Cunard to do away with Grills?

[keithm]

:confused: We just completed a 14 day Caribbean trip on Celebrity. It was outstanding. I'll post a Cunard vs.Celebrity review. On the Eclipse we met Miguel(the Maitre D) He had been Maitre D on the QE before going to Seaborn then to Celebrity. He told us that there are big changes coming to Cunard. As many of us know,Cunard has not been very profitable & has at times been losing money. The plans which are being discussed..are eliminating the "Grill Class" and making the restaurants "specialty extra cost" ones. The prices of the suites would be cut quite a bit to bring prices in line with suites on other lines.The top grade suites would still get "first choice" on seating,as well as a complimentary dinner once a cruise, but would be paying for the priviledge. There would still be butler service in the larger "Queens" level.Dresscodes would be relaxed somewhat, but not go to casual as on other lines. I'll let everyone respond to this:eek:

[cruiseluvva]

Oh dear, what a crying shame! We love the Grills and would be very,very sad to see them go.

 

Watch and wait then.......

[bananavan]

Well, that will make things interesting. Cunard is a business and needs to improve profitability.

We are sailing Grills for the first time in May for the Norwegian Grand Adventure. We are looking forward to eating in the Grills restaurant. The Brittania did not meet our culinary needs the last time we were onboard.

 

Celebrity has taken this approach already with the Solstice class. They still have the Aqua class separate from the masses. Each of the three specialty restaurants appeal to a different clientele. We were celebrating my 60th birthday and purchased the three dinners with three wines package. The Murano was worth it, the rest, meh.......... Celebrity's service in the main dining room was deplorable. In fact, we have not sailed with them since.

We have, however, spent 60 sea days on Princess and Cunard in that period. We even get to take advantage of all the Celebrity perks because of the amount we have sailed with them in the past, but even that does not make up for the poor culinary and service standard in the main dining room.

 

Our service and food on the Island Princess this past summer was the best of all cruises we have ever enjoyed. One thing that I noticed there though is that very few people took advantage of the Specialty Dining. The attitude was that they were already paying for meals and were not about to pay more for a different venue.

 

 

 

I guess I should enjoy every single moment of my 28 day Grills experience, knowing that I might never get that again.

Edited February 9, 2014 by bananavan

[BobBranst]

I tend to take information like this with a grain of salt. Unfortunately, some people love to make disparaging remarks about their former employers. The spreading of unfounded rumors may be the reason why he is no longer are working for Cunard.

Edited February 9, 2014 by BobBranst

[keithm]

I tend to take information like this with a grain of salt. Unfortunately, some people love to make disparaging remarks about their former employers. The spreading of unfounded rumors may be the reason why he is no longer are working for Cunard.

Not sure. I'm hoping some QE pax will spread some light on him. He did state some issues I KNOW to be true, such as a lot of problems on Seaborn. I hate saying it makes sense, but I do know Cunard is not that profitable. When I get specials such as $499 PP for a Trans Atlantic, then I know they're having problems filling the ship.

[david,Mississauga]

There wasn't even a hint of this on a summer cruise we had on the Q.E. For the two crossings we are taking this year Princess Grill was sold out 10 months in advance for one and six months for the other. Queens Grill was also sold out well in advance with the exception of a small number of the larger suites. Given the fares charged for the Grills I suspect they are quite profitable.

[keithm]

Well, that will make things interesting. Cunard is a business and needs to improve profitability.

We are sailing Grills for the first time in May for the Norwegian Grand Adventure. We are looking forward to eating in the Grills restaurant. The Brittania did not meet our culinary needs the last time we were onboard.

 

Celebrity has taken this approach already with the Solstice class. They still have the Aqua class separate from the masses. Each of the three specialty restaurants appeal to a different clientele. We were celebrating my 60th birthday and purchased the three dinners with three wines package. The Murano was worth it, the rest, meh.......... Celebrity's service in the main dining room was deplorable. In fact, we have not sailed with them since.

We have, however, spent 60 sea days on Princess and Cunard in that period. We even get to take advantage of all the Celebrity perks because of the amount we have sailed with them in the past, but even that does not make up for the poor culinary and service standard in the main dining room.

 

Our service and food on the Island Princess this past summer was the best of all cruises we have ever enjoyed. One thing that I noticed there though is that very few people took advantage of the Specialty Dining. The attitude was that they were already paying for meals and were not about to pay more for a different venue.

 

 

 

I guess I should enjoy every single moment of my 28 day Grills experience, knowing that I might never get that again.

This what makes all tthis very interesting. Our recent 14 day trip on Celebrity Eclipse was only bettered by our time in the Queens Grill. The Moonlight Sonata was FAR superior to ANY time we did in Britannia(the exception being QM2's first year in 2004)We never felt rushed, something we always felt in Britannia. The waitstaff was outstanding. It was always very good in Britannia, but not quite as good as Eclipse. I'm sure it varies by ship. Though I loved the interior of QV, the service was lacking from other Cunard ships. We found portions to be rather stingy & the waitstaff not quite so willing to bring larger portions(We know there is portion control)but the "tiny" Lobster thermidore on the last formal night on QV was deplorable. We got Chataubriand on second formal & Lobster & Beef Wellington on Eclipse. I think Eclipse caters to an older demographic(due to longer voyages)so the quality could be better than other Celebrity ships.

[BobBranst]

Not sure. I'm hoping some QE pax will spread some light on him. He did state some issues I KNOW to be true, such as a lot of problems on Seaborn. I hate saying it makes sense, but I do know Cunard is not that profitable. When I get specials such as $499 PP for a Trans Atlantic, then I know they're having problems filling the ship.

It has been my past experience that upper managment seldom share their discussions of massive change with lower level employees. I would be more inclined to accept such statements as the person's personal speculation rather than a discription of actual discussions from the decision makers in upper management.

[keithm]

There wasn't even a hint of this on a summer cruise we had on the Q.E. For the two crossings we are taking this year Princess Grill was sold out 10 months in advance for one and six months for the other. Queens Grill was also sold out well in advance with the exception of a small number of the larger suites. Given the fares charged for the Grills I suspect they are quite profitable.

True, but unfortunately, the money comes from filling the "standard" staterooms. They far outnumber the Grills, for all their fine quality. If you've read my past reviews on Cunard, you'll find I support them in the fullest. Without a doubt the Grills are the way to go, but we can't always afford the $$. It's just that the Eclipse MDR was so superior to Britannia(with the exception of 2004 QM2)I just can't ignore the quality of food & the quality of the staff on that ship. Unless Cunard moves quickly, then they will lose us as loyal pax. I feel they need to offer B2B transAtlantics from New York as they used to. Having to fly home fro South Hampton is not cost wise for us.

[Cunard Cruiser]

I was on QM2 a few months ago and based on a conversation with a senior officer who I am friends with for many years this is what I know. The reason for no dry docking in 2014 is a complete overhaul proposed for 2015. At the moment discussions and plans include:

- Ending Todd English contract and placing a specialty dining such as a Veranda Grill

- Redoing the entire Kings Court for better flow

- Removing the Winter Garden

- Removing the basketballs courts and lookout on Deck 13 for more luxury cabins

- Revamping the Britannia Club dining experience

- Refreshing the Britannia Restaurant

There was no mention of the Grills going and as far as I am aware they are profitable as David Dingle outlines in this interview: http://www.travelagentcentral.com/cruises/iconic-outlook-one-one-david-dingle-ceo-cunard-line-44314

Keep in mind the above are planning stages. As we know with Cunard things can quickly change or remain the same.

[keithm]

It has been my past experience that upper managment seldom share their discussions of massive change with lower level employees. I would be more inclined to accept such statements as the person's personal speculation rather than a discription of actual discussions from the decision makers in upper management.

Not sure here. That's why I hope there's some PAX who knew Miguel from the Princess Grill on QE & can shed some light on him. We found him to be outstanding in Murano on the Eclipse. What he does say, unfortunately makes some sense. There's still those who feel Cunard has a "class" system. We all know how Carnival manages their cruiselines. They all seem to be slowly homogonizing to one standard.

[BobBranst]

Sorry, I can't find how to delete duplicate messages.

Edited February 9, 2014 by BobBranst

[wripro]

The Grills are a great marketing ploy for Cunard. Without them the ships become just another cruise ship.

[BobBranst]

The Grills are a great marketing ploy for Cunard. Without them the ships become just another cruise ship.

Absolutely True. Turning Cunard ships into ordinary cruise ships is a sure way to lose most of your repeat business.

[Jim Avery]

Absolutely True. Turning Cunard ships into ordinary cruise ships is a sure way to lose most of your repeat business.

 

Yes, but we are running out of options.:eek: There does seem to be a great homogenization going on in the industry. If it is Tuesday, this must be Belgium.:eek::D

[keithm]

I was on QM2 a few months ago and based on a conversation with a senior officer who I am friends with for many years this is what I know. The reason for no dry docking in 2014 is a complete overhaul proposed for 2015. At the moment discussions and plans include:

- Ending Todd English contract and placing a specialty dining such as a Veranda Grill

- Redoing the entire Kings Court for better flow

- Removing the Winter Garden

- Removing the basketballs courts and lookout on Deck 13 for more luxury cabins

- Revamping the Britannia Club dining experience

- Refreshing the Britannia Restaurant

There was no mention of the Grills going and as far as I am aware they are profitable as David Dingle outlines in this interview: http://www.travelagentcentral.com/cruises/iconic-outlook-one-one-david-dingle-ceo-cunard-line-44314

Keep in mind the above are planning stages. As we know with Cunard things can quickly change or remain the same.

Miguel said the same thing..These changes are not etched in stone, but he felt the time to move to a different line. He liked seaborn at first, but then they had issues. So he chose Murano Celebrity Eclipse & really likes it. He also mentioned about TE going away in favor of a Varanda rest.

[keithm]

Absolutely True. Turning Cunard ships into ordinary cruise ships is a sure way to lose most of your repeat business.

I totally agree, but we ALL know how "well" Carnival has been managing their cruiselines!

[Presto2]

Absolutely True. Turning Cunard ships into ordinary cruise ships is a sure way to lose most of your repeat business.

 

But it means that those of us who can't afford Grill prices, but still want a quality experience, can still afford it without having to stay with the likes of Celebrity :)

 

I am not too sure what an 'ordinary cruise ship' is, however, as each line seems to have its pros and cons. :confused:

[BobBranst]

I totally agree, but we ALL know how "well" Carnival has been managing their cruiselines!

 

While there is no doubt that Carnival Corporation has had a some highly publicized disasters recently, it is also true that there would not be a Queen Mary 2 or any of the current Cunard Queens without the Carnival Corporation. With 10 subsidiary lines and over 100 ships, they operate quite successfully in many different markets. While it are far from perfect, I believe it would be a mistake to characterize it as a poorly managed company.

[BobBranst]

I am not too sure what an 'ordinary cruise ship' is, however, as each line seems to have its pros and cons. :confused:

 

My personal definition of "ordinary cruise ship" are those that lack the "formality" present on Cunard. I prefer a large ballroom and a proper dance band to floating amusement parks. Most of all, I like a ship that caters primarily to adults so I don't have to share my dinner and shows surrounded by hordes of screaming children in shorts and swimwear. I suppose these might be possible without the Grills, but I seriously doubt if it would be the same without them.

 

Just to clarify, we normally choose Britannia but would probably switch to the Grillls if we were to win the lottery :)

[cunardaddict]

I tend to take information like this with a grain of salt. Unfortunately, some people love to make disparaging remarks about their former employers. The spreading of unfounded rumors may be the reason why he is no longer are working for Cunard.

 

Exactly.

[BlueRiband]

... The reason for no dry docking in 2014 is a complete overhaul proposed for 2015...

 

Payne has mentioned in passing that Carnival was moving toward a 5-year dry docking cycle for their ships. If this is true than 2016 would be next as she was last dry docked in 2011.

...Removing the basketballs courts and lookout on Deck 13 for more luxury cabins

 

Not sure how this would add to weight. Payne had also said in interview that QM2 was pretty much "maxed out" from the start in order to justify the construction costs. He had been specifically asked about major refits since QE2 had undergone so many in her career. For every ton of weight above a ship needs two tons below. It is vital that QM2 be able to navigate the Elbe River.

 

It is entirely possible that somebody did a feasibility study as it would make economic sense to maximize revenue generating space. The bulk of the revenue does come from fares. Payne gave a talk at the Webb Institute last October which included the revenue and expense pie charts. (Advance to the 37:02 mark for Payne's presentation.)

[Cunard Cruiser]

I could be wrong but from my memory when Carnival sued Rolls Royce for the issues with QM2 Azipods they stated she required frequent dry docking for review and repairs of the pods compared to typical dry-docking schedule. I realize Stephen Payne states that QM2 was maxed out from the beginning; however a ship can’t stay in class or remain modern/up-to-date attracting cliental without being refreshed and renovated.

Edited February 9, 2014 by Cunard Cruiser

[southland rob]

I really doubt that this is true.

 

At a recent Travel Agent's briefing, the information given was that Cunard's

bottom line has been improving in the last couple of years and that the

fastest growing sector has been the Grills.

In that case it would seem to be counter productive to do away with them.

 

With Cunard, as with most cruise lines, the cabins that sell out first are the

most expensive and the least expensive.

 

Rob

[pepperrn]

Gosh, this year is going fast, April 1st already ;) . Well played Keithm! :) Some nearly fell for your little jape, you rascal :) .

 

I'm sure that if major changes and rebuilds of QM2 are planned, the very first people to be informed would be the dining room staff :rolleyes: . It's not like they ever gossip with passengers, so they can be totally trusted to keep a corporate secret.

 

I first heard stories of extra cabins on deck 13, the stern being boxed off (ala QE) instead of terraced as now, several years ago. And again, it was an ex-member of the dining room staff (then working for a competing cruise line) who had the "inside story" of the huge changes to QM2's profile that were "guaranteed to take place in the winter of 2011"...

 

Doing away with the grills? Sorry, I can't concentrate on that at the moment, I think a pig just flew past my window.

Edited February 9, 2014 by pepperrn