NCL called me! RSC clarification.

[fshagan]

I thought the same thing. Even with a disability, there are many, so how would they draw the line? As you stated, why should RSC be waived?

 

It could be as part of their effort to afford the person a "reasonable accommodation" based on the person's circumstances. If that person is not able to easily eat in another venue, and the ship is under the ADA jurisdiction, a company may decide it is better to waive the charge for the same items otherwise free in another venue if that person is not able to easily get to that other venue (or has another issue, such as must be fed by another person, etc). The ADA's main enforcement mechanism is empowering civil litigation by aggrieved parties so I could definitely see a company waiving a charge to meet the "reasonable accommodation" threshold.

[Minoushka]

With all these extra charges ,tips drink s18% etc etc etc ...spe ialty testaurants and shows ..what exactly is our cruise fare which is not cheap ..covering .if you charge a daily service charge it should cover all .Originally in specialty restaurants you paid a service charge not the food ...or so we were told ..now we pay both food and 18% tip ...its becoming expensive

I find MDR

Food not always up to snuff ..it is not fair to expect to dish out even more for good food by going to Specialty restaurant

This has to stop or cruising will become rediculously expensive without reason ....or start including a heap of stuff

Charging fir room service is a big nono....its what makes cruising special ...you will kill that if you keep charging

Charge 1daily service charge that covers all .

Soecialty restaurants should be free .. 1visit per restaurant per cruise ...much fairer

 

Im not really happy with these plus plus plus over my cruise fare

[njhorseman]

Welcome to Cruise Critic, where correcting someone is more important than contributing to the content of the discussion. Even when you are wrong. It's a case of argumentum ad ignorantiam all over these forums.

 

I know you, and know you worked with ADA law every day for quite a few years. And I know you know that the ADA, or any Federal law, is not applied the same in every state in every circumstance.

 

The answer is that foreign flagged cruise ships may or may not have ADA requirements while in an American port depending on the state. Because, indeed, the Federal ADA may not apply to cruise ships in certain states (but does in others).

 

The Fifth Circuit's decision in Spector v. Norwegian Cruise Lines, Ltd., 356 F.3d 641 (5th Cir. 2004), held that the ADA does not apply to foreign-flag cruise ships serving U.S. ports.

 

However, the Eleventh Circuit in Steven v. Premier Cruises, Inc., 215 F.3d 1237 (11th Cir. 2000) held that it did apply while the ship was in an American port.

 

I didn't find a Supreme Court or later ruling in either the Fifth or Eleventh Circuit that superseded these rulings, but it could be out there.

 

An NCL cruise ship in a port in the Fifth Circuit is NOT subject to the law (LA, MS and TX) but one in the Eleventh Circuit (AL, FL and GA) is subject to the ADA. All predicated on whether or not the above decisions have been overturned or superseded.

 

As to the other question, I know you were involved in ensuring that "reasonable accommodation" for those with disabilities was in place from the passage of the ADA in 1990 to some 15 - 20 years thereafter as part of your daily job. Those people are probably all dead now, but you lightened their burden when they needed it the most. And you are absolutely right, there may indeed be a policy, based on providing reasonable accommodation, that a company would put in place IF they were subject to the ADA and started a charge for a service previously free; it would all depend on their own policies and risk management guidelines from their lawyers and internal advocates. Because, as you know, the ADA empowers litigation from an aggrieved party.

 

In June 2005, in Spector v. Norwegian Cruise Lines, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that Title III of ADA did apply to foreign flagged ships calling on US ports, overturning the Fifth Circuit's ruling.

 

Here's the ruling: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/04pdf/03-1388.pdf

Edited April 11, 2015 by njhorseman

[maywell]

With all these extra charges ,tips drink s18% etc etc etc ...spe ialty testaurants and shows ..what exactly is our cruise fare which is not cheap ..covering .if you charge a daily service charge it should cover all .Originally in specialty restaurants you paid a service charge not the food ...or so we were told ..now we pay both food and 18% tip ...its becoming expensive

I find MDR

Food not always up to snuff ..it is not fair to expect to dish out even more for good food by going to Specialty restaurant

This has to stop or cruising will become rediculously expensive without reason ....or start including a heap of stuff

Charging fir room service is a big nono....its what makes cruising special ...you will kill that if you keep charging

Charge 1daily service charge that covers all .

Soecialty restaurants should be free .. 1visit per restaurant per cruise ...much fairer

 

Im not really happy with these plus plus plus over my cruise fare

 

Here's what the cruise fare covers and don't:

http://www.ncl.com/faq/cruise-fare-includes

 

Regarding the specialty restaurants, the 'free' alternative to that is the MDR and buffet which is included in the fare. Regarding room service - one either used it alot for all 3 meals / just breakfast, or just use it once / twice/ not at all during the trip; that's why there's not really a 'united front' regarding the change.

[hpecorari]

It could be as part of their effort to afford the person a "reasonable accommodation" based on the person's circumstances. If that person is not able to easily eat in another venue, and the ship is under the ADA jurisdiction, a company may decide it is better to waive the charge for the same items otherwise free in another venue if that person is not able to easily get to that other venue (or has another issue, such as must be fed by another person, etc). The ADA's main enforcement mechanism is empowering civil litigation by aggrieved parties so I could definitely see a company waiving a charge to meet the "reasonable accommodation" threshold.

 

I don't believe for a moment that anyone.....HC or not eats ALL their meals in their cabin. If they can get to the buffet, MDR, or any other eating establishment on the ship then they should pay as anyone else does. IF, however, they eat ALL their meals in their cabin....we'll then I can see waiving the fee.

 

However, I'm sure they're not taking a cruise and spending 24/7 x 7 days or more in their cabin.

 

Harriet

[lynn2002]

I don't believe for a moment that anyone.....HC or not eats ALL their meals in their cabin. If they can get to the buffet, MDR, or any other eating establishment on the ship then they should pay as anyone else does. IF, however, they eat ALL their meals in their cabin....we'll then I can see waiving the fee.

 

However, I'm sure they're not taking a cruise and spending 24/7 x 7 days or more in their cabin.

 

Harriet

 

 

I think you are missing the point of how disability affects not only the disabled person but also the carer and the rest of the family. My friend has a progressive neurological disease that affects him mentally and physically. He uses a manual wheelchair but can still tire very easily. When he tires we have to go back to the cabin and get him ready for bed because the more tired he is the more accidents and falls he has. There are many families in the same situation as us. The fact that they are not able to go to the restaurant one night - does that mean they should go hungry. I have a young daughter, should she also go hungry? I cannot leave him alone in the cabin as he may get hurt trying to fetch something or get himself a glass of water.

 

We have been on five cruises and so far not used room service so I am not saying it because I want something for free. Paying $7.95 is neither here or there considering the cost of the cruise and the fact that we have to book well ahead of time to find a wheelchair accessible cabin that takes three people, but it saddens me when I hear people with no compassion for others.

[CanadaTraveller]

:) I had a message on my phone this morning from "Dawn" from NCL. She left a call back number with the reason she was calling, so I called her back. She wanted to clarify the room service charge per the postings on CC and the FB site.

 

 

 

Dawn stated that as far as she knows the RSC is a 2 week trial on 2 of their ships and is only for the full entrees (hot meals). The Continental breakfast will continue to be served at NO additional charge in the mornings. This confirms what another CC poster listed with photo's of the full menu and the door card for the Continental breakfast. She did not know if this was going to go Fleet wide as this information has not been communicated to them as of yet. Remember she is the messenger, not the CEO, we don't shoot the messenger here.....Don't shoot me either.

 

 

 

I have another call into NCL regarding some follow up verification questions that I thought of after I got off the phone.

 

1. Full Suites and Havens RSC waived or just the Havens?

 

2. ADA, RSC waived if there is a disability issue?

 

3. How did NCL handle the issue with those on the BA and GA who weren't happy with the surprise RSC?

 

4. If NCL does continues the RSC for full menu fare Fleet wide, how will this be communicated to those with a future booking?

 

 

 

Dawn (sp) was pleasant, professional and listened to my concerns. My issue was with the way NCL rolled out of the charges without prior notification to current guests on board the Getaway and Breakaway. She understood my concern about the RSC roll out that could have / should have been communicated better. I suggest it would be NICE if there could be a NEWS window icon/window on the NCL website. The NEWS window would inform cruisers of changes regarding status of specific cruises and rate changes and updated weekly. It is better to get the news (good or bad) directly from NCL in my opinion.

 

 

 

If I hear back, I will add the answers to the above questions.

 

We have all read the LONG posts regarding this issue, so I think that the call from NCL was a positive step in improving communication.

 

 

 

“A little Consideration, a little thought for others, makes all the difference.“

 

― Winnie the Pooh

 

 

 

Thanks OP for sharing your discussion with Norwegian. It is greatly appreciated. I just wish others had read all the way down to your Winnie the Pooh quote. Not everything requires a scholarly review of each word, possible meaning and intent of the speaker. You had a chat, you were told some things and you graciously shared.

 

From my perspective, I am happy to pay for expanded service. Cooked eggs sound great. It may prompt me to use RoomService more often. But I won't know until my next cruise and I won't worry about it, vow never to cruise NCL, study my contract, and get myself filled with anxiety for what is relaxation time. Times change. I once got free delivery of milk; I don't anymore. My life went on. I am sure others will be able to cope with this change.

 

All will be well if we channel our inner Winnie.

[fshagan]

I don't believe for a moment that anyone.....HC or not eats ALL their meals in their cabin. If they can get to the buffet, MDR, or any other eating establishment on the ship then they should pay as anyone else does. IF, however, they eat ALL their meals in their cabin....we'll then I can see waiving the fee.

 

However, I'm sure they're not taking a cruise and spending 24/7 x 7 days or more in their cabin.

 

It's an interesting question. The nature of the ADA is that the company has to try and anticipate what a reasonable accommodation is for each and every individual (not people as a group) that board the ship. So what is reasonable to me and you is not the standard; it is what is reasonable for that individual who is on board.