Guilt trip by HAL to promote ships tours?

[galensgrl]

We help quite a few here on CC and even on cruises who want to do independent travel in various ports (primarily Europe). But when somebody mentions to us that they have a fear of missing the ship we stop helping and immediately suggest they just take ship's tours. That being said, in over forty years of extensive cruising to 6 continents, we have done nearly every port on our own and never missed the ship....nor have we ever actually met anyone else who actually missed the ship. It can happen, and most independent travelers always have a "Plan B" which is what to do if one would miss the ship (normally catch-up at the next port).

 

I would add that especially in Europe, DW and I will often venture 2 and sometimes even 3 hours from the port via trains or rental cars. The biggest impediment to adventurous travel is one's own demons :).

 

Hank

 

I understand what you are saying Hank. I'm sure passengers being stranded is a rare thing, but it does happen. I haven't seen a youtube video of a HAL passenger being stranded yet, I didn't mean to mislead anyone about that if that's how it came across. DH's paranoia comes from being stationed in Bermuda when he was in the Navy. Bermuda has had shut downs of their transportation systems when the bus drivers and cab drivers strike, and DH said it happened to him without warning. He was once stranded on the other side of the Island when there was a strike, and had to find his own way back to the base hitching rides. We have cruised to Bermuda many times, even taken ship sponsored excursions there. I am sure a ship sponsored excursion would be fine, but DH still gets too nervous for us to take any kind of excursion if it finishes too close to the time we need to be back onboard for sail away. He can't relax and enjoy it as he is constantly watching the clock. I am wondering how he is going to do on our upcoming cruise as it is port intensive, where in Bermuda we are docked for three days. We have taken ship excursions with other lines, we would have no problem booking with HAL as a ship excursion is probably the only kind DH would be comfortable with. That's just us, everyone does what they feel the most comfortable with I guess. :)

 

Lorie

[PatsyAnne]

I haven't seen this before on HAL's online ship excursion page.

 

 

 

"Although much of Hammerfest is readily accessible on foot, Holland America Line has partnered with a tour operator here to offer a local perspective and commentary that would not be present when exploring on your own. Sources of outside revenue are scarce in small villages such as Hammerfest and the local population benefits from tour participation."

 

 

The way I read this, it says "... benefits from tour participation." Not "... benefits from HAL tour participation." JMO, I don't see this as a scare tactic.

[Seafoam Green]

Our next cruise is now less than 2 weeks away. This week we received the "Don't Miss Out On Booking Excursions" email from HAL, with a 'personal' recommendation for a tour in each of the ports that we haven't booked an excursion for. (The excursions we do have booked in these ports don't resemble HAL's recommendations. LOL)

 

Do I mind the suggestions? No. The HAL excursions we have booked were chosen for reasons of 1. Short duration of port visit at one stop and 2. Feeling safer with a group sponsored by HAL at another, and I'm glad we are taking them. The email was merely a reminder, but certainly not high pressure. As a business, HAL needs to maximize profits and keep their passengers happy with activities on the ship and in port and they seem to be doing their job.

[3rdGenCunarder]

Our next cruise is now less than 2 weeks away. This week we received the "Don't Miss Out On Booking Excursions" email from HAL, with a 'personal' recommendation for a tour in each of the ports that we haven't booked an excursion for. (The excursions we do have booked in these ports don't resemble HAL's recommendations. LOL)

 

Do I mind the suggestions? No. The HAL excursions we have booked were chosen for reasons of 1. Short duration of port visit at one stop and 2. Feeling safer with a group sponsored by HAL at another, and I'm glad we are taking them. The email was merely a reminder, but certainly not high pressure. As a business, HAL needs to maximize profits and keep their passengers happy with activities on the ship and in port and they seem to be doing their job.

 

I suspect that the recommendations were based more on which tours had few bookings than on what you'd already booked. Kind of like waiters in a restaurant "suggesting" whatever they have a lot of in the kitchen. ;)

[Seafoam Green]

I suspect that the recommendations were based more on which tours had few bookings than on what you'd already booked. Kind of like waiters in a restaurant "suggesting" whatever they have a lot of in the kitchen. ;)

 

Good point - 'moving' the product, at least without fear of spoilage if nobody bites!

 

:D

[planmaker]

As others have pointed out the bottom line is do your research. I took cruiseline tours all the time at first and I enjoyed them. I started researching ports out of necessity the first time. The whole extended family was going on a cruise together and not everyone could afford the cruiseline tours. The alternatives I found were eye opening in many ways. We ended up having a great time with a fraction of the money by booking local. I did it all on line and read reviews, crime rates, recomendations from locals etc. I personally feel good about giving my money directly to the locals. Read, Read, Read!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[iancal]

HAL is stretching a point.

 

When we book a private tour with a local operator, 100% of the tour price remains in the community.

 

When we book a ship tour with HAL or any other cruise line, considerably less stays in the community. The cruise line uplift sails away with the ship.

 

Clearly there are other differences however the economic argument that HAL presents is a stretch to say the least.

 

A number of years ago a local tour operator in St. Vincent related to us how Carnival Corp (HAL, Princess, Carnival, Costa, etc) negotiates with tour operators and how their ultimate goal is to get the lowest price and wherever possible to exclude the possibility of any local tour operators in order to keep their prices high. The threat is always that they will bring in their own people for the season. And they do in some areas.

Edited April 24, 2016 by iancal

[serendipity1499]

I haven't seen this before on HAL's online ship excursion page.

 

"Although much of Hammerfest is readily accessible on foot, Holland America Line has partnered with a tour operator here to offer a local perspective and commentary that would not be present when exploring on your own. Sources of outside revenue are scarce in small villages such as Hammerfest and the local population benefits from tour participation."

 

I see nothing wrong with this blurb.. As part of my job when I first joined the Telephone Sales Dept in our Airline I had to take Salesmanship classes... The hardest thing I had to do was cold calling to try to get a sale.. It's not easy.. Later on I had to give the same classes to new Agents.. IMO this is excellent Salesmanship..

 

Obviously HAL would like to sell shore excursions. it's part of their business.

 

But RKA explains the situation quite well for this port.

 

Why must everyone try so hard to find something insidious, sneaky, or just plain negative in everything HAL says or does?

 

Completely agree! A large part of HAL's revenue comes from their shore excursions.. If they want to stay in business they have to find a way to sell these shore excursions.. As a stockholder I'm happy that they are being proactive about their sales..

Edited April 24, 2016 by serendipity1499

[dockman]

As a CCL stockholder I always enjoy watching the massive numbers of shore excursions that they typically sell as I know the profit margins are very large on the excursions.

 

As a frequent cruiser I personally rarely if ever actually buy one of their excursions as I much prefer to do my own thing. I am not a fan of being herded around on bus tours etc but that is my own preference. I have traveled a LOT and have no fear of dealing with local drivers, riding local buses, etc etc.

 

However I do understand that for MOST holland passengers that they look at a cruise to a certain destination as a "once in a lifetime visit" and they want to see as much as possible and are often somewhat fearful of trying to figure things out on their own. Holland excursion salespeople are not likely to do much to allay these fears as their job is to SELL TOURS.

 

Naturally Holland is going to try and convince passengers to buy their tours and often are not going to tell you that there is a free shuttle or that you can do it on your own for a fraction of the cost. I do find it a bit dishonest when they don't even tell you of free shuttles or claim that they are not sure if the local port will provide or not. I suspect that they are 99% sure if there will or will not be a local shuttle or it could be confirmed with a simple phone call or email to the port agent.

 

Shore excursions are a big profit center for cruise lines and big sales help to keep the basic cruise prices somewhat lower. So for me I always hope they sell a LOT of them and it seems to me that even though most people do find the pricing to be semi exorbitant that most passengers do seem to be usually pretty happy with the tours.

 

As others have already said it ultimately is up to you if you want to buy the tours or not and to sort out the sales pitch and sometimes "scare tactics" to make an intelligent decision that works best for you. There are tons of reviews and sites all over the internet that can provide you with a wealth of options and information to assist you.

[kevingastreich]

It is true that the ship can not wait even a few minutes for an individual passenger. The cost of time at the dock is very expensive and no HAL is not going to pay several hundred thousand dollars to rearrange tugs and pilots and lane charges while a passenger does not make the ship in time. When the ship leaves is exact! They do wait for their tours on a rare occasion when one or more are late because it might be worth the money to avoid the bad public relations of leaving 100 people or so behind. Usually it involves waving good-bye to the ship as it sails without you.

 

I can definitely see the value in cruise line booked excursions for longer and more detailed trips as there are more things that can go wrong to possibly delay your return to the ship. For short term "city tours" in populated areas, you can probably risk it knowing that if something did happen you most likely could find your way back to the ship someway somehow. That being said, I do remember one time the Captain came on the loudspeaker and announced that we were going to wait "one hour max" for some passengers who had not yet returned to the ship and were not on HAL booked excursions. The four people showed up 30 minutes late and we were still at the dock waiting for them.

[cruisemom42]

As a CCL stockholder I always enjoy watching the massive numbers of shore excursions that they typically sell as I know the profit margins are very large on the excursions.

 

As a frequent cruiser I personally rarely if ever actually buy one of their excursions as I much prefer to do my own thing. I am not a fan of being herded around on bus tours etc but that is my own preference. I have traveled a LOT and have no fear of dealing with local drivers, riding local buses, etc etc.

 

However I do understand that for MOST holland passengers that they look at a cruise to a certain destination as a "once in a lifetime visit" and they want to see as much as possible and are often somewhat fearful of trying to figure things out on their own. Holland excursion salespeople are not likely to do much to allay these fears as their job is to SELL TOURS.

 

Naturally Holland is going to try and convince passengers to buy their tours and often are not going to tell you that there is a free shuttle or that you can do it on your own for a fraction of the cost. I do find it a bit dishonest when they don't even tell you of free shuttles or claim that they are not sure if the local port will provide or not. I suspect that they are 99% sure if there will or will not be a local shuttle or it could be confirmed with a simple phone call or email to the port agent.

 

Shore excursions are a big profit center for cruise lines and big sales help to keep the basic cruise prices somewhat lower. So for me I always hope they sell a LOT of them and it seems to me that even though most people do find the pricing to be semi exorbitant that most passengers do seem to be usually pretty happy with the tours.

 

As others have already said it ultimately is up to you if you want to buy the tours or not and to sort out the sales pitch and sometimes "scare tactics" to make an intelligent decision that works best for you. There are tons of reviews and sites all over the internet that can provide you with a wealth of options and information to assist you.

 

Well written and I agree 100% with your points.

 

I also agree that ships could provide a little more info to the DIYers, when it is readily available, as it's probably clear these passengers are NOT going to book a ship tour in most cases.

 

The niche cruise line I sail on most often includes most excursions in the cost of the trip. They are very good about providing information for folks who want to do other things, including walking maps, information about taxis and shuttles, etc. They have a small staff, so I'm sure they are not going to extraordinary lengths to find such info. Think there is a correlation? ;)

[cruisemom42]

 

When we were on one of our cruises, can't remember which one we watched people being left at the dock..

 

You might want to read this man's post about being left at the dock:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1157383

 

Beware!! Westerdam Capt. Waits for noboby

 

There have been several other threads about people being left at the dock..

 

 

Yes, but:

 

A) We have no idea whether his being late back to the ship was simply the result of his own idiocy (e.g., having a drink at a nearby watering hole, shopping near the port, etc.) or the result of some private tour. I'd say the first sounds more likely given the limited information he provided. And....

 

B) Embedded within that very long 29-page thread is also a discussion from a CC Host of a European tour run by the cruiseline which ALMOST left behind an entire busload of passengers.

 

I have also read stories of people being late to pick-up points on tours (or getting lost) and then getting left behind by ship tours. Nothing is written in stone.

 

I will agree with Hank (HLitner) however, in that if you plan well and have a back-up, the chances are probably not significantly higher that you will get left behind by DIY versus taking a ship's tour. But not all people want to put in the time and effort to do that -- I get it. Ships' tours are easy and are generally middling good.

Edited April 24, 2016 by cruisemom42

[boards]

HAL is a business. End of story. Not a travel club, not a heritage association.

 

They have an absolute right to promote their products in any way that they see fit. They simply have to be truthful, set the right expectations, and deliver on those expectations.

 

Not really certain what the fuss is about. Take the excursion, do an independent tour, or simply stay on the ship. The choice is yours. What is there to whine about? A little basic research prior to the cruise should assist anyone in making this decision.

 

Thank you - that is our opinion too. It's your vacation, go and enjoy, just be wise and watch the time.

[helvic]

Yes they care so much, they take 50% of the tour price. That really helps the locals.