam for almost two years now. I was actually booked on the Zuiderdam for my 25th anniversary last year, and we jumped ship because of the reports.

Three things surprise me (although I suppose they shouldn't)...the first is some people's insistence in blaming the problem on the passengers, the second is the apparent willingness of some to accept these conditions as "the price of doing business" on a cruise ship in the Caribbean or the tropics, and the third is that HAL hasn't addressed the problem in any meaningful way.

As far as I'm concerned, the passenger blame game and the "what do you expect in the tropics?" excuses are a load of dung. I've been on 18 cruises on four different cruise lines - most of them in a tropical climate. I've never had any noticeable or lasting problem with the plumbing or air conditioning. I wouldn't go on a ship thinking if I was without A/C in the Caribbean it would be OK, and I also wouldn't find it acceptable to have a toilet that either didn't flush or was so delayed as to suck my insides out when I decided to risk taking care of business. Perhaps I could solve that problem by squatting like I'm in a Port-a-Potty instead of on a cruise ship! I think it's deplorable that people are spending thousands of dollars and finding themselves without air conditioning or a flushing toilet for a couple weeks. Yes, mechanical things break, but for HAL to continue selling cabins with known problems week after week is pathetic customer service and shows little regard for guests' comfort or vacations.

 

You're absolutely right.

[djhsolara]

I spoke to at least 5 or 6 aft cabin occupants at random my time dining tables plus the couple at disembarkation, staying on varying decks, and none of them ever mentioned anything about any crew members coming in to verify room temperature. It was not the the AC was producing inadequately cooled air, it was putting out no air at all. What I garnered from these conversations was that it was the same age old, ongoing problem of no AC in any aft facing rooms on decks 6, 7, and 8. If this is not the case, I hope someone with first hand experience in this area of the ship will correct me, as my postings are not intended to be the source of a runaway rumor mill, but a heads up to future passengers who have paid substantial rates for these cabins.

Just as a reference as to what the cabin temps might have been, the daily weather temp was 88 to 91 degrees and typically 79% relative humidity.

 

My SIL and family were not in an aft stateroom, but were in an OV on 1. After the ceiling a/c unit was leaking because it was frozen over, they were moved to another OV more toward the front of the ship. After not being able to sleep that night due to temperatures that were confirmed by a few visits from a supervisor at the front office (named Michelle) to be over 80 degrees they were moved to their third stateroom...which remained cool for them for the rest of the cruise.

 

 

Sent from my iPad

[Watson's aunt]

hi

 

I was just on her left yesterday. I had no problem with A/C or Toliet. zo was in middle of ship I few times during the nigh my cabin got a bit warm but only slighly. Not enough to complain. I id n the layout of the ship I gues I have been spoiled on the Amsterdam. But I did see people at front desk reporting problems and I saw more than a few mainteance men walking up and down the hallways. Some with buckets. So Alhough I had did not have any problems others had lots.

 

Mary

[OlsSalt]

Including passenger causation for many of these problems is critical information. That is something passengers need to know.

[OlsSalt]

I have been reading about pervasive and persistent plumbing and A/C problems on the Zuiderdam for almost two years now. I was actually booked on the Zuiderdam for my 25th anniversary last year, and we jumped ship because of the reports.

Three things surprise me (although I suppose they shouldn't)...the first is some people's insistence in blaming the problem on the passengers, the second is the apparent willingness of some to accept these conditions as "the price of doing business" on a cruise ship in the Caribbean or the tropics, and the third is that HAL hasn't addressed the problem in any meaningful way.

As far as I'm concerned, the passenger blame game and the "what do you expect in the tropics?" excuses are a load of dung. I've been on 18 cruises on four different cruise lines - most of them in a tropical climate. I've never had any noticeable or lasting problem with the plumbing or air conditioning. I wouldn't go on a ship thinking if I was without A/C in the Caribbean it would be OK, and I also wouldn't find it acceptable to have a toilet that either didn't flush or was so delayed as to suck my insides out when I decided to risk taking care of business. Perhaps I could solve that problem by squatting like I'm in a Port-a-Potty instead of on a cruise ship! I think it's deplorable that people are spending thousands of dollars and finding themselves without air conditioning or a flushing toilet for a couple weeks. Yes, mechanical things break, but for HAL to continue selling cabins with known problems week after week is pathetic customer service and shows little regard for guests' comfort or vacations.

 

We get it. No you should not put up with anything the way you described it. Why are you still here. You found ships that work far better for your wants and needs. Got it.

[Cindy]

We get it. No you should not put up with anything the way you described it. Why are you still here. You found ships that work far better for your wants and needs. Got it.

 

Let's see...I'm a HAL past passenger, potential future passenger, and a stock holder. I'm not going anywhere. Sorry if my presence and opinions irritate you.:)

[TracieABD]

We are in a VB gty. Now I am worried...

:eek:

[startwin]

If it is true, it should never be tiresome to keep reminding people to not force open their balcony doors, and not put anything that is prohibited down the toilets.

 

You never know who along your line may have caused a plumbing back up that affected your cabin, so how can you be sure it was not a "passengers" fault.

 

All ships get these reports which makes one suspect indeed these could very well be people problems too, which do need more attention that is for sure.

 

Just read in International Travel News (pp26/27 Dec 2013) about the Volendam having not only "constant electrical and plumbing problems, with toilets either not working or overflowing", but losing all power between Java and Singapore where the ship drifted in the wrong direction for 1 1/2 hours. -- Volendam now on the critical list with "no electricity, no flushing toilets, and no air-conditioning in that equatorial heat"/ (November 24-Dec 10. 2012)

 

Take her out and shoot her.

 

You need to read posts that you are quoting much more carefully. I said it was not THIS passengers fault. And nowhere did I say the balcony door was ever forced open. I see you've gone back to your old persona on here. I haven't forgotten the "petulant trolls" comment for daring to report on the plumbing issues.

[OlsSalt]

We are in a VB gty. Now I am worried...

:eek:

 

You should be. Imagine a cruise line that hates its passengers, doesn't care if they are wretched and miserable, yet surprisingly those passengers keep coming back for more abuse. :rolleyes:

 

After reading a horrible tale of woe about the Volendam in another travel organization, I went to the Cruise Critic member reviews for the same time on the same ship and all I saw were four and five star plus reviews. What one passenger described as "losing all power and drifting backwards for an hour and half" might well have been the medical evacuation another reviewer described was necessary for her husband.

 

But no one reported the "toilets were overflowing all the time and the A/C never worked". Not a peep about either problem in several reviews around the exact same time this report was made. I don't think people lie about an incident; but I do suspect there is a lot of embellishment and exaggeration as to duration and impact. And yes, there can be multiple reports that conclusively show a serious problem and HAL has not shied away from recognizing this too. And compensating accordingly.

 

And yes, you can and will run into incidents yourself. We all have. I don't think these are exclusive to HAL ships, And yes, some of them are caused by passenger carelessness. And that unfortunately does become part of the group travel experience on ships. If you want perfection at all levels at all times, I can assure you HAL ships will not guarantee you this. And this is okay with an awful lot of loyal passengers who have learned at any given time they might have to be adaptable and flexible out there on the high seas.

 

Toss out the worst reports and the glowing best ones too where everything was perfect and be content with what you find in the middle. No, I don't think you will have your guts sucked out by an errant toilet on HAL ships. That most certainly would have made the news by now.

 

Plus you might want to read up a bit about this ever happening and why from the new disclosure book written by an airline pilot about the hidden side of flying. Where I really do think they hate their passengers. :cool: But we still fly.

Edited November 20, 2013 by OlsSalt

[OlsSalt]

Name a cruise line and you will see problems reported. From Silver Seas, to Regent, to Crystal, to Oceania, to P&O, to Celebrity to Holland America, and on and on and on. Carnival comes in for more than its fair share, but they also have a lot of ships. http://www.cruisejunkie.com/Disabling.html#2012

 

BTW: unconfirmed sole passenger complaints need verification.