Have you ever had people give you a hard time with your children on a cruise?

[bububr]

I never said kids don't belong on a cruiseship. and I also said most of the people that participate on these message boards and have cruised frequently are the exception to the rule.

 

I ALSO agreed that many adults can act like idiots.

 

My point was that EVERYONE should follow the rules and be accountable for their own actions or their childrens.

 

I find that comments like "Children are not little people but children" to be QUITE rude and selfish. Cruises are for people if you do not consider your child a person then put them in a kennel for a week while your gone.

 

As far as Celebrity, who is owned by RCCL. It was formed not as a twin line but a more UPSCALE line...one step tward Crystal, Raddison, etc. As I said I saw very few children, and to be honest very few 'bad' children over the years but I have had cabins next to screaming babies where I could not sleep all night as well as a few other disturbances.

 

So not being able to sleep after I've 'paid for my cruise' night after night. What happened to my rights and my vacation. It wasn't as nice as it should have been because a couple of rude and inconsiderate people dragged their kid along. If I yelled and screamed all night next to your cabin for 7 night wouldn't you be just a little unhappy also? or would you shrug it off and just think I was cranky.

 

Celebrity at this time DOES do a good job with their kids program...they have to have it because they ARE affliliated with RCCL. Usually I hear of no more than 50 or 60 kids on board, and I see a dozen or so, and 99% of them are like 'little people'.. then there are the others. And the others are becoming MORE, and MORE, and MORE.

 

Kids and families are a minority on Celebrity, not a majority. And yes I've seen the advertisements and website. All of their material is based aound adults. Photos of older adults in gowns and tuxes, casinos, drinking...etc.

I have their 2006 brochures, and again adults....the only thing that I can find is a link on their home page HALF WAY DOWN under 'Why Celebrity', after 'New to cruising", a 'taste of Celebrity" entertainment abounds" and the "spa link" so after numerous ADULT based ideas then squeezed in is a little one and a half paragraph long decription aoubt the fun factory age relevence, and how they will have to groups the all the kids together if their is not a lot of participation in the club. Hmmm..doesn't sound like they are promoting it...more like offering it as an option.

 

Now, go to RCCL website. Upbeat music, photos of LOTS of kids families. Almost no one is dressed up, all in swimsuits, causal clothing.. Dad, Mom, and the kids....The info for family cruising is about three pages long with informative decriptions, suggestions, seperate links for the different age groups..etc. Is RCCL PROMOTING FAMILY CRUISING? YES!!!!!!!!

 

RCCL lots of kids families more to do, activities for everyone, kid oriented.

Celebrity MORE adults, Fewer KIDS. kids club varies with the amount of children on board.

 

You'd have to be BLIND or stupid or just plain ignorant not to see the difference.

 

Once again, Kids should cruise like anybody else...BUT ALL passengers whether 1 or 99 should be accountable for their actions or the actions of their children regardless. Thats my point.

 

Dave:eek:

[JandD Mom]

You'd have to be BLIND or stupid or just plain ignorant not to see the difference.

:

 

Forgive me for being one of the "stupid" people, but perhaps you should look at Celebrity's web site. I note that their facilities and programs are as extensive as the other "family" lines you mentioned. Also, if you read their brochure, you will see on the map for each of their various ships, a very large area called "ship mates fun factory" or something to that effect.

 

By the way, for those of you who don't like kids ... why are you trolling the family cruising board?

 

Signed: One of the ignorant.

 

http://www.celebrity.com/whyceleb/singleThumbTxtSub.do;jsessionid=0000TDXM3h-UNJ5wPFrKw0i0fJj:1028etrd4?pagename=family_friendly_cruising&cS=NAVBAR

[Gertrude]

=

By the way, for those of you who don't like kids ... why are you trolling the family cruising board?

 

LOL. You are 100% correct. I also find that people who have no facts to support their arguments, like to resort to calling people things like ignorant and stupid.

 

I have been enjoying this thread. It is amazing that people book one of the mass market cruise lines and are then upset to find kids on board.

[cuccicruisers]

We have never had a problem on a cruise when our children have been with us....the reason I hope is they are for the most part very well behaved. The following are some things that I do to make sure I have the best shot of it staying that way....

 

1. I always have lollipops....perfect for buses and waiting areas

2. Each child has a small bag of books or quiet toys to bring if we are going to be somewhere such as a dining room

3. We feed the kids at the buffet and then drop them off at the kid's club and then go to our long dinner

4. I carry a backpack on excusions which has an insulated bottom for a stash of snacks and drinks. I also carry children's tylenol.

5. We always use phrases such as "thank you" and "excuse me"...politeness goes a long one

6. Most of all....we practice what we preach. The rules at home are the same as on a cruise or in any public place. Be polite, think of others and listen !

 

I would only choose a cruise line that caters to families when we are bringing along the kids. I think for the most part everyone we have met have been complimentary of my children...but let's face it some people are just not positive and nothing will ever change that.

 

I love vacation, love cruising and my kids feel the same way.

[helenb]

I've just finished reading through this long thread and there have been many good points raised.

 

My DH and I fell in love with cruising on our honeymoon and we have cruised many times with just the two of us. Our youngest has just turned 3 and now we are going to take our 2 kids on a cruise next weekend.

 

We knew that cruisintg would be an adjustment for them. So we purposely chose a cruise line and ship (Sapphire Princess) that had a lot of kids' facilites, and a port within driving distance and that was in the same time zone as our home.

 

We want to be able to take our kids on cruises to Europe in 5 or 6 years. But if that is their first cruise then how are they going to behave? Kids need to LEARN how to behave in an adult dining room, in public areas, in common swimming pools, etc. If they don't have the experience how can they be expected to know how to deal with it?

 

Now that doesn't mean that I'm going to let my kids run wild. I'm bringing a big bag of toys and activities to entertain them in the dining room as well as other comforts of home and I have been teaching the kids about table manners, politeness and that there are times we need to be quiet. If they scream somewhere I will take them and leave. They're not going to be perfect for an entire week, but if they don't get the chance to behave properly how will they learn to do that?

 

I will do my darndest to be considerate of others, but at the same time I want to use this as a learing experience for my kids. If they have a good time they will want to go on another cruise, and then that just ups the motivation to behave properly, doesn't it?

[usgoobers5]

[Kids need to LEARN how to behave in an adult dining room, in public areas, in common swimming pools, etc. If they don't have the experience how can they be expected to know how to deal with it?

 

I will do my darndest to be considerate of others, but at the same time I want to use this as a learing experience for my kids. If they have a good time they will want to go on another cruise, and then that just ups the motivation to behave properly, doesn't it?

 

You didn't get the memo? Us parents are no longer allowed to vacation or leave the house until our children are at least twelve years old. All the anti kid vacationers have finally past a law that went into effect January 1st 2006. If you are found to be in violation of this law you will be banned to the only kid friendly vacation spot left in the world Disneyland or Disneyworld whichever is closer to your children filled home base! Parents we must unite to change this law. LOL :D :D :D

[helenb]

If you are found to be in violation of this law you will be banned to the only kid friendly vacation spot left in the world Disneyland or Disneyworld whichever is closer to your children filled home base! Parents we must unite to change this law. LOL :D :D :D

 

Hey according to most Moms I know Disney has been taken over by adults who knock small kids down while running to Splash mountain in the morning! :)

[Onessa]

Just in case any of you missed it here are the highlights of the Leave ALLChildren Behind act of 2006. :D

 

Article I - Children have no place on a cruise ship, at a resort, in a hotel, or at any resturant where you do not place your order by shouting into a clown statue. Children should be left behind if parents of said children wish to visit any public space.

 

Article II - Children are allowed one vacation every two years - driving vacation of no more than seven days in duration. Entire vacation must occur during the period between Memorial Day and Labor Day. Vacation destination must be a state or national park. Entire group must tent camp. All campgrounds used by families with children will be at least 15 miles from the closest RV park. Families will clear destination and timeframe of trip with all childless adults in the US at least three years in advance (so that they can plan to be out of the country that week).

 

Article III - In any public facility, children will, at all times, be seen but not heard. Being seen is discouraged as well.

• Parents will carry duct tape at all times (for use on mouths and/or extremities).
  
• Parents/caregivers will be expected to anticipate and deal with all outbursts at least 1/2 hour before they occur.
  
• Children will be "shushed" every 10 to 15 minutes (even when they are not talking).

Article IV - Children will be granted no rights. Childless adults will be able to cut into line in front of any child, will be able to remove any food from the child's plate that they feel is inappropriate for a child (or that they want for themselves), and will be able to clear all children out of any room or other area at any time for whatever reason. Childless adults need not move to allow a child eggress down any passageway or stairway.

 

Article V - All provisions become null and void when said childless adult is travelling with their grandchild, niece/nephew, or significant other's child.

[klarocco]

Onessa....THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I am still LMOA!!!!!!

[Zaniac]

but I have had cabins next to screaming babies where I could not sleep all night as well as a few other disturbances.

 

So not being able to sleep after I've 'paid for my cruise' night after night. What happened to my rights and my vacation. It wasn't as nice as it should have been because a couple of rude and inconsiderate people dragged their kid along. If I yelled and screamed all night next to your cabin for 7 night wouldn't you be just a little unhappy also? or would you shrug it off and just think I was cranky.

 

Are you for real Dave? Rude or inconsiderate people dragged their kid along? Well too bad for you. Do you honestly feel that they purposely set out to ruin your vacation? Did you ever politely bring this issue up with them? I can't believe how arrogant you are and hope I do not run into anyone like you on our cruise. Maybe you should stick to exclusive AO cruises if you hate kids so much. ugh...I don't even want to waste my time anymore responding to your trash...

 

 

The bottom line people is that the Cruiselines are catering more and more to families with Children, get used to it. I admit I haven't always been tolerant of kids in the past but always respected their right to be there. Since I now have my own DD of 8 mo I have become increasingly more tolerant of other children. I agree that the parent should keep their kids in line and make every effort not to disrupt anyones hard earned vacation but for the trolls (who are probably childless and miserable in their own personal lives) who come on here and B***h, B***h, B***h about the kids... quit whining and try to enjoy yourselves.. you may just have some fun when you decide to relax.

[OsirisShotDown]

That was awesome!

 

Sad thing is, that really seems to be the attitude of a certain contingent at times... :eek:

 

Heather

[Kuffam]

We have a DS (2.5) with hyperactively and development issues. But we refuse to allow this to stop us from living, we make adjustments to accommodate him, but we do the things we want. We've observed that we control the behavior of our children better then other parents who allow their children to run wild. But none the less, when DS has one of his "episodes" we try to remove him from the situation if possible. However on more then one occasion we've overheard rude comments from people about his behavior. This greatly upsets DW because she feels she trying to raise our children the best we can. We've sorry if we disturb you, but IMHO I think your behavior is worse, at least we're teaching our children proper behavior and they are becoming better people because of it. You on the other hand have not learned to be nice to other people.

 

PS. for all you thoughtful parents out there who have endured then same ridicule we have, as I tell my wife: How cares what other people think! Don't let anyone with no authority over you ruin your self-esteem over your children's behavior. If the captain says something then feel bad.:eek:

[Zaniac]

PS. for all you thoughtful parents out there who have endured then same ridicule we have, as I tell my wife: How cares what other people think! Don't let anyone with no authority over you ruin your self-esteem over your children's behavior. If the captain says something then feel bad.:eek:

 

Well said, I couldn't agree more. Hope everyone has a great cruise with their kids and don't put them on too tight a leash, they are on vacation to. :)

[Pamela W]

My husband and I have been on many different cruise lines-Celebrity is our favorite. We were on four HAL trips-a line known for mainly older adults. The best cruise we ever took with them was a Christmas cruise. There were 400 kids aboard and the line did a great job of keeping them busy. My theory is if you can't beat em-join em!

[nybumpkin]

We have a DS (2.5) with hyperactively and development issues. But we refuse to allow this to stop us from living, we make adjustments to accommodate him, but we do the things we want.

 

Know the feeling. Oldest son was diagnosed at 5 with ADHD; that was after we left a church that we had attended for 10 years because he wasn't welcome (they told me I just should stay home with him since he couldn't sit still) and after he was kicked out of a private kindergarten because they couldn't handle him. Today he's very active in the church we've attended since leaving the other one and he's a high school honor student. My own theory is that the more you expose him to different places and activities, the better for him - the fact that you need to deal with developmental issues doesn't mean you need to shut him off from the world!

[karmac]

I have not read every post in this thread (haven't had time yet) but I'll make sure I do. However, I'm amazed at the number of people who have something against children. Yes, I'll admit I have 3 (15,11 & 9). Most of you people (I think & please forgive me if I'm wrong) are from the U.S. I live in Australia & we are very restricted here as to what ship/line you cruise on as we only have 3 ships (all P&O) based here. However, you have lots of choices and I'm sure that if you don't like kids then you can choose a cruise line that doesn't cater much for them (thankfully P&O do cater for them). These kids are our next generation and I, for one, enjoy nothing more than watching them enjoy themselves. Sure, they can sometimes be loud & obnoxious but it's a part of life. Live with it. As long as they are not your responsibility, what does it matter? Learn to enjoy yourselves with having kids around. I'm sure many of you are grandparents. How would you feel if strangers talked about your grandkids the way you talked about stranger's kids? I know my dad and my mother in law would be heartbroken. They adore their grandkids and would be more than happy to cruise with them or with other kids (that they don't know).

My husband & I are taking our kids on a cruise in April and whilst I trust them to be well behaved etc, I really hope that if they do do something they shouldn't, then nobody will hold it against them (or us). Nobody's perfect.

 

Karen

[babytraveler]

I'd kind of like the people who don't think kids belong on cruises to read the tread on this sub-board about my agony at considering leaving my 2 year old at home rather than deal with the child challenges onboard an unfriendly cruise.

 

I have pretty much decided at this point to leave her at home with grandparents. But really, this is an agonizing heartbreaking decision.This is not a child I want to be separated from. This child is a joy. And she's incredibly attached to me and never leaves my hip. She's intelligent and loves to see museums. She has exotic tastes and loves elegant dining. And she loves her sister and her family and wants to be with them.

 

I'm very concerned about her freaking out at being apart from us and her sister for over a week. And heaven forbid she gets very sick or something and her mom isn't there for her.

 

(As posted elsewhere, I'd stay home except that I think that this is a huge trip for her 5 year old sister, and I think it would worse to abandon older sister on this big trip with excrusions than to abandon 2 year old with grandparents. We'd skip trip entirely except that it is a family event with 26 people and perhaps the last time the whole family will get together like this and it is just too important to make husband and older child skip trip to accomodate 2 year old).

 

But, as thoroughly discussed on this board, it is unfair to child, other passengers, and ourselves to force our youngest child into a situation that is completely hostile to her.

 

The cruise line HAL has no kids pictured in brochure. They used to have a kids program that starts at 5, but they've lowered it to 3. But no child under 3 is allowed in the kids area at all, ever. Little kids are not allowed in pool. No diapers or wipes are available on board--you have to bring all your own gear. No toys are provided. Excursion vehicles don't have seatbelts for car seats. Excursions are things like helicopter rides, rafting, and glacier walks--not the kind of thing I can do with her in a stroller. And she'd have to eat, so into the dining room she would go with the rest of the family. Short of saying don't bring your toddlers, they've sent the message. I sure wouldn't have picked HAL except that other family members booked this cruise and that's just how it is.

 

We'd be a family of four, none of us good sleepers, crammed into a cabin constantly waking each other up, and child will be thrown off by a multiple hour time change, and she'll be stressed because she's flown 11 hours and changed planes and slept in a hotel the night before and in unfamiliar surroundings with 2000 strangers. So there will be meltdowns and night crying no doubt.

 

If you take a family vacation, the whole family should go. If a family of 26 is gathering, the youngest child should be there too. I think it beyond unfortunate that there are semi-family vacations that work for some kids in the family but not all, and that both the ships and the fellow passengers have made it so unpleasant that I'm actually planning to leave a 2 year old home.

 

So if I change my mind and you see me walking the decks and halls and stairwells for a week trying to keep a 2 year old somewhat amused, and you wonder why anyone would bring a toddler on HAL, that's why. And no, I can't control her. With all the above mentioned challenges, there will be night crying and there will be meltdowns, which are not easy to stop. That's why I (and I'm sure other parents) will indulge a child a bit and let some behavior things slide. Because if you are too strict in a challenging situation, you get a complete and total behavior meltdown. It's not "misbehaving." It's a complete breakdown of the child's ability to function. And I've had it on vacation before, when cirucmstances have been out of our control and child just can't take it anymore. So if you see me, please give us all some understanding and indulgence and make it easier not harder.

 

As I've posted elsewhere, I'm shocked to hear so many incidents on cruiseships where children do things to other people (throwing stuff on them, etc.). My experince with kids is that they might misbehave or whine or cry, but they aren't out to do it TO ANYONE. They are just doing it.

 

I'm sure we're not alone. Was it Tolstoy who said all normal families are very much alike?

 

We've taken our kids to very fancy places, where they have been perfect, while adult diners have glared at us all the whole time. Then at the end, they come and compliment us on having such well behaved children. That bugs me. It's kind of like saying you thought they'd be horrible but are surprised they were good. I also have a hard time believing all the posters who claim they never let their kids misbehave in their day and their kids were taught to be well behaved in public. Really all people are the same, and I'm sure all previous generations had meltdowns, too. Except in previous culture maybe kids were not out and about in public so much.

 

My point is that a child who got up at regular time, ate, had 3 hours of activity, ate, took a nap, had 3 hours of activity, ate, then went to bed will probably be a little angel. Mine are. But throw that time change in and some travel and some unfamiliar surroundings and a host of frowny faces and we'll all see some misbehaving. So here's a call to cut families some slack.

 

And I hear you. I used to be a business traveler. I know no one thinks oh happy day, I get to sit next to the baby who might cry at the air pressure or from being confined for 11 hours. But we're all annoying in our own way, so what are you going to do?

 

There. I've said everything I have to say. I'll be quiet now!

[halos]

I'd kind of like the people who don't think kids belong on cruises to read the tread on this sub-board about my agony at considering leaving my 2 year old at home rather than deal with the child challenges onboard an unfriendly cruise.

 

I have pretty much decided at this point to leave her at home with grandparents. But really, this is an agonizing heartbreaking decision.This is not a child I want to be separated from. This child is a joy. And she's incredibly attached to me and never leaves my hip. She's intelligent and loves to see museums. She has exotic tastes and loves elegant dining. And she loves her sister and her family and wants to be with them.

 

I'm very concerned about her freaking out at being apart from us and her sister for over a week. And heaven forbid she gets very sick or something and her mom isn't there for her.

 

(As posted elsewhere, I'd stay home except that I think that this is a huge trip for her 5 year old sister, and I think it would worse to abandon older sister on this big trip with excrusions than to abandon 2 year old with grandparents. We'd skip trip entirely except that it is a family event with 26 people and perhaps the last time the whole family will get together like this and it is just too important to make husband and older child skip trip to accomodate 2 year old).

 

But, as thoroughly discussed on this board, it is unfair to child, other passengers, and ourselves to force our youngest child into a situation that is completely hostile to her.

 

The cruise line HAL has no kids pictured in brochure. They used to have a kids program that starts at 5, but they've lowered it to 3. But no child under 3 is allowed in the kids area at all, ever. Little kids are not allowed in pool. No diapers or wipes are available on board--you have to bring all your own gear. No toys are provided. Excursion vehicles don't have seatbelts for car seats. Excursions are things like helicopter rides, rafting, and glacier walks--not the kind of thing I can do with her in a stroller. And she'd have to eat, so into the dining room she would go with the rest of the family. Short of saying don't bring your toddlers, they've sent the message. I sure wouldn't have picked HAL except that other family members booked this cruise and that's just how it is.

 

We'd be a family of four, none of us good sleepers, crammed into a cabin constantly waking each other up, and child will be thrown off by a multiple hour time change, and she'll be stressed because she's flown 11 hours and changed planes and slept in a hotel the night before and in unfamiliar surroundings with 2000 strangers. So there will be meltdowns and night crying no doubt.

 

If you take a family vacation, the whole family should go. If a family of 26 is gathering, the youngest child should be there too. I think it beyond unfortunate that there are semi-family vacations that work for some kids in the family but not all, and that both the ships and the fellow passengers have made it so unpleasant that I'm actually planning to leave a 2 year old home.

 

So if I change my mind and you see me walking the decks and halls and stairwells for a week trying to keep a 2 year old somewhat amused, and you wonder why anyone would bring a toddler on HAL, that's why. And no, I can't control her. With all the above mentioned challenges, there will be night crying and there will be meltdowns, which are not easy to stop. That's why I (and I'm sure other parents) will indulge a child a bit and let some behavior things slide. Because if you are too strict in a challenging situation, you get a complete and total behavior meltdown. It's not "misbehaving." It's a complete breakdown of the child's ability to function. And I've had it on vacation before, when cirucmstances have been out of our control and child just can't take it anymore. So if you see me, please give us all some understanding and indulgence and make it easier not harder.

 

As I've posted elsewhere, I'm shocked to hear so many incidents on cruiseships where children do things to other people (throwing stuff on them, etc.). My experince with kids is that they might misbehave or whine or cry, but they aren't out to do it TO ANYONE. They are just doing it.

 

I'm sure we're not alone. Was it Tolstoy who said all normal families are very much alike?

 

We've taken our kids to very fancy places, where they have been perfect, while adult diners have glared at us all the whole time. Then at the end, they come and compliment us on having such well behaved children. That bugs me. It's kind of like saying you thought they'd be horrible but are surprised they were good. I also have a hard time believing all the posters who claim they never let their kids misbehave in their day and their kids were taught to be well behaved in public. Really all people are the same, and I'm sure all previous generations had meltdowns, too. Except in previous culture maybe kids were not out and about in public so much.

 

My point is that a child who got up at regular time, ate, had 3 hours of activity, ate, took a nap, had 3 hours of activity, ate, then went to bed will probably be a little angel. Mine are. But throw that time change in and some travel and some unfamiliar surroundings and a host of frowny faces and we'll all see some misbehaving. So here's a call to cut families some slack.

 

And I hear you. I used to be a business traveler. I know no one thinks oh happy day, I get to sit next to the baby who might cry at the air pressure or from being confined for 11 hours. But we're all annoying in our own way, so what are you going to do?

 

There. I've said everything I have to say. I'll be quiet now!

 

Hmm.

Honey I don't buy what you're selling.

If you really wanted to not be separated from your child you'd bring her and wouldn't give a rats butt what anyone else thought. From little things you said in your post it seems to me like you realize that a cruise ship is not really where a 2 year old should be...not because of the 'kid haters' but because it honestly isn't a good place for a baby...you won't be able to do excursions with the baby and you don't really want to be stuck on board while your husband and older child get to go....it doesn't sound like you want to have to walk away from the crowd when she (or he) has a meltdown (because obviously that would be the right thing to do). Please do not blame this situation on the cruise lines not being baby friendly enough OR the other passengers who want a vacation free of children becauase that isn't fair at all. There are several other cruise lines out there that are probably at least a bit more child friendly that HAL. Your gripe should be with the family member that put this vacation together and didn't consider your baby...although an Alaskan Cruise on any line would be difficult with a 2 year old.

I guess what I have to say is welcome to parenthood. There are sacrifices to be made...either on that ship with your baby or off you will sacrifice something. That is what parenting is about, SCARIFICE...and it doesn't ever end either.

Get used ot it.

And, by the way..if you do decide to leave your child at home, I can tell you first hand that she will survive just fine, she won't freak out without you (not for too long anyway) You will feel worse than she does (if you allow yourself to wallow in it all week on the ship) and she will be happy as can be with her grandparents...not to mention that after she spends some time apart from you, and sees that you do return, it will be a GOOD thing for her and will not scar her as you seem to think it will, but will be good for her.

Trust me that the anticipation of leaving her is far worse than actually doing it.

You'll both be fine.

AND if she goes on the ship with you, have a good time. If you don't get to do excursions, just make sure you get a promise from your husband that you can go back another time when the kids are both older.

[Cruisin' Chick]

I remember when our daughter was really little. My hubby was fretting over whether we would be able to take a vacation with her. So we ended up not going anywhere for almost two years. Our cruise right before that was during my pregnancy.

 

But then we decided to try it out with a weekend cruise. My hubby also wanted to check out the Tall Ships so we added that. Thus, we went on Carnival for a Baja California trip and then drove down to San Diego for a few more days. Worked out really nicely. At 23 months, the girl couldn't be in the kids program. But Carnival is very kid friendly. We realized she took to cruising very well (she didn't get sea sick at all on her SIXTh cruise to Hawaii last month despite rough seas that made me woozy).

 

So even if it's too late to change these current plans, why not check out going on a cruise with just the immediate family. Make it a short one -- 3 or 4 days. That way, you won't have to bring as much stuff.

[Cruisin' Chick]

Babytraveler, I didn't see where you live but if you end up flying to take a cruise, here's a suggestion. Get into the port city a day or so before and buy what you need there (sippy cups, pullups, juice boxes) for your toddler.

[2Cruise4Ever]

Babytraveler ~ I really know how you feel about being separated from your kids. I have a hard enough time doing it on a daily basis when going to work. However, we did take both our kids with us on a cruise last Summer (2yo DD and 7yo DS). Let me tell you, we had an absolute blast. I love spending time with my kids no matter where we are. They are very polite and respectful of others. They know when to be quiet and when they can be roudy. And, they absolute loved the Kids Crew on NCL's Dawn. Please re-consider taking both kids the next time you cruise. Most of the cruise lines are so kid friendly these days you all would be hard-pressed not to have a good tiem. And, keep this in mind: you won't hear (read) much about childless travelers commenting on how good the neighbors' kids were. You'll most likely only see those who complain about them. Remember that most people are 10 times more likely to report bad experiences than good ones. You keep cruising and know that your kids are going to have a good time and you are an awesome parent! Kudos to you for loving them that much :D

[Lomita]

Hmm.

Honey I don't buy what you're selling.

If you really wanted to not be separated from your child you'd bring her and wouldn't give a rats butt what anyone else thought. From little things you said in your post it seems to me like you realize that a cruise ship is not really where a 2 year old should be...not because of the 'kid haters' but because it honestly isn't a good place for a baby...you won't be able to do excursions with the baby and you don't really want to be stuck on board while your husband and older child get to go....it doesn't sound like you want to have to walk away from the crowd when she (or he) has a meltdown (because obviously that would be the right thing to do). Please do not blame this situation on the cruise lines not being baby friendly enough OR the other passengers who want a vacation free of children becauase that isn't fair at all. There are several other cruise lines out there that are probably at least a bit more child friendly that HAL. Your gripe should be with the family member that put this vacation together and didn't consider your baby...although an Alaskan Cruise on any line would be difficult with a 2 year old.

I guess what I have to say is welcome to parenthood. There are sacrifices to be made...either on that ship with your baby or off you will sacrifice something. That is what parenting is about, SCARIFICE...and it doesn't ever end either.

Get used ot it.

And, by the way..if you do decide to leave your child at home, I can tell you first hand that she will survive just fine, she won't freak out without you (not for too long anyway) You will feel worse than she does (if you allow yourself to wallow in it all week on the ship) and she will be happy as can be with her grandparents...not to mention that after she spends some time apart from you, and sees that you do return, it will be a GOOD thing for her and will not scar her as you seem to think it will, but will be good for her.

Trust me that the anticipation of leaving her is far worse than actually doing it.

You'll both be fine.

AND if she goes on the ship with you, have a good time. If you don't get to do excursions, just make sure you get a promise from your husband that you can go back another time when the kids are both older.

 

I agree with much of what you said. My husband and I are planning on going on a cruise with our now-13-year-old daughter. I know everyone has strong (!) opinions on this subject and I respect the opinions of others who differ from what I believe.

 

My own observations in raising my daughter this far lead me to believe that a cruise is probably not a good choice for a family with small children (under age 9-10). FWIW we took our daughter on several extravagant (for us) land vacations when she was under seven, and I learned several things from these.

 

First off, children under the age of 5 or six are almost certainly not going to remember much (if anything) about the trip once they get older. Amazingly (to me), my daughter does not remember anything about the trip to Disneyworld/Epcot we took when she was 4. She does not remember anything at all about the trip to Monterey, CA when she was 5. She does not remember very much, hardly anything at all, about our trip to New Orleans when she was 6. So if the purpose of the trip is to build memories, you can pretty much forget about the memories your little ones are going to carry with them if they're under 6.

 

Second, children under the age of about 6 or 7 have no sense of perspective or reference to understand how very special an extravagant vacation is. For most very young kids, a drive to some local vacation spot and a stay in an economy motel is going to be every bit as thrilling and enjoyable as a vacation costing 10 times as much to some ultra-deluxe destination and a stay in a four-star resort. Very young children, who are still storing up experiences, are capable of being thrilled by much more mundane things than adults or older kids. So no matter how you slice it or dice it, or what spin you put on it, for a 3-year-old, a trip to a local museum or attraction is going to be every bit as special as a trip to France to see the Louvre. The beach that's within an hour's drive is going to be as fabulous to them as the beach in Tahiti.

 

Third, as an adult who wants to enjoy the super-deluxe vacation, going with small kids puts you at a disadvantage from the get-go. You're going to be schlepping the entertainment/provisions kit with you. You have to be cognizant of the fact that small kids have short attention spans, are impervious to hazard and potential danger, tire easily and find lots of things grown-ups enjoy boring or even scary. If you play fair with the kids and the adults who don't want to be around an overtired, whiny, verge-of-tantrum kid, you just aren't going to get to spend as much time actually ENJOYING the trip as an adult as you would if you didn't have kids.

 

Fourth, the farther you are from home, the worse off you are with a small child if something goes wrong. An ear infection in your three-year-old that's a minor concern if you're at home can become a major problem if it happens the day you're supposed to board a plane for a six-hour flight home at the end of a vacation. (If you want to know what hell is like, then be the mother of a small child with an ear infection on an airplane.)

 

Fifth, courtesy to others means that if you have small children, you have to be aware that in your zeal to open up new vistas and share new delights with your child, you need to be very mindful that you don't tread on the rights of others.

 

IMO having a child means deliberately choosing to forego some of the things that people without children can enjoy, and not feeling any regret at that decision. You can't have it all. And with the huge amounts of things you can do with young children and have the time of your life, why strain yourself trying or fret over the sacrifices you have to make?

 

My husband and I are so looking forward to our first cruise with our daughter, who has grown into an awesome young lady who I am privileged to be the mother of. I'm not sorry we've waited.

 

JMO. Your mileage may vary.

[Nliedel]

I am really going to have to disagree with much of what the above poster said. I was very lucky as a child. My father had a position that required world travel and he took us with him. I remember trips to Europe, clearly, from as early as four. I also had a real feel of the exotic and that what we did was special. My oldest remembers Disney World, in great detail, from when he was 3. When we went back this year (he is 8) he pointed things out that he could not have known about had he not remembered the past trip, (including, to my sorrow, Small World).

 

If people want to spend their money on a cruise for their children (I elected not to bring the toddlers. Too much chasing) then that is their choice. Your experiences with your child are just that. This is a very personal decision. Certainly no child should ever thread on others rights however an occasional upset child is not going to ruin my trip. Even adults lose their tempers.

 

Did my boys get every cultural experience out of the cruise they could have? No. They were 6 and 8. Even my, then 15 year old Sister in Law famously said about the Grand Canyon, "It's just a hole in the ground, can we go shopping?". It depends on the child. My boys loved the food, loved the ship, loved spending time with Dad in a fun environment would not get off to go into port. They vastly preferred to stay on board and play in the children's center. Two days of the 7 that's what they did. There is nothing wrong with letting them enjoy the children's center, it does not equate to a need for separate vacations, as some people suggest on the boards. We loved having a sitter at night on a regular basis after they were asleep and getting the opportunity to go out together. A cruise was a perfect vacation, for us and our family.

 

If your child is a monster (like my two year old, bless him but he is a challenge for me, and will not be cruising till he is 8 or older) then know your kid enough to keep your kid home. Please. You know if you child is ill behaved, you really do. You also have time to work on it with them. If your kid is reasonable, most of the time, and no kid is perfect 100%, then go on your cruise and enjoy.

[Lomita]

I am really going to have to disagree with much of what the above poster said. I was very lucky as a child. My father had a position that required world travel and he took us with him. I remember trips to Europe, clearly, from as early as four. I also had a real feel of the exotic and that what we did was special. My oldest remembers Disney World, in great detail, from when he was 3. When we went back this year (he is 8) he pointed things out that he could not have known about had he not remembered the past trip, (including, to my sorrow, Small World).

 

If people want to spend their money on a cruise for their children (I elected not to bring the toddlers. Too much chasing) then that is their choice. Your experiences with your child are just that. This is a very personal decision. Certainly no child should ever thread on others rights however an occasional upset child is not going to ruin my trip. Even adults lose their tempers.

 

Did my boys get every cultural experience out of the cruise they could have? No. They were 6 and 8. Even my, then 15 year old Sister in Law famously said about the Grand Canyon, "It's just a hole in the ground, can we go shopping?". It depends on the child. My boys loved the food, loved the ship, loved spending time with Dad in a fun environment would not get off to go into port. They vastly preferred to stay on board and play in the children's center. Two days of the 7 that's what they did. There is nothing wrong with letting them enjoy the children's center, it does not equate to a need for separate vacations, as some people suggest on the boards. We loved having a sitter at night on a regular basis after they were asleep and getting the opportunity to go out together. A cruise was a perfect vacation, for us and our family.

 

If your child is a monster (like my two year old, bless him but he is a challenge for me, and will not be cruising till he is 8 or older) then know your kid enough to keep your kid home. Please. You know if you child is ill behaved, you really do. You also have time to work on it with them. If your kid is reasonable, most of the time, and no kid is perfect 100%, then go on your cruise and enjoy.

 

Nliedel, as I said, obviously people are going to have "varying mileage" on this one. Personally, knowing that most people don't have unlimited fiscal resources, I think it's a valid choice to hold off on pricier vacations if you have children until the kids are old enough to really, truly appreciate them. The lagniappe that goes along with doing that is that older kids are less work for their parents, which frees the parents to enjoy the trip more too.

 

Cost-benefit analysis: for the cost of one super-deluxe vacation to some far-away place, or for something like a cruise, you might be able to do three or four less-expensive, close-to-home vacations that are less stressful for all involved and where you can have a really great time. It's a matter of choice.

 

I think the issue here is people on both sides of the children/no children debate who are determined to have the vacation that's best for THEM, and to heck with anyone else who stands in the way. By that I mean both the adult people who fuss at normal, well-behaved children because the kids interfere with their idea of what a perfect cruise should be, and who have unrealistic expectations; and the parents who won't curb their kids or who inflict a screaming, crying child in meltdown on others when they could bow out, simply because by-god-we've-paid-for-our-vacation-and-we're-going-to-enjoy-it-no-matter-who-it-bothers.

 

While I grit my teeth over people who, by their words or actions, show that they are clueless about age-appropriate expectations and who pride themselves on lack of compassion and tact, I also grit my teeth over parents who simply will not recognize or act when their kids (for whatever reason) exceed the bounds of what's reasonable. While the grownups who snarl at kids who are playing in the pool or otherwise behaving appropriately are worthy of censure, so too are the parents who let their kid run around in a restaurant getting in everyone's way or otherwise behaving badly. There are "bad actors" and tactless, discourteous people on both sides of the equation.

 

My point: I really believe that with very small children, you have to accept that there are some things that you might have to give up for a few years and wait until your kids are older before you try them. It really can be excruciating to be in a position where there's something you want very badly to do, but you can't do it because to do so would be unfair to your child and the people around you. An example might be going to a museum to see something you've longed to see and finding that your child is just too tired, cranky, overwrought and overstimulated to deal with. If you're in the Louvre and you long to see the Mona Lisa, but your two-year-old is an hour and a half past her naptime, in the whine-and-fuss stage leading up to meltdown, and the meltdown starts, do you do the right thing and remove yourself and your child from the museum so you don't spoil other people's enjoyment; or do you say to heck with everyone else, I'm gonna see the Mona Lisa and I don't care about anyone else because I've paid to be here and it's my right to inflict my screaming, tantruming kid on everyone else and too bad for them?

 

JMO. Your mileage may differ.

[Cruisin' Chick]

I think it's really a case by case situation. You have to judge what kind of outing or vacation is best for your children and your family.

 

I still remember a few things about a family trip to Disneyland when I was 3. And also, the bee stinging me outside our house at around the same age. That was about 48 years ago.

 

We took our daughter to Sea World when she was about ten months old. Will she remember that trip? No, but it was an experience for all three of us. We got to see how she handles a long drive (about 300 miles) and an all day excursion.

 

She went on her first cruise at 23 months. She won't remember it but we got a chance on that three-day cruise to see that she enjoys cruises. She enjoys the big production shows. She doesn't get seasick. And that the crew, esp. the waiters, were very nice to her.

 

She does have some memories of her week long cruise when she was three. Of going on her first plane ride. Of the jungle gym on the Paradise.

 

On her fifth cruise, two summers ago, she wasn't too interested in the scenery, either on our train trip up the West Coast or in Alaska. She just wanted to stay in the Fun Zone as much as she can.

 

This last cruise (last month) at age eight, she came with us in all the ports. She even went on an all-day scenic tour of Hilo and seemed engaged the whole time.

 

One thing that I learned while reading books on babies while pregnant is that experiences, languages, reading...all these help the infant's brain develop. The first thing a friend who's an audiologist told me after calling me after the birth was that we should expose her to different languages.

 

So, if you can afford that third person fare, and you feel your child can travel well (try short trips and cruises first), why not expose them to the world of traveling.