John Heald about slot pulls

[Shhhq]

Participated in my first and last slot pull just last week. We had a HUGGGE turnout of over 128 people! We really didn't win anything, and took way too long. I don't blame the organizers for anything but with the crowd, it got out of hand. At least 2 people came to collect money that had put in money but hadn't actually participated... they had to be turned away because at this point the used tickets had been counted and the pot split between that many people. For them to even get their money back would take money away from others. It was too disorganized due to the abundance of people.... I actually think a representative from Carnival would have made things go smoother!

[GROUCHPUSS]

Canadians do not have to worry about the US IRS for any winnings. They are just to make things miserable for US citizens.

 

One obvious solution to the points scam (and it is a scam) is for each person to put their card in the machine when it is their turn to play. Everybody gets some points. In case of a jackpot, make sure a Canadians S&S card was inserted prior. :cool:

 

 

Each time you pull your card out of the machine all the money that is loaded in the machine goes to that players bank.

[meatloafsfan]

Hi

 

Just wondering if someone knows. Probably never thought about it because I have never won very much in any casino.

 

I didn't realize that there would be tax consequence from a large win in the casino, mainly because I thought in international waters the state wouldn't have jurisdiction.

 

So what would happen to myself for example...casino winnings are not taxable in Canada. The ship would not withhold anything, would they?

 

In case I ever hit I big, it would be nice to know. :)

 

lucky enough to have won many hand written jackpots... as a Canadian you fill out a different form. I know this because i have had it taken back from me, oh Canada, wrong form.

 

As a Canadian they take your name, room number etc etc, but there is no tax impact whatsoever.. as any lottery, casino or such type win is tax free.

 

And you may have to remind the casino folks that there is a different form as a Canadian. When I won a jackpot on the Pride, I had to push the guy (maybe he was new) and then the head casino host came over and he knew what form was needed.

 

You fill out a form that basically says you're not subject to US taxes as a foreigner.

 

This is different from winning in a US casino as a Canadian.

[stevefrisco]

Moral of the story let the Canucks use their card for slot pulls. No taxes and the points are a goodwill gesture for being such good allies. Win/win/win in my opinion.

[Elaine5715]

Like I said, you can ask the casino cashier. I have never participated in a slot pull that had winnings that needed a 1099. I wish ! However, I have seen many people report that they were allowed to divide it. I have also seen some people report that the cashier would not allow division. Like many things, it sounds like it depends on who you get that day. YMMV

They are lying. Watched a guy argue with the Casino Manager (after yelling at the hosts) that his $5000 payout was to be split between him and his four family members that he called after winning. The Casino Manager, after checking ID against the Sail & Sign that was in the machine that payouts go to the card that was in the machine at the win and if no card was in the machine, they check the tape. The guy got the choice of accept the payout or having his win voided.

I talked to the Casino Manager and he said Americans try that all the time to avoid taxes and also they switch cards but if the card doesn't match player, they don't pay.

[stevefrisco]

They are lying. Watched a guy argue with the Casino Manager (after yelling at the hosts) that his $5000 payout was to be split between him and his four family members that he called after winning. The Casino Manager, after checking ID against the Sail & Sign that was in the machine that payouts go to the card that was in the machine at the win and if no card was in the machine, they check the tape. The guy got the choice of accept the payout or having his win voided.

I talked to the Casino Manager and he said Americans try that all the time to avoid taxes and also they switch cards but if the card doesn't match player, they don't pay.

 

 

Elaine, I know you're not purporting to be an expert and are just reporting what you heard but could you go into more detail if you have it regarding the cards not matching the player? The reason I ask, my in laws were told on their last cruise that sharing an account is ok if husband and wife. They are actually on a cruise right now and I assume operating under that advice. Would have for them to get a jackpot voided.

[Elaine5715]

Elaine, I know you're not purporting to be an expert and are just reporting what you heard but could you go into more detail if you have it regarding the cards not matching the player? The reason I ask, my in laws were told on their last cruise that sharing an account is ok if husband and wife. They are actually on a cruise right now and I assume operating under that advice. Would have for them to get a jackpot voided.

If the husband and wife are playing the same machine, both are present, obviously only one card is in the machine, that is not an issue, the problem is that some people use a non present person's card so they can play two machines at once or just to max play all on one card and that is a problem.

So if husband has wife's card in the machine and she is elsewhere, he won't be able to collect a jackpot.

[Elaine5715]

Elaine, I know you're not purporting to be an expert and are just reporting what you heard but could you go into more detail if you have it regarding the cards not matching the player? The reason I ask, my in laws were told on their last cruise that sharing an account is ok if husband and wife. They are actually on a cruise right now and I assume operating under that advice. Would have for them to get a jackpot voided.

This is the same for land based casinos. If you have another's player's club card in the machine, they may void the card.

[boaterette]

Just from the responses here I can understand why they quit helping. You have whiners complaining about about someone else getting the points. Organize your own slot pull if you dont like the one someone has organized.

[I Luv Crusin]

I love gambling but I don't think I'd ever do a slot pull because people who don't gamble often don't really understand gambling ethics and I could just see if breaking down into some type of fight or awkward situation. Plus, say the group hits the jackpot, who is the person who is responsible for the taxes? I'm pretty conservative on my taxes and would hate to have to request everyone in the group sign an affidavit about what went down for the IRS. Kind of takes the fun out of everything and good luck finding a notary at sea haha

 

The person who arranged our slot pulled said that she would be solely responsible for taxes, hence her "benefit" of getting the points.

[klfrodo]

The person who arranged our slot pulled said that she would be solely responsible for taxes, hence her "benefit" of getting the points.

 

And that is a bunch of hoooey.

 

When a jackpot is hit, that requires a cash payout. The machine is locked out and no more play.

The attendant comes over and verifies the win. They also verify the player. They then go into the back, verify the win and the player by reviewing tape. If all is okay, they come back out and pay out 100% in cash to THAT player.

THAT play (if a US Citizen) then receives a 1099G or a W2G that they use for their taxes.

The casino does not withhold taxes. It is up to the player. The casino DOES report the winnings to the US Govt.

 

Therefore, the "arranger" of the slot pull cannot be soley responsible for the taxes.

[poz222]

If the 1099g is issued to the organizer then they would be responsible for filing the winnings on their taxes and subsequently, be solely responsible? Seriously, if so many have issues with who gets a few points, or who’s card etc... just don’t participate... simple as that. If you are the organizer, it’s your rules, all others can skip it or organize one with their rules... period.

[angela12345]

(y) (y)

two thumbs up

[angela12345]

Each time you pull your card out of the machine all the money that is loaded in the machine goes to that players bank.

I didn't realize this happened. I have always been very careful to cash out before leaving a machine when playing slots, whether with a group or by myself. I have now verified that what you say is true, I have been told this by 2 different casino staff. So basically, if anyone puts their card in then pulls it back out for the next person to put their card in, there will be no money left in the machine to continue the slot pull, it will all be automatically loaded to the first person's card when they pull out. I meant to go try it afterwards with $1 in the machine to test, but I forgot, lol.

 

Regarding playing with the card in the machine, I have always done it this way as a time saving thing to load the money in fast and so everyone can see on the machine balance that the entire amount was loaded into the machine. People are ready to PLAY, not play feed the machine. Load the money all in at one time by punching a button, punch a button to go back to the cage to cash out. It had never occurred to me that anyone would even care about the points and noone at my past slot pulls has ever said a thing, in fact many come up to me and speak or email me after, thanking me for organizing it and are complimentary on the job I did and how much fun they had.

 

The slot pull generates so few points compared to what you need, that I have never earned the Drinks on Us card in the casino . Even though I consider myself doing a fair amount of gambling for at least an hour or a few hours every single night in addition to the slot pull. It's just not that easy to earn that card. Even for the person (above) who had 128 at their slot pull, which is a HUGE group, assuming $20 per person, the organizer got 128 x $20 = 2560 / 2.50 = 1024 points. They would have still had to play an additional $1190 of their own money (1500 - 1024 = 476 x $2.50 = $1190) to earn the drinks card. I'm very sorry you had a bad experience and it sounds like your host was kinda unorganized. Maybe give it a try again sometime with a different, and smaller group, we think it is SO much fun ! We literally had other people in the casino coming over asking if they could join our group last time because they heard us all whooping and cheering and having a great time.

 

I have spent considerable time on how to set up a slot pull, and made several spreadsheets with rules, for recording a list of people who are interested in participating before the cruise, sign up sheets for meet & greet, for recording funds paid and disbursed, recording each of the pulls during the slot pull and tabulating who were the biggest winner(s)/biggest loser, a note/sign I have printed that I go around the night before and leave at every cabin for each of the people who have signed up reminding them of the event for the next day, making name tags, buying raffle tickets for when we have a side pot, bringing all of this stuff with me on the cruise, a list of ideas for prizes, and spending a lot of time answering emails/questions/comments people have about what a slot pull is and how it works.

 

I will continue to do it this way when I am the host for slot pulls. Anyone who thinks I am trying to "scam" for points can feel free to organize their own slot pull or not participate in mine.

 

They are lying. Watched a guy argue with the Casino Manager (after yelling at the hosts) that his $5000 payout was to be split between him and his four family members that he called after winning. .... (snip)

Perhaps you are correct and the people who have reported they were allowed to split amongst their slot pull group were lying. Or perhaps the people who reported that the casino would not allow them to split were lying. Or perhaps you are lying about what you saw. It's just as likely if you are going to call other people liars, that you are in fact lying. Or perhaps the people reporting they were allowed to split is because everyone playing in the slot pull was all standing right there for the win and were all participating, not his "four family members that he called after winning". Like I said twice before, you can ask the casino cashier to split if you are lucky enough to be in a slot pull that wins that large of a jackpot, they may or may not grant it. If I am ever lucky enough to be involved in one that wins that big, I will report back here with my first hand results (we have won big before, but not quite big enough for that). Like many things in life and with Carnival, it sounds like it depends on who you get that day. YMMV. Which means 'your mileage may vary'. Which means your results may vary from other's. Which means if you ask for it from one person/cashier on one ship during one cruise, you may get entirely different results or answer than asking for the same thing from another person/cashier on another ship during another cruise on a different date.

[jwjax]

OK, so how many Slot Pulls have you participated in that hit a jackpot big enough to require tax forms???

 

Me.....None!:) Why even worry about the taxes, chances are, you will come out even, or a little bit above!:cool: If you hit big.....GREAT!:):)

 

 

We have had one big spin in our slot pull adventures. Not enough to create a tax issue, but it did cause the cashier at the cage a bit a grief. She had to split it among 20 of us.:)

[stevefrisco]

Re: tax issue, it seems to me that if a person was particularly dishonest, he or she could have them take out as much tax as possible then split the rest with the slot pull group. No one would ever know if they person got the tax money back due to other gaming losses.

 

Like I said earlier I just don't think slot pulls will be an activity that the Frisco family will ever do with strangers. Wouldn't mind doing it with friends and family though.

[angela12345]

Re: tax issue, it seems to me that if a person was particularly dishonest, he or she could have them take out as much tax as possible then split the rest with the slot pull group. No one would ever know if they person got the tax money back due to other gaming losses.

Very good point ! And unfortunately the world is full of dishonest people. What makes it difficult is we cannot assume that person will sustain any other gaming losses to offset the win. Or, what if they win with the group in January but sustain gaming losses later in the year like in October. They couldn't have known that either.

 

The safest and most fair way to do it, in my opinion, would be to take the total cashed out minus the starting amount, then subtract the % for that person's tax bracket. For example, 20 people x $20 = $400. Assuming they lost $300 before they won a $5000 jackpot and 22% tax bracket, it would be (400-300=100+5000=5100 cashed out) 5100-400 = 4700 x 22% tax bracket = 1034. So 5100-1034 = 4066 / 20 = $203.30 per person

 

I don't think the cruise line actually withholds the taxes, I think you get 1099'd and you're responsible for the taxes yourself. But I'm not sure about that. I would love to have that problem happen to me to find out though ! (y)

 

 

2018 Income Tax Brackets

Rate .. Individuals ..................Married Filing Jointly

12% .. $9,526 to $38,700 .......$19,051 to $77,400

22% .. $38,701 to $82,500 .....$77,401 to $165,000

24% .. $82,501 to $157,500 ...$165,001 to $315,000

32% .. $157,501 to $200,000 .$315,001 to $400,000